General Discussion Thread No. 17

[Texana]

Now we know why Gerry can't go back to work. He's too busy monitoring what the newspapers in foreign countries say about him.

 

[STEADFAST]

Sorry to cut in in the middle of this discussion, but I saw a topic in "Up To The Minute" that reminded me of this case. It's about Infant Tylenol being recalled because of the risk of overdose. Infant Tylenol is exactly the same medicine as The McCanns admitted (?) giving to their kids.http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=54782

Didn't know if this new news report had been discussed on here in relation to this case. Best to you all -- I can't keep up with this fast-paced thread!

 

[Tuba]

Maybe this should have been investigated when Maddie first disappeared.:banghead:
Oct. 11. 2007
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22568084-401,00.html

Last week I mentioned that the man who photographed Madeleine & children on the beach, to my thinking, should not have been so swiftly cleared of suspicion. The pictures on the 150 computers come from someone snapping pictures. In no way am I saying that photographer is guilty of pedophilia. He could have thought those were delightful beach scenes. But the fact that he took the shots close in time to the disappearance of the subject bears investigation of a thorough sort.

 

[ThoughtFox]

All the players are denying that they are the "source" for the 24 Horas story about Gerry and the paternity issue:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/12/nmaddy112.xml

Yesterday, 24 Horas co-editor, Luis Fontes, said he stood by the story, which he claimed was confirmed by both Portuguese and British pathology sources as well as Leicestershire and Portuguese police.

"It's absolutely – our sources are rock solid," he said. "If they think they can sue us, bring it on." :woohoo:

A spokesman for the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham, where scientists are still testing samples sent to them from Portugal, insisted the story had not come from them.

"As with any ongoing case, it is not possible to comment on matters that could jeopardise the investigation," she said. "Our inquiries are ongoing."

A spokesman for Leicestershire Police said that they had refused to comment when contacted by 24 Horas on Wednesday.

. . . Nor would Policia Judiciaria comment further: "At this moment in time, we cannot and will not deny that news."

Interesting wording in that last denial. They "will not deny" what? That Gerry is "not" the father (double negative) or that he is the father?

This gets more interesting every day - amazing.

 

[AfterMidnight]

Madeline threads are all about possibilities, and those possibilities include the McCanns. As has been said many times, a lot of the problems the McCanns are encountering were brought about by their actions.

Maybe the McCanns are wonderful people and have been misjudged. But, maybe, too, there's a darker side to them. I think the old saying, "Where there's smoke, there's fire," applies here - not necessarily to the McCanns murdering their child, but something is certainly amiss. And, if Madeline's disappearance includes their lifestyle, it's appropriate to the discussion.

I don't have a problem with discussion - even about the "possible" darker side of people. I believe I'm put off by the accusations (I have heard the McCanns referred to as murders on this board), the innuendo, and the lack of evidence for any of it. I'm not even sure I agree about leaving the children alone. I don't care what anyone on this or any board believes about child care, if it was/is permissible at some resorts/hotels, then I see no fault. Back in the "good old days" of the United States, children were left alone a lot more frequently than most know. Some were left for days - from necessity. It's a recent innovation that the govt gets involved in child care, cigarette smoking, who thinks what about the holocaust, and every other aspect of our lives. There is a pattern here, and I feel sad when I see people falling into the trap. If it was an accepted practice to use baby monitors, phones, or walk through tending of children, then I find no fault with the McCanns.

I further believe we can discuss all aspects of the case, but need to keep it within a "discussion" framework. This is not happening on many message boards. In some places it has deteriorated to nothing more than a pack of hounds baying after the prey - in this case the McCanns whom people have judged with no SOLID evidence as guilty of something. It's like some smell blood and just cannot stop until the quarry is ripped apart.

Would it not be better to concentrate on WHERE Maddie might be - dead or alive?

It appears to me there are enough pedophiles in the vicinity to write a book, and enough leaks from PLE to sink a battleship. Let's try to REALLY get out of the box and come up with some fresh thinking. Maybe if people let go of their anominosities (for whatever reason they feel a right to have them) we could get on to really creative thinking. Like, who are some of the other suspects? There seem to be quite a few. Do some research on Murat - there seems, according to one article, a hidden room in the villa. There's a lot going on here - some of it is dirty dust from greedy newspapers, tired accusations from posters all over with nothing better or worse to say, and insults about the parents. Why not really dig? What could be "new" that we've overlooked? What have we missed? I know there are missing elements that have yet to be explored - why not do it?

 

[Tuba]

In the news, for the first time, this week: a basement storage room under 5A. I'm sure it was examined for evidence Madeleine had been there but what about this area as a hiding place for an abductor, like the man who had earlier been in the stairwell scrutinising the elevator, the stairs and the parking lot? One of the Ocean Club maids physically bumped into him, a surprise to them both according to her.

 

[Rino]

I'm not even sure I agree about leaving the children alone. I don't care what anyone on this or any board believes about child care, if it was/is permissible at some resorts/hotels, then I see no fault. Back in the "good old days" of the United States, children were left alone a lot more frequently than most know. Some were left for days - from necessity.

Children left for days?? Come on, that is not now or ever permissable.

Just something I thought was intereting, while watching an old Peter Sellers movie a few months back, made in the 40's one of the lines that struck me was "It is illegal to leave your kids alone at night"

How things change....

 

[ThoughtFox]

There used to be a commercial you would see on TV back in the 60s and 70s in the U.S.

"It's eleven o'clock ~ do you know where your children are?"

While there may be a perception that kids were left alone alot in the old days, I disagree. My parents grew up during the Great Depression of the 30's, and they were very protective. Their mothers never left them alone as children - and they had alot more kids than the McCanns have! My parents never left us with anyone except relatives and then very rarely.

Where I grew up, neglect was instantly noticeable - nobody left their kids alone at night. If kids were roaming around the neighborhood with no supervision, then you knew something was wrong at home.

I would say 80% of parents in the world do not leave their small children alone anywhere except in their own house, and even there, accidents can happen. Any parent knows that.

 

[browneyedgirl]

I honestly have a hard time leaving my 13 year old son home alone, just to venture to the grocery store because of all of the "what if's". Part of it is his maturity (or lack there of sometimes).
And NO WAY would I have done it while on vacation this summer. You just never know nowadays.
Just my thoughts......

 

[Pocono Sleuther]

I do agree gord.I cringe sometimes at some of the things said on here and can only wonder where such ideas come from, especially the sex angle.I do believe they are innocent but am open to being convinced by the evidence however I have seen nothing to convince me they were into orgies and really they could have been doing it with every person in Portugal it still wouldnt make them murderers and has no bearing on the case IMO.

Mind if I ask why you are so staunch in your stand of the Mc's innocence?

 

[Pocono Sleuther]

All the players are denying that they are the "source" for the 24 Horas story about Gerry and the paternity issue:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/10/12/nmaddy112.xml



Interesting wording in that last denial. They "will not deny" what? That Gerry is "not" the father (double negative) or that he is the father?

This gets more interesting every day - amazing.

Geez, big surprise to us, huh ThoughtFox?! Of course they're denying it. Remember good ole JP, deny deny deny. And the last denial. No wonder my head is spinning trying to keep up with this case. :waitasec:

 

[Tuba]

Last week I mentioned that the man who photographed Madeleine & children on the beach, to my thinking, should not have been so swiftly cleared of suspicion. The pictures on the 150 computers come from someone snapping pictures. In no way am I saying that photographer is guilty of pedophilia. He could have thought those were delightful beach scenes. But the fact that he took the shots close in time to the disappearance of the subject bears investigation of a thorough sort.

The Mercury newspaper in the McCann's home county is reporting "police are scouring photos taken by holidaymakers in the Algarve around the time of Madeleine's disappearance, using hi tch face mapping techniques."

 

[PharmSleuth]

:waitasec: I thought members of the McCann family called the dogs "Lassie" and that the PLE asked for help from UK who suggested the dogs. Spin, spin, spin...

According to this article:
Speaking of the McCanns:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2007/10/11/mccann-refused-to-leave-89520-19931974/

The friend added: "It was they who asked for more searches and why dogs were brought over from the UK."

"Why would they have done that if they were guilty?"

 

[Pinkhammer]

Has this been posted yet?

Unreported News


A snippet of news that appears to have been overlooked is that yesterday, 10th October, between the hours of 1.15pm and 4.45pm, the McCanns were visited by Detective Superintendent Bod Small and two female detective sergeants: one believed to be a family liaison officer.

The police were seen to enter the McCanns house with a number of files but were not believed to be in possesion of those files when they left.

