Hannah Graham: The Search - #2

[human]

I do not think his sites are random, but private property is a problem.

I do hope people are out there, but if the area is tough to get to, it might be hard.

 

[human]

Obviously he is not talking to LE.

Right now he is innocent.

So can he watch stuff on TV? Do they get the newspaper?

Does his lawyer tell him what his chances are or do lawyers tell their clients that they will get them off?

I wish the perp ( I will not honor him with a name) would think the DP is calling to him.

Or is he so arrogant that he thinks he will get off with his saintly personna?

 

[human]

Here is a definition of reasonable doubt.

It does not mean there is no doubt.

Lucky I can't be on the jury because it is reasonable that a rapist murderer did not let her go.
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Beyond+a+Reasonable+Doubt

 

[aHoo]

It has recently been reported that the search for Hannah is focused around an "8 mile radius". I find this somewhat specific. I am not familiar with how cell phone pings and towers work, but could this specified search area be related to tracking Jesse's cell phone location on the night Hannah disappeared? Another possibility could include gas and mileage in the car, if they were able to locate information from receipts or Credit Card purchases or video of him filling up with gas before or after the disappearance. I just think there is some reason the search is focused within a specific area (8 mile and radius being the key words). Why not a broader number like 10 miles within Charlottesville or 20 miles east? Any thoughts?

It's because most bodies are found within an 8 mile radius of where the missing girl disappeared. That's why they chose 8 miles, and LE has stated this (without using the word "bodies").

 

[aHoo]

Given that JLM was reportedly an avid fisher, I wish LE would organize a team of local fishers to work with SAR people. I live south of Charlottesville, and I know from experience that local fishers don't hesitate to trespass if the fishing is good and they think they can get away with it. There's a lake on our community's property, supposedly closed to outsiders, which has been completely fished out by trespassers who think nothing of crossing our properties at midnight or 3AM, if necessary, to get to the lake and fish without getting thrown out. I don't doubt for a minute that JLM knew all the good fishing spots south of town, where he grew up, and many of these were likely not accessible without trespassing.

I recall seeing trespassing as one of the items on JM's rap sheet. I wonder if the property he trespassed on was for him to fish--or perhaps he was fishing for a future hiding spot to conceal a body.

 

[ksj3]

Sorry if repost. "Everyone I've talked to says UVA suspect knows the woods better than anyone." - Coy Barefoot

https://twitter.com/CNNSitRoom/status/519242760852103169

 

[Heroine]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

 

[Heroine]

Obviously he is not talking to LE.

Right now he is innocent.

So can he watch stuff on TV? Do they get the newspaper?

Does his lawyer tell him what his chances are or do lawyers tell their clients that they will get them off?

I wish the perp ( I will not honor him with a name) would think the DP is calling to him.

Or is he so arrogant that he thinks he will get off with his saintly personna?

If I know him like I think I do from all the media reports he probably thinks he'll get a way with this. Why not? He's gotten away with everything else.

 

[MJPeony]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

I am not an expert by any means on the Cassandra Morton case, and I don't have a link right now to support it, but I was looking into her case last week. I seem to remember reading in more than one place that one of the sad elements to her story is that she kind of lived at different places and had no set routine or schedule. So there was no real way to pinpoint "where she was living" at that exact time, or who saw her last (contrasted to someone noting she was missing b/c they were expecting her). If that makes sense.

Anyone who knows the CM case better than, please correct me. But the threads are rather slow these days here on HG so I wanted to reply with what I understand at least.

 

[jamicat]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

Very sad case. I did a quick read on it. Just as Foxfire states in Post #639, an excellent and thorough post on the subject, some cases get a lot more attention than others due to a number of factors which he well addresses.

Unless there is some very good evidence left on Cassandra's body, or someone talks, I don't think her perp will get caught.

 

[jamicat]

I am not an expert by any means on the Cassandra Morton case, and I don't have a link right now to support it, but I was looking into her case last week. I seem to remember reading in more than one place that one of the sad elements to her story is that she kind of lived at different places and had no set routine or schedule. So there was no real way to pinpoint "where she was living" at that exact time, or who saw her last (contrasted to someone noting she was missing b/c they were expecting her). If that makes sense.

Anyone who knows the CM case better than, please correct me. But the threads are rather slow these days here on HG so I wanted to reply with what I understand at least.

As I stated above, Foxfire's post #639 does a thorough and great job in explaining how some cases go viral and public with a lot of attention and some simply don't. CM's case is one that did not. In fact, her case was brought up when MH's disappearance occurred, but not a word of any evidential link between the two, though a DNA link was reported to be established between MH's case and a 2005 rape victim. Sadly, I don't think there is going to be any resolution on CM's case.

You are right that due to lack of schedule and other factors, it too k a while to even report her missing. No one knows exactly when she even disappeared.

 

[Moonchime]

Thanks for your answers!

Somhe could assume that no one might go there for years.

