FL - 17-yo Teen Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #3

[ScubaTwinn]

In the police report an officer states that Zimmerman was bleeding from his nose and the back of his head. I'm not sure how a fall would cause both injury's.

http://cnninsession.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/martinpolicreport.pdf

I believe the gun kicked back and hit him in the nose. The blood on the back of his head came from touching Tray trying to find a gun on his waistband, and when he didnt, put his hands on his head like witnesses said "What THF have I done?" No pictures to support the back of the head injuries or the nose for that matter. MAYBE we might get them if they were taken in a homicide.

 

[Velouria]

I agree. However, my question is.... would Al Sharpton have been concerned with whether said parents got answers or justice? Would there be this huge uproar in defense of said white child?


My guess is most probably not.

My question is, would Al Sharpton have found it necessary to intervene, or whether GZ would have found TM suspicious in the first place had he been a white child?

My guess is probably not.

 

[jjenny]

I believe that the poster is referring to the 13 yr old boy who was walking his dog, he saw part of the scuffle and then the dog got off the leash and he had to chase it, and he didn't see anymore after that.



http://www.urbanfaith.com/2012/03/will-there-be-justice-for-trayvon-martin.html/

There are better links that have a more comprehensive account but I didn't have one to hand, I will search, because there is as usual some controvery here as well.

No, there is another guy who claims that saw the two of them fighting and Zimmerman was the one screaming help. I posted that article numerous times already.

 

[jjenny]

I heard mentioned on JVM that no autopsy was performed on Trayvon. This is a misstatement, I pray!

I don't believe that. I think since he died a violent death an autopsy had to have been done. Also I presume the body was released to the parents so they could get another autopsy.

 

[ScubaTwinn]

And I look forward to hearing all about them in great detail, hopefully with pictures.

I so heartedly agree, in a homicide case. I cannot get over the failures in this case and need to step away.

 

[Sensei]

I heard mentioned on JVM that no autopsy was performed on Trayvon. This is a misstatement, I pray!

Don't know how it could be anything else since it is a law that any death by any unnatural cause or any death not attended by a physician must be autopseyed. And a shooting is certainly not a death by natural causes.

 

[ScubaTwinn]

And I look forward to hearing all about them in great detail, hopefully with pictures.

I so whole heartedly agree, in a homicide case. I cannot get over the failures in this case and need to step away.

 

[songline]

Start here Song - http://www.sanfordfl.gov/frames/home_frames.html

The girlfriend gave her statement 3 weeks after the fact - ABC got an exclusive with the girl and the family attorney. Trayvon was dead two days before being identified. The girlfriend describes talking on the phone with Trayvon and his being scared - being followed by someone, being hit....the phone somehow disconnecting (she never says she heard a shot), and then she apparently goes on with her life without ever calling the police about what she'd heard.

BBM - Extremely odd to me. Thank you for the article.
If I thought a friend of mine was in any kind of an up-heavel... and we got disconnected....
I would call back, I would call someone I trusted, I would not just go on about my life.

She may not have his parents number but she had someone she can call including her own parents.
Not at any age would I have just gone on as if, nothing happend...
A man followd him...the call disconnected.The more I read the more I read....

and from the onset I did not like that Al Sharpton was
brought into this at all. NOW....I would disect each word the girl sais,
The only thing I trust is that Ty was on the phone with her.

What was said - BY NOW can also include some subliminal indoctrination by the time the case comes up.
I can see her getting the suggestive conversation. I am not accusing...

but it did not have to became a race card, that in itself is twisted.

 

[ScubaTwinn]

According to JVM, the girl's parents called Sanford LE to tell them about the phone call with Trayvon. LE never called them back.

And I believe that if everything else we've read about them is correct. THE FBI WILL TELL US!

 

[gxm]

Politicians love these kind of situations. There will be plenty of them clamoring to repeal the "stand your ground" law and enact new laws restricting peoples access to guns which caused this tragedy. JMO.

Too true. I am particularly saddened by President Obama's "my [imaginary] son would look like Trayvon" statement. <snip> Let the political games begin! (sigh)

 

[daisy7]

Tell your Florida state senator and representative: Repeal Florida's "Shoot First" law.

Florida's "Shoot First" law, combined with the state's permissive concealed weapons laws, gives armed vigilantes like George Zimmerman virtual carte blanche to shoot anyone they deem as a threat, with no legal requirement to first attempt to remove themselves from a dangerous situation.

(snip)

http://act.credoaction.com/campaign/fl_repeal_shootfirst_fax/?rc=fb_share1

 

[Sensei]

BBM - Extremely odd to me.
Thank you I did read the article.
If I thought a friend of my was in any kind of an up-heavel... and we got disconnected.... I would call back, I would call someone I trusted, I would not just go on about my life.
Not at any age would I have done that.
The more I read the more I read....I do not like that Al Sharpton
was brought into this at all. I would not trust that girl at this stage....
No matter what she said. - the only thing I trust is that Ty was on the phone with her.
What was said BY NOW can also include some subliminal indoctrination when the case comes to be heard.
I can see her getting the suggestive conversation. I am not accusing....
but it did not have to became a race card, that in itself is twisted.

The girl herself was hospitalized after the incident, the parents of the girl claim, and I would bet can prove that they did in fact call Sanford PD and attempt to report that they had information that their daughter was on the phone with TM when the incident occurred, and they never got a call back, and the girl was never interviewed, although apparently she through her parents had come forward very early on.