What could they have been doing at the home of the prime suspects in a criminal investigation?

http://trannyfattyacid.blogspot.com/

 

[Pinkhammer]

Clarence doth protest too much.

Gerry's fatherhood, biological or otherwise, is pertinent to the investigation.

 

[SleuthMom]

Hi SleuthMom. Jumping in a little late this morning with my first post. I searched Gerry's blog for the first reference to he and/or Kate going on a "run". May 20. Day 17. Kate is a keen runner and in the last few days has tried to include a run in the daily routine. Yesterday (Sat) at 7am we ran to the monument at the top of the steep cliff overlooking Praia de Luz. We reached it in 19 minutes.

A bit odd, IMO, considering how "devastated" they were over Maddie's "abduction". I'm a runner (for over ten years now) and found that running or trying to run while in the midst of a personal emotional crisis was either very difficult or impossible. Other runners I know have indicated the same. I remember trying to go for a run a few days after 9/11 and just couldn't. So here are Gerry and Kate - barely two weeks since their daughter has gone missing - running up a steep hill at 7 a.m. and timing it. And reading his entry again, they've been out running before May 20!
:waitasec:

Thanks for following-up I thought they went running much earlier actually.

 

[SleuthMom]

You don't see or hear of interviews with Maddie's preschool teacher, Sunday school teacher or her Nanny. No play group Mom's, no Neighbors. No one seems to pour out any grief that's she's missing. Why is that?

Just kind of weird.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Not at all, you are right. It is very interesting.

 

[SleuthMom]

. I don't care what anyone on this or any board believes about child care, if it was/is permissible at some resorts/hotels, then I see no fault.

Now I fully understand your need to defend the Mc Canns when they left their three little babies alone.

It appears to me there are enough pedophiles in the vicinity to write a book, and enough leaks from PLE to sink a battleship. Let's try to REALLY get out of the box and come up with some fresh thinking. Maybe if people let go of their anominosities (for whatever reason they feel a right to have them) we could get on to really creative thinking.

Let me guess...you want to talk about other suspects but wanna stop talking about the Mc Canns as such? Sorry I do not think that is going to happen as long as they remain arguidos and as long as the police continues their investigation on them. AND even if all that stopped, they are Maddie's parents and like ANY other case of this nature, parents are usually investigated and suspected because unfortunately, most of the time kids are the victims of their own parents or close relatives.

, tired accusations from posters all over with nothing better or worse to say, and insults about the parents. Why not really dig? What could be "new" that we've overlooked? What have we missed? I know there are missing elements that have yet to be explored - why not do it?

Go ahead sweety, bring up your points. Honestly I would love to discuss it and I am sure other posters as well.

 

[DeltaDawn]

I'm not even sure I agree about leaving the children alone. I don't care what anyone on this or any board believes about child care, if it was/is permissible at some resorts/hotels, then I see no fault.

Where did you get that info please?

Everything I have read says the resort did not approve of them leaving the children alone and reiterated with The McCanns that they had services available to take care of the children. The hotel even got complaints about the children being left unattended...they were 3 years and under.

 

[ThoughtFox]

Has this been posted yet?

Unreported News


A snippet of news that appears to have been overlooked is that yesterday, 10th October, between the hours of 1.15pm and 4.45pm, the McCanns were visited by Detective Superintendent Bod Small and two female detective sergeants: one believed to be a family liaison officer.

The police were seen to enter the McCanns house with a number of files but were not believed to be in possesion of those files when they left.

What could they have been doing at the home of the prime suspects in a criminal investigation?

http://trannyfattyacid.blogspot.com/

I wonder what the first "source" of that is? Curious . . .

I know there are missing elements that have yet to be explored - why not do it?

Go ahead sweety, bring up your points. Honestly I would love to discuss it and I am sure other posters as well.

I don't think Sleuthing works from the Unknown-In. I think solving a crime works from the known facts outward.

People here get criticized for believing wild scenarios, but it makes no sense to me that we should go and search in other countries for "unknown" suspects. How could we do that through the Internet? We would just be speculating and it would all be hazy. Absolutely no one has been a suspect except Murat and the McCanns. If there was anyone else, we would all be researching them, I'm sure.

So I don't know what we can do except discuss the McCanns. All I do usually is just link to news stories or to the McCann's interviews. I believe alot of their statements speak for themselves.