Germany/Portugal - Christian Brueckner, 27 @ time of 1st crime (2004), charged with sexual assault crimes, Praia de Rocha, Portugal. #3

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Mex said:
If the minor was detained by him without her consent for four days ... at the very least that indicates he kidnapped her.
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Would it be kidnap if she went willingly in the first place but was later prevented from leaving ?
Might be difficlt to prove, though irrelevant if the girl remains unidentified.
 
Davieson said:
Would it be kidnap if she went willingly in the first place but was later prevented from leaving ?
Might be difficlt to prove, though irrelevant if the girl remains unidentified.
Click to expand...
Yes.

There is nothing hypothetical about the vicious rape endured by HB in 2004 carried out by an uninvited intruder carrying with him tools of restraint and torture, intent on forcing himself on her.

Investigators have built a case against CB which is strong enough to merit CB being indicted for that home invasion. The court will decide if the evidence investigators present to the court is strong enough to sustain conviction.
 
Mex said:
Yes.

There is nothing hypothetical about the vicious rape endured by HB in 2004 carried out by an uninvited intruder carrying with him tools of restraint and torture, intent on forcing himself on her.

Investigators have built a case against CB which is strong enough to merit CB being indicted for that home invasion. The court will decide if the evidence investigators present to the court is strong enough to sustain conviction.
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I don't think anyone disputes any of that. Why keep repeating it ?
 
Davieson said:
Would it be kidnap if she went willingly in the first place but was later prevented from leaving ?
Might be difficlt to prove, though irrelevant if the girl remains unidentified.
Click to expand...

I can't see this particular case getting a conviction. Hearsay only, even if credible, and no victim and no parallels to be drawn with any of the other 5 cases? I can't see it.

But, rather than keep on going round the houses re this particular case, can we all please just agree that if what HeB and MS said they witnessed on tape is a true account of what they saw, then this 14yr old, whether she was there for 4 days or four hours, was absolutely the victim of an assault and rape by CB? She was 14yrs old. I don't give a crap what the age of consent in Portugal is, no 14yr old is in a position to give consent to be assaulted and raped in the horribly brutal and degrading way she was.
 
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Anxala said:
I can't see this particular case getting a conviction. Hearsay only, even if credible, and no victim and no parallels to be drawn with any of the other 5 cases? I can't see it.

But, rather than keep on going round the houses re this particular case, can we all please just agree that if what HeB and MS said they witnessed on tape is a true account of what they saw, then this 14yr old, whether she was there for 4 days or four hours, was absolutely the victim of an assault and rape by CB? She was 14yrs old, I don't give a crap what the age of consent in Portugal is, no 14yr old is in a position to give consent to be assaulted and raped in the horribly brutal and degrading way she was.
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I agree. No 14 year old would be in a position to consent to this. She was a victim.
 
Davieson said:
Would it be kidnap if she went willingly in the first place but was later prevented from leaving ?
Might be difficlt to prove, though irrelevant if the girl remains unidentified.
Click to expand...
She would have been held against her will. Whether this is considered kidnap or not I don't know. But just to mention that rape can even occur between couples. If the one does not want to have intercourse or whatever, even if they have chosen to be partners, it is still rape.
 
Anxala said:
I can't see this particular case getting a conviction. Hearsay only, even if credible, and no victim and no parallels to be drawn with any of the other 5 cases? I can't see it.

But, rather than keep on going round the houses re this particular case, can we all please just agree that if what HeB and MS said they witnessed on tape is a true account of what they saw, then this 14yr old, whether she was there for 4 days or four hours, was absolutely the victim of an assault and rape by CB? She was 14yrs old. I don't give a crap what the age of consent in Portugal is, no 14yr old is in a position to give consent to be assaulted and raped in the horribly brutal and degrading way she was.
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Does that not rather assume CB will be found guilty, if he's not then what does that say about the witness testimony?
 
C.greek said:
I agree. No 14 year old would be in a position to consent to this. She was a victim.
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Yes, it seems such a small ask, to not doubt that the description of what HeB and MS claim they saw on video was absolutely, no question, the rape and abuse of a 14yr old girl.

And it's fine to doubt HeB and MS but that's not what's happening here. The 'doubt' relates to whether or not what they claim to have seen constitutes rape. Effectively, those believing the account of the witnesses but looking for reasons to downplay and minimise what the witnesses claim to have seen, at the expense of a 14yr old.

It's depressing to read.
 
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HB and MS have been credible witnesses in the DM case. The judge from DM told us. As far as I can see there is no doubt and lately even MT told us about CB telling him about the rape of the teenager.
We have two chances. Either believe them or think it was all made up between all 3 of them.
I go with the first choice and the similarities of the DM case to the video rapes and HaB is striking. Especially DM and HaB, same entry, ( patio or balcony door) same backpack, same MO and same ending( sent to the bathroom)
I think there are much more similarities only a profiler ( Mr. D) can prove
MO of course
 
I know there are still people who doubt the rape of DM was done by CB. His hair was a body hair of 3 cm. Which is long so there is the assumption of a pubic hair. I saw pictures of her villa and it is like a fortress with high walls and palms. The assumption the wind brought the hair in her bed is nearly impossible.
 
What I don’t understand is why people here laughing about others opinion without answering or contradict? This forum has become worse as when I joined were everyone answered politely
 
Hygge said:
HB and MS have been credible witnesses in the DM case. The judge from DM told us. As far as I can see there is no doubt and lately even MT told us about CB telling him about the rape of the teenager.
We have two chances. Either believe them or think it was all made up between all 3 of them.
I go with the first choice and the similarities of the DM case to the video rapes and HaB is striking. Especially DM and HaB, same entry, ( patio or balcony door) same backpack, same MO and same ending( sent to the bathroom)
I think there are much more similarities only a profiler ( Mr. D) can prove
MO of course
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the problem is they may have been credible witnesses in the first case but that doesnt mean they are credible in the latest one. Especially when you consider MS lied in court and was asked if he had a mental illness because his testimony had changed.

Btw about the person laughing its possible the person meant to do another button and pressed that by mistake
 
UK Girl said:
the problem is they may have been credible witnesses in the first case but that doesnt mean they are credible in the latest one. Especially when you consider MS lied in court and was asked if he had a mental illness because his testimony had changed.

Btw about the person laughing its possible the person meant to do another button and pressed that by mistake
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5 years have gone and people change. MS lives a low life and his consume of alcohol has influenced his behavior last years. The judges surely will know that and that he wasn’t like that 5 years ago.
 
Hygge said:
5 years have gone and people change. MS lives a low life and his consume of alcohol has influenced his behavior last years. The judges surely will know that and that he wasn’t like that 5 years ago.
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He still lied in court
 
HB did not lie and he is the most important witness. MS isn’t.
 
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