GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 6

[Jabarn]

Yes, Ocean. You are correct. I think the perp expected what you describe - body never being found because of decomposition and being eaten by fish, turtles, etc and that's why he dumped here where the lake was sooo deep. He's familiar enough with the lake to know where it's deep. Of course, it's deep right off the Dermond's pier.

I'm sorry about your friend. She committed suicide by drowning? If so, that must be very rare. Maybe not. I have never thought about it. Her lungs would have been filled with water. She would have sunk to the bottom from the weight of the water in her lungs. Mrs. Dermond was dead before she was dumped. Her lungs would not have filled with water. That was determined - Mrs. Dermond was dead before being dumped - no water in the lungs. . . thus, I believe, she did not sink to the bottom. She sunk as far as the weight took her. When the decomposition began. . . well. . . I'll just leave that part out there.

I still hate it there are no leads to help solve the Dermonds' murders. I too still feel it was a lone perpetrator, or at least if anyone was with him, they were a follower, in so much as a a conditioned person to follow someone around for protection, or fear, or some weird version of a faerie tale story, or due to brain damage (thinking of those crimes where a male controls a female, where both are sick, I guess). It is unlikely to me that this crime involved three (or more) equally decisive and controlling personalities.

Anyway, the answer to most crimes is within a matter of miles, maybe less than three in this case. Transient murders are extraordinarily rare, unless of the serial killer variety (not that theory should be completely thrown out). How many weirdos in GA? Probably the same as most states, just need to look at those who live closer to the Dermonds. I don't mean a neighbor of the same economic background with as nice a house. If they came on boat, then look for weirdos in other places along the river.

 

[Canaille]

But why would they go to all that trouble though when it wouldn't even be necessary?

Don't you think any woman in her right mind that had just seen a murderer kill and decapitate her husband would blurt out the combination immediately to any safe they may have had? Taking her hostage wouldn't even be necessary. In fact if that is what they wanted and they had a gun I think Russ or Shirley both would have given it to them right away. A lot of people don't keep safes anymore in their homes because break ins have increased in recent years and use safety deposit boxes at the bank.

The ME never states whether there were multiple blows or not when coming up with the COD. They always put they died from blunt force trauma to the head. They will testify to how many blows of course if and when the suspect is arrested and brought to trial. I think she died from multiple blows.

See so many seem to think the rage was against Russ but to me a murder by a shot to the head is not an up close and personal method of killing someone. But bludgeoning someone to death is a very up close and personal way to murder someone. Usually when that is the way the murder is carried out it is because of anger, rage, resentment or hatred of some kind against the victim by the perpetrator.

BBM

OMG, I seriously doubt I'd be in my right mind if I witnessed my husband (or anyone else) murdered and decapitated! :scared:

So true about the rage against Mr D vs. Mrs. D... I never thought of it that way.

 

[Vedder]

Hi there Cana!

I think he said his torso was dragged a few feet or maybe he said only a short distance.

I don't really know but in my mind I thought he meant dragged a little ways when it was already inside the garage as if he needed to drag him only a short distance so that his torso may have been hidden behind one of their cars or something like that. Of course we have no clue where the drag marks are located in the garage and only Sills and the investigators know that.

Just guessing though.


IMO

I don't recall Sills using the word "dragged" (saying Mr. Dermond was dragged)...didn't he say he was moved a few feet?

Argh I wish we knew more!

 

[atthelake]

I think I understand your question now. The second Mark Winne video with Sheriff Sills does show A LOT of venues, but the first video we saw:

1. A boat being lowered into the water (Sills was telling us how he thought the perps came by water) from storage.

2. Screen widens to focus on neighbors across the cove from the Dermonds and they sit there a good while and ALL you see is that neighbor's house (back of the house) and their pier.

3. Then he takes us to the Dermond's pier. Talks about evidence being obtained.

Here is #1 video with only three venues mentioned above: <RAW VIDEO>

http://www.wsbtv.com/videos/news/raw-video-sheriff-discusses-reynolds-plantation/vCcz4n/

Here is #2 video with many venues: <EDITED VIDEO> Excellent video! Need to listen again!

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/exclusive-sheriff-says-reynolds-plantation-couple-/ngDzD/

TOTALLY missed that! Thanks Boot for taking the time to show BOTH the videos!! :hug:

 

[fred&edna]

Thank you to everyone responsible for the photos on the thread today (blown margins or not )

I've spent the last few minutes trying to enlarge and study the photo (thumbnail below) and it appears to me that there may be outside steps (stairs) from the yard to the second floor. Right side of house... upper part of photo. (Which would mean easy access to both floors from the outside).

