GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #6

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I've been thinking about this too, trying to think of a believable reason/excuse for going to the vehicle... The best idea I can come up with would be if his phone needed charging?

(This was my first post. I hope I didn't screw it up.)

yes -- maybe he charged it in the office and put the charger back in the car -- smart phones are ''juice suckers'' for sure. Maybe he charged it at work at his desk and put the charger back in at lunch.

Welcome to WS
 
I've been thinking about this too, trying to think of a believable reason/excuse for going to the vehicle... The best idea I can come up with would be if his phone needed charging?



(This was my first post. I hope I didn't screw it up.)


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But a special trip????

I don't know about you, but the last thing is want to do on any break would be to walk to my car when it's 90+ degrees outside to put something inside it!
Whatever it was, it could have waited until I was done for the day.

And whatever it was...police are purposefully keeping from us. IMO


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Maybe he took out to his vehicle, an air freshener..............some type of personal computer/tablet that he'd searched for info on that he didn't want to risk anyone finding (eg: if for any reason employer or LE searched work computer).......maybe he had a secret pay-as-you-go/disposable phone to speak privately w/ wife/someone else that he didn't want to risk anyone finding. Heck.........maybe he left his vehicle running when he got out of it in the morning, with plans to carbon monoxide Cooper.......and went out at lunch to shut vehicle off so he didn't run himself out of gas (that would be a hard one to explain). So many things he could have taken out there. Maybe whatever he took out there, he 'tossed' out the window before he arrived at the mall for his big dramatic performance? Or maybe he took nothing of significance out to vehicle......but just used doing so as a reason to check on Cooper. Wonder how long he was at his vehicle for?
 
I would love to see the text and phone records of mom & dad that day.
 
Yes, I understand.

My point was how are they going to prove which one conducted the search.

They have various ways starting with common sense if it's on the desktop. What time stamp? Was dad at work at that time, etc.

Find the search she takes credit for and see where else they went during that time on internet. Was it to one of her sites or his. They will be able to find out.
 
Maybe he took out to his vehicle, an air freshener..............some type of personal computer/tablet that he'd searched for info on that he didn't want to risk anyone finding (eg: if for any reason employer or LE searched work computer).......maybe he had a secret pay-as-you-go/disposable phone to speak privately w/ wife/someone else that he didn't want to risk anyone finding. Heck.........maybe he left his vehicle running when he got out of it in the morning, with plans to carbon monoxide Cooper.......and went out at lunch to shut vehicle off so he didn't run himself out of gas (that would be a hard one to explain). So many things he could have taken out there. Maybe whatever he took out there, he 'tossed' out the window before he arrived at the mall for his big dramatic performance? Or maybe he took nothing of significance out to vehicle......but just used doing so as a reason to check on Cooper. Wonder how long he was at his vehicle for?
BBM: Working off the theory that he knows the baby is in the car and needed an excuse to go to the car to "discover" baby Cooper, I would think he wanted to take something of significance. Otherwise, his reason for being out there is suspect. IMO
 
They have various ways starting with common sense if it's on the desktop. What time stamp? Was dad at work at that time, etc.



Find the search she takes credit for and see where else they went during that time on internet. Was it to one of her sites or his. They will be able to find out.


You didn't follow the Casey Anthony case ?


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IIRC the "web searches" in the Casey Anthony trial became very ambiguous when her mother claimed that *she* was the one to have done the searches (http://newsfeed.time.com/2011/06/23...hell-mother-searched-internet-for-chloroform/), so perhaps wife claiming to have to done the searches is some form of early mitigation strategy for a future trial defense.

This is just my armchair opinion at this point, but I drive a white vehicle in Florida, and I won't even let my adult boyfriend get into the car before I've opened the windows and let the heat out of the interior when we've been out on a summer day. I have no kids, but I wig out when I leave even my smartphone in the car for more than a few minutes, I've cooked a few electronics that way.

I also am vocal if I see in animal in a hot car; a guest of a neighbor did this, and we ended up calling animal control to intervene ... I stayed next to the car until they arrived to make sure of the health of the animal, if the dog had gotten lethargic, I'd have broken the ^$%% window. A dark tint on the windows and no noise, I may never have known.

I don't care how dis-associative you are, wouldn't the briefest DOUBT of where your kid might be make you check your car sooner than lunchtime?

Finally, I just feel even Mom here is a bit off, the comments attributed to her sound as if she's reconciled with the loss somehow already. Everyone's grief process is different, but I can't conceive how this is even possible, even in shock, to make like you wouldn't want this child in this world even if you could have him back, etc. I find these statements completely perplexing.
 
Would Leanna be able to pick up Cooper from daycare, since it was for Home Depot employees? They could be very strict about that. My mom's company also uses Bright Horizons daycare, and of course this differs by company, but at her work, you need to have your employee pass to get passed the guards and enter the campus (where the daycare + work buildings are). Maybe you need a special pass to enter the daycare building, one that only Home Depot employees are able to receive.

