George Floyd death / Derek Chauvin trial - Sidebar week 1

[ilovewings]

Column: Derek Chauvin's race-baiting defense is rooted in centuries-old stereotypes

I hope this is not behind a pay wall- good article reflecting the tactic of the defense to make it a "black angry crowd" that distracted Chauvin--- and all the rest that follows from there . Making the black people in the crowd hostile and threatening (when we know that was not going on)

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Not even was the use of force unnecessary, but the police arriving on the scene to check out a suspected $20 forged bill was was unnecessary. Seriously, where in the world do police come out for something like that?

If I called in a complaint about a suspicious $20 bill, I can guarantee that the response would be, "Bring it in sometime when you come by, and we'll check it out". And that would be the end of it.

Nobody would die.

I've pondered that myself.

But a crime is a crime, and the store had a right to call 911.

People have called 911 for even silly things, and once 911 was called the police did come out.

Passing a conterfiet bill can also lead to finding more counterfiet bills.

I asked a police officer if he would come to a store who had received a counterfeit bill if 911 was called for his assistance? He said. Absolutely, he's answered calls before when someone was passing counterfeit money. He said the detectives would be called in to investigate where the counterfeit money came from, and who was behind passing them around, and who was the mastermind behind it who was printing them.

So I don't fault them for calling the police.

So I don't fault the store for calling or the police for showing up when called.

What I do have fault with is what the police did after they got George on the ground while already handcuffed.

Jmho

 

[MsBetsy]

These are all of the incidents the State asked to introduce at trial:

1. On March 15, 2014, Defendant restrained an arrested male by placing his body weight on the male’s upper body and head area as the male laid in the prone position on the ground. Defendant reported that he used this restraint to control the male’s movements and to place the male in handcuffs. See MPD CCN 2014- 082863.

2. On February 15, 2015, Defendant restrained an arrested male by applying pressure to the male’s lingual artery below the male’s chin bone and pressing the male against a wall. Defendant then pulled the male to the ground, placed him in a prone position, and placed handcuffs on the male. Defendant kept the male handcuffed in the prone position until other officers arrived to aid him in placing the male in a squad car. See MPD CCN 2015-054320.

3. On August 22, 2015, Defendant participated in rendering aid to a suicidal, intoxicated, and mentally-disturbed male. Defendant observed other officers fight with and tase the male. Defendant then observed other officers place the male in a side-recovery position, consistent with training. Defendant rode with the male to the hospital to receive medical care. Officers involved in the response received a commendation for their appropriate efforts and received feedback from medical professionals that, if officers had prolonged their detention of the male or failed to transport the male to the hospital in a timely manner, the male could have died. See MPD CCN 2015-317385.

4. On April 22, 2016, Defendant restrained an arrested male by placing both of his hands around the male’s neck and applying pressure to both sides of the male’s neck. Defendant then forced the male backwards onto the sidewalk and handcuffed him. After Defendant placed the male in handcuffs, he stood the male up. Defendant’s actions resulted in a small crowd of concerned citizens to view Defendant’s actions. The male later complained of asthma, and paramedics were called to the scene. See MPD CCN 2016-141710.

5. On June 25, 2017, Defendant restrained an arrested female by placing his knee on her neck while she laid in prone position on the ground. Defendant shifted his body weight onto the female’s neck and continued to restrain the female in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD CCN 2017-235836.

6. On September 4, 2017, Defendant detained an arrested juvenile by applying a neck restraint, flipping the juvenile on his stomach, and pinning him to the floor. Defendant continued to restrain the juvenile in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD CCN 2017- 337738.

7. On March 12, 2019, Defendant detained an intoxicated male on the ground by applying a neck restraint on the male while sitting on the male’s lower back. Defendant continued to restrain the male in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD 2019-71230.

8. On July 6, 2019, defendant kicked an intoxicated male in the midsection and then applied a neck restraint on the male until the male was rendered unconscious. Defendant continued to restrain the male in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD 2019-19749.


Complaints

• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, DEMEANING TONE, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, DEROGATORY LANGUAGE, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, LANGUAGE--OTHER, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 04-2100, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 05-2306, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 09-2643, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 09-2680, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 12-3244, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-09814, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-10527, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-32189, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 14-14106, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 14-23776, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 15-04541, IA , Closed - No Discipline
• 15-12394, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 20-06870, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• A10-140, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• A10-269, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• A11-185, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• FR08-06, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• IA06-76, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• IA07-39, Internal Affairs, ABUSE OF DISCRETION, SUSTAINED, LETTER OF REPRIMAND
• IA07-39, Internal Affairs, MVR, SUSTAINED, LETTER OF REPRIMAND
• IA10-172, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• P11-115, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• P12-174, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline

Page

https://mncourts.gov/mncourtsgov/me...otice-of-Intent-to-Officer-Other-Evidence.pdf

#3 shows that Chauvin knew Floyd should have been put in the recovery position. He observed other officer's actions, who were later told by medical professionals that the man would have died if they had prolonged their detention of him and not sought medical attention in a timely manner.

