I agree that the proposed sentence is too much. Why in the heck didn't she accept the plea?
Perhaps because she is a spoiled, enabled brat whose parents feel she can do no wrong.
This is pure conjecture on my part, but it would explain some things.
Do you realize the "plea" involved the possibility of her being categorized as a sex offender for life? She'd have to accept the plea deal, and then go before a judge who would decide if she would have sex offender for life status.
NO WAY she should accept that. NO WAY.
As I stated numerous times, with absolute proof provided (the plea deal, which makes ZERO mention of being on the sex offender registry), this is flat false. I provided a copy of the plea offer. I'm sorry if that is not as good as news articles. But sometimes news articles get things wrong.
This is not really pertinent, but it sounds like you didn't even google it. Prom contracts, Project Graduation contracts. I did google it before responding again, and yes, parents of adult students do sign them. Again, this isn't really all that relevant except to say that 18 year olds are very much the property of public high schools. Google it, honestly.
I sure as heck did. I actually downloaded three different ones.
Nowhere on any does it state that a student over the age of 18 must have parent signatures. In my experience, with my brother's in law, the information we were given was filtered through them and they were allowed to leave campus, drop out of school (in one case), go on field trips and go to the final graduation party, WITHOUT parental permission, once they turned 18.
And listen, I get your point. !8 year old seniors are still babies in most cases. I do agree with that. But there is a VAST difference intellectually, emotionally and sexually between most 18 and 14 year old kids. Vast. And most I know would not want anything to do with a kid that much younger than them - unless they have an issue themselves, such as they like to take advantage of someone who is less mature, or if they themselves are very immature. But both of those things may be recipes for predation.
I am very much concerned about imbalances of power when it comes to sexual relationships. If these kids were 20 and 24, that would be so much different because they would be near the same level developmentally. But 14 and 18 are to very different levels developmentally which is why, again, most healthy seniors do not socialize with freshman.
Here's the CNN article that says if she accepted this plea deal, she's have to plead guilty to child abuse. NO. I wouldn't allow my daughter to do that. That shuts doors, for her, for her whole life.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/24/justice/florida-teen-sex-case/index.html?hpt=hp_c3
That's true and I you're right. It is pretty harsh. But the problem is the alternative. I think she made a huge mistake in not accepting the deal.
I feel, very strongly, the same way.
Someone was "clever" in choosing to vilify the victims family with the same sex aspect and choosing to take to social media instead of fighting fair. This does not make it so-as others pointed out, it gives an opportunity to feed outrage without paying attention to the details of the case.
I think she is predatory and weird as well, to use gitana's words. She should have taken the plea deal, and I think the mandatory psych aspect might have given her a chance to explore the predatory aspect of her crime and help her get a handle on that.
Let me explain that I believe this because of the police report. It details how she came on to the younger child, persisted, knew she could "get in trouble" because of the age difference and assisted the 14 year old in running way.
If you add in that the parents claim she was twice warned to stay away from their daughter, well, I'm seeing someone who is taking advantage of a difference in maturity levels and/or someone who refuses to control her sexual impulses despite the consequences, which is what we see with sex predators.
All I can do is imagine what would happen if some 18 year old senior was coming around my 14 year old child and having sex with her. And I am imagining a guy because I think people on both sides are getting hung up on the Queer aspect of this case.
If some fully grown man, albeit still a student, was loitering around my little, freshman girl, telling her how much he loved her and making sexual moves toward her, I would be scared and appalled.
If that same man then ignored my admonitions to stay the heck away from my kid, and my kid continued sneaking around with him, I would rapidly become unglued, frankly. If that man then helped my baby run away to sleep over at his house, I would be frantic beyond belief.
If then, after I was led to believe it was over, a host of people came up and told me they caught this man having sex with my kid, that would be the last straw. I would do what I had to to protect her.
There is a possibility that I would not feel as horrified if the 18 year old was a girl because men tend to be much more predatory, in general (no stones), than women, but it wouldn't change things that much for me. The age difference is pivotal to me here.
I totally get that she is legally an adult, and I agree there is a big difference between a senior and a freshman, especially an 18-14 difference. But I also think the fact that they were schoolmates is a bit mitigating. I knew plenty of girls, including myself, who dated seniors when we were freshmen. I can't think of any of those senior guys that I'd automatically paint as weird, predatory (well, beyond the usual "wants sex" attitude of many teens), or very immature. Some of the relationships were long term. Some were just hookups.
I do think a black and white approach can be very problematic when dealing with two high school students. A felony child abuse record is pretty darn harsh, as is sex offender registry (which I realize isn't the case here, but just speaking generally). I DO wish that prosecutors wouldn't seek to make a point when we are dealing with a teen who has barely crossed the age of majority, and dealing with sex acts that were not coerced.
And that's talking any gender. Boy/girl, boy/boy, girl/girl, and including the whole spectrum of non-binary gender identifications!
I'm curious what the 14 year old has said about the relationship.
You make some good points. But, IMO whenever you have an age gap that big in that developmental spectrum, there is necessarily coercion going on. That's my opinion, not fact. But I base it on years of studying predators and adolescents.
