GUILTY FL - Calyx, 16, & Beau Schenecker, 13, shot to death, Tampa, 27 Jan 2011 #3

[Jewels53]

Agreed, best I could think of at the time, the sensation is so hard to describe to a non sufferer, but you know your head isn't what it used to be prior to suffering depression. I'm just watching the start of day 3 & her performance, I think she was singing la-de-dah in her head & saying I'm not listening to you today lol

Margaret, I understand and it is hard to explain that feeling to others. It is like now I can't not always explain my thought in written words or verbal. It doesn't always come out the way I intend it to come out. I feel like people either think I am rude or crazy. At least this is how I see it.

 

[Liebchenmutti]

As I recall the dates read on the Oxycontin & Hydrocodone 30 tabs were from 2010 so maybe that's why they were empty. I have many RX bottles laying around empty from years ago. Her other meds were recent in Jan 2011.

Oh, thanks! I was wondering about the dates. You should see the top of our fridge & the empty bottles that accumulate!

 

[04009margaret]

Margaret, I understand and it is hard to explain that feeling to others. It is like now I can't not always explain my thought in written words or verbal. It doesn't always come out the way I intend it to come out. I feel like people either think I am rude or crazy. At least this is how I see it.

It really sucks doesn't it, people also don't understand why you won't socialize,you just can't hold a fluid verbal or written conversation

 

[04009margaret]

Falling asleep here, it's 3:47 am nice chatting with you Jewels

 

[jacct]

PS has filed or will file a wrongful death civil suit I believe. What will that do for him? She has no assets but I would think there must be a reason? Proceeds from the house which I believe has not been sold yet? Just wondering as I would assume he would/should get away from this legal stuff and start healing. And I know he does some things towards that but I mean just get away for awhile.

On 1-31-11 Julie filed out and submitted a form for indigent status.

On 2-7-11 it was denied because of the amount of assets she listed on the form.

On 2-16-11 Julie submitted a request for a public defender and a request for the court to freeze marital assets to pay back the public defender office in the event she was found guilty (per FL law a convicted felon that used a public defender must pay back the costs).

On 2-18-11 Parker filed for divorce.

On 2-23-11 Parker filed a motion to the court to dismiss the request to freeze marital assets.

On 2-24-11 the court denied the request to freeze marital assets as outside the jurisdiction of the criminal court and recommended Julie submit the request to the divorce court.

The documents for the above dates can be found at the following link. Scroll down to the bottom of the page to see the older documents.

http://www.hillsclerk.com/PublicWeb/HighProfileCases595.aspx

On 5-9-11 Parker filed a wrongful death suit against Julie in Hillsborough County Civil court and froze all marital assets. This case is still pending and documents are not available to the public to explain why the case is still open. You can see the court docket at the following link. Click on Civil Cases and search on Schenecker, Parker.

http://pubrec10.hillsclerk.com/Unsecured/CaseDetail.aspx?CaseID=2497486

In December, 2011 Julie filed a counter wrongful death suit claiming Parker was equally responsible for the deaths as he was aware of Julie's mental illness. Here's a link to that story:

http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/l...help-julie-schenecker-avoid-the-death-penalty

 

[Bernina]

In all fairness to Parker, he certainly knew JS had a problem. I think because of being away from home a lot, he didn't realize the full scope of her illness. I also believe he didn't fully understand it. And he didn't really effectively stem his daughter's hate speech, which was so devastating to JS. He seemed to believe Julie was choosing to be ill; even though he mentioned in his email to her doc that her recent downturn followed a med change.

He was certainly very concerned in the months prior to the murder -- repeated emails to her doctor. It was a poor choice to leave her alone with the children. Perhaps the abnormal had come to seem normal. Perhaps he just let his job take precedence -- one time too many.

BBM:

PS said she was "broken" when he married her. He knew of her condition for 20 years. He criticizes family members for their ignorance in his emails. (read the emails)
How can anyone NOT know or understand their significant other's MI when they've been with them for over 20 years? That's like not understanding your SO's diabetes, cancer, MS, etc.

Not once, in the paperwork from LE or Child Protective services on the abuse, is Mental Illness or alcohol abuse mentioned. WHY NOT?

Children usually mimic the behavior of one or both parents. Was the children's attitude towards JS was a direct result of observing interactions between JS and PS?
Scientists agree there is a genetic pre-disposition for bipolar. Was Calyx's behavior indicative of BP coming to the surface?

