Has any doubt crept in to your 100% guilty belief?

[bananarama]

None. Zero. Zip! Travesty of justice, praying for Karma is all that's left for me!

 

[Harlow]

I had absolutely no doubt at all until last night when I saw an interview Dr. Drew had with Jeff Ashton.

Dr. Drew said (I'm paraphrasing so forgive me if I don't have the words exactly right) that often coroners or medical examiners will put something (I think he said cotton) in the mouth and nose of the deceased to prevent/block anything from spilling out and Jeff Ashton agreed with him that the jury could have used this as a possible theory for the duct tape being applied to Caylee after she had died.

For the very first time since Caylee was found and we learned of the duct tape I had a "hmmmm" moment that actually made sense to me and might support the drowning theory.

Yes, there are still 1,000 things that don't make any sense at all about the drowning theory but I'm just saying that I went from being 100% to maybe 98%.

I still feel absolutely SICK at the verdict and regardless of whether caylee drowned, was chloroformed, or was suffocated, Casey played a part somehow.

I am floored that someone who threw her baby out like trash while she had the time of her life is going to walk out of jail like nothing ever happened.

 

[Ambiance]

I had absolutely no doubt at all until last night when I saw an interview Dr. Drew had with Jeff Ashton.

Dr. Drew said (I'm paraphrasing so forgive me if I don't have the words exactly right) that often coroners or medical examiners will put something (I think he said cotton) in the mouth and nose of the deceased to prevent/block anything from spilling out and Jeff Ashton agreed with him that the jury could have used this as a possible theory for the duct tape being applied to Caylee after she had died.

For the very first time since Caylee was found and we learned of the duct tape I had a "hmmmm" moment that actually made sense to me and might support the drowning theory.

Yes, there are still 1,000 things that don't make any sense at all about the drowning theory but I'm just saying that I went from being 100% to maybe 98%.

I still feel absolutely SICK at the verdict and regardless of whether caylee drowned, was chloroformed, or was suffocated, Casey played a part somehow.

I am floored that someone who threw her baby out like trash while she had the time of her life is going to walk out of jail like nothing ever happened.

Interesting...but why would casey want the fluids kept in? or are you saying they might have thought the ME put the duct tape on?

I am about 50-50 now between murder and an accident - but not drowning - think they threw that in because they could. you'll notice that they use the term accident alone most of the time not drowning. I think she died somehow when casey was trying to chloroform her. that's why she couldn't confess or testify because that would surely be homicide or manslaughter plus child endangerment. it explains the chloroform searches. and she was just to demented to do anything so she hid the body.

 

[Harlow]

Im, not saying the ME had anything to do with the duct tape. I'm just coming at this from my experience as a nurse. I have seen victims of drowning. It is very messy and there are a lot of fluids involved. I was just thinking if in fact there was a drowning if in a moment of panic she realized caylee was dead and she realized how much water was coming back out and maybe she tried to stop that from happening with the tape to make a cleaner scene for herself at the time.

 

[Ambiance]

Most people will never admit that they have doubt or find cause for a jury to have reasonable doubt because they are tired of being attacked for it.

If justice was really blind in this case we could probably have a lot of good discussion over this one but the parties to the case are prone to provoke some very passionate feelings.

I haven't been here long at all. I thought the name "websleuth" implied that people would be looking at all angles opening and without emotion. But, after reading the opening post today it sounds like I may be wrong because it sounds more like it is a place for people who unconditionally support the prosecution of a murderer - more like a victim's advocacy then a place to debate. This is fine...totally fine. I guess I was wrong.

 

[chasing.halos]

ZERO doubt. ZERO. If anything, I feel even stronger after watching the case that Casey murdered her daughter. I think she chloroformed her, duct taped her face and placed her in her crib and walked away. Came back, wrapped her in her blanket, put her in bags, threw her in the trunk. Then dumped her like garbage after partying for a couple of days and the smell made her remember she was still in there.

 

[Harlow]

Interesting...but why would casey want the fluids kept in? or are you saying they might have thought the ME put the duct tape on?

I am about 50-50 now between murder and an accident - but not drowning - think they threw that in because they could. you'll notice that they use the term accident alone most of the time not drowning. I think she died somehow when casey was trying to chloroform her. that's why she couldn't confess or testify because that would surely be homicide or manslaughter plus child endangerment. it explains the chloroform searches. and she was just to demented to do anything so she hid the body.

