Found Deceased FL - Madeline Soto, 13, Missing Child Alert, 13500 blk Town Loop Blvd, Orlando, 26 Feb 2024 *arrest* #10

[Gemmie]

Sunrise was at 6:53 am Feb 26th in Orlando, so first light was about ~6:23. I think by virtue of the fact that he wasn't spotted on the condo complex cameras carrying her, we have to assume he was able to do so discreetly/in darkness.

Good point about sunrise times. Either that or no cameras pointed in the direction of the front door and car which is entirely possible.

 

[ttjo]

Sunrise was at 6:53 am Feb 26th in Orlando, so first light was about ~6:23. I think by virtue of the fact that he wasn't spotted on the condo complex cameras carrying her, we have to assume he was able to do so discreetly/in darkness.

I think so too, the way their apartment faces , there is really only one unit that could have captured anything definite ( if they had a ring) the other units facing the parking lot, would have had a more limited view.

 

[Gemmie]

LE was aware of the complex parking lot footage on 2024-02-28 and was talking to JS just before they arrested SS. I wonder why they chose the next day to inform her they believed MS was dead? Maybe they thought after SS was arrested JS might reveal something? I wonder why that conversation was not described in any incident reports in the doc dump? Maybe they didn't consider it an interview? I also wonder if LE believed MS was dead based off of the initial security gate footage that showed SS leaving the parking lot (found on the 27th) or if they weren't confident until the footage at the trash compactor (found on the 28th).

I woke up thinking about when they told JS on the 29th that they believed Maddie was dead. What I'm wondering is what her reaction was to that news. And I don't mean that her child is deceased, but because of HOW they knew that. (saw Maddie looking deceased in SS's car). Even if that's not in the data dump because it wasn't a true interview (I don't know if that's the reason, it's a guess as to why), you'd think noting her reaction to the news would be considered important enough to include. Sure, a mother is likely to be really upset at the news, but what about the news of who they think did it? Her lover and Maddie's "step-father" of 7 or so years. And whatever that reaction was, was it believable in LE's minds? Or did it look and feel like an act?

JMO

 

[ttjo]

I woke up thinking about when they told JS on the 29th that they believed Maddie was dead. What I'm wondering is what her reaction was to that news. And I don't mean that her child is deceased, but because of HOW they knew that. (saw Maddie looking deceased in SS's car). Even if that's not in the data dump because it wasn't a true interview (I don't know if that's the reason, it's a guess as to why), you'd think noting her reaction to the news would be considered important enough to include. Sure, a mother is likely to be really upset at the news, but what about the news of who they think did it? Her lover and Maddie's "step-father" of 7 or so years. And whatever that reaction was, was it believable in LE's minds? Or did it look and feel like an act?

JMO

I remember them saying "she reacted just as any mother would, hearing that news", I took that to mean a natural reaction and believable. Does anyone else remember hearing that? I doubt I can find a source. As for her questioning who may have killed her? or how they knew? We have never heard a word.

 

[Pruddennce]

I remember them saying "she reacted just as any mother would, hearing that news", I took that to mean a natural reaction and believable. Does anyone else remember hearing that? I doubt I can find a source. As for her questioning who may have killed her? or how they knew? We have never heard a word.

I remember that from Chief Holland during the joint presser believing that Madeline was deceased:

Sheriff Mina: " detectives from the CMI Police Department met with madeline's mother and they had to tell her the very devastating news that although we have not found meline uh we are now confident that she is dead so our efforts will be focused on recovering..."

Chief Holland:

yeah so obviously detectives have spoken um to her mother and you know as you can imagine um the reaction that any parent would have

 

[ttjo]

I remember that from Chief Holland during the joint presser believing that Madeline was deceased:

Sheriff Mina: " detectives from the CMI Police Department met with madeline's mother and they had to tell her the very devastating news that although we have not found meline uh we are now confident that she is dead so our efforts will be focused on recovering..."

