FL - Michelle Mishcon, 53, & John Stevens, 59, brutally murdered, Tequesta, 15 Aug 2016 - #2

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CARIIS said:
No druggy feeling, no hangover. Just random Facebook and twitter fights, embarrassing emails, surprise boxes from amazon.com, and amnesia!

If not for those few problems I would have stayed on it. :loser:




Both of these were hysterical!! Then I thought , oh my, is that why the amazon box came-- serious, no memory at all of making the purchase. Zero nada nothing blank, it sat up there (office) they told me for like two weeks.

In my defense however, It WAS something I was THINKING (as I recall!!) about ordering, its the ordering part that I have no memory of !!

So I was being productive then !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So there !!
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I'm laughing so hard at yalls stories! I've done some crazy things myself on sleep meds. I woke up one morning to a completely cleaned house and all laundry done. I even called my mother and asked if she did it for me! She laughed and said no that we had talked for hours that night on the phone while I cleaned. She knew it was my sleep meds but apparently I didn't seem drunk or anything. I've also bought the random crap off tv before too! But three of my friends have my favorite stories. One drove all the way to Sonic's and got a huge bag of their ice and drove home. Left the ice in the car and forgot about it. She had no clue what had happened until she found the receipt and the melted bag of ice. Another friend went shopping to the grocery store bought tons of food that was perishable. Got home and went straight to sleep. The next day she gets in car to go to work and it's FULL of destroyed food. Like 400$ worth! My favorite however is the last one. My coworker was one of those people who worked 7 days a week and two jobs because she liked to work. She had been having trouble sleeping (I have no idea why! I would be dead if I worked like she did!) So her doctor ordered her some Ambien. She popped two that morning after her night shift and mowed the lawn. She almost fell asleep on the lawnmower so she stumbled inside and stripped naked and sat on toilet getting ready to take a shower. I should add she took a few laxative tablets at work that night before... she remember nothing else. She woke up naked in bed and freaked out. Her husband told her she fell asleep on the toilet and when he found her she was face first on the floor with her butt in the air. He laughed and told her he left the ceiling for her to clean up. Lolol [emoji23]

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PositiveLight said:
I'm laughing so hard at yalls stories! I've done some crazy things myself on sleep meds. I woke up one morning to a completely cleaned house and all laundry done. I even called my mother and asked if she did it for me! She laughed and said no that we had talked for hours that night on the phone while I cleaned. She knew it was my sleep meds but apparently I didn't seem drunk or anything. I've also bought the random crap off tv before too! But three of my friends have my favorite stories. One drove all the way to Sonic's and got a huge bag of their ice and drove home. Left the ice in the car and forgot about it. She had no clue what had happened until she found the receipt and the melted bag of ice. Another friend went shopping to the grocery store bought tons of food that was perishable. Got home and went straight to sleep. The next day she gets in car to go to work and it's FULL of destroyed food. Like 400$ worth! My favorite however is the last one. My coworker was one of those people who worked 7 days a week and two jobs because she liked to work. She had been having trouble sleeping (I have no idea why! I would be dead if I worked like she did!) So her doctor ordered her some Ambien. She popped two that morning after her night shift and mowed the lawn. She almost fell asleep on the lawnmower so she stumbled inside and stripped naked and sat on toilet getting ready to take a shower. I should add she took a few laxative tablets at work that night before... she remember nothing else. She woke up naked in bed and freaked out. Her husband told her she fell asleep on the toilet and when he found her she was face first on the floor with her butt in the air. He laughed and told her he left the ceiling for her to clean up. Lolol [emoji23]

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Maybe you guys should switch to Adderall or something. Lol.

Or straight Crystal Meth. Lol. Just joking.

Nice stories though.
 
ninij9 said:
I'm shocked. Stumped. How could he be walking? Multi organ failure, possible brain damage? I think his condition was EXTREMELY exaggerated. Mentally he looks zonked. Thorazine zonked. I'm thinking some brain damage? Anyway, I'm conflicted because if he is very mentally unwell, jail won't suit him. He also could be a danger to other inmates.

Very interesting. I thought this thread wouldn't ever progress again. But looks like victims will hopefully get justice for their loved ones.

Just an aside, I've been hospitalized maybe 4 times for major surgeries and didn't come out looking as good as he does. Even his hair!!!

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His look reminds me of the guy who shot up the theater. Definitely drugged up good.

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Wow!! Can't believe I am just now hearing about this!!

I am not shocked by his ability to walk freely nor am I shocked that he looks relatively healthy. I said a couple of weeks ago that I felt that things had gotten quiet was because he would be released from the Hospital. I feel the Family and the Lawyer grossly over exaggerated his condition.

