GA - Katherine Janness, 40, fatally stabbed and dog killed, Piedmont Park, Atlanta, 28 July 2021 #2

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I was thinking the same thing. In the dark, it would be hard to see. Emma was looking since she had just found Bowie.
This is only speculation but I think Katie‘s body was staged(fbi, behavioral sciences, something we haven’t seen before). She was close enough to the walkway path and the road that goes thru park to be seen by someone walking by. I’m sure there are some lights inside the park at that area. It may not be terribly bright but I don’t think it would be pitch dark either. Actually, I’d really like to know how dark it is there at midnight. But no way I’m going there at night not with five pit bulls and five large men!

in the video of the runner turning around what can we can see of the road back into the park it looks well lit.

editing to add that I think the killer wanted her found quickly and to create shock. Within a couple of yards of where they were found he could’ve hid her behind a tree but put her near the sidewalk. Bowie as well.
 
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The last time I went to do the park late at night was just before Covid hit. We went to a concert at the botanical gardens. It got out well after dark. Lots of people at least 100 walked through the park to get home or to get to an Uber. Lots of people were parked in the parking garage there as well but a huge crowd had either walked there or taken an Uber like me. We did not walk in the area where Katie was found but near it. I don’t remember thinking it was dark at all.
 
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I'm starting to be concerned that the police/FBI possibly have no leads or suspects in this case. I pray that I am wrong. I just cannot stop thinking about Katie and Bowie. :(
Me too.
I know they have a lot of information and leads but the longer we go without an update the more I fear that this case is super complicated and hard to solve.
It’s only my speculation but I think if it was someone Katie or her girlfriend worked with or someone Katie knew well or someone who was a known witness or the 911 caller there would be an arrest by now.

The first case I followed on the websleuths was Mickey Shunick. There was a well respected long time poster named Foxfire who answered a lot of questions for me and taught me some things. I wish he was still with us. Would love to know his thoughts on this case. Anyway, one thing he said was that when a crime goes unsolved and we don’t know what’s going on behind the scenes in the investigation we tend to start thinking that the killer is smarter and more crafty than they actually are. Foxfire said that most of the time the killer turns out to be just lucky or smart about one or two things like getting away with a crime.
It turned out that in Mickey’s case her killer was not intelligent or special in anyway. He had some luck and he was aware of jurisdictional blindness and took advantage of that.

sorry for the long post. I said all that because the longer this goes on the more I’m afraid that this killer is intelligent and there is more than luck keeping him from being caught.
 
Also, Katie was dressed in black. And her hair was dark. It would have been pretty hard to see her in the dark. Yet the guy yelling in the background during Emma's call saw something that shocked him. We don't know what he saw though, do we?
He definitely saw blood all over Emma, IMO. I don't know if I would have stayed w/her. I would have called LE & probably reported her too from a safe distance...in all honesty.
 
Me too.
I know they have a lot of information and leads but the longer we go without an update the more I fear that this case is super complicated and hard to solve.
It’s only my speculation but I think if it was someone Katie or her girlfriend worked with or someone Katie knew well or someone who was a known witness or the 911 caller there would be an arrest by now.

The first case I followed on the websleuths was Mickey Shunick. There was a well respected long time poster named Foxfire who answered a lot of questions for me and taught me some things. I wish he was still with us. Would love to know his thoughts on this case. Anyway, one thing he said was that when a crime goes unsolved and we don’t know what’s going on behind the scenes in the investigation we tend to start thinking that the killer is smarter and more crafty than they actually are. Foxfire said that most of the time the killer turns out to be just lucky or smart about one or two things like getting away with a crime.
It turned out that in Mickey’s case her killer was not intelligent or special in anyway. He had some luck and he was aware of jurisdictional blindness and took advantage of that.

sorry for the long post. I said all that because the longer this goes on the more I’m afraid that this killer is intelligent and there is more than luck keeping him from being caught.
Awww...I wish Foxfire was still here to chat with us. The fact that the killer took the risk of being so out in the open makes me think he was "disorganized" and careless, however, we haven't heard anything which makes me fear that they have no suspect. :(
 
It really doesn't sound like there's been an official answer on whether Katie walked down Piedmont Road and entered the park through 11th/12th street, or if they continued on 10th and entered that way.. . . . I really hope they reached out to all the residential houses that live East of Monroe and border the park. I'd also wager Park Tavern has some cameras. I really doubt the Killer exited at a main entrance. If I was trying to leave undetected, I'd probably head towards Park Drive or Amsterdam to exit the area.

I read on AJC I believe that LE was going around asking for video of that night from people and businesses in the surrounding area. I think one issue right now is the APD and investigators are overworked with all the violent crime lately. There is just so much of it.

