GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #5

[milagoddess]

Thanks for organizing this! Do you have a page for this? Wanted to post on FB...

Not yet. Still working on sponsors and getting a firm date. I'll know the date next Wednesday for sure and then will have a page set up.

The money will be going to bring a Basic Child Self Defense Training at either Canton or Liberty Elementary to start.

 

[Hickory Born]

IMO his family will submit a lawsuit against DOC because he was not on suicide watch. Attorney Cannon's statement "It's over" was sooooooo incorrect.

Has an obituary come out in the papers yet? Wonder if Ryan's birth-mother knows? Can a birth-mother sue the adoptive/foster parents? We need an attorney on this site.

 

[abagale]

I so agree. RB has brothers who loved him, no matter what, and my heart breaks for them - they were in denial for this past month, but they've gone completely silent now. It's sad. They've had a hard life and this, there's no telling what will become of them, but I honestly pray they go a completely different way.

RB's brothers knew he was like that. They just probably never thought he would kill. They probably wanted him to get some help for it. Maybe they didn't know where a person could turn for help. If RB wasn't taken to get some real help for his problem when the family first noticed the symptoms of him molesting young children, then the ball was dropped. Frankly, a lot of families don't know where to turn for that kind of help. Plus a lot of people don't have the insurance they need to get that kind of help anyway. Believe me psychiatric help is very expensive. RB being adopted, his family should have requested that he get health insurance at least until the age of 24 years. That is if he was adopted as a special needs situation from foster care.

 

[marazul]

RB's brothers knew he was like that. They just probably never thought he would kill. They probably wanted him to get some help for it. Maybe they didn't know where a person could turn for help. If RB wasn't taken to get some real help for his problem when the family first noticed the symptoms of him molesting young children, then the ball was dropped. Frankly, a lot of families don't know where to turn for that kind of help. Plus a lot of people don't have the insurance they need to get that kind of help anyway. Believe me psychiatric help is very expensive. RB being adopted, his family should have requested that he get health insurance at least until the age of 24 years. That is if he was adopted as a special needs situation from foster care.

Just speculation, but I am not so sure his brothers knew. His adoptive mom and now step-dad, probably, but I don't see them as the type to sit down and have a family meeting about it. It is amazing how family members will cover up even an adult molesting a child for fear of community shame or personal shame, it has happened in my extended (step)family (offender now deceased)..sadly stuff like that gets swept under the rug too often. I am by no means justifying any of this kind of horrible stuff, but say a 13 year old boy is touching a 7 year old girl, some uneducated, strange people chalk this up to 'curiosity' and maybe yell at the teenager for it, but it is not considered a RED FLAG to them, no police are called...I have no desire to know about the poor previous victims in RBs case but I am curious as to the CIRCUMSTANCES, how old was he, how old were they, did they accuse him or was he caught in the act, did he have ANY counseling or punishment or consequences or was no big deal to his family.....

 

[Hickory Born]

Just speculation, but I am not so sure his brothers knew. His adoptive mom and now step-dad, probably, but I don't see them as the type to sit down and have a family meeting about it. It is amazing how family members will cover up even an adult molesting a child for fear of community shame or personal shame, it has happened in my extended (step)family (offender now deceased)..sadly stuff like that gets swept under the rug too often. I am by no means justifying any of this kind of horrible stuff, but say a 13 year old boy is touching a 7 year old girl, some uneducated, strange people chalk this up to 'curiosity' and maybe yell at the teenager for it, but it is not considered a RED FLAG to them, no police are called...I have no desire to know about the poor previous victims in RBs case but I am curious as to the CIRCUMSTANCES, how old was he, how old were they, did they accuse him or was he caught in the act, did he have ANY counseling or punishment or consequences or was no big deal to his family.....

If the Virginia case was "unfounded" as it is being reported, then the person who declared it unfound has a lot to think about for the rest of his/her life. That alone could have saved Jorelys. IMO "anyone" who knew RB was like this has blood on their hands.

 

[Hickory Born]

I think he adoptive dad and stepmother in Virginia knew. If the case was "unfounded" wouldn't that mean a police report had been filed? What years did he live with his dad in Virginia, how old was RB then?

