GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #6

[SnoopyDawgDawg]

The smell would of be overwhelming. I am surprise he made it out of his parking lot with out looking around. That just makes me so sick.

I think LE has more on video. That is why he is not being released on bond.

Oh yes, the smell would be overwhelming.

I don't know of any nice way of putting this, so I'll just say it. I have smelled a human body which has been exposed to elements. The smell is like nothing else in this world. Even if you have never smelled it before, you instinctively know what it is, and there is an overwhelming need to wretch your guts out.

The smell stays with you for days to come (and haunts your dreams). Many EMTs and LEOs say once you've smelled it, you never forget it, and I firmly believe them. I know I never will, and I hope I never have to smell it again.

The point being: I firmly believe that if that awful smell was present in that car, I seriously doubt this man could have made it out of the parking space much less the lot or down the street without having to bail out of the car and investigate the source or quickly change his cover story. I doubt he would have mistaken it for a diaper, dead squirrel, day-old chicken sandwich, rotting shrimp, chicken livers, or anything else.

And if this person drove down the street with his own child exuding that smell, knowing that it was his own child exuding that smell, then this person is devoid of feelings and has teflon-coated olfactory senses and a stomach of steel.

 

[Melanie]

The First Years True Fit™ IAlert™ Convertible Car Seat…:
I won't be having any more babies, but I would think about purchasing this for a grandbaby.
Maybe the price will go down before mine are born!!
Still people can't solely rely on electronics, I worry that might happen.
http://youtu.be/J7kYpbYXoK4

OMGosh - this is just fabulous! I never heard of such a thing when my wee one was a tot (now 17).

Too bad Mr. Harris didn't have this technology

RIP Cooper

 

[sorrell skye]

I do. I think that many people don't know that a 70 degree car in the sun and with the windows rolled up can be like an oven in a few mins.

I can totally see the search without any evil intent.

I think anyone who lives in the South, and who has gotten into their car on a hot afternoon and has felt the sweltering heat of the interior of that car before the a/c cools it down knows without a shadow of a doubt how blazing hot a car becomes when it sits in the sun in the summertime.

I don't think it takes a genius to know that.

These two are college educated people - one with a degree in computer sciences, the other a degree in nutrition (which requires many life science courses).

These two have lived in the South their entire lives. They would know that cars get hot in the summertime. Just parking for a few minutes to run into the grocery store, they would have experienced a miserably hot car upon return on more than one occasion during the course of their lives.

Hot car deaths regarding pets and children are featured on the nightly news often enough that most folks have heard about at least one tragic story during their lifetimes.

I firmly believe that if a parent was truly fearful they might forget their child in the car, they would take proactive steps to ensure it would never happen. They would find a method that works for them to prevent it from happening.

Researching how hot a car needs to be for a child to die is not, IMO, seeking a solution to prevent forgetting. To me, it smacks of seeking information about how to go about either leaving a child in a car without killing them, or how to kill a child in a hot car.

As others have posted in these threads, I, too, wonder if they have a history of occasionally leaving their child in the car.

At this point, based on the available information, it doesn't appear to me that prevention methods were the objective with the online searches. If more information comes out that shows they looked up tips and tricks to prevent accidentally forgetting, I'll gladly change my mind.

 

[Nana46]

Just some personal experience about decomposition, CPR, and death notifications.

Last August, I went to check on my SIL, whom family members hadn't been able to contact for a couple of days.

I got her key from her neighbor, and opened her front door afraid that I might smell something. No odors. So that was a good sign. However, I found my SIL dead in bed - cold to the touch and with obvious livor mortis.

I don't know why I didn't call 911 from my cell phone or my SIL's home phone, but I went next door and called from the neighbor's (I suppose I wanted to get out o the house).

The 911 operator asked if I was sure she was dead. I said yes, she was cold and had livor mortis (I thought I might have to explain how I know about this from crime forums!). But the 911 operator wanted me to perform CPR anyway. So I went back over to my SIL's, called back 911 from my cell, and I had to do CPR until the paramedics arrived. [So if a bystander had called 911 about Cooper, they may have told him to do CPR even though he was obviously dead.]

The sheriff and a chaplain came. The sheriff asked who the next of kin was. I don't remember if the sheriff offered to do the notification or not - I remember I said I would drive to my niece's house to tell her in person.

The house was a comfortable, but not hot temperature. There was no air conditioning. Time of death was estimated to be 24-48 hours earlier. There was no discernible odor at all. [No comparison to Cooper's case here.]