 

[turaj]

WOW. I don’t consider it a defense either but this is shocking - the language and everything. IMO, it’s common sense for an adult to know that what was done to GF could have deadly consequences.

Thank you for sharing this . For those not in the area Bob Kroll has been a lighting rod here for a very long time It was well known about his ideas including those of "warrior force" . As the complaint outlines he is a very bad actor and "influencer" with the force and sadly many looked up to him and followed his training to the tee As I recall officers attended something like a "warrior camp" from time to time. This was news for some time after this case as well as others. I am pretty sure that Mr. Chauvin was a strong supporter of Bob Kroll and thankfully Kroll retired just in Jan. of this year.He has daily death threats. While things were to change after all of this..sadly they have not. On Monday I expect you will see Chief Arronando ..a basically good person with a steep climb to change the entire mentality of this police force.. That should be interesting.

 

[turaj]

I just checked the witness list and the night club owner (Santamaria) is on the states list. I'm interested in what she will say if she's called to testify.

I thought at first he may have had some personal vendetta on Floyd..I mean that was personal what was going down on Chicago Ave. I still think so and am really hoping they call that witness.

 

[turaj]

I wonder if being rookies, they wanted to prove themselves to their superiors. Once they met resistance, did they want to show Floyd who was boss and show their bosses they were tough and wouldn’t back down? And when Chauvin arrived he had to show he was boss. It’s all so juvenile, and as you said, the struggle getting GF into the squad car was almost comical/keystone cops material...until Mr Floyd died.

From Lane's interview what I heard was a guy in that position for a few days that had been trained "yes sir" and that seniority was EVERYTHING in the field right down to who drives the squad. The minute Chauvin arrived despite the fact that it was their call (the rookies) Chauvin was taking over and as the senior office on the call the rookies just said "yes sir" right up to the last breath. It is a case study in the mentality of the police force.

 

[delilah]

This may be a perfectly normal response for EMT but seems odd to me (although I admit I have zero medical training). It is 3 mins between EMT Smith finding no pulse and one of the police officers beginning CPR in the back of the ambulance. Why wouldn’t EMTs start chest compressions immediately? Every second counts when a person stops breathing so why the long delay? I know they needed to get GF into the ambulance to use specialist equipment but couldn’t one of them have started CPR while the other got the stretcher prepped? Here are the timings:

20:27.45: EMT Smith checks for corotid pulse and checks pupils. All three police officers are still holding GF down.
20:28.40: EMTs get stretcher ready. All three police officers are still on GF.
20:28.45: police get off and GF is loaded onto stretcher still cuffed.
20:29.28: GF is now in the ambulance.
20:29.42: police belt GF to the stretcher. EMT cuts off GF’s vest.
20:30.15: ambulance moves to new location with EMT Bravinder driving.
20:30.43: EMT Smith checks again for a pulse.
20:30.47: Officer Lane begins chest compressions.

Any EMT experts out there?

 

[turaj]

BBM

Yes, the man who made the mistake was very apologetic and contacted the media right away IIRC.

George Floyd and Derek Chauvin Were Once Co-Workers, Ex-Club Owner Tells TV Station

Floyd was inside and Chauvin outside sporting his mace. She would be an interesting "character" witness for Chauvin. I doubt there will be one person getting on that stand saying what a great guy he is..GF was not a model citizen but at least some really cared about him and spoke highly of him

 

[turaj]

I've pondered that myself.

But a crime is a crime, and the store had a right to call 911.

People have called 911 for even silly things, and once 911 was called the police did come out.

Passing a conterfiet bill can also lead to finding more counterfiet bills.

I asked a police officer if he would come to a store who had received a counterfeit bill if 911 was called for his assistance? He said. Absolutely, he's answered calls before when someone was passing counterfeit money. He said the detectives would be called in to investigate where the counterfeit money came from, and who was behind passing them around, and who was the mastermind behind it who was printing them.

So I don't fault them for calling the police.

So I don't fault the store for calling or the police for showing up when called.

What I do have fault with is what the police did after they got George on the ground while already handcuffed.

Jmho

It must have been a slow day in that precinct as it is common knowledge calling 911 in Minneapolis you often never get someone sent out.

 

[Lilibet]

I do know he worked at Conga and thought that Chauvin did as well.I thought that was the point of reference.

I was replying to @MsBetsy who recalled another employee initially saying Chauvin and Floyd had a “beef” with each other at the nightclub. That turned out to be a case of mistaken identity regarding the conflict. It wasn’t Floyd and the employee cleared up the mistake with the media right away. But yes, both Chauvin and Floyd worked there. Sorry for any confusion.