As for the killer leaving the park . . . I think it's probable he just hid somewhere until the police were done in the park, especially if he was bleeding or wounded. Looking at a map of the park I was struck by how close the lake is to the Charles Allen gate. My speculation is that the killer is athletic, or at least very strong, to murder a woman and a dog so quickly and violently, so it seems likely he could possibly have run somewhere in the park to hide, at least for awhile.

The more I wonder how this could have been done the odder it seems. This was a quick strike on both woman and dog. What could the motive for that have been? The killer could not have lingered, given the tight timeline. I hope that homicide profiler has some good ideas.
 
It was open the very next morning. Not roped off or anything just back to how it was, but with flowers at the entrance and where she was found. It was very bizarre in my opinion. I expected it to be closed off.

That is weird. So they were certain they got all available evidence from the grass etc. the night before, in the dark? I would have expected the crime scene taped off for a day or two at least.

Were there any working cameras in that area the next day or two, recording the spot constantly? I'm just thinking of that stereotype of the criminal returning to the scene of the crime, maybe to pick up evidence or just see the spot in the daylight afterwards.
 
My oldest niece will be a freshman at Georgia Tech this year and moves in this weekend. Obviously, I would love for LE to get this guy off the street ASAP — now more than ever. In the meantime, I’ve demanded that my niece follow the laundry list of safety precautions below. :D


Have your keys ready in your hand BEFORE you walk to/from your car. Don’t talk or text on your phone when you’re out alone (at any time — but especially at night).

Keep your keys with you and lock your car doors every time you stop for gas.

Avoid parking in dimly lit areas and avoid spots sandwiched between two vans, large trucks, or SUVs.

Never leave your drink unattended and only accept drinks if you’ve seen them prepare it (even water). Check bottle seals.

Always stay alert and aware of your surroundings. (I know this sounds like a tedious way to live, but maintaining awareness will quickly become second nature.)

Identify areas where a predator could easily conceal himself and avoid them (behind dense shrubbery, in poorly lit doorways or hallways, behind large dumpsters, etc).

Never get in an elevator with a lone male if you’re by yourself.

Don’t wear earbuds/headphones when you exercise.

Never walk past a group of loitering males.

Avoid fringe areas when you’re alone at night — these “in between” places are those we pass thru on our way to/from somewhere else (parking lots, stairwells, elevators, public bathrooms, ATMs, event exits at concerts and sporting events, shortcuts thru parks or alleys, etc).

If a stranger approaches you, draw attention to yourself in any way you can.

If you ever need help, always take the initiative to ask for it (rather than accept it from someone who offers). You’re much less likely to randomly ask someone who wants to harm you versus the other way around.

If someone demands your bag or wallet or jewelry or whatever, always comply. But toss it over their shoulder and then run in the opposite direction when they turn around to grab it.

If a stranger follows you, turn around and face them directly. Firmly tell them you’re not interested in continuing the conversation. Make direct eye contact to let them know you know what’s up and you’re not easy prey.

Don’t let well-established social norms trap you in potentially dangerous situations. Criminals aren’t bound to the rules of a civilized society and often use them to control their victims. They gamble with their lives and freedom every time they commit a crime, and the risk versus reward ratio largely depends on their ability to choose the “right victim”. One of the most critical factors in the victim selection process is an unwillingness to deviate from social norms. A “good” or “safe” victim will behave as they are expected — but narrow their chance of escape by doing so.

Examples of Social Norms: Don’t draw attention to yourself. Don’t lie. Don’t be loud in movie theaters and libraries. Don’t walk outside naked. Don’t take things that don’t belong to you. Don’t drive on the grass. Don’t ignore someone speaking to you. Don’t shove at people in a crowd. Don’t run a red light. Don’t touch anyone without their permission. Don’t skip others waiting in line. Don’t stand too close to people. Don’t speak out of turn. Don’t trespass on someone’s property without their permission.

If you are in danger, all bets (and social rules) are off. Do WHATEVER is needed to ensure your safety. You can worry about traffic tickets, looking crazy, being loud or rude, running thru someone’s yard after they decide you aren’t worth the risk and move on to an easier target.

Use every tool you have at your disposal (and say whatever might be necessary) to convince them you aren’t worth the effort.

If all else fails, aim for body parts where you can do the most damage: eyes (gouge, poke, scratch), nose (strike upwards using the heel of your palm), neck (thrust your elbow into his neck while pitching your weight forward), knee. Then run in a zigzag pattern toward the brightest lit nearby area.

MOST IMPORTANTLY: never get into a car or comply with demands to move to another location (even if he has a gun and threatens to kill you).

If he wants to take you somewhere else, it’s because he can’t carry out his plans where you are now. Your odds of survival are the very best they will ever be in that moment.

YOU ARE NOT EASY PREY, SO DON’T ACT LIKE IT.
 