 

[marazul]

I think he adoptive dad and stepmother in Virginia knew. If the case was "unfounded" wouldn't that mean a police report had been filed? What years did he live with his dad in Virginia, how old was RB then?

RIght, this is what I am curious about as well..was "unfounded" a LE remark or a media way of saying "the parents or other parties involved didn't take it seriously"

 

[marazul]

from
http://canton-ga.patch.com/articles/evidence-accelerated-brunn-case

"It was a decision that Brunn's family members, who weren't at Tuesday's proceeding, supported, said Burns, who has been in contact with relatives from the start of the case.

"I think that his family loves him and they support him and they realized that this was a decision that only he could make."


His family confuses me greatly. I have seen the smug comments by C.(last initial changes regularly on fb) and the sad comments by Se.B on fb, but I am surprised the mother or father doesn't give any prepared statement, even simply "our deepest sympathy to the Rivera family.....we supported his decision to plead guilty, he took responsibility for what he did....this is a tragedy in every way.." ..I mean just SOMETHING...maybe it is just me, but if Ms. Rivera can talk through her pain, why the silence from the Brunn family? Do family members usually make public statements in these cases?

 

[milagoddess]

We need to start a timeline and family tree like they have in the Alaihna Lemmon forum. I can't keep track of who is who here. Step-dad and adoptive mom?

So rb was adopted at birth. Then those parents divorced? Dad moved to VA and remarried? Mom stayed in NY til a few years ago and then took the boys to Dahlonega? rb visited dad in VA...did he molest a family member there? Then got found out and was sent back home to mom in GA? And did it to someone else? Maybe got kicked out and sent to Canton? Maybe mom thought him getting away from "someone" (a brother? all the brothers? were the bad influences on him, or he on them?) maybe she thought him getting away and getting a real job, living on his own would make him grow up??

 

[marazul]

milagoddess lets just lump it all into "very unstable upbringing"...but yes, it appears that the children are all adopted, from an early thread in which a paternal grandparent said that to MSM. Adoptive mom and dad divorced, dad is now in VA, mom now in GA with brothers, sister seems to live on her own and have a child, RB lived with or visited dad in VA for an extended time, GBI says there was a molestation in VA of a "family member". So, yeah...very unstable home life as far as I can tell. Not sure if this is admissable or not, but SB did say on the fb page RB is Innocent that they were blood brothers, this is not verified or MSM, I don't think there has been official word on if they were adopted from one home or from various homes.

 

[intrepid]

Ryan Brunn’s death was most likely NOT painful.
A soft sweatshirt.
Just gently sit and lean into it.
Think erotic asphyxiation methods.
Maybe, maybe not the erotic part, but not necessarily painful.

Sorry for the graphic images.

 

[intrepid]

Regarding the seeming additional pages that do not ‘come up’, several posts have been deleted and this thread may still be allowing ‘slack’ spaces for the deletions.

 

[JeannaT]

marazul, I think we as a community are very used to hearing from corporate spokespersons/apologists who make slick statements like that.

If I were the Brunn family, I'd be trying to stay out of the spotlight too, and get through this as best as possible. The brothers, IMHO, are in no way whatsoever responsible for this horror, and they will live branded with this for the rest of their lives. They in no way caused this.

There are families who have a lot of grace and poise, (I'm thinking Jeffrey Dahmer's father in particular) who come out with a public mea culpa and a heartfelt apology.

I don't expect this family to. If I had to choose, I'd rather be Jorelys' mother than Ryan's mother.

 

[officer'swife 2010]

Im not sure we really know too much about him do we? Did they find child pictures on his computer? I told my husband about him killing himself and he said he probably felt so guilty and had it planned to do it when he confessed. I haven't heard the whole confession because they say it's too graphic. Was there a jury? Or did the judge just decide? I guess if he confessed then no need to go to trial. It's sad situation but I don't feel sorry for Brunn.

 

[JeannaT]

We need to start a timeline and family tree like they have in the Alaihna Lemmon forum. I can't keep track of who is who here. Step-dad and adoptive mom?