My hubby helped on farms even as a boy of around 8 or 10 so I can see the perp,working there or having a friend that did. I can see him sneaking on the property as a kid.

If he wore a headlamp, would he be noticed?

People are awake early on farms.

I do think HG is somewhere that he has scoped out

On the night that Morgan disappeared, JM was a taxi driver. Also, the owners of Anchorage Farm were out of the country on a cruise. Perhaps, JM drove them to the airport? Or, he knew that nobody was on the premises at that time.

Most likely JM did wear a headlamp since he knew there was nobody around to see him--since the Bass family was on vacation. On that night there was no moon because it was raining in Charlottesville.

I've often wondered why Lt. Rader said that the murderer of Morgan returned to that spot at times of extreme stress. It makes me wonder if JM would return to the scene of the crime and absent mindedly discard his cigarette butts around MH's remains?!? He thought her body was so well hidden that she'd never be found.

 

[LI-Mom]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/loc...792-8c32-5c35-ab11-924e06468aa1.html?mode=jqm

She was found on Candlers Mountain.

 

[Le Singe]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

i had mapped out some of this and one point and he last seen place and body location where very close defo within 8 miles but iirc even closer than that.

Edit: looks like about 5 miles

 

[brainysthenewsexy]

The number of articles, segments can be measured. Anyone know the number vs Hannah's coverage even up to now? Also we can count how many posts on websleuths, though there is intermingling.

Look at the attention other miising persons get. Lauren Spiere got quite the media attention. A lot parent driven. Count her threads, posts here.

As for Alexis Murphy, if you google her, not nearly the attention, not even close and this is a case that's gone to trial and done. Couldn't find much on it at all, not even a wiki entry. Sad. AA girl, not the media push. White, college students, a whole other story.

Interesting. I just read an article about this called "What the Hannah Graham Disappearance Says About U.S. Culture and the Media. The dangers of “Missing White Woman Syndrome.” I'm not sure I agree with everything the author had to say, but the article had some interesting points.

http://reason.com/archives/2014/10/06/what-the-hannah-graham-disappearance-say

 

[Foxfire]

It's because most bodies are found within an 8 mile radius of where the missing girl disappeared. That's why they chose 8 miles, and LE has stated this (without using the word "bodies").

The problem with statistics is that they include the disposal site geographical distances of sexual predators/serial killers in training. Due to the CSI effect and information easily acquired on the internet, crime shows such as Criminal Minds, etc., Experienced Sexual Predators/Serial Killers are aware of the geographical distance protocols of searches during abduction investigations. Experienced and escalated Predators will often times take advantage of jurisdictional linkage blindness and investigative SOP...

Example; Just a few of the jurisdictional linkage blindness games that Mickey Shunick's killer played to confuse LAPD/FBI investigators;

Experienced/recidivist Sadistic malignant psychopathic sexual predators/serial killers are very calculating, manipulative, creative, and deflective.

Unfortunately, it is often the case that serial offenders will rely on these jurisdictional boundaries to hamper investigations and cause confusion & linkage blindness in their crimes....

"Jurisdictional Linkage Blindness calculated by Tier 3 RSO Serial Killer BS Lavergne, in Mickey Schunick's abduction/murder and during the aftermath"

Imo, there is only one investigative tool that LE has that prevents jurisdictional linkage blindness; the American public via the MS Media...

BSL's Residence - 1 LE Jurisdiction

Mickey Shunick's Abduction - 2 LE Jurisdiction

MS Bike Disposal - 3 LE Jurisdiction <Whiskey Bay Bridge where Baton Rouge Serial Killer Derrick Todd Lee disposed of a victim's body years earlier>

Hospital NO/LA - 4 LE Jurisdiction

Opelousas General - 5 LE Jurisdiction

BSL'sStolen DW Truck Report - 6 LE Jurisdiction -Texas

BSL's Burned/Stripped DW Truck Located - 7 LE Jurisdiction - Texas

Mickey Shunick's body dumped - 8th LE Jurisdiction

Mickey Shunick's remains buried - 9 th LE Jurisdiction

* Mickey Shunick's body was buried in a shallow grave at a historical cemetery over 25 miles away from the abduction site.

 

[jamicat]

Obviously he is not talking to LE.

Right now he is innocent.

So can he watch stuff on TV? Do they get the newspaper?

Does his lawyer tell him what his chances are or do lawyers tell their clients that they will get them off?

I wish the perp ( I will not honor him with a name) would think the DP is calling to him.

Or is he so arrogant that he thinks he will get off with his saintly personna?

We don't know what JM has said to LE. He's spoken to them before the caputre and charges, but they've been tightlipped about anything he said. It seems to me, he's told them very little about Hannah.

No idea what his jail conditions and his privileges. His lawyer and visitors might have apprised him of the situation. I don't know a Defense attorney who would guarantee his getting off and as for chances, they change as the evidence changes. The defense is allowed som access to evidence and then during discovery before the trial gets to see what the case is against the client.