Thank you for sharing. And for the record here, I just searched livor mortis to be sure I understood correctly!

 

[newone]

I looked at the map (here) of his driving direction into the parking lot and it wasn't at all odd under the circumstances. Hard to explain unless you're looking at the photo, so I won't try. But do look before you decide that's important, imo. I thought it might be and that's why I looked.

I have seen the map just can't get my head wrapped around the idea of him looking for a dumpster......((security cameras abound))...if he was going to ''dump'' the body that could have been 'awkward'

 

[DeDee]

I don't know. If the smell was HORRIBLE - that's one thing. I'm very curious to hear what others said about the odor at the scene - I'm sure the car was taken to forensics and gone over. If I open the car up and a FOUL odor whooshes out at me, I would search it before getting in.

If I got in and the car smelled funky, and as I drove more it smelled funkier, I think I'd first imagine some awful thing was in the atmosphere. I'd turn the AC to "recirc" and maybe roll down a window to see if the smell was coming from outside.

I guess the basis of this is that I don't believe a baby would smell all THAT foul after such a short period. A cop saying it "stunk to high heaven" might indicate he could detect an odor he knew - human decomposition - in that car. It may not turn out that the smell was so awful as the media says.

Coroners wouldn't be able to do their jobs if little babies like that stunk to high heaven after 4 hours, IMHO.

It was 7 hours that Cooper was left alone in the hot vehicle. His tiny body was in rigor.

Many bodies are in various stages of decomposition before they are discovered dead. Coroners wear masks over their nose and mouth. They also use an oil of peppermint applied directly to the mask. Further, many medical examiners facilities have adequate or proper ventilation to prevent the odor of putrefaction from prevailing. These odors are from highly toxic gases.

The intense and unique odor of putrefaction inside the vehicle is what garnered the officers attention. How could this man enter his vehicle and drive 1 - 2 minutes without puking is a mystery to me.

Reporter Randy Travis: "He should have known immediately because of the smell." Witness quotes: It "reeked." "It smelled to high heavens of a dead body."

The reason LE took him in to question him is because they could not understand how a man could drive any distance and not realize his child was dead in the carseat. This is a horrible, sad and tragic story.

http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/clip/10304691/story-didn39t-make-sense

 

[princesslisa]

I have two little ones, and if my husband left our kids in the car to die - whether accidentally or not (I live in a VERY hot climate), I would not 'forgive' him or be understanding. I would be a grieving mother, and I would be so resentful and angry that life would stop. Is that healthy? No. But, I have met mothers who have lost children at various points (still birth through adult hood) and NONE of them reacted 'rationally.'

Are we even sure that he was at Chick Fil A if there weren't any witnesses? I've read that he was late for work - was this the reason? Or, did he make up the Chick Fil A stop because he was actually late for work due to drugging the baby/waiting for whatever was given to him to kick in? Maybe he was late because he knew most everyone would be at work already and so the chances of someone seeing Cooper would be more slim (which would guarantee his death)?

 

[newone]

Along the lines of wondering if one or both of them had done this before - maybe this was a bone of contention between them and it set off a duel of online searches to determine who was correct and who wasn't.......

 

[Karmady]

I have seen the map just can't get my head wrapped around the idea of him looking for a dumpster......((security cameras abound))...if he was going to ''dump'' the body that could have been 'awkward'

Oh, I seriously don't think he was looking for a dumpster. I'm not gonna get all blunt again lol

 

[JeannaT]

IMO Coroners smell dead bodies which are alot worse than that. They still have to perform autopsys.

Right. I'm going off a reliable link that says a "well run morgue should not smell". I just don't think this little bitty person stunk so bad after that little bit of time.

 

[Nana46]

Did Dad usually visit the baby on his lunch break?

Also...the googling is just too much for me. If they had googled a type of child death that happens often, like car accidents, car-seat dangers, choking on toys, for instance, and one of those things happened...I would still be wary but would be far, far less so. This is just too specific for something that really happens very rarely, statistically. And it is not like they had just moved to a warm climate.

That part bothered me also Clu....plus he is/was a coach or referee or something like that in his spare time...so he was used to be out in the elements....our south is hot.....nothing further to say.

 

[JeannaT]

I have two little ones, and if my husband left our kids in the car to die - whether accidentally or not (I live in a VERY hot climate), I would not 'forgive' him or be understanding. I would be a grieving mother, and I would be so resentful and angry that life would stop. Is that healthy? No. But, I have met mothers who have lost children at various points (still birth through adult hood) and NONE of them reacted 'rationally.'