So rb was adopted at birth. Then those parents divorced? Dad moved to VA and remarried? Mom stayed in NY til a few years ago and then took the boys to Dahlonega? rb visited dad in VA...did he molest a family member there? Then got found out and was sent back home to mom in GA? And did it to someone else? Maybe got kicked out and sent to Canton? Maybe mom thought him getting away from "someone" (a brother? all the brothers? were the bad influences on him, or he on them?) maybe she thought him getting away and getting a real job, living on his own would make him grow up??

I think it's actually against forum rules (Thank Goodness) to post a family tree of this family. It's not fair, they're not involved, they should be allowed to be judged by their own behavior and life, and not by Ryan's.

 

[marazul]

marazul, I think we as a community are very used to hearing from corporate spokespersons/apologists who make slick statements like that.

If I were the Brunn family, I'd be trying to stay out of the spotlight too, and get through this as best as possible. The brothers, IMHO, are in no way whatsoever responsible for this horror, and they will live branded with this for the rest of their lives. They in no way caused this.

There are families who have a lot of grace and poise, (I'm thinking Jeffrey Dahmer's father in particular) who come out with a public mea culpa and a heartfelt apology.

I don't expect this family to. If I had to choose, I'd rather be Jorelys' mother than Ryan's mother.

BBM. Oh what a horrible choice either way. I don't know which would be worse!

to Officerswife..there was no jury, there was no trial, just a guilty plea and confession followed by sentencing by the Judge.

I have seen family trees posted in other cases (Hailey Dunn) when the family seems to be involved in some way, but that is when there is still an active investigation going on.
This case just seems like the media gives us just enough to really make us wonder. I agree the family should have privacy if they want it, but seems to me that a sit down interview or MSM public statement would serve them better than their fb comments do.

 

[georgiagirl]

from
http://canton-ga.patch.com/articles/evidence-accelerated-brunn-case

"It was a decision that Brunn's family members, who weren't at Tuesday's proceeding, supported, said Burns, who has been in contact with relatives from the start of the case.

"I think that his family loves him and they support him and they realized that this was a decision that only he could make."


His family confuses me greatly. I have seen the smug comments by C.(last initial changes regularly on fb) and the sad comments by Se.B on fb, but I am surprised the mother or father doesn't give any prepared statement, even simply "our deepest sympathy to the Rivera family.....we supported his decision to plead guilty, he took responsibility for what he did....this is a tragedy in every way.." ..I mean just SOMETHING...maybe it is just me, but if Ms. Rivera can talk through her pain, why the silence from the Brunn family? Do family members usually make public statements in these cases?

This is what puzzles me too! It appears that the stepmom has been too busy playing Farmville to worry about that is going on in her stepsons case. Very telling...

 

[Hickory Born]

BBM. Oh what a horrible choice either way. I don't know which would be worse!

to Officerswife..there was no jury, there was no trial, just a guilty plea and confession followed by sentencing by the Judge.

I have seen family trees posted in other cases (Hailey Dunn) when the family seems to be involved in some way, but that is when there is still an active investigation going on.
This case just seems like the media gives us just enough to really make us wonder. I agree the family should have privacy if they want it, but seems to me that a sit down interview or MSM public statement would serve them better than their fb comments do.

Personally, I think it would have been appropriate to have a friend of the family, attorney, or someone read a written statement from RB's family on Tuesday (when he confess) regarding the loss of Jorelys' life.

What was their reason this time for not attending the Tuesday court session? Has anyone found out if any family member visited him while in the Canton jail?

 

[Magdalyn]

IMO his family will submit a lawsuit against DOC because he was not on suicide watch. Attorney Cannon's statement "It's over" was sooooooo incorrect.

Has an obituary come out in the papers yet? Wonder if Ryan's birth-mother knows? Can a birth-mother sue the adoptive/foster parents? We need an attorney on this site.

Can you sue the DOC as the parent of an adult, non-dependant offspring? He was over 18, living on his own, never going to be a financial provider for the family; they could never hope to be dependant on a LWOP offspring.