Chief Holland:

yeah so obviously detectives have spoken um to her mother and you know as you can imagine um the reaction that any parent would have

Thanks for finding that, I knew I heard it somewhere.

 

[Pruddennce]

Thanks for finding that, I knew I heard it somewhere.

your welcome!

 

[Mack the Knife]

I woke up thinking about when they told JS on the 29th that they believed Maddie was dead. What I'm wondering is what her reaction was to that news. And I don't mean that her child is deceased, but because of HOW they knew that. (saw Maddie looking deceased in SS's car). Even if that's not in the data dump because it wasn't a true interview (I don't know if that's the reason, it's a guess as to why), you'd think noting her reaction to the news would be considered important enough to include. Sure, a mother is likely to be really upset at the news, but what about the news of who they think did it? Her lover and Maddie's "step-father" of 7 or so years. And whatever that reaction was, was it believable in LE's minds? Or did it look and feel like an act?

JMO

As well, at this point (the 29th), SS had already been arrested. SS and JS were both at the Sheriff’s office for the scheduled press conference on the 28th. I don’t know if the original plan was to have either one of them appearing at the conference, but they reinterviewed both at that time and during the course of interviews with SS they decided to seek an arrest warrant for SS. Then the press conference was held at 15:33, then later that evening SS was arrested.

<modsnip: no source link>

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

I feel sort of inconclusive on JS still. Since LE has not named JS has a POI or suspect or anything, and the only charges right now are against SS, the information that is public is obviously directed at the investigation of SS, so I don't feel like we know all that much about JS, really. I think I'm more skeptical of statement and body language analysis than the general consensus of WS users, so certain things that have been red flags for a lot of folks with JS ("we" dropped her off, referring to MS in the past tense, etc.), haven't bothered me as much. I'm leaning toward, right now, there is no significant evidence (known or unknown) that JS was criminally involved in the murder of MS or the attempted cover up.

I feel a bit more confident about my general theory of the case. That is built primarily on the big doc dump because that is what I read most recently and there is a lot in there, less so on the early interviews and press conferences which I haven't watched since they happened, some general absorption of what has been shared here, and not at all on other videos/reporting (like from Court TV or Gray Hughes) because I just don't like watching videos.

Pure speculation alert...
My leading hypothesis: I actually don't think SS is a pedophile. From what we know or have heard about his other preferences and habits, I think he is more of a generic deviant--I don't want to go too deep into this area because it's more just a feeling I have, but there is a path wherein people addicted to p-rnography get numb to "normal" stuff and seek things that are increasingly extreme and end up with CSAM, and I think something similar may be the case for SS. That was more than I wanted to say on that but I think it's relevant because I don't think that MS was going to age out of SS's preferences, as could happen when a pedophile's victim goes through puberty.

I don't think MS told anyone about her abuse. It's not unusual for victims of CSA to not tell anyone or to care for their abusers, which it seems like she did. I couldn't guess how she thought about it or internalized it, but to me it seems like no one in her life had any inkling. Maybe JS had an inkling, I don't know. Maybe if she didn't, she should have. I don't think MS told her, and I definitely don't think SS thought JS knew.

In this hypothesis, SS was at a lot of points lucky and a lot of points brazen. I think he intended to assault/abuse MS on the first night he was back in town, and because he hadn't been around as much in the prior few months,I d something somehow was different and went wrong--maybe MS pushed back--and he regained "control" of the situation by killing her. He then scrambled for how to cover it up, and landed on her going missing some time after he drops her off at school, which included the absurd idea of putting her body in the front seat of his car.

I don't think he ever really assembled a full plan of what he was going to do because he was probably freaking out. I don't think he's some cold-blooded killer, I think he's a coward and killed her out of cowardice. And finally, his luck ran out and his brazen moves caught up to him because he was repeatedly caught on camera moving a dead body, his story was easily falsified, and he gave police consent to search a device he kept CSAM on.

For the JS aspect of this hypothesis, her knowing or being involved just doesn't fit.