A parent would ALWAYS be able to pick up from daycare, if they are not expressly barred from picking up their children by court order (not allowed visitation, etc.). She is his Mom, for goodness' sake, and they were married. I don't think this is a possibility. If she needed an employee pass, I'm sure they would let her have a guest one or something.
 
Wait till you get there then. No one's denying the smell. They're just explaining how it's consistent with an accident.

ANY kind of smell that can be associated with the human body, even an "accident" smell - actually, maybe ESPECIALLY an "accident" smell, is going to make me take notice that my child is in the car. Right away, not 10 minutes into a drive! Most likely even 3 hours in, when I open the driver door to put something in the car. Especially if this smell has been stewing in a stifling car for hours. Defies logic and reason that anyone could ignore that, unless they had no sense of smell.
 
I haven't heard any report that he said he heard a noise followed by a bad smell. Only that Cooper was choking!

I am not going to read through every single post to find these quotes that are being discussed (I don't frankly have the time) but I can say that Ross Harris said Cooper was "choking" at the scene, and there is no documentation I have read anywhere that says that corpses can choke! Belch, lose control of bowels and bladder, and eerie noises, sure. Choking, no.
 
I'm thinking that he planned on going as far as his friends to do the 'big reveal'-"'OMG, Cooper! I forgot to bring him to daycare thing.' What better place than friends who know you and love you and know you would never do anything to harm your son? I'm thinking the body burped or released gas or twitched-and scared the heck out of him. That might be why he 'screeched off the highway' and pulled in to the parking lot. If the baby groaned or loudly belched..he might have freaked out. Might also be why he called out to strangers the baby was choking...he researched time and temps-he might not have researched what happens to the body after death-or the belches, burps, gas etc that can happen after. When my 86 year old mom passed, and I was waiting for the coroner, she sighed and burped. We knew she had passed-my daughter is a nurse-and I knew some stuff from being here in the forum-but it was still pretty scary! If it was behind me in the back seat, I know I would have freaked!
 
A parent would ALWAYS be able to pick up from daycare, if they are not expressly barred from picking up their children by court order (not allowed visitation, etc.). She is his Mom, for goodness' sake, and they were married. I don't think this is a possibility. If she needed an employee pass, I'm sure they would let her have a guest one or something.
Yes, I don't live in Georgia, but I'm pretty sure child care can't deny a parent access to their child, in any state, unless there's legal paperwork on our school file stating that parent can't have access. I explain this to parents all the time. Even if the custodial parent didn't add the other parent to the "family" or "emergency contact" sections of the registration packet, if a biological or adoptive parent comes in with paperwork and identification, unless I've got the paperwork saying they can't take the child, all I can do is call the custodial parent as soon as they leave, or possibly try to stall then while a co-worker calls. IMO because this is based on experience.
 
ANY kind of smell that can be associated with the human body, even an "accident" smell - actually, maybe ESPECIALLY an "accident" smell, is going to make me take notice that my child is in the car. Right away, not 10 minutes into a drive! Most likely even 3 hours in, when I open the driver door to put something in the car. Especially if this smell has been stewing in a stifling car for hours. Defies logic and reason that anyone could ignore that, unless they had no sense of smell.
I don't think accident here meant potty accident, but the entire incident as an accident versus an intentional act?
 
Patsy Ramsey did. She said JonBenét would never have to know the pain of losing a child or the possibility of getting cancer. In her deposition, she said she was scared of dying but she wasn't after JonBenét died because "she had to go there" and she could enjoy her son in the meantime.

Yes. I know. JonBenet also didn't get to go to college or have a wedding and children. Really hard to imagine finding a good side to your child being dead.:moo::moo:
 
Yes, I don't live in Georgia, but I'm pretty sure child care can't deny a parent access to their child, in any state, unless there's legal paperwork on our school file stating that parent can't have access. I explain this to parents all the time. Even if the custodial parent didn't add the other parent to the "family" or "emergency contact" sections of the registration packet, if a biological or adoptive parent comes in with paperwork and identification, unless I've got the paperwork saying they can't take the child, all I can do is call the custodial parent as soon as they leave, or possibly try to stall then while a co-worker calls. IMO because this is based on experience.

Me too. Thanks for confirming that. I'm a former child care worker/preschool teacher and now going into elementary ed. Nice to meet a kindred spirit! Welcome to this discussion.
 
That's the theory. Local tv interviewed someone who was inside the retail space where Harris ran inside and told them to call 911. The person they interviewed said they thought it was a little odd in hindsight that he came in and asked them to call when most people carry a cell phone. Knowing his bad luck that day he probably left it @ work.

Theory: RH used to be a LE dispatch. Many times in cases of murder, the 911 call was evaluated regarding the comments made, the authenticity of the emotion, leading with an alibi and other slip ups on the 911 call. If he was in the middle of a theatrical outburst he may have wisely decided not to be the one who made the 911 call so that his voice and reactions could not be evaluated later.

I think he had his phone with him. After he asked someone else to call 911, he was observed talking on his phone.

Yes he had his phone.

