Hannah Graham: The Search - #4

[FindHG]

I'm pretty sure we're not supposed to link to other sites, but just saw the most recent analysis on the conservative tree house site. Anyway, I'm not advocating views or anything, but it's impressive suggestions, as are MJPeony's suggestions. All tangents, tried and tested does't hurt, it seems to me.

 

[SolVol]

I'm pretty sure we're not supposed to link to other sites, but just saw the most recent analysis on the conservative tree house site. Anyway, I'm not advocating views or anything, but it's impressive suggestions, as are MJPeony's suggestions. All tangents, tried and tested does't hurt, it seems to me.

Empty Summer Camps - yes, that's a real possibility. Wonder if they have cctv/security cameras? The older defunct camps likely would not.

Dog teams reconnoitering would be a good idea. But could a dog detect a body in a septic tank?

 

[FindHG]

Being of a different mindset about how or why JM ended up in the Galveston area, I'm curious as to your thoughts that it is deliberate choice for rather gruesome reasons. I have read and appreciate many of your posts and just wonder what is it that leads you to believe there is a specific connection that would imply knowledge of the history of the area. I haven't seen or read anything that leads me to believe that JM would be likely to seriously study up on SKs, emulate their actions or make pilgrimages to their notorious sites.

it seems to me that most of what we have learned about JM indicates impulsivity, recklessness and someone frequently on the prowl for an opportunity. The active search for an opportunity (vulnerable target) may be a deliberate action, but I just don't see him having a game plan that places great significance on the actions of other SKs/predators or symbolism in his choice of locales.

This delving into his MO may seem a better fit for the "what we know about JLM" thread, but I believe who he is, and how he approaches his predation, informs where he would take his victim(s) and where he would leave them. And I think it is more likely that after a "successful" prowl, he would head to a fairly local area that he knows well, offers the privacy he needs and a place to leave his victim. If his MO is more sophisticated, strategic and/or symbolic that would open up an entirely new can of worms to search through.

I'd appreciate if you could elaborate on what leads you to believe his actions are much more deliberate and not "accidental" i.e., going to Galveston due to significance of the location.....and what do you think that could mean for where he might have taken HG? Not meant to be confrontational question in any way--just curious as to a different line of thinking. TIA :+)

Thank you for asking. It's always appreciated and I welcome this process, not stuck on any one way to try to approach this. The reason I thought it may have been deliberate is that he took the time with his social media facade. Part of that was to engage in interacting and following the Harrington's efforts to find their daughter through a support group, that had local young women on it as well, according to WSers, from whom I've learned most of what is known about his activities. It's been mentioned that he was a hiker and had linked to various sites associated with it and other outdoor activities. Early on, he was said, in the press, to have told a long time acquaintance that he spent much of his free time playing online poker. He was said early on to have linked to a group advocating for teachers accused of abuse, an association from his past. He was said to have scrubbed his facebook page soon after the videos of him appeared. He was said to have, by a verified insider on this forum, received friendly legal advice soon after the videos appeared. He was said to have blacked out his facebook page picture soon after he went into CPD and called a defense attorney, before he took off for Tx.

He was reported in the press to have left with family inside the car with him during the chase, then ditched them who knows where, once he lost LE surveillance. His friends were reported to have questioned him about his likeness to the perp sketch, so he chose to change his looks. There are many more reasons besides, examples of choice he made, that would lead me to think that he had the penchant, capacity and motivation to inform himself about the thing that may have interested most in life. The thing he apparently may have hidden so well from all he knew, as far is known. He was reported in the press a couple of times by anon sources that he latched onto people, those who knew him from school and those who were with him that night. He may have not been super smart or able to control his impulse to rape and murder, but he may have known for a long long time how to game this world in order to get away with it. I think the chances are not small that he may have latched onto that idea, the way he felt as a predator. That he may have fed that same perverse ego on the notion by mastering it, by studying, even emulating others like himself. That the truest from of flattery perhaps may have been behind his choice of ending up where he did seems more likely, not some obscure college bacchanal, the way I still see it. So these are just some of the reasons, respectfully presented in the wrong thread, to try to explain why. Sorry bessie. Most of all though, Hannah Graham has been impossible to find until now.

I am sincere in saying I appreciate your question. The more there's a chance to take it from every angle the more what is true is exposed. Thank you.

 

[4MYGUYS]

I don't know if this was already discussed so...
I was reading another site discussing the possibility that JM gleaned info on vacant properties from his work at the hospital. I find that a bit remote, but what I don't find remote is JM possibly getting info on properties that may be absent their owners, from his work at the nursing home. It might be worth checking out who was residing at that particular home when he was working there. Families often employ caretakers from nursing homes for continued care of their loved ones upon discharge too. (JM, his roomies, a family member as a caretaker???). Might be worth looking into. JMHO etc. etc.