Heck, maybe I'm seeing things and/or maybe this has been discussed. I spent the greater part of the afternoon head-down/feet-up enduring a root canal.

 

[atthelake]

Forensic files on HLN highlighting 3 bodies thrown in Tampa Bay..and how they analyzed where put in water etc. FYI

 

[tomkat]

Thank you to everyone responsible for the photos on the thread today (blown margins or not )

I've spent the last few minutes trying to enlarge and study the photo (thumbnail below) and it appears to me that there may be outside steps (stairs) from the yard to the second floor. Right side of house... upper part of photo. (Which would mean easy access to both floors from the outside).

Heck, maybe I'm seeing things and/or maybe this has been discussed. I spent the greater part of the afternoon head-down/feet-up enduring a root canal.

i see them too, i dont recall discussion on this

 

[fred&edna]

i see them too, i dont recall discussion on this

Yay... it's not just me! Thanks!


Now, I'm also wondering if a walkway extends around to the garage?

 

[tomkat]

other forums also discussing "moved a few feet"

http://www.dreamindemon.com/2014/05...ey-dermond-elderly-woman-husband-decapitated/

http://mydeathspace.com/vb/showthre...s-wife-Shirley-(87)-abducted-amp-killed/page2

still looking for article, if it's out there

I also posted a link on decapitation, it was very informative yet probably gruesome

In order to get a clean cut, they may have moved the body a few feet to get the right angle for a single cut

 

[gngr~snap]

other forums also discussing "moved a few feet"

http://www.dreamindemon.com/2014/05...ey-dermond-elderly-woman-husband-decapitated/

http://mydeathspace.com/vb/showthre...s-wife-Shirley-(87)-abducted-amp-killed/page2

still looking for article, if it's out there

I also posted a link on decapitation, it was very informative yet probably gruesome

In order to get a clean cut, they may have moved the body a few feet to get the right angle for a single cut

"When they didn't show friends gave it a couple of days and on Tuesday morning at 10 a.m. they went to the house and discovered Russell Dermond's body in the garage, WMAZ reports. He had been moved a few feet and his head had been removed. Shirley Dermond was nowhere to be found."

http://dunwoody.patch.com/groups/tr...g-in-crime-mystery-that-has-attracted-the-fbi

Sent from my SM-P607T using Tapatalk

 

[charminglane]

I still hate it there are no leads to help solve the Dermonds' murders. I too still feel it was a lone perpetrator, or at least if anyone was with him, they were a follower, in so much as a a conditioned person to follow someone around for protection, or fear, or some weird version of a faerie tale story, or due to brain damage (thinking of those crimes where a male controls a female, where both are sick, I guess). It is unlikely to me that this crime involved three (or more) equally decisive and controlling personalities.

Anyway, the answer to most crimes is within a matter of miles, maybe less than three in this case. Transient murders are extraordinarily rare, unless of the serial killer variety (not that theory should be completely thrown out). How many weirdos in GA? Probably the same as most states, just need to look at those who live closer to the Dermonds. I don't mean a neighbor of the same economic background with as nice a house. If they came on boat, then look for weirdos in other places along the river.

Male/female partner killers. Never even crossed my mind. Thanks.

 

[tomkat]

http://dunwoody.patch.com/groups/po...husband-beheaded-wife-may-have-been-kidnapped

When they didn't show friends gave it a couple of days and on Tuesday morning at 10 a.m. they went to the house and discovered Russell Dermond's body in the garage, WMAZ reports. He had been moved a few feet and his head had been removed. Shirley Dermond was nowhere to be found.

 

[fred&edna]

"When they didn't show friends gave it a couple of days and on Tuesday morning at 10 a.m. they went to the house and discovered Russell Dermond's body in the garage, WMAZ reports. He had been moved a few feet and his head had been removed. Shirley Dermond was nowhere to be found."

http://dunwoody.patch.com/groups/tr...g-in-crime-mystery-that-has-attracted-the-fbi

Sent from my SM-P607T using Tapatalk

This has me wondering if there's a 911 call available on scanner rewind? But, even if there is, it probably wouldn't tell us anything more than we already know.

 

[ela_ss teacher]

Thanks for posting the videos again. NOW I see where people speculated on Mrs. D being weighed down. So here are my questions and thoughts (which may have already been asked and answered ad nauseum)...