Firstly, thank you for this. I have tried and failed to say what you have said many times.
And the bolded: I feel like the arrival of SS was either the reason MS had been at Grandma's recently or a complete surprise at the apartment. Both could fit.

 

[DoctorRose]

I agree with most of your well thought out theory. However, not to be nitpicky, but if someone is abusing a child, he/she is a pedophile, period. Regardless of how he ended up on that track. Maybe he didn’t start out as a pedophile, but once he started getting pleasure from seeing/abusing the body of a child, he certainly became one.

Agreed. Imo The post you replied to should read that they don’t think he’s “only” a pedophile.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I feel sort of inconclusive on JS still. Since LE has not named JS has a POI or suspect or anything, and the only charges right now are against SS, the information that is public is obviously directed at the investigation of SS, so I don't feel like we know all that much about JS, really. I think I'm more skeptical of statement and body language analysis than the general consensus of WS users, so certain things that have been red flags for a lot of folks with JS ("we" dropped her off, referring to MS in the past tense, etc.), haven't bothered me as much. I'm leaning toward, right now, there is no significant evidence (known or unknown) that JS was criminally involved in the murder of MS or the attempted cover up.

I feel a bit more confident about my general theory of the case. That is built primarily on the big doc dump because that is what I read most recently and there is a lot in there, less so on the early interviews and press conferences which I haven't watched since they happened, some general absorption of what has been shared here, and not at all on other videos/reporting (like from Court TV or Gray Hughes) because I just don't like watching videos.

Pure speculation alert...
My leading hypothesis: I actually don't think SS is a pedophile. From what we know or have heard about his other preferences and habits, I think he is more of a generic deviant--I don't want to go too deep into this area because it's more just a feeling I have, but there is a path wherein people addicted to p-rnography get numb to "normal" stuff and seek things that are increasingly extreme and end up with CSAM, and I think something similar may be the case for SS. That was more than I wanted to say on that but I think it's relevant because I don't think that MS was going to age out of SS's preferences, as could happen when a pedophile's victim goes through puberty.

I don't think MS told anyone about her abuse. It's not unusual for victims of CSA to not tell anyone or to care for their abusers, which it seems like she did. I couldn't guess how she thought about it or internalized it, but to me it seems like no one in her life had any inkling. Maybe JS had an inkling, I don't know. Maybe if she didn't, she should have. I don't think MS told her, and I definitely don't think SS thought JS knew.

In this hypothesis, SS was at a lot of points lucky and a lot of points brazen. I think he intended to assault/abuse MS on the first night he was back in town, and because he hadn't been around as much in the prior few months,I d something somehow was different and went wrong--maybe MS pushed back--and he regained "control" of the situation by killing her. He then scrambled for how to cover it up, and landed on her going missing some time after he drops her off at school, which included the absurd idea of putting her body in the front seat of his car.

I don't think he ever really assembled a full plan of what he was going to do because he was probably freaking out. I don't think he's some cold-blooded killer, I think he's a coward and killed her out of cowardice. And finally, his luck ran out and his brazen moves caught up to him because he was repeatedly caught on camera moving a dead body, his story was easily falsified, and he gave police consent to search a device he kept CSAM on.

For the JS aspect of this hypothesis, her knowing or being involved just doesn't fit.

You've detailed this rather well. Thank you.
From what's been revealed publicly all along from LE exclusively, I'm basically of the same opinion.

 

[ttjo]

Firstly, thank you for this. I have tried and failed to say what you have said many times.
And the bolded: I feel like the arrival of SS was either the reason MS had been at Grandma's recently or a complete surprise at the apartment. Both could fit.

I agree both do fit, although if I had to choose, I'd say his visit was unexpected. There are too many things to consider without more information, seems like a lot of things in this story have a viable alternative explanation, so hard to even guess. ie ( staying at G-mas b/c of SS or b/c Jenn was training?) his convenient arrival time / unexpected?