I believe PS and the children were embarrassed and ashamed of JS. They "shamed" her. She was "broken". (WTH, who says their wife is "BROKEN"?) How can a person with BP live in that environment?

JS could not live up to the standards her husband and children expected of her. Her own brother added to the fire in his email to her, probably not having a clue. She had failed. If she only killed herself, it would be another "embarrassment" the family would have to carry. She didn't want to add that to what she already perceived as a huge burden on her children or husband.
By killing her children, herself, and maybe even PS, no one would be ashamed or embarrassed anymore. It's all about "appearances".

In her mentally ill "reality", it made total sense.

 

[Whiteorchids]

If she really wanted to commit suicide so badly why hasn't she? People do commit suicide in jail and prison. It's easier than you think.

In Santa Ana, CA the ex-army homeless serial killer accumulated Ajax given to inmates to clean their cell and swallowed it Thanksgiving Day and died.

I would be curious if she is ever put on suicide watch. I'm beginning to think she was never going to kill herself just execute the children.

 

[Whiteorchids]

BBM:

PS said she was "broken" when he married her. He knew of her condition for 20 years. He criticizes family members for their ignorance in his emails. (read the emails)
How can anyone NOT know or understand their significant other's MI when they've been with them for over 20 years? That's like not understanding your SO's diabetes, cancer, MS, etc.

Not once, in the paperwork from LE or Child Protective services on the abuse, is Mental Illness or alcohol abuse mentioned. WHY NOT?

Children usually mimic the behavior of one or both parents. Was the children's attitude towards JS was a direct result of observing interactions between JS and PS?
Scientists agree there is a genetic pre-disposition for bipolar. Was Calyx's behavior indicative of BP coming to the surface?

I believe PS and the children were embarrassed and ashamed of JS. They "shamed" her. She was "broken". (WTH, who says their wife is "BROKEN"?) How can a person with BP live in that environment?

JS could not live up to the standards her husband and children expected of her. Her own brother added to the fire in his email to her, probably not having a clue. She had failed. If she only killed herself, it would be another "embarrassment" the family would have to carry. She didn't want to add that to what she already perceived as a huge burden on her children or husband.
By killing her children, herself, and maybe even PS, no one would be ashamed or embarrassed anymore. It's all about "appearances".

In her mentally ill "reality", it made total sense.

Thanks, Good post Bernina. Does anyone know by memory what day the email from the brother was written? I forgot. Did she start planning before or after that date?

 

[Bernina]

I believe JS is a game player--she is a smart cookie! She's an expert in interrogation in the military; I have bipolar disorder & have 3 young children. Believe me, I've had problems with medications, times when I was severely depressed, etc. The bottom line is that if you have ANY illness, and you are an adult, it is YOUR responsibility to take care of it. You may not blame your kids for acting like kids as the reason you are a wreck.

Drinking alcohol and eating bottles of Oxycontin is NOT a symptom of bipolar disorder, and it is evidence that she had no interest in controlling her mental illness.

Her mugshot & "perp walk" displays a woman who had it together enough to go get her hair highlighted--let me tell you, if you were so desperately ill that you could not care for your kids, you would not have the energy needed to visit a salon! (And you are also not capable enough to go to a drugstore & buy Clairol & then do it yourself).

I get a sense that JS is highly manipulative, that she uses her illness to control and punish her family, and that she is filled with rage. She is putting on an act in court. Bipolar disorder does not make you incoherent--and please be aware that SHE IS ON MEDICATION RIGHT NOW. That will ensure that she is NOT PSYCHOTIC--so her confusion is just an act.

Suicide is the leading cause of death in people with Bipolar disorder--homicide is exceedingly rare. I was diagnosed at age 18 with severe bipolar--and I've noticed that murderers like to pretend that this disorder "makes" you murder children. That's total BS. You fluctuate (when unmedicated) from severe depression to manic states (either euphoria or extreme irritability).

JS was also on medication at the time of the murders. She kept it together so well at "Lock & Load" that she was sold a firearm and hollow point bullets that she planned to shoot her kids with. She needs to go to prison for the rest of her pathetic life.

JMO!:loveyou:

But, does your bipolar have psychotic features and schizoaffective disorder as the defense stated in their opening?

And isn't a huge issue to being "well" getting the right "cocktail" of medications, add the effects of hormonal changes during menopause (she was 50), and a solid support system?