I am sure that JM is not sitting pretty there. He's scared I'm sure, thinking death penalty, I would not be surprised, and especially upset of the life and freedom he has lost from all of this. I doubt he is so arrogant and stupid that he thinks he will get off scott free. I'm sure he's sick about this.

But the fact of the matter, is that as it stands now, unless there is a lot more evidence, or very good evidence, it may not even go to trial. DAs do not like losing cases, and right now without a body, a murder charge is not in the picture. If they procede with it, the chances are not good even if they can prove Hannah was with him (done), was in the car (probably done), had sex with him (maybe done). that he raped her, that he killed her. that's a high bar to clear.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

The number of articles, segments can be measured. Anyone know the number vs Hannah's coverage even up to now? Also we can count how many posts on websleuths, though there is intermingling.

Look at the attention other miising persons get. Lauren Spiere got quite the media attention. A lot parent driven. Count her threads, posts here.

As for Alexis Murphy, if you google her, not nearly the attention, not even close and this is a case that's gone to trial and done. Couldn't find much on it at all, not even a wiki entry. Sad. AA girl, not the media push. White, college students, a whole other story.

I have tried to look up the number of articles and segments about the case, and there have been a significant number, and the case has been getting national coverage almost every day since it happened, and there are still always about 100-200 people on this forum. It is obviously a high-profile case. But the national coverage does not feel overwhelming or like the case is "overexposed".

 

[johnallore]

Here's the thing, let's just assume for a moment he was responsible for the death of Cassandra Morton. We know that her body was left in Lynchburg. I know I could read through these threads and find the exact spot and all these answers but it's too time consuming at the moment. How far did Cassandra live or where was she last seen vs. where her body was found? If she lived semi- nearby then there is an indication that he leaves the bodies at least near where they were last seen.

"November 29, 2009. A hiker discovered the body of Cassandra Morton in a wooded area off a hiking trial on Candlers Mountain near Camp Hydaway Road in Campbell County.

Investigators believe Cassandra Morton’s body had been there for more than a month.

Morton was initially reported missing from her Campbell Avenue home on Oct. 14"

I added to map I'm working on, but locations are not exact yet: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/albumMap?uname=101923034129909332892&aid=6066051544686321921#map

 

[jamicat]

The problem with statistics is that they include the disposal site geographical distances of sexual predators/serial killers in training. Due to the CSI effect and information easily acquired on the internet, crime shows such as Criminal Minds, etc., Experienced Sexual Predators/Serial Killers are aware of the geographical distance protocols of searches during abduction investigations. Experienced and escalated Predators will often times take advantage of jurisdictional linkage blindness and investigative SOP...

Example; Just a few of the jurisdictional linkage blindness games that Mickey Shunick's killer played to confuse LAPD/FBI investigators;

Experienced/recidivist Sadistic malignant psychopathic sexual predators/serial killers are very calculating, manipulative, creative, and deflective.

Unfortunately, it is often the case that serial offenders will rely on these jurisdictional boundaries to hamper investigations and cause confusion & linkage blindness in their crimes....

"Jurisdictional Linkage Blindness calculated by RSO Serial Killer BS Lavergne, in Mickey Schunick's abduction/murder and during the aftermath"

Imo, there is only one investigative tool that LE has that prevents jurisdictional linkage blindness; the American public via the MS Media...

BSL's Residence - 1 LE Jurisdiction

Mickey Shunick's Abduction - 2 LE Jurisdiction

MS Bike Disposal - 3 LE Jurisdiction

Hospital NO/LA - 4 LE Jurisdiction

Opelousas General - 5 LE Jurisdiction

BSL'sStolen DW Truck Report - 6 LE Jurisdiction -Texas

BSL's Burned/Stripped DW Truck Located - 7 LE Jurisdiction - Texas

Mickey Shunick's body dumped - 8th LE Jurisdiction

Mickey Shunick's remains buried - 9 th LE Jurisdiction

* Mickey Shunick's body was buried in a shallow grave at a historical cemetery over 25 miles away from the abduction site.

Great info, as usual, Foxfire. I am thinking and hoping that JM really doesn't study things like this, and is just flat out impulsive and sloppy. Picked up Hannah because it was so easy, thought he could have sex with her easily, maybe with the help of some drugs, maybe just raped her, and it was easy too. Maybe something went wrong, so then, he killed her and ditched the body. or then again, maybe did it to clean up any evidence. But he was awfully stupid not to know that she would have been linked to him. He was seen, clearly seen with her.

Unlke the 2005 rape case, or the MH case, where the perp was not seen by anyone who knew him, in Hannah's case, he was openly with her at Tempo where he was clearly known. Also, his face is as clear as can be in the DMV photo. You'd think she'd have slashed him. Maybe marks on his arms or elsewhere. How could he be so careless, so foolish to think that she wasn't going to come up missing and be reported, and that LE would be coming to him as a POI, would have to do so, in that he was with her those early morning hours? This was not a spontaneous thing like the 2005 rape. It was not a clean opportunity lke the MH case. What did he expect?