I re-watched the body cam videos. these are the 3 things that make me think she is not involved.
1 when he says to give them pictures from the birthday party and she says "Yeah but I wasn't there so I have to look it up" her tone is snippy. if his visit was planned, he would know she was working and not at the party. she almost sounded like "Are you dumb?
2 Correcting the clothing. I can't figure out how someone who we know didn't see Maddi getting dressed at 8 am can override what he said unless she doubted his description, (is it true that Maddi always wore gym clothes on Mondays,?) So what is she thinking here?? does she not believe him?
3. when she said "he dropped her off and just..." drove away" it was her tone, the way she responded like simplifying it" felt like she was saying, can you believe that?

There are so many times when she looks like she is side-eyeing him, and sometimes with her ear more toward what SS was saying on the phone than to the cop at some points.
When I first heard her say all things about where Maddie wouldn't be, it didn't make sense to me, is it possible she was suspicious of SS even then? and without saying it or accusing, she was pointing in that direction.
She said she saw her at 8 am and we drove her to school. Was she covering for him or was she covering for herself? not because she was involved but I wonder if there is a family history of them saying " dont leave Maddi alone with him"
By the time they show her the photos, she probably was in denial, and shock and guilt, all the feelings that go with that reality.

here is the " he just drove away its the first 5 sec in, clipped it to the part

 

[ttjo]

and who does he think he is by correcting her weight by 2 lbs. Please... stay in your lane you monster.

 

[Tealgrove]

and who does he think he is by correcting her weight by 2 lbs. Please... stay in your lane you monster.

But that tells us something very significant. It tells us HOW INTIMATELY he knows her. How he knows her BODY.

I’ll bet dimes to doughnuts that the investigating officer noted that. How would a boyfriend of mom know “to the lb” what she weighed? Kind of odd don’t ya think?

The more he talked, the more he interjected and corrected, the more he exposed.

But here’s the other thing….he always needed to be right.

Just keep on talking and tell us everything you know.

MOO

 

[ttjo]

But that tells us something very significant. It tells us HOW INTIMATELY he knows her. How he knows her BODY.

I’ll bet dimes to doughnuts that the investigating officer noted that. How would a boyfriend of mom know “to the lb” what she weighed? Kind of odd don’t ya think?

The more he talked, the more he interjected and corrected, the more he exposed.

But here’s the other thing….he always needed to be right.

Just keep on talking and tell us everything you know.

MOO

it just makes me sick. and you are 100% right, It crossed my mind that he knows her that intimately. His arrogance is off the charts, you have to get past that and allow him to hang himself with his own rope. Investigators sure need to have thick skin.

 

[Pruddennce]

I agree both do fit, although if I had to choose, I'd say his visit was unexpected. There are too many things to consider without more information, seems like a lot of things in this story have a viable alternative explanation, so hard to even guess. ie ( staying at G-mas b/c of SS or b/c Jenn was training?) his convenient arrival time / unexpected?

I re-watched the body cam videos. these are the 3 things that make me think she is not involved.
1 when he says to give them pictures from the birthday party and she says "Yeah but I wasn't there so I have to look it up" her tone is snippy. if his visit was planned, he would know she was working and not at the party. she almost sounded like "Are you dumb?
2 Correcting the clothing. I can't figure out how someone who we know didn't see Maddi getting dressed at 8 am can override what he said unless she doubted his description, (is it true that Maddi always wore gym clothes on Mondays,?) So what is she thinking here?? does she not believe him?
3. when she said "he dropped her off and just..." drove away" it was her tone, the way she responded like simplifying it" felt like she was saying, can you believe that?