 

[ToodieWorm]

It really sucks doesn't it, people also don't understand why you won't socialize,you just can't hold a fluid verbal or written conversation

Hey all! New Here! Just wanted to add - my grandmother suffered from schizophrenia. As a little girl, I can remember her thinking the phone company tapped her phones, that people had hidden things in her house when they came to visit, etc. She didn't know she was MI. When she was much older, we had to tell her she was getting an Osteoporosis shot - while in reality, she was getting her medication. If one were to meet her, she was functioning - you'd probably not recognize that something was "off". But, it really was and was sad to watch and to feel helpless.
Also, wanted to add that Parker wrote that he didn't believe that she had the "energy to commit suicide" in one of his emails to the therapist. I also read in one of the emails that he saw the therapists note basically okaying JS to drink no more than two drinks with her Lithium.
One final thought - like other posters, I too believe that she should have been checked out medically before being interviewed. I think many of her comments show a lack of connection to reality.
Glad to be here!

 

[Whiteorchids]

Hey all! New Here! Just wanted to add - my grandmother suffered from schizophrenia. As a little girl, I can remember her thinking the phone company tapped her phones, that people had hidden things in her house when they came to visit, etc. She didn't know she was MI. When she was much older, we had to tell her she was getting an Osteoporosis shot - while in reality, she was getting her medication. If one were to meet her, she was functioning - you'd probably not recognize that something was "off". But, it really was and was sad to watch and to feel helpless.
Also, wanted to add that Parker wrote that he didn't believe that she had the "energy to commit suicide" in one of his emails to the therapist. I also read in one of the emails that he saw the therapists note basically okaying JS to drink no more than two drinks with her Lithium.
One final thought - like other posters, I too believe that she should have been checked out medically before being interviewed. I think many of her comments show a lack of connection to reality.
Glad to be here!

Welcome ToodieWorm

 

[Coldpizza]

Great first post ToodieWorm and :welcome4:!

 

[Bernina]

Thanks, Good post Bernina. Does anyone know by memory what day the email from the brother was written? I forgot. Did she start planning before or after that date?

If I recall, that was the tipping point. Urgh, can't find the links.
She asks the family members to forward the PS email and they refuse. Could she possibly have seen that as "all is lost"? "Everyone" was against her?

 

[Abigail]

BBM:

PS said she was "broken" when he married her. He knew of her condition for 20 years. He criticizes family members for their ignorance in his emails. (read the emails)
How can anyone NOT know or understand their significant other's MI when they've been with them for over 20 years? That's like not understanding your SO's diabetes, cancer, MS, etc.

Not once, in the paperwork from LE or Child Protective services on the abuse, is Mental Illness or alcohol abuse mentioned. WHY NOT?

Children usually mimic the behavior of one or both parents. Was the children's attitude towards JS was a direct result of observing interactions between JS and PS?
Scientists agree there is a genetic pre-disposition for bipolar. Was Calyx's behavior indicative of BP coming to the surface?

I believe PS and the children were embarrassed and ashamed of JS. They "shamed" her. She was "broken". (WTH, who says their wife is "BROKEN"?) How can a person with BP live in that environment?

JS could not live up to the standards her husband and children expected of her. Her own brother added to the fire in his email to her, probably not having a clue. She had failed. If she only killed herself, it would be another "embarrassment" the family would have to carry. She didn't want to add that to what she already perceived as a huge burden on her children or husband.
By killing her children, herself, and maybe even PS, no one would be ashamed or embarrassed anymore. It's all about "appearances".

In her mentally ill "reality", it made total sense.

Wow -- that's a lot to chew on. I do agree that there seemed to be a huge effort to "cover up" Julie's mental illness and alcohol abuse. I never even thought about it not being mentioned in the investigation by social services. And...come to think about it...HOW did Julie get home from the ER so quickly after her car accident??? Wouldn't someone have had to go to the hospital to get her? How convenient that she got picked up before any blood work was done.

 

[Jewels53]

:welcome6: Toodieworm

 

[Abigail]

Thanks, Good post Bernina. Does anyone know by memory what day the email from the brother was written? I forgot. Did she start planning before or after that date?

She bought the gun 3 days after brother Dave sent the email.

And the email that Dave sent Julie was triggered by the email her husband sent out to her family (apparently he felt they were critical of the way he was handling things). Julie got wind of her husband's email, but apparently never actually saw it (her Mom asked Parker to forward it to Julie, because Julie was imagining the worse).