I found this:

"This question is important, because cases interpreting Article III of the Constitution prohibit federal courts from hearing suits by plaintiffs who have not themselves suffered some kind of injury as a result of a defendant's misconduct. The Supreme Court has also placed further, prudential limits on who among the injured parties is entitled to bring a cause of action."

and later in same article...

"It is therefore virtually always going to be the state's violation of the adult child's rights themselves (rather than a direct attack on the parent's right to run her child's life) that will result in injuries to parents that might lead the parents to sue. And the predictable case in which such an injury would occur is when the government has used excessive, deadly force against a child and left the parents bereft of their offspring.


"Therefore, to the extent that parents of minor children have been granted standing to sue for the deaths of their children, the question becomes what one understands that loss to consist of.

"If one accepts the view that the age of majority extinguishes any constitutional right to a relationship with one's children, then one must assume that the essential ingredient of parental rights is control. Once a person has lost the right to control a child's activities and whereabouts, the killing of that child no longer deprives the parent of anything that is constitutionally cognizable. "

http://writ.news.findlaw.com/colb/20031231.html


I interpret that as, Ryan's parents (birth or adoptive, or his siblings) were not themselves injured by the DOC, therefore, their suit will not be heard. I don't think pain and suffering of the Brunns counts as injured, but I'm no lawyer.

And the DOC didn't kill him. No deadly force by a DOC employee. He killed himself. Voluntarily.

Personally, considering adoptive mama just filed bankruptcy, I'm wondering who'd volunteer to serve as the family lawyer. Mom and Dad aren't charged for any crimes so they don't get a lawyer pro-bono like Ryan did if they want to sue, assuming this is even a case that would be heard.

(And perhaps because of the reasons stated above, that's why RBs lawyer stated 'it's over'.)

But I'm no lawyer! :crazy: :seeya:

 

[Magdalyn]

IMO his family will submit a lawsuit against DOC because he was not on suicide watch. Attorney Cannon's statement "It's over" was sooooooo incorrect.

Has an obituary come out in the papers yet? Wonder if Ryan's birth-mother knows? Can a birth-mother sue the adoptive/foster parents? We need an attorney on this site.

Can you sue the DOC as the parent of an adult, non-dependant offspring? He was over 18, living on his own, never going to be a financial provider for the family; they could never hope to be dependant on a LWOP offspring.

I found this:

"This question is important, because cases interpreting Article III of the Constitution prohibit federal courts from hearing suits by plaintiffs who have not themselves suffered some kind of injury as a result of a defendant's misconduct. The Supreme Court has also placed further, prudential limits on who among the injured parties is entitled to bring a cause of action."

and later in same article...

"It is therefore virtually always going to be the state's violation of the adult child's rights themselves (rather than a direct attack on the parent's right to run her child's life) that will result in injuries to parents that might lead the parents to sue. And the predictable case in which such an injury would occur is when the government has used excessive, deadly force against a child and left the parents bereft of their offspring.


"Therefore, to the extent that parents of minor children have been granted standing to sue for the deaths of their children, the question becomes what one understands that loss to consist of.

"If one accepts the view that the age of majority extinguishes any constitutional right to a relationship with one's children, then one must assume that the essential ingredient of parental rights is control. Once a person has lost the right to control a child's activities and whereabouts, the killing of that child no longer deprives the parent of anything that is constitutionally cognizable. "

http://writ.news.findlaw.com/colb/20031231.html


I interpret that as, Ryan's parents (birth or adoptive, or his siblings) were not themselves injured by the DOC, therefore, their suit will not be heard. I don't think pain and suffering of the Brunns counts as injured, but I'm no lawyer.

And the DOC didn't kill him. No deadly force by a DOC employee. He killed himself. Voluntarily.

Personally, considering adoptive mama just filed bankruptcy, I'm wondering who'd volunteer to serve as the family lawyer. Mom and Dad aren't charged for any crimes so they don't get a lawyer pro-bono like Ryan did if they want to sue, assuming this is even a case that would be heard.

(And perhaps because of the reasons stated above, that's why RBs lawyer stated 'it's over'.)

But I'm no lawyer! :crazy: :seeya: