GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #7

[Tawny]

On the subject of apps for kids in cars, the issue arises when parents refuse to acknowledge this could ever happen to them (accidental car heat death, I mean), and those people wouldn't use that app anyway.

If you're aware this could happen, I feel IMO you're more likely to be aware at all moments that it's possible and more alert to when your kid is in the car.

Saying "This could never happen to me, I'm a good parent" is the worst thing a parent could say about anything, be it car heat deaths, drownings, abuse, accidents... etc.

JMHO.

 

[southerncat]

Also, not sure how old Cooper was in that car seat photo, but he looks a lot younger than 2 years. Maybe around 9-12 months? So if he was using that car seat, he would have been bigger and come up higher on the back of it.

My son is 9 months and is large for his age. He is almost to the height limit on that same seat. If I did not have a mirror in the back with him I would not be able to see him. His head does not stick out over the top. Same goes for his convertible.

 

[LietKynes]

There are certain instances where the use of mental health problems as an excuse to harm one's children annoys the hell out of me.
There are people who suffer from depression and sometime severe psychosis who still have not harmed their kids ; or have even had themselves committed to prevent themselves from hurting or killing anyone.
Not trying to judge anyone who truly did not know what was going on ... but this RH does not seem to be one of those unfortunate people.
MOO

 

[popsicle]

On the subject of apps for kids in cars, the issue arises when parents refuse to acknowledge this could ever happen to them (accidental car heat death, I mean), and those people wouldn't use that app anyway.

If you're aware this could happen, I feel IMO you're more likely to be aware at all moments that it's possible and more alert to when your kid is in the car.

Saying "This could never happen to me, I'm a good parent" is the worst thing a parent could say about anything, be it car heat deaths, drownings, abuse, accidents... etc.

JMHO.

If you're aware this could happen.... and then you don't do anything to prevent it.

Saying "This could never happen to me, I'm a good parent"... because you take the time and attention and precautions to ensure this doesn't happen to you.

jmo

 

[Starry Night]

:grouphug: I'm sorry.

Thank you Pops-I have no humans for Grandchildren-he was what he was-his name was Blue-and the Apple of my DD's eye. Originally belonged to her husband serving in the U.S. Navy.
Enough of that though.

I wish Gitana was here to give us more of her knowledge and insight into tomorrow's Hearing. .
She has a way of calming me down ha ha.

 

[lillybell]

I think that is exactly what he wanted to happen and sooner than later. Hence the "how long to die" research. It didn't happen though. He checked at lunch. Waited some more and hoped someone would see the baby in the back. Again nothing.

Then he panicked. Drove in a stinking reeking car trying to decide where to pull over and make his dramatic discovery in front of witnesses, where he could put on his show.

I do not think that was ever part of his plan. I think he wanted the discovery to be made, by someone else, in his work parking lot. Then he would be notified and could have his breakdown right there.

That plan ^^^ would ( in his mind) make his "innocent" forgetfulness more believable than 7 full hours of forgetting and then driving around for 10 minutes in a car that stunk to the high heavens. I believe this is where the "my son is choking" comment came from....he was panicking as he had no plan B and was forced to improvise at the end of his work day.

If you think about it, everything that he does after 12 noon makes him look the most guilty. The going into the car....not noticing Cooper. The getting back in the car at 4 and driving for 10 minutes in a putrid vehicle, he didn't smell anything that tipped him off, instead a "choking" dead cooper alerted him that his son was in trouble. Without the events from Noon on, we only have a father who "forgot."

His original plan did not work.

That is just my opinion.

Yep, I agree. I think it didn't go to plan and the outcome was certainly not what he was expecting!

I've been thinking about that lunch time trip to the car, could he have gone to check on cooper, realised that he was still alive( maybe just), and seen or heard him choking? Then when he went into 'acting mode', shouting what have I done etc, he slipped up and remembered The earlier choking incident x

 

[ahintexas]

Wonder if he took the seat out with the baby in it or if he unbuckled him??

I also would think you could see the top of the rear facing seat. At least a little bit of it. If it's that far down he most certainly seen him in there at lunch time and as he got in the car.

I doubt he took the car seat out, and LE would leave it in for evidence. I have a Tahoe, and I can see the top of my rear facing seat through the windows. I can also see top of daughters head in the rear view mirror.

 

[Tawny]

If you're aware this could happen.... and then you don't do anything to prevent it.

Saying "This could never happen to me, I'm a good parent"... because you take the time and attention and precautions to ensure this doesn't happen to you.

jmo

There are plenty of people who insist they are great parents who don't take the time and precautions to prevent it. They assume it would never happen to them, so they don't bother to pay extra attention.

Being aware it could happen is what makes someone a great parent, IMHO. Admitting you could possibly someday make a mistake like that is what will prompt you to take those precautions.

(general you, btw, not direct at you )

 

[southerncat]

I have a question about daycare. Is it normal for daycare's to contact you if your child is absent? My older two are in a daycare/preschool and I don't know if they have a policy on calling parent's or not. The facility we use is small and they are very close with the kids. I always let them know if we are going to be out but I've wondered if all parent's are like that or if I am just strange.

If this is an onsite facility they may have different policies? Has it been verified it was an onsite facility?

 

[2door73chevy]

i have not seen this posted and it's not much but since RH loved music maybe he had the radio/ipod on when in the car with Cooper and was really into music and did not hear him babble or talk.

just thinking out loud....

 

[Spice]

Yep, I agree. I think it didn't go to plan and the outcome was certainly not what he was expecting!

I've been thinking about that lunch time trip to the car, could he have gone to check on cooper, realised that he was still alive( maybe just), and seen or heard him choking? Then when he went into 'acting mode', shouting what have I done etc, he slipped up and remembered The earlier choking incident x

Ugg. Maybe. It could be that Cooper was making postmortem sounds at noon? A medical expert stated that Cooper would be dead within an hour at those temperatures. So he was likely dead for a couple of hours by noon. And decomposition speeds up RAPIDLY in high temperatures.

I think the window of death was between 15 minutes and one hour for someone as small as Cooper. Maybe his body was emitting gasses etc...when RH checked the car at noon and he heard what could be described as gurgling and choking.

It made me sick to type that. Really.

 

[Maiko]

This is a fast moving thread! I'm trying to catch up...

I saw this this morning, just sharing for information.

http://murfreesboro.com/child-trapped-in-hot-car-law-has-a-catch/

“In the past people have been hesitant to take action when they do see a child left unattended in a car,” said Cavaliero.

Reading that just breaks my heart. I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to take action if I saw a child in a locked vehicle.

RIP Cooper.

 

[sorrell skye]

That appears to be a light blue Tucson parked under that tree. The reserved spaces you see in the front are the first row across the street from the building.

that is interesting. I'm betting they have CCTV for that day. Homedepot is huge company like the one I work for. We have CCTV on all floors of our parking garage at this location. Also on the outside of the buildings where we have parking lots instead of garages. Also our company has a reverse first parking rule. All vehicles must be backed in. Some really bright (I doubt it) person did a study and states it is safer to reverse park. So now we must abide by this ridiculousness. I know other companies within our field require it. homedepot may also.....just more food for thought

Based on the google map image posted upthread of the parking lot, it doesn't appear that his particular HD location has a reverse park policy, as I can see several cars that are parked head-first.

 

[Tawny]

I have a question about daycare. Is it normal for daycare's to contact you if your child is absent? My older two are in a daycare/preschool and I don't know if they have a policy on calling parent's or not. The facility we use is small and they are very close with the kids. I always let them know if we are going to be out but I've wondered if all parent's are like that or if I am just strange.

If this is an onsite facility they may have different policies? Has it been verified it was an onsite facility?

Our daycare never contacted us if she was absent.

 

[ahintexas]

Perhaps by the time this photo was taken the car seat had been removed by a tech at the scene? I don't know. I don't see a seat either.
Unlessn in the struggle dad pulled both the car seat and Cooper, then removed Cooper.
moo

Having a family full of LE, they don't remove car seats (or anything from vehicles for that matter) at the scene. They tow the car, and the crime unit goes through the car.

 

[popsicle]

There are plenty of people who insist they are great parents who don't take the time and precautions to prevent it. They assume it would never happen to them, so they don't bother to pay extra attention. That was my point.

Being aware it could happen is what makes someone a great parent, IMHO. Admitting you could possibly someday make a mistake like that is what will prompt you to take those precautions.

(general you, btw, not direct at you )

I agree. The most disturbing thing to me is knowing you are prone to this and yet not taking any precautions at all.... nothing...nada.

 

[Spice]

i have not seen this posted and it's not much but since RH loved music maybe he had the radio/ipod on when in the car with Cooper and was really into music and did not hear him babble or talk.

just thinking out loud....

For 3 minutes though? If that is the case, surely he would have heard him when he turned the car off in the parking lot. His travel from Chikfila to work could barely be considered it drive. It was so close. He wouldn't have even had time to listen to one full song.

 

[Tawny]

I agree. The most disturbing thing to me is knowing you are prone to this and yet not taking any precautions at all.... nothing...nada.

Absolutely!

 

[ahintexas]

What innocent reasons?

Why did you need to know what temperature was dangerous to leave a child in a car at?

Exactly! Common sense should tell you, don't leave your kids in the car in any temperature. Period!

 

[lillybell]

Ugg. Maybe. It could be that Cooper was making postmortem sounds at noon? A medical expert stated that Cooper would be dead within an hour at those temperatures. So he was likely dead for a couple of hours by noon. And decomposition speeds up RAPIDLY in high temperatures.

I think the window of death was between 15 minutes and one hour for someone as small as Cooper. Maybe his body was emitting gasses etc...when RH checked the car at noon and he heard what could be described as gurgling and choking.

It made me sick to type that. Really.

Thanks for that, I didn't see the medical experts opinion,
I know it's truly horrible to think how he suffered,
I find one of the hardest parts of this, is the lunchtime trip to the car.
How could that man just shut the door and walk away??
Not sure what sentence could possibly be enough x