IMO it's more like psychopath that didn't study the role he needed to play. "Grieving horrified loving father" just wasn't in his repertoire


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Yep, I wonder if he practiced.


I'd like to point out about the mother again, I feel uncomfortable to see people ripping apart her statements. Granted to some they may seem a little weird, but most people don't have their funeral statements dissected in front of the whole world. If she is innocent in this I think it is very cruel to do this.

I have a friend who is a born again Christian and years ago there was a fire in her daughters apartment building. It was a mess and she kept saying "Praise God! God is good!" I thought it was a little off putting especially because a man who had gone through the building waking people up and banging on doors perished in the fire. But she said he took his angel home. That man was a hero who saved others and went home to his maker. Etc. I think she was in a manic state after the fire.

In my personal opinion this woman is facing a tidal wave of devastation and an emotional bottomless pit. She is hanging on to that manic high at the moment to save herself. And I can't judge her for that.

Also, IMVHO as an atheist, it's a little strange to watch people with "their beliefs" ridiculing someone else for "their beliefs." Beliefs are irrational and emotional and spiritual. We have to respect that we might not understand why a person sees the world the way they do, but it's their world that they are living in, not ours. JMVHO


This conversation has been very interesting. I would agree that they need to take the death penalty off the table because if they don't I don't think he will be convicted. There's too much emotional bias at the idea of it MIGHT have been an accident and we can't execute someone for an accident.

Even though I think he deliberately did this, I would be fine with him getting 10 years in prison because at least that way SOME price is paid.

Playing devils advocate for a second.

I don't think the smell is a strong enough argument to be bringing into the discussion. As I posted earlier, we don't hear from WITNESSES on the scene anything about an overwhelming smell. They were close enough to see the body so they should have smelled something, if it was that strong. It could be true that while handling the body the smells were released. A long 'burrrrrping" sound emitting from the childs body "could" have sounded like a choking sound and then the smell suddenly overtakes the car and he pulls over. We only heard from LE that they noticed it, but LE is trained in this differently than the average person. RH is just an average person.

Even though some of us can say that we don't think this is what happened, it is POSSIBLE. So I hope the DA doesn't go down this line of argument and try to push it as evidence. Doing so creates Reasonable Doubt, IMO.

What I think we need to stick to are the actual time stamps and facts and evidence that we can prove without a doubt.

To me these include the following.

A. He and his wife were both worried about this happening enough to google it. (IMO it doesn't matter HOW he googled it. We've all looked up weird things on the internet. Perhaps he got curious about an animal in the same situation seeing it being discussed on similar sites. Benefit of the doubt.) But the bottom line is that they WERE worried about this happening.


B. He stopped at Chikfila before going to work. I need to really know exactly the situation of that stop. There will obviously be surveillance video to show what he did at Chikfila. But thus far it seems that he took the child out of the car and put him back in. Then he drove to work.

Benefit of the doubt number 2. The child, having been just out of the car for a few minutes, settled back in quietly on the ride. Most of the comments I've seen about how "other people's children" acted in cars are too personalized for me to use to evaluate this situation. The argument could go either way based on the statement "Hi Red Car" and Cooper's talkativeness that has been documented by the parents.

A. He should have been yapping up a storm according to the DA.

B. Defense Attorney jumps up and says "Yes, he should have and this is the problem. They were so used to Cooper chatting in the car, that when he fell silent this contributed to his father forgetting about him! You seee????"


So Cooper's behavior in the car that morning is an unknown and unproveable issue. Bringing it up only creates Reasonable Doubt. It doesn't destroy it.


What I'd need to know is the plan for the day. Because there is another possibility here in that his wife may have forgotten to pick him up from day care. If it was HER day to pick him up, (which is evidenced by RH having plans with friends right after work) it could be that the husband didn't expect to have to stop by the daycare center after work which is why he left the office and jumped straight on the road.

It's possible. It's also possible that the father as the leader of the house took the full responsibility for the incident. Perhaps this is why he came across so fake in the parking lot, he was trying draw the attention off his wife failing to pick him up, onto himself. In this case he martyred himself to save his wife, which might be why she's so supportive of him right now. Perhaps.

So I'd need to see some details on their schedule and routine. I'd need to know when he made the plans with his friends and whether they expected him to be bringing Cooper or if he had already stated that "mom's got him, so we can have a baby free fun time." Etc.

The surveillance tapes from the HD parking lot are also very important. I suppose I have this image of it being very clear, but it might be at a distance and not clear. I personally don't think the LE and DA would be going forward as strongly as they are unless they have irrefutable evidence that he did something wrong.

IMPO he went to the car in the afternoon to discover the body. But I want to see what he did on the surveillance tape.
 
I don't think accident here meant potty accident, but the entire incident as an accident versus an intentional act?

You're probably right. It's hard to tell when it's a post referring to another post and I don't have the patience or time to go back and find the original post out there.
 
Thank you JeannaT. Maybe someone from The Body Farm in Tennesse would know more.

There has got to be some idea as to whether there would be a smell or not in this situation.

See the media thread. Cops on scene said there was a smell. Cannot link from tablet
 
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