George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #4

[sorrell skye]

Not anymore. Many schools are dropping it from the curriculum

This is, IMO, an example of why it may not be a good idea to stop teaching it.

 

[especiallyheather]

Not anymore. Many schools are dropping it from the curriculum

In Florida, I believe it (cursive) is slated to be dropped next year from CORE...

 

[PaintingAnemone]

I believe this witness. Whether I like her is beside the point, although I don't; she does remind me of other teenagers I've met, though, so her attitude doesn't strike me as unique. But I do believe her. She's been surprisingly candid about herself and her motives, to the point of making some really unflattering admissions about her own behavior and the decisions she made early in the investigation. I think the only thing she's been coached on is that if she lies on the stand, she's going to go to jail. But her attitude on the stand is too spontaneous to be anything but genuine, to me. You can see exactly what she's thinking all over her face. She'll never be any good as an actress, that's for darn sure.

 

[iluvmua]

He is trying to use her bad use of the english language against her to make her seem like a liar. Is that fair? NOPE. MO

That's because she is and she has been repeatedly lying her butt off on the stand.

There is no disputing that.

IMO

 

[Tricia]

Dear Posters,

Please, I AM BEGGING YOU, stop insulting the witness. WE DON'T NEED THAT TYPE OF POSTING.

Yes, post that you can't understand her

Yes, post that you don't believe her

Yes post that she is disrespectful in your opinion

But PLEASE STOP with the 3rd grade references and insults.

Here is what you do, If what you post is an insult don't post it.

If what you post is an opinion on what she is saying or what she is doing and it does not insult her as a human being then post it.

We will start timing people out.

PLEASE?????

Thank you,
Tricia

 

[mom23gr8kids]

Why would there be a question as to whether or not a recording of a deposition would be allowed to be entered? If the written transcripts are in why not the recording?

I understand he has to follow the rules for marking I'm asking more about the judges directions to get it marked then see if the state has any objections to it coming in.

 

[Schuby]

He is trying to use her bad use of the english language against her to make her seem like a liar. Is that fair? NOPE. MO

C'mon now, you can't present a lawyer with variously worded answers and not expect him to try to pin them down or exploit their differences.

 

[PaperDoll]

Why? I know you already have your mind made up, but I don't. In my opinion, as stated before, I honestly think that West is repeated the same questions just to make sure she understands the questions he has asked. He is also trying to understand her answers.

He is also trying to impeach her, which requires West to ask questions again, in order to hear her answers.

I get that, but her answers are the same. She said what she heard, that hasn't changed. Even the judge is telling him to move on. DeeDee gets confused by his questions, too. I don't know how many times she can tell him what she heard..

 

[PaintingAnemone]

Not anymore. Many schools are dropping it from the curriculum

I heard about this, also. I thought it was a mistake then, and I still do. I just personally think penmanship is something everyone should know. Imo, part of knowing language is being able to recognize it written form.

 

[corundogs]

You can believe whatever you want. Seems you feel it was okay that GZ was being viciously attacked (eyes blacken, nose broken, repeated getting his head slammed against the concrete). Yeah, he had no right to defend himself!! And since TM had him pinned down on the ground, George did not have the option of running away. You make it sound like TM was shot merely because he was walking home minding his own business. Not so. This incident never would have happened if TM didn’t physically attack GZ.

Except you seem to be discounting that TM could have been the one defending himself!

Even if TM did all that you said, which I am not in that camp but for argument let's go with it, how do you know that it wasn't TM defending himself from someone following him and trying to detain him...unlawful detainment since he has NO AUTHORITY to do that...then GZ can't be defending himself from someone defending themselves.

It doesn't work that way.

GZ did not say - then or now - that he identified himself as Neighborhood Watch or anything else. So to TM, he literally was some creepy guy following him.

TM had NO IDEA what GZ's intentions were. If GZ didn't tell him, that's on GZ.

And I cannot in anyway excuse him for doing what he did that night that his actions lead to the death of Trayvon Martin.

That's what this case is about for me. His actions lead to the death of another person.

 

[gxm]

Let's hear the recording. Although it may not be clear no matter how many times it is heard....

Agreed. At the very least, it will confirm whether she is unintelligible in the recording (as she is claiming).

 

[Mendara]

C'mon now, you can't present a lawyer with variously worded answers and not expect him to try to pin them down or exploit their differences.

Oh I expect it, but don't think it is fair.

 

[Lovelymountains]

Why? I know you already have your mind made up, but I don't. In my opinion, as stated before, I honestly think that West is repeating the same questions just to make sure she understands the questions he has asked. He is also trying to understand her answers.

He is also trying to impeach her, which requires West to ask questions again, in order to hear her answers.

But I have seen in various trials that the opposing attorney will object on the grounds of "Asked and Answered," and the objection will be sustained. I don't understand how it is acceptable on some occasions to ask the same question repeatedly and on other occasions it is not. Anyone?