Are we even sure that he was at Chick Fil A if there weren't any witnesses? I've read that he was late for work - was this the reason? Or, did he make up the Chick Fil A stop because he was actually late for work due to drugging the baby/waiting for whatever was given to him to kick in? Maybe he was late because he knew most everyone would be at work already and so the chances of someone seeing Cooper would be more slim (which would guarantee his death)?

Yes. Some people forgive, others don't. I'm inclined to think I would have a very hard time forgiving. Or forgiving myself, frankly.

Other Christians forgive people who kill their loved ones on purpose. So, it's all over the map.

 

[MyBelle]

I'm curious about that as well.

Something is really off with the father's actions that morning, imo. They seem calculated to be hurtful to the mother. Someone posted that the mother is a registered dietician. If so, I find it difficult to believe she was okay with her son having breakfast at Chic fil-A. The father then "forgot" to take the child to his daycare and "forgot" to pick him up. He made plans to meet friends after work. Did he phone his wife and let her know he wasn't coming straight home? If she was out of town, did he call her to see if she had returned? The motive may be one of control.

 

[cluciano63]

OT but many marriages end following the death of a child, even if the death was from disease, car accident, etc...they feel the other spouse is not grieving enough, or secretly blame them, etc...

 

[Tricia]

We need to find out exactly how long sweet little Cooper was in that hot car after he passed away.

If it can be proven that the smell would be unmistakable then that would do it for me as well.

 

[x_files]

Something is really off with the father's actions that morning, imo. They seem calculated to be hurtful to the mother. Someone posted that the mother is a registered dietician. If so, I find it difficult to believe she was okay with her son having breakfast at Chic fil-A. The father then "forgot" to take the child to his daycare and "forgot" to pick him up. He made plans to meet friends after work. Did he phone his wife and let her know he wasn't coming straight home? If she was out of town, did he call her to see if she had returned? The motive may be one of control.

yes, I felt it when he said "Cooper never did anything to anyone."
I bet he resented she would be out of town that day and he couldn't go drinking with his bros.
Do we know why she was NOT at work that day but "out-of-town" yet?

 

[princesslisa]

I just mean that it seems way too soon to be singing your husbands praises, saying that you're not mad at him, looking at the bright side ('Oh well, he won't have to go through grade school!) It just seems so phony.

I know everyone grieves differently, but... It's your child, you know? They're gone, never coming back. I had a friend who had a loved one commit a brutal suicide, and her therapist told her that murders and suicides are grieved twice - because your mind cannot wrap itself around both the death and the circumstances of the death.

Regardless of faith, I can't imagine being so forgiving of the person who left your child to die in an extremely horrific fashion.

ETA: People here bring up good points - about control. Is it possible he abused his wife? I wonder if this was his idea and she went along with it because she was afraid of him if she didn't?

 

[JeannaT]

We need to find out exactly how long sweet little Cooper was in that hot car after he passed away.

If it can be proven that the smell would be unmistakable then that would do it for me as well.

Tricia, I think it's clear he was in there for at least 4 hours, and maybe 6, after he passed away.

I can't find any resource that says there would be any smell - at all - in that time. But the resources don't account for baking hot cars.

It's hard to know.

 

[Melanie]

I miss him with all of heart. Would I bring him back? No. To bring him back into this broken world would be selfish - Mom.

IMHO - they no longer wanted him in this world. How could any mother say this about their child shortly after his death. Did she care so little for Cooper that she didn't want him back? I am a mother of a wonderful boy -- and although he's older now, he is my ONE-derful, my life, and who I care about most in this world (second to my DH). I don't understand. Is it grief? Is she protecting him? Did she want Cooper dead.

And then this woman goes on to say "if we have more children, he will be a great father". Why would you want to bring more children into this broken world.

That statement just breaks my heart.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4zrHQZub50

3:50 minute mark.

Mel

 

[newone]

Something is really off with the father's actions that morning, imo. They seem calculated to be hurtful to the mother. Someone posted that the mother is a registered dietician. If so, I find it difficult to believe she was okay with her son having breakfast at Chic fil-A. The father then "forgot" to take the child to his daycare and "forgot" to pick him up. He made plans to meet friends after work. Did he phone his wife and let her know he wasn't coming straight home? If she was out of town, did he call her to see if she had returned? The motive may be one of control.

I 'think' that premise may hold some promise -- how many times have you noticed one parent is more cavalier about safety than the other and how much of a problem it raises.