1. If I had a deceased body on my boat and I rolled the body out of the boat and into the water, would it sink right away without being weighed down?

If so, then the killer(s) could have, out of sheer ignorance, thought what was rolled into the water would stay in the water. Hence Sills saying they may not have expected her body to rise to the surface. No weights, just ignorance.

2. Didn't we establish that there are trees/large vegetation in the lake?

My thought on this is that Mrs. D was NOT weighed down but merely floated down the lake as she floated to the surface and got tangled in the lake trees.

IDK, I just don't give enough credit to the killer(s) to be very sophisticated. I don't think it was very well thought out. I believe Mrs. D witnessed the murder of her husband, was killed and then dragged (possibly on a tarp or something) into the boat and rolled off into the water. Killer(s) not realizing that she would eventually surface. The delay in surfacing (I feel) has more to do with the vegetation than being weighed down.

As for Mr.D, I feel like his decapitation was an afterthought, to hide the evidence OR just for "fun". I think anyone who has done any hunting and has gutted a deer or cleaned a fish probably had the proper type of knife to do the job.

**All speculation and opinions**

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't recall Sills using the word "dragged" (saying Mr. Dermond was dragged)...didn't he say he was moved a few feet?

Argh I wish we knew more!

You are probably right Vedder. I have read so much, and watched so many videos now that some of it becomes a blur as to exactly what was said.

But don't you think he drug him a few feet and that is how Sills knew he had been moved a few feet? By the drag marks?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Male/female partner killers. Never even crossed my mind. Thanks.

Last Sunday my hubby and I watched the Oxygen Channel and they had "Killer Couples' on all day long and in most of them the female was the evil mastermind behind all the gruesome murders.:scared:

 

[AskMeNoQuestions]

In the video by Mark Winne and Sheriff Sills in the boat at Lake Oconee, the scene opens with the boat being lowered from storage into the water and then the next scene is tight on Sheriff Sills. It then opens up wider and is focused COMPLETELY on the neighbors' house and dock. It is focused on most of the interview and then they gradually move to the Dermonds' dock. Will look for the link to that interview. I did save it, but I have saved so much stuff. Anyway, from that interview, I definitely got the impression that the "area in question" is the Dermond's dock.

I thought he said " we have great footage of the Dermond's dock but not the area in question" to me that sounded like two entirely different locations in the lake. I didn't think that he could have been referring to two different areas of the Dermond's dock. Hmmm. Somebody call him and ask what he meant by that!

 

[Hickory Born]

Last Sunday my hubby and I watched the Oxygen Channel and they had "Killer Couples' on all day long and in most of them the female was the evil mastermind behind all the gruesome murders.:scared:

Femme fatale.

 

[atthelake]

Thank you to everyone responsible for the photos on the thread today (blown margins or not )

I've spent the last few minutes trying to enlarge and study the photo (thumbnail below) and it appears to me that there may be outside steps (stairs) from the yard to the second floor. Right side of house... upper part of photo. (Which would mean easy access to both floors from the outside).

Heck, maybe I'm seeing things and/or maybe this has been discussed. I spent the greater part of the afternoon head-down/feet-up enduring a root canal.

Stairs were not on the tax records survey which I posted earlier today - (see photos that tlcya resized as thumbnails when I blew margins) .. I'm not saying that tax assessors are always correct! Just the layout on the assessors site that DID INDEED show a landing on the uppper floor but no stairs (outside the master?)

Yet..... in all my theories - that would be a moot point... are you thinking that IF there were stairs, the hoodlum(s) came into the house through the second floor?...but yet Mr. D ended up in garage and Mrs. in the lake.

Sorry, not seeing how this connects to a theory.

 

[fred&edna]

Stairs were not on the tax records survey which I posted earlier today - (see photos that tlcya resized as thumbnails when I blew margins) .. I'm not saying that tax assessors are always correct! Just the layout on the assessors site that DID INDEED show a landing on the uppper floor but no stairs (outside the master?)

Yet..... in all my theories - that would be a moot point... are you thinking that IF there were stairs, the hoodlum(s) came into the house through the second floor?...but yet Mr. D ended up in garage and Mrs. in the lake.

Sorry, not seeing how this connects to a theory.

DANG... you want an accompanying theory, TOO?!?! lol

Heck, if I had one then someone might suggest I was "conjuring" ideas