There are so many times when she looks like she is side-eyeing him, and sometimes with her ear more toward what SS was saying on the phone than to the cop at some points.
When I first heard her say all things about where Maddie wouldn't be, it didn't make sense to me, is it possible she was suspicious of SS even then? and without saying it or accusing, she was pointing in that direction.
She said she saw her at 8 am and we drove her to school. Was she covering for him or was she covering for herself? not because she was involved but I wonder if there is a family history of them saying " dont leave Maddi alone with him"
By the time they show her the photos, she probably was in denial, and shock and guilt, all the feelings that go with that reality.

here is the " he just drove away its the first 5 sec in, clipped it to the part

I have a different take on interpreting how and what she said about Madeline: re: seeing her at 8am. IMO, just from that first statement about the morning, which turned out to be a lie, for me it infers covering for him AND herself in the event LE suspects something happened to Madeline while in the home with her right there.

she attempted to redirect the focus off of both of them right out of the starting gate by saying she saw her alive in the morning .....which fits with her story 'someone took her after she was dropped off' which she peddled to the media/public......and she tried to recover from that lie in another LE interview by then saying LE 'she didnt hear Madeline definitively because of other roommates in the home'. inferring among the morning sounds, could be Madeline.

...then, along with the her supposed last conversation with Madeline before she went to bed. again, no substance, barely a conversation to relay because IMO, it never happened as a 'happy girl' conversation. IMO, something explosive could have occurred between them OR Madeline was drugged out in bed and she never saw her when she came home. and now known she DID NOT see her that morning.

they both echoed the same story, so rehearsed, hence the 'we'....with SS leading the duo, interjecting, punctuating with additional 'info'...but we see JS changing his clothing description, but even then she prefaces that with 'she thinks' she was wearing black shorts. at this point, it is now known she never saw her that morning.

also, the LE narrative indicates that Madeline did not tell JS about a crush, which JS stated to the media as 'she told "US" when she had a crush. the LE narrative indicates JS said that SS TOLD HER about Madeline having a crush on a boy and his name is then redacted.

her LE interview narrative, she said he was going to be there a week 'but he was trying to move back'. so yes, there's that conflict of what she knew or didnt know...on one hand it sounds like it was planned, but then a conflicting statement, doesnt know what day he arrived. and he danced around that question as well, but he settled on sunday evening after her bd party.

'he drove away': I didnt view that comment as being 'can you believe it!' I viewed it as 'thats it' because she finished telling the 'car embarrassment story, wanting to walk', so there was nothing more for her to say about the dropoff...he continues to fill in the narrative and notably the last time she was seen was "at 8:30-8:40 when WE dropped her off'. JS does not correct him. in fact, she is intently listening to SS's story about Madeline walking, the headphone backpack story that she loses her train of thought and asked LE to repeat a question...

thanks for your opinion as to how her words/behaviour appeared to you. It would be helpful to listen to her LE interviews instead of reading an abbreviated LE narrative.

 

[Gemmie]

Is that just on his possession of CSAM? I don't see how a murder trial can come together that soon, unless he is planning on pleading guilty and just being sentenced by the Judge. IDK

MOO

I don't think so as the CSAM has a different case number. But I could be very wrong about that as I don't know how these sorts of things work in FL, or anywhere for that matter. Especially when you have CSAM evidence against a person, and evidence leading to murder with the same two people (so they get different case #s).

The 7/16 jury trail is for the death penalty case, so that has to be Maddie's murder: Case Number:2024 CF 001293



The CSAM Case Number:2024 CF 000632. It has a jury date of 8/19.



Both can be found at: https://courts.osceolaclerk.com/

Anyone have any idea why it appears that a jury trail for murder would be so soon, and before the CSAM jury trial? It can't be THE trial as it's too soon as @girlhasnoname mentioned. Are there different stages of "jury trials"? I tried Googling for it but got a bunch of info about jury duty, not the definitions of different trials and timing.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

I have a different take on interpreting how and what she said about Madeline: re: seeing her at 8am. IMO, just from that first statement about the morning, which turned out to be a lie, for me it infers covering for him AND herself in the event LE suspects something happened to Madeline while in the home with her right there.

she attempted to redirect the focus off of both of them right out of the starting gate by saying she saw her alive in the morning .....which fits with her story 'someone took her after she was dropped off' which she peddled to the media/public......and she tried to recover from that lie in another LE interview by then saying LE 'she didnt hear Madeline definitively because of other roommates in the home'. inferring among the morning sounds, could be Madeline.