 

[turaj]

I was replying to @MsBetsy who recalled another employee initially saying Chauvin and Floyd had a “beef” with each other at the nightclub. That turned out to be a case of mistaken identity regarding the conflict. It wasn’t Floyd and the employee cleared up the mistake with the media right away. But yes, both Chauvin and Floyd worked there. Sorry for any confusion.

I posted above a clip...they did work at some club...one inside one out..not sure there was ever any interaction above knowing each was there...it almost seemed in the take down that Chauvin was talking out years of frustration at his job which I am sure can be very challenging in the precincts that he chose to work in. With his seniority he could have moved shifts and locations but he chose to stay down there and even work off duty at the clubs.

 

[Lilibet]

Column: Derek Chauvin's race-baiting defense is rooted in centuries-old stereotypes

I hope this is not behind a pay wall- good article reflecting the tactic of the defense to make it a "black angry crowd" that distracted Chauvin--- and all the rest that follows from there . Making the black people in the crowd hostile and threatening (when we know that was not going on)

Excellent article and it’s worth adding a few quotes to drive home the dishonest tactic of the defense making the “angry black crowd” and Floyd’s large black body to blame for Chauvin’s inhumanity toward Mr Floyd...

The Chauvin team is doubling down on the hope that race-based fear-mongering can convince at least one juror that the officer was outmatched by a big, scary Black demon.

The strategy of demonizing the victim works particularly well when the victim is Black, because it activates the unconscious racial biases jurors unwittingly bring into the courtroom. Research has shown that people of every race tend to overestimate the size, weight and strength of Black men, and perceive Black bodies as more threatening than white bodies.
<snip>

In that same series of studies, white participants rated Black men more capable of doing harm than white men of the same physical stature and size. And they also believed that police would be justified in using more force to subdue Black men.
<snip>

These kinds of deep-rooted stereotypes are painful to acknowledge and difficult to dislodge. But recognizing and rejecting that kind of biased thinking is necessary in order for Black lives to really matter in this country.

BBM UBM

Column: Derek Chauvin's race-baiting defense is rooted in centuries-old stereotypes

 

[angelainwi]

These are all of the incidents the State asked to introduce at trial:

1. On March 15, 2014, Defendant restrained an arrested male by placing his body weight on the male’s upper body and head area as the male laid in the prone position on the ground. Defendant reported that he used this restraint to control the male’s movements and to place the male in handcuffs. See MPD CCN 2014- 082863.

2. On February 15, 2015, Defendant restrained an arrested male by applying pressure to the male’s lingual artery below the male’s chin bone and pressing the male against a wall. Defendant then pulled the male to the ground, placed him in a prone position, and placed handcuffs on the male. Defendant kept the male handcuffed in the prone position until other officers arrived to aid him in placing the male in a squad car. See MPD CCN 2015-054320.

3. On August 22, 2015, Defendant participated in rendering aid to a suicidal, intoxicated, and mentally-disturbed male. Defendant observed other officers fight with and tase the male. Defendant then observed other officers place the male in a side-recovery position, consistent with training. Defendant rode with the male to the hospital to receive medical care. Officers involved in the response received a commendation for their appropriate efforts and received feedback from medical professionals that, if officers had prolonged their detention of the male or failed to transport the male to the hospital in a timely manner, the male could have died. See MPD CCN 2015-317385.

4. On April 22, 2016, Defendant restrained an arrested male by placing both of his hands around the male’s neck and applying pressure to both sides of the male’s neck. Defendant then forced the male backwards onto the sidewalk and handcuffed him. After Defendant placed the male in handcuffs, he stood the male up. Defendant’s actions resulted in a small crowd of concerned citizens to view Defendant’s actions. The male later complained of asthma, and paramedics were called to the scene. See MPD CCN 2016-141710.

5. On June 25, 2017, Defendant restrained an arrested female by placing his knee on her neck while she laid in prone position on the ground. Defendant shifted his body weight onto the female’s neck and continued to restrain the female in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD CCN 2017-235836.

6. On September 4, 2017, Defendant detained an arrested juvenile by applying a neck restraint, flipping the juvenile on his stomach, and pinning him to the floor. Defendant continued to restrain the juvenile in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD CCN 2017- 337738.

7. On March 12, 2019, Defendant detained an intoxicated male on the ground by applying a neck restraint on the male while sitting on the male’s lower back. Defendant continued to restrain the male in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD 2019-71230.

8. On July 6, 2019, defendant kicked an intoxicated male in the midsection and then applied a neck restraint on the male until the male was rendered unconscious. Defendant continued to restrain the male in this position beyond the point when such force was needed under the circumstances. See MPD 2019-19749.