 

[FindHG]

I don't know if this was already discussed so...
I was reading another site discussing the possibility that JM gleaned info on vacant properties from his work at the hospital. I find that a bit remote, but what I don't find remote is JM possibly getting info on properties that may be absent their owners, from his work at the nursing home. It might be worth checking out who was residing at that particular home when he was working there. Families often employ caretakers from nursing homes for continued care of their loved ones upon discharge too. (JM, his roomies, a family member as a caretaker???). Might be worth looking into. JMHO etc. etc.

Seems like a wise thing to do. Seems to me, you're right.

 

[Foxfire]

I have my own theory about how JM knew about and chose an obscure place like Bolivar Peninsula on Galveston Island to lay low. I'd be willing to bet he'd heard of Galveston Island because of the annual Beach Party Weekend. Maybe even been there himself partaking in the festivities.

Starting back in the '90's a black fraternity called Kappa Alpha Psi started hosting an annual Beach Party Weekend in Galveston every year. It grew every year until approximately 250,000 black college students (and non students) from all over the United States would converge upon Galveston for this event. It was a HUGE deal. But in later years it started to get out of control.



Back when JLM was in college the Beach Party Weekend in Galveston would have been in it's hayday. It was advertised heavily and well known to young black college students throughout the United States.

http://http://www.houstonpress.com/2002-04-11/news/beach-party-blues/

Link didn't work for me.. Posting additional link --> http://montgomerycountypolicereport...thousands-in-surfside-one-dead-three-injured/

SHOOTING ERUPTS AMONG THOUSANDS IN SURFSIDE-ONE DEAD THREE INJURED
Posted on April 7 2012, 11:59 pm by Scott Engle in Fire and EMS, Local / Area News, State / National News

 

[ChiaPet]

I don't know that the info about the party in Galveston fits on this thread because I don't think he brought Hannah that far but I do think its worthwhile to explore more local places where there may have been parties when he was in high school. I can think of a number of secluded areas in my hometown where people went to party, do drugs or hook up with people that would be out of the way enough that you could hide things or people. Any of the locals know of any places like that where they may have had a field party? He might not bring a victim to THE actual place where they partied but he would know of back roads to get to the secluded areas or would know what parts wouldn't be popular for HS kids to poke around.

 

[Spotsy Dude]

Local Trail Maps and internet search suggstion

Below are some links to maps of trails and parks in the C-ville and Albemarle County area. May be sleuthers with a little more time than me and more familiar with the area can utilize these to look for escape routes from Tempo or possible disposal sites JM may have used.

Also, if we could pin down some “user names” JM used on the internet we could find forums he was a member off.

If we had a user name we could look for forums related to C-ville and Albemarle County. Other search terms I would use are: off-road, 4x4, atv, fishing, hunting, back roads, back woods. rural, little known, secret, walking trails, running trails, nature trails, biking trails


Trails in Charlottesville (Click on “Map of City Trails” in first paragraph for pdf map of C-ville with the trails outlined)
http://www.charlottesville.org/Index.aspx?page=1725

Albemarle County Parks & Recs Trails
http://www.albemarle.org/department.asp?department=parks&relpage=4648

Rivanna Trails
http://www.rivannatrails.org/Resources/Documents/rivannaTrail.kml

Ivy Creek Map
http://www.hikingupward.com/OVH/IvyCreek/

Best Trails Near Albemarle county
http://alltrails.com/search?q=albemarle+County&ref=search

Links to Mountain Biking, Hiking, off-roading trails in Virginia
http://www.americantrails.org/resources/statetrails/VAstate.html

 

[themom]

So that's a well-known party place.

Anchorage Farm was apparently known as a party place.

What other farms and remote locations around Charlottesville are known as party places? Would those be more likely places for him to take a body?

GOOD QUESTIONS!
The party connection is sounding like a good tip!

 

[FindHG]

Local Trail Maps and internet search suggstion

briefed respectfully

Great suggestions! Thank you.

 

[imjustagirl123]

Is the bad weather expected to stop the search efforts today? Every day I wake and come on here hoping she has been found! With each passing day especially in bad weather evidence may be lost. I hope they find her soon so her family friends everyone will find some answers (whatever that may be).

 

[FindHG]

GOOD QUESTIONS!
The party connection is sounding like a good tip!

Found it! Zimm posted information that related to your question Thread 3 post #451
hope it helps

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...m-The-Search-3/page39&p=11070999#post11070999

 

[kathryann]

I come here every day hoping that Hannah is found ... her poor parents need answers. Where are you Hannah?

 

[Spotsy Dude]

This is a Virginia Appellate court document that mentions “Jesse Matthew”
This may give some more insight into how some women trusted this “big teddy bear”.