Yeah, there are senior boys who date freshmen girls. I find them all to be creeps. I'm sorry. When there are beautiful juniors or seniors to choose from all over the place, who are not right out of junior high or middle school, why are they going for someone so different developmentally? Because it's easy to manipulate and coerce someone much younger into having sex. I;m sorry, but I have a real problem with that.
Well, I see what he is saying. You stick all these teenagers together. They have classes together, clubs together, lunch, extra-curriculars, dances, etc, its not a surprise that relationships develop, even freshman-senior relationships. And given the hormones in flux, sex isn't (or shouldn't be) a surprise either. Except not in the bathroom. Good grief, I mean, just...ewwww.
If its true that she kept coming around after being warned, then I guess I'd prefer to see a misdemeanor charge of harassment, stalking, whatever. But felony child abuse, with this kind of possible sentence is just unduly harsh for what would otherwise have been a consensual relationship.
Tere just has to be some kind of middle ground here, when its two young people in the same school, in a mutual, non-coerced relationship. Two people with adult bodies in close proximity 5 days out of 7 form a mutual attraction - and at least one set of parents doesn't want them involved, so they see each other in secret, sneaking out, etc. It's an old, old story, been going on forever, and will go on forever.
I can't help but wonder if what if the older student were a guy, honor society, football player, top of his class type. Many parents would be thrilled at the thought of their daughter dating a guy like that (not me, but I do know of those who would be). But not so thrilled if its a person of the same sex.
I just don't think this is a crime worth jail time. Or a permanent record.
I don;t think the crime merits any kind of prison or jail time either. And perhaps a permanent child abuse record is too harsh. But to say this is simply two, young people in a consensual relationship, well, what if this was a 13 year old boy and a 9 year old girl? At what age can a child consent? At what age is it possibly consent when dealing with differences in ages.
Our laws in this regard are generally designed to protect children from predation. 14 year old girls are easily manipulated into thinking it is consensual. They should not be having sex at all especially with someone four year older, at that age.
I will say this, though: One thing that may make this a bit different for the Queer community than the typical boy-girl statutory rape scenario, is the fact that there are much fewer gay kids than straight. It is not only much harder for gay kids to find anyone to date, it also an isolating thing and there is a huge amount of prejudice toward such kids and such relationships. So that may have motivated Kaitlynn to some degree. This may have been her first chance at a Queer relationship which may have made her fall hard and strong.
I;m trying to be fair here and consider all aspects. I really am. And I get that for a gay kid wandering around not ever connecting with a romantic partner and not even knowing the feeling they may one day be able to have, when such a kid finally meets another kid who appears to have those leanings as well, it may be natural to be attracted, no matter the difference in ages. And then I can see how that could be a very compelling relationship - two gay kids in love against the world and finding a harbor in their isolation.
But as an adult, predation is something that is very scary and if that was my child, all I would care about is that my baby is having sex and having sex with someone vastly older developmentally. Again, our laws in this regard are meant to protect fragile adolescents from such an imbalance of power.
Finally, to play the devil's advocate a bit, I will say that Debra La Fave, also a Florida woman, received basically the same plea deal as Kaitlynn was offered. A 24 year old woman was offered no prison time, three years house arrest and seven years probation. The only difference then, between a teacher molesting a student and Kaitlynn having sex with a fellow student, when it comes to what they were offered, was that La Favre would have to register as a sex offender for life.
I kind of have a problem with the similarity in deals offered given the vast difference in the level of harm committed.
But it gets worse: Debra La Favre has her charges entirely dropped and faced zero penalty whatsoever. So an 18 year old senior may face 15 years prison for having sex with a freshman while a fully adult teacher got off scott-free for raping a 14 year old student. So those who are concerned about discrimination may have a point:
Lafave pleaded guilty under the agreement and was sentenced to three years' of community control (house arrest) and seven years' probation. She effectively ended her teaching career with her guilty plea; her Florida teaching license was automatically revoked, and no other state will grant a teaching license to a convicted felon. Under the terms of her probation, she had to be home by 10 pm every day, could not leave Hillsborough County without a judge's permission, and could not be around children. She also had to register as a sex offender. There was widespread skepticism as to whether a man guilty of lewd or lascivious battery would have received similar treatment. On December 8, 2005, Marion County Circuit Judge Hale Stancil rejected the plea deal, claiming that any agreement that didn't require Lafave to serve some prison time "would undermine the credibility of this court, and the criminal justice system as a whole, and would erode public confidence in our schools." He set a trial date for April 10, 2006. The Marion County state's attorney subsequently dropped the charges. In a statement, the prosecutors cited an assessment by psychologist Martin Lazoritz that found the victim would be so severely traumatized by a potential trial that it would take as long as eight years for him to recover. Based on this, prosecutors said that putting Lafave on trial would not be worth the harm to the victim's well-being.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debra_Lafave
ETA: It looks like somehow, the terms of the plea deal did become la Favre's sentence. Not sure how that works when they dropped the charges,. But she didn't get off scott free, apparently.