 

[shelley921]

Why isn't the judge admonishing her? Shouldn't she? OMG - this is the most ridiculous thing I've ever watched! I mean I get the judge is pro prosecution but give me a break with the girl's attitude. She's not making any friends and the jury can't be ok with this. It's SO hard to listen to.

This is a new low in acceptable behavior. She doesn't look the lawyers in the eye. This is a court of law. Maybe this "girl" is unsophisticated but someone should be admonishing her. She's made herself look really bad and the attitude STINKS. I can't watch it anymore.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

This case has been deeply troubling to me from the beginning for a variety of reasons, beginning with the Martin family's and their attorney's efforts to mislead the public and manipulate public opinion by offering photographs of Trayvon Martin that were at least five years old. The blatant attempt to make TM look more vulnerable to the public than the 6'0 160 17 year old that GZ encountered that night is a shameful misrepresentation on the part of the Martin family that continues to be kicked under the carpet.

To that, I will add that I was deeply disturbed by the tacit support the Martin family lawyer lent to the New Black Panther Party putting a "dead or alive" bounty out on George Zimmerman prior to his arrest. TNBBP is an organization that has been rejected by the original BBP and is characterized by the The Southern Poverty Law Center as "a virulently racist and anti-Semitic organization whose leaders have encouraged violence against whites, Jews and law enforcement officers..."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...-party-offers-10k-bounty-for-george-zimmerman

Everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion. This is mine: the Facebook and Twitter content of TM is absolutely relevant to understanding the person that GZ encountered that night. Far from being the sweet faced 12 year old depicted in the photos provided by the family and their lawyer to the media, he was a recreational drug user and underage drinker who, by his own admission, was involved in multiple assaults of others and who was in the process of trying to illegally obtain a weapon. If I'm not mistaken, THC was found in his system at autopsy. He had been expelled from school and kicked out of his mother's home and sent to live with his father when she could no longer control him.

I find it interesting that we have had so many conversations about the value and accuracy of our personal intuition in so many other cases yet no one is prepared to give GZ the benefit of his intuition.

Finally, I'm just confounded by the talking heads (and some members here) who are willing to bend over backward to justify the deplorable courtroom behavior of yesterday's 'star witness' and the justifications offered here for the racial slurs used by TM. I can only speculate as to the reasons for that so I won't go into any detail. Her Twitter account was recently scrubbed of her references to getting drunk, stoned and driving under the influence and I believe that all of that goes to her credibility:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/zimmerman-witness-gets-twitter-scrub-748092

At this point, I have seen nothing from the Prosecution that would allow me, in good conscience, to convict GZ of anything. Then again, the case hasn't been fully presented or defended yet so I'm reserving judgment until then.

I like some of your points, but the big thing bothering me is why did GZ continue to follow TM after the police had instructed him not to? And why didn't he identify himself as a Neighborhood Crimewatcher? I also feel that the phone suddenly turning off is hinky. Certainly during a scuffle, no one worries about whether a phone is on and the witness could still hear them scuffling. She is a reluctant witness, albeit for many reasons, but I wonder what else she heard and if she is afraid to disclose what she may have heard due to backlash. This is just my gut, or MOO.

 

[Tricia]

please stay on topic

love and kisses,
tricia​

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think this witness is holding up remarkably well. It's the lawyer that's getting frustrated and that's why it's taking so long. IMO

 

[TXN4LIFE]

Dear Posters,

Please, I AM BEGGING YOU, stop insulting the witness. WE DON'T NEED THAT TYPE OF POSTING.

Yes, post that you can't understand her

Yes, post that you don't believe her

Yes post that she is disrespectful in your opinion

But PLEASE STOP with the 3rd grade references and insults.

Here is what you do, If what you post is an insult don't post it.

If what you post is an opinion on what she is saying or what she is doing and it does not insult her as a human being the post it.

We will start timing people out.

PLEASE?????

Thank you,
Tricia

Thank you Tricia!

 

[cityslick]

The fact of the matter is if there is attitude is being shown to the DT, the jury isn't going to be accepting of that, no matter what she's saying.

 

[iluvmua]

Except you seem to be discounting that TM could have been the one defending himself!

Even if TM did all that you said, which I am not in that camp but for argument let's go with it, how do you know that it wasn't TM defending himself from someone following him and trying to detain him...unlawful detainment since he has NO AUTHORITY to do that...then GZ can't be defending himself from someone defending themselves.

It doesn't work that way.

GZ did not say - then or now - that he identified himself as Neighborhood Watch or anything else. So to TM, he literally was some creepy guy following him.

TM had NO IDEA what GZ's intentions were. If GZ didn't tell him, that's on GZ.

And I cannot in anyway excuse him for doing what he did that night that his actions lead to the death of Trayvon Martin.

That's what this case is about for me. His actions lead to the death of another person.

Why would Trayvon be defending himself? especially since, he could have made it home well before GZ got off of the phone?



GZ was not on NW that night. GZ lived in the complex, Trayvon was just a guest.

JMO