Complaints

• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, DEMEANING TONE, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, DEROGATORY LANGUAGE, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 03-1999, Civilian Review Authority, LANGUAGE--OTHER, SUSTAINED, ORAL REPRIMAND
• 04-2100, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 05-2306, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 09-2643, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 09-2680, Civilian Review Authority, Closed - No Discipline
• 12-3244, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-09814, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-10527, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 13-32189, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 14-14106, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 14-23776, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 15-04541, IA , Closed - No Discipline
• 15-12394, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• 20-06870, Office of Police Conduct Review, Closed - No Discipline
• A10-140, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• A10-269, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• A11-185, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• FR08-06, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• IA06-76, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• IA07-39, Internal Affairs, ABUSE OF DISCRETION, SUSTAINED, LETTER OF REPRIMAND
• IA07-39, Internal Affairs, MVR, SUSTAINED, LETTER OF REPRIMAND
• IA10-172, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• P11-115, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline
• P12-174, Internal Affairs, Closed - No Discipline

Page

https://mncourts.gov/mncourtsgov/me...otice-of-Intent-to-Officer-Other-Evidence.pdf

Is the judge allowing any of these in?

 

[angelainwi]

#3 shows that Chauvin knew Floyd should have been put in the recovery position. He observed other officer's actions, who were later told by medical professionals that the man would have died if they had prolonged their detention of him and not sought medical attention in a timely manner.

Do we know if the Judge is allowing #3 in?

 

[MsBetsy]

I thought at first he may have had some personal vendetta on Floyd..I mean that was personal what was going down on Chicago Ave. I still think so and am really hoping they call that witness.

It's possible they knew each other or at least Chauvin knew "of" him. Either way I think Chauvin and Thao were biased simply because they knew Floyd was intoxicated and resisting. Chauvin was also said to be "afraid" of black people. They knew excessive force wasn't appropriate in that situation. It's not supposed to be used for a person who is "passively" resisting. Hence the reason Chauvin omitted that part to his supervisor. All of the officers should have known that. None of them attempted to de-escalate before they decided to throw him to the ground and restrain him. Thao admitted that during his interview, even though it was part of his training.

I would really like to hear what Chauvin said when he was interviewed.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I'm sure there are biases at play among police officers. I have no doubt about that whatsoever.

Does anyone think white officers have biases against their own race as well? The reason I ask is I keep up with a site that shows how many are killed by police officers each year, and last year, iirc, close to a thousand whites or Hispanics were killed by cops.

After I prepare our Easter lunch I'll link the site. It was created by an AA a few years back. It's very informative, and up to date as they occur no matter what state/city.

He also links the local news articles about each one killed by a.cop listing the name, and race of the ones killed. I feel so sad when I see George's name listed there.

I trust his site more than any other because he does it in real time when they actually happened.

Most never make the national news for some reason.

I really admired how George seemed so fit, and strong. He was a very muscular man. When I first saw him I thought he may be trained as a boxer. Didn't his GF testify he worked out. If so, it certainly showed.

Jmho

 

[MsBetsy]

Do we know if the Judge is allowing #3 in?

I don't think we know which they are allowing. That would be a good one, though.

 

[turaj]

It's possible they knew each other or at least Chauvin knew "of" him. Either way I think Chauvin and Thao were biased simply because they knew Floyd was intoxicated and resisting. Chauvin was also said to be "afraid" of black people. They knew excessive force wasn't appropriate in that situation. It's not supposed to be used for a person who is "passively" resisting. Hence the reason Chauvin omitted that part to his supervisor. All of the officers should have known that. None of them attempted to de-escalate before they decided to throw him to the ground and restrain him. Thao admitted that during his interview, even though it was part of his training.

I would really like to hear what Chauvin said when he was interviewed.

As far as I can find and I have searched I have yet to hear an in person word from Chauvin....that interview must be toxic.

 

[MsBetsy]

It must have been a slow day in that precinct as it is common knowledge calling 911 in Minneapolis you often never get someone sent out.

Maybe that's because so many people call for non-emergencies. Passing a fake bill, dancing around and acting weird is hardly an emergency.

 

[turaj]

I'm sure there are biases at play among police officers. I have no doubt about that whatsoever.

Does anyone think white officers have biases against their own race as well? The reason I ask is I keep up with a site that shows how many are killed by police officers each year, and last year, iirc, close to a thousand whites or Hispanics were killed by cops.

After I prepare our Easter lunch I'll link the site. It was created by an AA a few years back. It's very informative, and up to date as they occur no matter what state/city.

He also links the local news articles about each one killed by a.cop listing the name, and race of the ones killed. I feel so sad when I see George's name listed there.

Most never make the national news for some reason.

I really admired how George seemed so fit, and strong. He was a very muscular man. When I first saw him I thought he may be trained as a boxer. Didn't his GF testified he worked out. If so, it certainly showed.

Jmho

He clearly could have had some sort of future in the sports world but some bad choices and maybe luck took him in the wrong direction...