…” The victim became increasingly frightened by appellant’s presence and began
“running through the rest of the [stop]lights trying to get away.”
As she drove, the victim called her friend Jesse Matthew on her cell phone and then proceeded to
drive directly to Matthew’s house. At this point, the victim testified that appellant abandoned his
pursuit of her before she reached Matthew’s street.”

https://cases.justia.com/virginia/court-of-appeals-unpublished/2689092.pdf?ts=1323968272

 

[Ollie]

continuing ideas from #3 last night; where is Hanna;we know LE has her in the orange crysler leaving Tempo. where did he park, my guess is Water st less visible and train tracks on one side. quickest exit route 5th st going South,we all know he could go any direction but people know him and his car so UVA is out. South is his comfort zone(MH). He went to school there ,he fished there;he knows the roads(some may say well he drove a taxi ,he knows C'ville but you go where you know ) my opinion;so south to at least Red Hill Rd could be further;but he has abducted someone,I don't see him using 64 or 250 ,not with his driving record. again he has to get to site,I would assume outside of the car(his size and evidence) then dispose of her and get back before daylight so he won't be seen.So I don't see this happening on a paved road where someone could drive past. So since he doesn't have a 4 wheel car;I think gravel or dirt road for access. It has to be away from homes and dogs that bark. so we are eliminating possible search areas for SAR. He doesn't want her to be found by air ,so l think heavy foliage ;she weighs 140lb so how far can he walk with her (uphill not far) ;so more likely downhill ;decomposition attracks scavengers and smells,so under something, possibly in water. culvert,drainage area, old cisterns; not where she could be seen by air.well that's my 2 cents for now.

 

[cgwhoo]

Oops, I meant to quote Calico's reply (post #377) to SolVol from earlier but left the quote out and now can't figure out how to add it.

Here was my response:
Yup that's what I had found too (regarding LEC as grandfather's initials).

SolVol - the official cemetery site doesn't list all the people buried there. It's listed on a different site, which indicates that LEC and Hugh Carr were buried at the same cemetery. I haven't been able to find a connection between LEC and HC but if they were buried in the same (small) cemetery, I would think there would be one.

 

[RSC]

Wow.
This is interesting. You should call this in, just in case these folks would be worth LE's time to talk to. Presumably JM knew this "stalker..."

This is a Virginia Appellate court document that mentions “Jesse Matthew”
This may give some more insight into how some women trusted this “big teddy bear”.

…” The victim became increasingly frightened by appellant’s presence and began
“running through the rest of the [stop]lights trying to get away.”
As she drove, the victim called her friend Jesse Matthew on her cell phone and then proceeded to
drive directly to Matthew’s house. At this point, the victim testified that appellant abandoned his
pursuit of her before she reached Matthew’s street.”

https://cases.justia.com/virginia/court-of-appeals-unpublished/2689092.pdf?ts=1323968272

 

[RSC]

MH's shirt really bothers me.
A lot of people have discredited JM as being too careless/dim to put any thought into where he is taking his victims. I have no such faith--just watching the video in front of Sal's I get the chilling feeling that he is a very calculating man, and I am really guessing that he had a clear plan for his next victim, whoever it was going to be, regarding where he would take her. I do NOT think MH's shirt was a careless accident. I also do not think it was an accident that he was seen at Tempo with HG the night she disappeared. IMO, either:
1. He is getting "braver" as time goes by because he feels infallible. While this results in carelessness, it is not caused by carelessness, IMO. It is caused by whatever malfunction in his brain is causing him to do these heinous crimes to begin with., or
2. He is playing some sort of game, taunting LE intentionally. Also because he thinks he is infallible.

I think WS is doing a great job of digging up possible connections, and I don't think that HG will be found in a random place. I think the fact that JM listed his business address as right around the corner from the farm where MH was found (AFTER she was found) was very calculating. And frightening.

If you watch the video of JLM in Texas he seems to be inordinately concerted about appearances.For some reason this rings true to me given his background as a football star with people wearing "I love LJ" t-shirts in high school and all the attention that was likely lavished on him.

I can see a narcissist paying 600 bucks for a cell phone and then having it unlocked for a cheap plan.

I wonder if theres some way we can figure his narcissism into search efforts? We are all assuming that he placed HG as far away from MH as possible but maybe he didnt.

Theres also MHs shirt found on a busy street and not far from the Hessian Hills apartments, as if taunting the public and LE.

Maybe there is something like that at work with HG's location as well?

 

[Gilamon]

I think WS is doing a great job of digging up possible connections, and I don't think that HG will be found in a random place. I think the fact that JM listed his business address as right around the corner from the farm where MH was found (AFTER she was found) was very calculating. And frightening.

Whoa... I have not heard this. Where did we learn that he registered a business address in this area? Is there any info on what the business activity was?

 

[ksj3]

https://twitter.com/search?f=realtime&q=#hannahgraham&src=typd

This must mean something (in my wishful thinking). Mark Eggeman is coming back to Charlottesville today for the search!