Here's the link to the emails:

http://tbo.com/news/breaking-news/schenecker-emails-show-woman-who-had-lost-control-20140127/

http://tbo.com/assets/pdf/TB48127.PDF

 

[Abigail]

If she really wanted to commit suicide so badly why hasn't she? People do commit suicide in jail and prison. It's easier than you think.

In Santa Ana, CA the ex-army homeless serial killer accumulated Ajax given to inmates to clean their cell and swallowed it Thanksgiving Day and died.

I would be curious if she is ever put on suicide watch. I'm beginning to think she was never going to kill herself just execute the children.

My thoughts too -- esp. thinking of Castro, and the 1 year anniversary of the girls' rescue.

I'm sure she'd have been put on suicide watch, at least in the beginning. However, she may have stabilized a bit mentally. In jail, she has to follow a routine -- get up in the morning, get showered and dressed, eat her meals, take her meds, follow a routine. She can't abuse alcohol or OD. It's actually probably a good setting for someone like her, who is either unable or unwilling to take charge of her life on her own.

 

[turaj]

BBM:

PS said she was "broken" when he married her. He knew of her condition for 20 years. He criticizes family members for their ignorance in his emails. (read the emails)
How can anyone NOT know or understand their significant other's MI when they've been with them for over 20 years? That's like not understanding your SO's diabetes, cancer, MS, etc.

Not once, in the paperwork from LE or Child Protective services on the abuse, is Mental Illness or alcohol abuse mentioned. WHY NOT?

Children usually mimic the behavior of one or both parents. Was the children's attitude towards JS was a direct result of observing interactions between JS and PS?
Scientists agree there is a genetic pre-disposition for bipolar. Was Calyx's behavior indicative of BP coming to the surface?

I believe PS and the children were embarrassed and ashamed of JS. They "shamed" her. She was "broken". (WTH, who says their wife is "BROKEN"?) How can a person with BP live in that environment?

JS could not live up to the standards her husband and children expected of her. Her own brother added to the fire in his email to her, probably not having a clue. She had failed. If she only killed herself, it would be another "embarrassment" the family would have to carry. She didn't want to add that to what she already perceived as a huge burden on her children or husband.
By killing her children, herself, and maybe even PS, no one would be ashamed or embarrassed anymore. It's all about "appearances".

In her mentally ill "reality", it made total sense.

Bernina...excellent post and you hit some real key points for me. That comment by PS about his wife being broken is very indicative of his attitude on her mental illness. The brother's email was just shortly before the purchase of the gun and you are right he was trying to help...but it made things much worse.

I would love to hear from some military friends of PS as to what they knew about his "perfect family". If I had to guess I bet he did not tell anyone about what was really going on in his life...embarrassed for sure and not fitting for his rank. I don't know much about military life but from what I see I wonder how mental illness is regarded? It seems like so many return from combat and are "broken" as PS puts it and don't get the help they need.

Her defense team would be well served to hit this angle as I think it all contributed to her desperation to let everyone know just how sick she was.

Again...she is responsible but PS and many others contributed to the perfect storm in the Schenecker family.

 

[ToodieWorm]

Bernina...excellent post and you hit some real key points for me. That comment by PS about his wife being broken is very indicative of his attitude on her mental illness. The brother's email was just shortly before the purchase of the gun and you are right he was trying to help...but it made things much worse.

I would love to hear from some military friends of PS as to what they knew about his "perfect family". If I had to guess I bet he did not tell anyone about what was really going on in his life...embarrassed for sure and not fitting for his rank. I don't know much about military life but from what I see I wonder how mental illness is regarded? It seems like so many return from combat and are "broken" as PS puts it and don't get the help they need.

Her defense team would be well served to hit this angle as I think it all contributed to her desperation to let everyone know just how sick she was.

Again...she is responsible but PS and many others contributed to the perfect storm in the Schenecker family.

What I find strange is the constant referral to her "messing up" the basic spelling of words or grammar. I mean, considering the gravity of what her brother knew of her Mental Illness - isn't that a tiny thing? It's like they all were just over her illness and wanted her to just "straighten up" and get "fixed".

 

[Abigail]

Sorry to monopolize things this afternoon. One quick question, and then I'm off to finish the laundry and go out and do some gardening.

I've been checking to find out what would happen if JS were found guilty and what would happen if she were found not guilty.

If guilty, she'd get 25 years to life (can't see her living more than 25 years -- she's aged 2 decades in the past 3 years)

But what if not guilty due to insanity? Would she be committed to an institution -- and how long? Or would she just be let out on the streets? Where would she go?

I've been searching the web, but can't yet find what they do in Florida.