I looked it up and it was reportedly a home surveillance camera video, although they didn't give a location. That's something I hadn't considered... all the home surveillance footage possible along the park's boundary.

This June 2021 video is a walking tour of a part of Piedmont Park and the surrounding area at night.


It has nothing to do with this case but you can see all the businesses around the park, how well-lit it all looks, the amount of people at night, the traffic, etc. It also includes the two rainbow street crossings starting at 40:24
I would think there would be several cameras around the outside of the park.
Does anyone know what street he's on during the last 10 minutes? (I think the street sign above the entrance seen at the end says "Charles Allen") 49:41
After that, the street looks like it gets very dark.

So you can see that entrance up close as someone is walking by it. And it could have been a possible route she took.
 
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My oldest niece will be a freshman at Georgia Tech this year and moves in this weekend. Obviously, I would love for LE to get this guy off the street ASAP — now more than ever. In the meantime, I’ve demanded that my niece follow the laundry list of safety precautions below. :D


Have your keys ready in your hand BEFORE you walk to/from your car. Don’t talk or text on your phone when you’re out alone (at any time — but especially at night).

Keep your keys with you and lock your car doors every time you stop for gas.

Avoid parking in dimly lit areas and avoid spots sandwiched between two vans, large trucks, or SUVs.

Never leave your drink unattended and only accept drinks if you’ve seen them prepare it (even water). Check bottle seals.

Always stay alert and aware of your surroundings. (I know this sounds like a tedious way to live, but maintaining awareness will quickly become second nature.)

Identify areas where a predator could easily conceal himself and avoid them (behind dense shrubbery, in poorly lit doorways or hallways, behind large dumpsters, etc).

Never get in an elevator with a lone male if you’re by yourself.

Don’t wear earbuds/headphones when you exercise.

Never walk past a group of loitering males.

Avoid fringe areas when you’re alone at night — these “in between” places are those we pass thru on our way to/from somewhere else (parking lots, stairwells, elevators, public bathrooms, ATMs, event exits at concerts and sporting events, shortcuts thru parks or alleys, etc).

If a stranger approaches you, draw attention to yourself in any way you can.

If you ever need help, always take the initiative to ask for it (rather than accept it from someone who offers). You’re much less likely to randomly ask someone who wants to harm you versus the other way around.

If someone demands your bag or wallet or jewelry or whatever, always comply. But toss it over their shoulder and then run in the opposite direction when they turn around to grab it.

If a stranger follows you, turn around and face them directly. Firmly tell them you’re not interested in continuing the conversation. Make direct eye contact to let them know you know what’s up and you’re not easy prey.

Don’t let well-established social norms trap you in potentially dangerous situations. Criminals aren’t bound to the rules of a civilized society and often use them to control their victims. They gamble with their lives and freedom every time they commit a crime, and the risk versus reward ratio largely depends on their ability to choose the “right victim”. One of the most critical factors in the victim selection process is an unwillingness to deviate from social norms. A “good” or “safe” victim will behave as they are expected — but narrow their chance of escape by doing so.

Examples of Social Norms: Don’t draw attention to yourself. Don’t lie. Don’t be loud in movie theaters and libraries. Don’t walk outside naked. Don’t take things that don’t belong to you. Don’t drive on the grass. Don’t ignore someone speaking to you. Don’t shove at people in a crowd. Don’t run a red light. Don’t touch anyone without their permission. Don’t skip others waiting in line. Don’t stand too close to people. Don’t speak out of turn. Don’t trespass on someone’s property without their permission.

If you are in danger, all bets (and social rules) are off. Do WHATEVER is needed to ensure your safety. You can worry about traffic tickets, looking crazy, being loud or rude, running thru someone’s yard after they decide you aren’t worth the risk and move on to an easier target.

Use every tool you have at your disposal (and say whatever might be necessary) to convince them you aren’t worth the effort.

If all else fails, aim for body parts where you can do the most damage: eyes (gouge, poke, scratch), nose (strike upwards using the heel of your palm), neck (thrust your elbow into his neck while pitching your weight forward), knee. Then run in a zigzag pattern toward the brightest lit nearby area.

MOST IMPORTANTLY: never get into a car or comply with demands to move to another location (even if he has a gun and threatens to kill you).

If he wants to take you somewhere else, it’s because he can’t carry out his plans where you are now. Your odds of survival are the very best they will ever be in that moment.

YOU ARE NOT EASY PREY, SO DON’T ACT LIKE IT.
You are the best Aunt ever!!!
 
This June 2021 video is a walking tour of a part of Piedmont Park and the surrounding area at night.