...then, along with the her supposed last conversation with Madeline before she went to bed. again, no substance, barely a conversation to relay because IMO, it never happened as a 'happy girl' conversation. IMO, something explosive could have occurred between them OR Madeline was drugged out in bed and she never saw her when she came home. and now known she DID NOT see her that morning.

they both echoed the same story, so rehearsed, hence the 'we'....with SS leading the duo, interjecting, punctuating with additional 'info'...but we see JS changing his clothing description, but even then she prefaces that with 'she thinks' she was wearing black shorts. at this point, it is now known she never saw her that morning.

also, the LE narrative indicates that Madeline did not tell JS about a crush, which JS stated to the media as 'she told "US" when she had a crush. the LE narrative indicates JS said that SS TOLD HER about Madeline having a crush on a boy and his name is then redacted.

her LE interview narrative, she said he was going to be there a week 'but he was trying to move back'. so yes, there's that conflict of what she knew or didnt know...on one hand it sounds like it was planned, but then a conflicting statement, doesnt know what day he arrived. and he danced around that question as well, but he settled on sunday evening after her bd party.

'he drove away': I didnt view that comment as being 'can you believe it!' I viewed it as 'thats it' because she finished telling the 'car embarrassment story, wanting to walk', so there was nothing more for her to say about the dropoff...he continues to fill in the narrative and notably the last time she was seen was "at 8:30-8:40 when WE dropped her off'. JS does not correct him. in fact, she is intently listening to SS's story about Madeline walking, the headphone backpack story that she loses her train of thought and asked LE to repeat a question...

thanks for your opinion as to how her words/behaviour appeared to you. It would be helpful to listen to her LE interviews instead of reading an abbreviated LE narrative.

Yes Pruddennce a very nice synopsis on some early events. And there are some odd behaviors displayed by both JS and SS IMO.

And reading that and the prior post got me to wondering…… what if perhaps JS and SS were aware that he was to be with JS in the residence that night? And if MS was to continue to remain at the grandmother’s house? They had possibly planned an evening together, alone? And MS was not to be present with them? But then things changed?

Wasn’t it reported that one of the grandparents may have dropped MS off at the JS residence? Maybe her supposed displeasure with attendance at the party and something about gifts - and she wanted to leave there and head back?

And if so, then maybe JS and SS supposed evening alone went awry? I might have some events transposed…. as there have been so many things said and so much questionable or disinformation given.

And then there is the odd deal about JS being too tired to take MS to school in the morning….. and needing SS to assist her with that. MOO

 

[FromGermany1]

Yes Pruddennce a very nice synopsis on some early events. And there are some odd behaviors displayed by both JS and SS IMO.

And reading that and the prior post got me to wondering…… what if perhaps JS and SS were aware that he was to be with JS in the residence that night? And if MS was to continue to remain at the grandmother’s house? They had possibly planned an evening together, alone? And MS was not to be present with them? But then things changed?

Wasn’t it reported that one of the grandparents may have dropped MS off at the JS residence? Maybe her supposed displeasure with attendance at the party and something about gifts - and she wanted to leave there and head back?

And if so, then maybe JS and SS supposed evening alone went awry? I might have some events transposed…. as there have been so many things said and so much questionable or disinformation given.

And then there is the odd deal about JS being too tired to take MS to school in the morning….. and needing SS to assist her with that. MOO

IF Maddie had been at her grandmother's home for a week and IF Maddie's mother JS had to work on Sunday evening and knew, she would be tired the next morning, then WHY Maddie didn't stay for one single night more at grandmother's home? Grandmother could have taken her to school like she did for one week already - would have been a normal arrangement in a normal family, IMO. I see no reason at all, why Maddie should have left grandmother's home for this one night, only to have a problem with her too tired mother and who would take her to school the next morning. The story seems to be totally incomplete or false. I believe, there are more liars than JS and SS, but for what exactly?