 

[ScubaTwinn]

He was interviewed by a NARCOTICS officer. I am pretty sure a NARCOTICS officer would have noticed if he was high as a kite or drunk as a skunk .

Someone posted he knew some of the Officers quite well, and by first name. I would be intersted to know how well these 2 know each other.

 

[vlpate]

Maybe cause he signed it and now he is feeling the heat?

He did not say the law that he signed was not applicable in his state, he said, based on the information given him:

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/poli...ned-shouldnt-apply-in-trayvon-martin-case.ece
"ARLINGTON -- Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said Friday that the “stand your ground” self-defense law he signed while in office should not apply to the case of a teenager who was shot by a neighborhood watch volunteer in his home state.
“This law does not apply to this particular circumstance,” Bush said after an education panel discussion at the University of Texas at Arlington. “Stand your ground means stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn’t mean chase after somebody who’s turned their back.”
He was referring to reports that the 17-year-old, Trayvon Martin, was pursued by the volunteer and fatally shot in a scuffle."

 

[jjenny]

He did not say the law that he signed was not applicable in his state, he said, based on the information given him:

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/poli...ned-shouldnt-apply-in-trayvon-martin-case.ece
"ARLINGTON -- Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush said Friday that the &#8220;stand your ground&#8221; self-defense law he signed while in office should not apply to the case of a teenager who was shot by a neighborhood watch volunteer in his home state.
&#8220;This law does not apply to this particular circumstance,&#8221; Bush said after an education panel discussion at the University of Texas at Arlington. &#8220;Stand your ground means stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn&#8217;t mean chase after somebody who&#8217;s turned their back.&#8221;
He was referring to reports that the 17-year-old, Trayvon Martin, was pursued by the volunteer and fatally shot in a scuffle."

Well police say pursuit is not illegal. Therefore just because Zimmerman was following Trayvon doesn't mean the law doesn't apply to Zimmerman.
So why is Bush claiming otherwise?
What I think is that they passed a law that is so broad and vague they can't even figure out what's covered under it and what isn't.

 

[angelmom]

There is a huge difference between "bleeding" from the back of your head, and "having blood' on the back of your head. I am sure a trained and experienced police officer could tell the difference.

maybe, if he really examined the wound, but maybe not. I am reminded of a time when my friend's dog was attacked and they were both covered with blood. We raced to the vet and I kept asking my friend if she was okay, sure that one or both of them was gravely wounded. After getting cleaned up, neither of them had more than slight abrasions, and the owner of the other dog claimed her dog had no serious cuts either. We still can't figure out where that much blood came from, but I was CERTAIN that my friend had been caught in the attack and needed medical attention herself.

I think if the officer noticed blood on his face and head and referred him to the EMTs, the officer wouldn't necessarily have looked closely at the "wound." The EMTs felt no need to rush this guy in an ambulance (and they don't take chances), nor did the hospital keep him for observation. IMHO, if they had so much as taken a stitch or sent him for an x-ray to rule out a concussion, we would have heard about that by now. Since we haven't, I truly believe that GZ either had a minor scrape OR no wound at all and had simply gotten Tray's blood on him when he touched the back of his head, as witnesses have claimed.

 

[pkz]

Why was a narcotics detective the first person to question a homicide suspect?

That makes no sense and it could ruin a case. Homicide detectives are trained to investigate homicides.

What is the relationship between Zimmerman and this narco detective? Why did he talk to him first? Were they buddies and he was helping him get his story straight?

Something is up with this.

I posted the link back a coupla pages...but Zimmerman's father is a retired judge and his mother is a court interpreter, he went to classes for neighborhood watch....small town, one can bet the Zimmermans' knew nearly all of the law community....JMHO

 

[RANCH]

I believe the gun kicked back and hit him in the nose. The blood on the back of his head came from touching Tray trying to find a gun on his waistband, and when he didnt, put his hands on his head like witnesses said "What THF have I done?" No pictures to support the back of the head injuries or the nose for that matter. MAYBE we might get them if they were taken in a homicide.

I've never seen someone hit themselves in the nose when firing a handgun. You would have to hold it close to your face. Very awkward. Now a shotgun held wrong? Yes.

Looks like there is at least two witness's who can testify to whether the blood on the back of GZ's head was a transfer or a bleeding wound. JMO.

 

[Sensei]

I posted the link back a coupla pages...but 911 Zimmerman's father is a retired judge and his mother is a court interpreter, he went to classes for neighborhood watch....small town, one can bet the Zimmermans' knew nearly all of the law community....JMHO

After making 46 or so calls in 10 months, I bet he did IMO JMHO and stuff

 

[LolaMoon08]

I've never seen someone hit themselves in the nose when firing a handgun. You would have to hold it close to your face. Very awkward. Now a shotgun held wrong? Yes.

Looks like there is at least two witness's who can testify to whether the blood on the back of GZ's head was a transfer or a bleeding wound. JMO.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnPk07z6aa0"]Gun Fires and Hits the Girl - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfjpEMxcoO4&feature=related"]Gun Backfire compilation - YouTube[/ame]

The second one is mostly rifles. A few hand guns.

ETA: I tried to only put the links in and the videos showed up? Hope that's okay.