It has nothing to do with this case but you can see all the businesses around the park, how well-lit it all looks, the amount of people at night, the traffic, etc. It also includes the two rainbow street crossings starting at 40:24
I would think there would be several cameras around the outside of the park.
Does anyone know what street he's on during the last 10 minutes?
he is walking down 10th St. the last 10 minutes.
At 49:42 He is at Charles Allen and 10th there at the gate.
Pause it at 49:49 In front of that SUV the white or gray one you can see the robot bathroom in front of it.
 
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He definitely saw blood all over Emma, IMO. I don't know if I would have stayed w/her. I would have called LE & probably reported her too from a safe distance...in all honesty.
Me too! A dead dog bleeding on the walkway and a women with blood on her saying, "did you see that? That's my girlfriend", would create fear in most anyone. One couldn't possibly know what they had walked up on at that point.
 
What really bothers me about this case is where it happened. I know this park like the back of my hand and there are a lot of areas where you wouldn’t feel comfortable being alone. Where Katie’s murder took place is one of the last places in the park that I’d expect a murder to happen.. I wouldn’t feel safe walking alone in Piedmont park after midnight in most places, but would feel pretty comfortable walking alone where she was killed. With the details of the brutality of the murder and the location I really do believe whoever killed her wanted to shock and scare people. Whomever killed her wanted people to come across her mutilated body. This wasn’t just about taking someone’s life.. if that was the case they would have found a much more secluded spot. I believe the murder chose this location. They chose this location to terrorize the community.
 
Sixtymph, I agree with you 100%!
I think the location the bodies were left and that location to shock and I think the killer wanted them to be found right away.

how on earth could someone kill them right there and get away with it for this long.
To me it seems like the killer spent some time at the crime scene. I don’t know how long but The killer would’ve been in that spot for a little while.
 
I can only assume the jogger ran east on 10th, was captured on camera going in and out of the Charles Allen gate around 12:46, continued east on 10th, then turned north/northwest to run on the Beltline Trail, where he was captured again on camera. This is my guess since we don't have a time stamp for the Beltline photos (that I'm aware of).

I have never thought the jogger coming out of the gate seemed like he'd seen anything to spook him in those 41 seconds, but now, knowing he also chose to run the Beltline, I'm even more convinced he saw nothing to make him avoid the park.

Between the entrance lighting, the jogger's headlamp, Bowie reportedly visible from the gate, and Katie visible to the 911 bystander (and Emma, but she was actively looking for her), I am still thinking the bodies were not yet there at 12:46. JMO

All that said, I will acknowledge that if they were behind the bathroom, and the jogger didn't go that far in, maybe he missed it. But Emma apparently saw Bowie from the gate, so...
That jogger has really perplexed me from the 1st time I saw him. If he didn't see anything at 12:46, meaning the crime had not taken place, that means Emma had 24 minutes to get home from work & find Katie & Bowie not home, unable to contact her by phone, activate the find my phone app, get in her car, drive, park, find Bowie, find Katie, run out of the park & call 911. Is that possible?
 
That jogger has really perplexed me from the 1st time I saw him. If he didn't see anything at 12:46, meaning the crime had not taken place, that means Emma had 24 minutes to get home from work & find Katie & Bowie not home, unable to contact her by phone, activate the find my phone app, get in her car, drive, park, find Bowie, find Katie, run out of the park & call 911. Is that possible?

I have also thought that Emma must have been very quick to start texting, looking and then going to find Katie. She maybe had "a feeling" or maybe she is a worrier.

I think it could have been over by 12:46 and the jogger didn't see the bodies, or maybe just saw the dog. In any case, it all had to have happened in a pretty small window of time.

One think I noticed from the video of the walking tour video I posted is that directly past the Charles Allen gate area, the walker/videographer continues down the sidewalk and it suddenly gets very dark. There are suddenly no lights on that area of sidewalk. Was there, or is there, a streetlight out at that spot right after the gate? If so, the killer could have been hiding there where it was so dark, taking advantage of a light being out. The rest of the sidewalk is pretty well lit.
 
This June 2021 video is a walking tour of a part of Piedmont Park and the surrounding area at night.


It has nothing to do with this case but you can see all the businesses around the park, how well-lit it all looks, the amount of people at night, the traffic, etc. It also includes the two rainbow street crossings starting at 40:24
I would think there would be several cameras around the outside of the park.
Does anyone know what street he's on during the last 10 minutes? (I think the street sign above the entrance seen at the end says "Charles Allen") 49:41
After that, the street looks like it gets very dark.

So you can see that entrance up close as someone is walking by it. And it could have been a possible route she took.
Thanks for posting this. You're right, it does get very dark right after the gate. Between that and the information @arfvonarf posted about sketchy routes back to their home on Myrtle, it doesn't seem like Katie would have gone any farther then the Charles Allen gate before turning around. Jmo

This killer committed the crime, apparently, just out of camera view, just out of light, and just between people walking past right before and after.
 
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