Being as he was not under arrest or charged with a crime, the Hospital was under no legal obligation to give Detectives updates on his condition. The Lawyer knew this and this was his way of playing up to the Media/Public and even the Victim's Families WHY he was unable to cooperate which in turn gave them a lot of time to build a defense.

I agree that he is extremely sedated (probably a therapist), but nothing in his demeanor tells me he doesn't fully comprehend what is going on. No doubt he was prepped for this moment. This may sound weird, but he looked both scared and cocky. While I believe he was prepped for this moment, I don't think anyone can really prepare to sit in front of a Judge and hear that you are facing two counts of First Degree Murder and one count of Attempted Murder.

I don't know what he remembers (if he remembers at all) about what he did that night, but he doesn't look incompetent.

Now we wait...

Sending prayers to the Victim's Families. It's just the beginning for them and it's going to be a very long road.
 
Why do cops shoot when someone hands is in the air. But they didn't walk up to this guy and unload a clip in his head while he was eating his victims as if he was a tiger or something.
 
DexterMorgan said:
Why do cops shoot when someone hands is in the air. But they didn't walk up to this guy and unload a clip in his head while he was eating his victims as if he was a tiger or something.
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I honestly have wondered that same thing myself.
 
This case has bothered me so much from the start. Partly because there is mental illness in my family, partly because I was a dumb teen once who dabbled in things that I had no business doing (thankfully, nothing crazy like flakka), and partly because I have a young son and AH seemed so "normal" before this turn of events. I don't know what to think. When I see him, he doesn't look like he understands what is going on. He has a flat affect and almost a child-like, uneasy gait. It could be from the shackles, but it did not look like he was struggling in that way. He may be heavily sedated or it may be a general flatness from mental illness, which could be characteristic of someone with schizophrenia. I have to say I feel so horrible for all of the victims in this case, especially those killed and injured. But if this turns out to be the onset of mental illness, I consider AH very much a victim, also, and I can't shake a sad feeling from that. I see him shackled up and looking completely unaware of what is going on, and it makes me sad for him. I have a mother who is Bipolar and I've lived through some pretty nasty manic/psychotic episodes with her. When she gets regulated on her meds and is told what she has done when manic, she is typically horrified. She has never done anything like what was done in this case, but she has done things really, really outside of her typical character. I'm talking a typical church going, actively involved grandma going out to biker bars and bringing home random men when she is manic. I guess that's why I am struggling so much with this case because I don't know how to feel. AH had been showing signs of mental illness before this happened, perhaps this was a build up and he just snapped. Schizophrenia/Bipolar do no typically cause violent tendencies but if he was suffering from steroid withdrawal or using other substances, it's hard to say what could have been "typical". Maybe I'm wrong for feeling this way but I see someone who got really lost, really fast, and did something that he didn't have control over. That doesn't take away any of sorrow felt for the two who were murdered and the one seriously injured. This is just horrible all around. I think he deserves to be institutionalized for the rest of his life, but I'm not sure he would do well in prison.
 
bwill24 said:
This case has bothered me so much from the start. Partly because there is mental illness in my family, partly because I was a dumb teen once who dabbled in things that I had no business doing (thankfully, nothing crazy like flakka), and partly because I have a young son and AH seemed so "normal" before this turn of events. I don't know what to think. When I see him, he doesn't look like he understands what is going on. He has a flat affect and almost a child-like, uneasy gait. It could be from the shackles, but it did not look like he was struggling in that way. He may be heavily sedated or it may be a general flatness from mental illness, which could be characteristic of someone with schizophrenia. I have to say I feel so horrible for all of the victims in this case, especially those killed and injured. But if this turns out to be the onset of mental illness, I consider AH very much a victim, also, and I can't shake a sad feeling from that. I see him shackled up and looking completely unaware of what is going on, and it makes me sad for him. I have a mother who is Bipolar and I've lived through some pretty nasty manic/psychotic episodes with her. When she gets regulated on her meds and is told what she has done when manic, she is typically horrified. She has never done anything like what was done in this case, but she has done things really, really outside of her typical character. I'm talking a typical church going, actively involved grandma going out to biker bars and bringing home random men when she is manic. I guess that's why I am struggling so much with this case because I don't know how to feel. AH had been showing signs of mental illness before this happened, perhaps this was a build up and he just snapped. Schizophrenia/Bipolar do no typically cause violent tendencies but if he was suffering from steroid withdrawal or using other substances, it's hard to say what could have been "typical". Maybe I'm wrong for feeling this way but I see someone who got really lost, really fast, and did something that he didn't have control over. That doesn't take away any of sorrow felt for the two who were murdered and the one seriously injured. This is just horrible all around. I think he deserves to be institutionalized for the rest of his life, but I'm not sure he would do well in prison.
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I feel the same way. If he is developing schizophrenia which usually comes at this age it is a tragedy for him as well


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I also think about how AH's parents must feel. If this was brought on by mental illness, which his attorney is alluding to, they have to be beating themselves up for not getting him help. AH's father made several comments about how he tried to get AH to "snap out of it" when he was showing signs. I'd be interested to hear who in the family suffers from schizophrenia. It isn't extremely common for it to run in families beyond a first or second degree relative, meaning, you would expect it to pass from parents or grandparents. If both of AH's parents are mentally well, then I would think the biggest risk would be a grandparent, WH's parents, since it sounds like it was on his side of the family. I would think, if WH grew up with a schizophrenic parent, he would be more aware of signs and more quick to get AH help. Perhaps he was worried about how it would affect his reputation or AH's bodybuilding and was hoping it was just normal teenage angst. I can't imagine what they are going through right now. To have to live with what their child did, and to essentially lose their child, also. Most mental illnesses are relatively treatable. I don't have experience with schizophrenia and my understanding is that it is the most debilitating of all mental illnesses but I know several people who suffer from Bipolar disorder and they lead mostly normal lives with the need for "tune ups" occassionally when either medicine stops being effective, they stop taking it, or other outside factors cause them to spiral into mania or depression (for my mom, it's typically going into winter and summer. In the summer, when it's warm outside, she starts showing signs of mania. In the winter, it's depression. Sometimes these episodes are mild and caught quickly and her meds are adjusted (usually along with a stay in the mental hospital for a few days) and sometimes all he** breaks loose and she is manic for months).What I'm trying to get at is that if all of this was caused by mental illness, it was preventable, most likely, had AH gotten help. And to think of AH's parents living with that is horrifying.
 
bwill24 said:
I also think about how AH's parents must feel. If this was brought on by mental illness, which his attorney is alluding to, they have to be beating themselves up for not getting him help. AH's father made several comments about how he tried to get AH to "snap out of it" when he was showing signs. I'd be interested to hear who in the family suffers from schizophrenia. It isn't extremely common for it to run in families beyond a first or second degree relative, meaning, you would expect it to pass from parents or grandparents. If both of AH's parents are mentally well, then I would think the biggest risk would be a grandparent, WH's parents, since it sounds like it was on his side of the family. I would think, if WH grew up with a schizophrenic parent, he would be more aware of signs and more quick to get AH help. Perhaps he was worried about how it would affect his reputation or AH's bodybuilding and was hoping it was just normal teenage angst. I can't imagine what they are going through right now. To have to live with what their child did, and to essentially lose their child, also. Most mental illnesses are relatively treatable. I don't have experience with schizophrenia and my understanding is that it is the most debilitating of all mental illnesses but I know several people who suffer from Bipolar disorder and they lead mostly normal lives with the need for "tune ups" occassionally when either medicine stops being effective, they stop taking it, or other outside factors cause them to spiral into mania or depression (for my mom, it's typically going into winter and summer. In the summer, when it's warm outside, she starts showing signs of mania. In the winter, it's depression. Sometimes these episodes are mild and caught quickly and her meds are adjusted (usually along with a stay in the mental hospital for a few days) and sometimes all he** breaks loose and she is manic for months).What I'm trying to get at is that if all of this was caused by mental illness, it was preventable, most likely, had AH gotten help. And to think of AH's parents living with that is horrifying.
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My daughter is bipolar and she has manic episodes in the spring and going into winter. Something about the seasons changing really makes them manic or depressed. I'm always monitoring her closely during those times. She cycles pretty fast though. One day she's up really high then the next she's down really low.

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PositiveLight said:
My daughter is bipolar and she has manic episodes in the spring and going into winter. Something about the seasons changing really makes them manic or depressed. I'm always monitoring her closely during those times. She cycles pretty fast though. One day she's up really high then the next she's down really low.

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My mom is the same way. What typically happens is she starts feeling bad going into winter, thinks her medicine isn't working, stops taking it and then gets really bad. Or going into summer, starts feeling manic, thinks she doesn't need her medicine (because she is convinced she isn't actually bipolar when manic), stops taking it and then it gets really bad. It typically seems to be caused by a change in season or sometimes a situation that happens (family moves away, etc.)
I just wonder with AH's dad, if he had experience with mental illness, and obviously he is a relatively intelligent man to have made it through dentistry school, why he wouldn't have acted sooner. I think it's really common to not think "these types of things" can happen for most people, but I know I am super aware of the possibility for mental illness in my son, because of our family history. I took him to a therapist when he was 5 because he was saying some wacky things. Turned out to just be a phase, but my point is that when you are exposed to mental illness, you are typically hyper aware of the possibility. Not that I blame his parents, at all, but I can imagine they blame themselves.
 
(first my apologies, wrong about the release date of the possum kingdom video. Don't know why it never came up on my searches before now)

Then, HOLY COW!!!!

I don't check in for a few days as I think nothing much is happening, so color me surprised and stunned!
Good heavens, I thought they would at least announce when he was moved out of ICU. Apparently he has been recovering for awhile now.

I am still thinking he had to be told what he had done. When did that occur and what was his response? Mentally ill or not, you would be sedated for that kind of news!

I was glad to see one msm article mention steroids.

I take 3 psychotropic drugs, ie, a high dose of an atypical antipsychotic, a strong tranquilizer and an antidepressant that is sedating and I do not have the shell shocked look. But it would be perfectly understandable to me if he were drugged extra strength much higher than normal dose., so I see a combination of being in shock and medicated to the gills.

I think this must be very surreal to AH.

This is jmo, but those sleeping pill blackouts are very scary to me. We would be scared if it were an alcohol blackout.

My story is not benign. I went to work in my professional office dressed worse than a hooker and was talking about seeing 4 of everything (while driving too). It ruined my career with those people and that company. I was talked to as if I were doing illegal drugs and told to go home. Only the secretary knew something was really very wrong...I wore long skirts & dresses usually, never in the least immodest. My sis came and took me to the ER, then a DR and he was furious with the combo I had been prescribed. Still mad at the guy who told me to go home while I was seeing 4 of things. He should have offered to drive me at least, it wasn't far. Apparently I also woke a co-worker neighbor distressed telling him someone was messing with my clock throughout the night.
Now, if I had been pulled over, I think I would have been way too disoriented to understand the situation and comply with police orders. Think about that.

Something I have been wondering about but thought I had all the time in the world......AH's dad said he had walked out on him from a restaurant 3 times in the past week, and we know he ran off from dad during that walk. Is this new behavior or had it happened before?

What exactly was dad referring to when he grabbed him and shouted "What is wrong with you?" Is this a normal thing for dad to say to him?

Did I miss a date for the next court appearance, a hearing of some sort? don't they usually do that at the arraignment? or is it wait and see because he is in the medical unit.

So many questions and none likely to be answered soon.

WOW, this is just the last thing I expected to see!

Got to go help hubs with all the fall plants we bought on deep discount. YAY! but I will be checking in regularly.

Thanks to everyone for bringing all the latest here.
 
DexterMorgan said:
Why do cops shoot when someone hands is in the air. But they didn't walk up to this guy and unload a clip in his head while he was eating his victims as if he was a tiger or something.
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That's the BIG question. LE claims he was too close to the victim. I wasn't there so I have to take their word. But, it is indeed a strange mystery.
 
strawberry said:
I feel the same way. If he is developing schizophrenia which usually comes at this age it is a tragedy for him as well


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Alot of gang members have A.D.D at young ages.

But they go undiagnosed all of the time. Then the media simply says that they were bad apples.

So I agree. Undiagnosed mental illness is definitely a problem that faces all classes of life.
 
x_files said:
That's the BIG question. LE claims he was too close to the victim. I wasn't there so I have to take their word. But, it is indeed a strange mystery.
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Personally, i think it's inhumane to execute people like that. Ultimately, everyone deserves a fair trial and if possible the death penalty is an option in some states.

But to simply blow their brains out is not how police are trained in civilized countries and tactics like that would make us no better than a terrorist group.


If two people are laying on the ground, one on top of the other...like that's described here, there's no safe way to take a shot. A stray bullet could have hit the victim, a bullet could have passed through the attacker into the victim. It's just not safe for the victim. Police didn't know his condition and wanted to save him if possible.

With that said, they tried physically break AH grasp, and eventually they did and removed him from further biting.

At that point he was able to be subdued and taken in. At that point there was officers and canine units surrounding him, so likely then force was the better option...at least that's how it sounds.
 
TDW59 said:
........snipped from post..........

What exactly was dad referring to when he grabbed him and shouted "What is wrong with you?" Is this a normal thing for dad to say to him?
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Snipped and bolded by me.

I keep thinking about how many of his family members had interactions with him just before he flipped out and committed these terrible crimes. He was with Dad on a walk, talked with Dad's gf, his Sister was around him, went to Mother's house...only they know just how odd he was acting. I have no idea if it's possible this was his first BIG psychotic break from a sudden mental illness without prior use of any drugs or steroids. It was such a violent, uncommon, unstoppable and a sudden-sudden break from reality with very little warning he might kill people. If no chemicals were involved prior to this, and he was experiencing early onset of a mental illness, then I'm surprised it came on so fast and murderously. I think I'd find it easier to understand if I found out he had been under some chemical influence. How often does something like this happen in a sudden onset?
 
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