Agree about shy she couldn't confees or testify that's why I said I still have a million questions. It still makes no sense to me why she would #1 sit in jail for 3 years if it was an accident and #2 not say it was an accident when the detectives asked and said they'd help her. I remain so confused.

 

[Rlaub44]

I just don't know.

Some crept in when Casey was mouthing things durning the SA closing arguments.

I think she had something to do with it. I think she's not innocent. There are certian actions of ICA that give me a bit of pause.

Sorry, I just found this thread, but I wanted to comment on this. I have been concerned that her habit of shaking her head, mouthing things, etc. had the same effect on jury members as it did to you.

Several people here commented that it was as if she were being allowed to testify without exposing herself to cross. To me, it was very transparent and I wasn't swayed, but now on second glance, perhaps HHJP should have clamped down on this to avoid persuading the jurors.

Back on topic, I have less doubt after trial than I did before. If it had been accidental, the DT wouldn't have had to discredit the trunk evidence, because Caylee's body had to get to the woods somehow. They wouldn't have had to invent the scenario where RK kept and hid the remains, nor would they have had to endorse CA's lies about the internet searches.

If the accidental drowning is the true story, why would you need all of the other lies to support it?

 

[wenderella]

Things that still do not make sense to me... If George disposed of Caylee...being a cop, wouldnt he have done a better job not to have her found? AND being a cop, why did it take the mom to seach for Casey, don't you think the dad would have connections to track her and her vehicle down sooner than 31 days?

 

[plastics]

I have a question. Why in the world did that person post that joke about chlorophorm on her myspace!? Who brings up talking/joking about chlorophorm?? I didn't even know what it was till this case happened.

I bet some friend joked with her about using chlorophorm on someone, and in her twisted mind, she was like "what a great idea." and she ends up using it on her daughter.

 

[DDLR]

I haven't been here long at all. I thought the name "websleuth" implied that people would be looking at all angles opening and without emotion. But, after reading the opening post today it sounds like I may be wrong because it sounds more like it is a place for people who unconditionally support the prosecution of a murderer - more like a victim's advocacy then a place to debate. This is fine...totally fine. I guess I was wrong.

Most of the people here have followed this story for three years, and saw all or most of the trial. They have seen all the jury saw and what the jury didn't see. They know enough to see that the circumstantial evidence against Casey Anthony was more than enough for reasonable, intelligent people to realize that she is absolutely, without a doubt guilty. Also, what is wrong with supporting prosecution of a murderer?

 

[crucibelle]

Im, not saying the ME had anything to do with the duct tape. I'm just coming at this from my experience as a nurse. I have seen victims of drowning. It is very messy and there are a lot of fluids involved. I was just thinking if in fact there was a drowning if in a moment of panic she realized caylee was dead and she realized how much water was coming back out and maybe she tried to stop that from happening with the tape to make a cleaner scene for herself at the time.

I saw on one episode of 48 hours where they said that when people drown, a blood-tinged foam comes out of the mouth and nose.

 

[crucibelle]

I WANT to doubt, because I WANT to feel better about this verdict. I am seriously depressed, and that is not pleasant, at all. I was trying to make myself feel better the other day and said to my husband "Well, if Caylee really did drown, I am glad Casey got off" then HE, a person who has NEVER paid any attention to this trial until he heard the verdict and saw all the outrage, said "If she drowned, how do you explain the duct tape?" Arrrggg... so much for me feeling any better about all this. Casey got away with murder, IMO.

 

[miss plum]

Seeing the look of pure, evil triumph on KC's non-grieving face as she strutted into court this morning, seeing her play coquettishly with her ghastly flowing hair as she beamed at JB, seeing her pout furiously about being held accountable for the piddling crimes she has been convicted of when she has media appearances to get ready for, did nothing to weaken my views on her guilt.

 

[cluciano63]

I was never 100% certain, but I was about 50% certain that they state did not prove their case. I still thought they would get a conviction though, just because a child is dead.

 

[MEM2010]

Something just popped in my head.

I recently read on another thread on WS that they didn't test Caylee's hair for the presence of chloroform because it doesn't deposit in the hair...

what if kc used the substance on Caylee for that very reason?!

IDK just wanted to write this down in case I forgot. I just can not get over the chloroform. I don't know how it was used but it is just everywhere!

anyway.. MOO

 

[Star12]

To answer the thread topic - NO.

She was adjudged not guilty, she was not adjudged innocent.

 

[lynxofsd]

I am about 50-50 now between murder and an accident...I think she died somehow when Casey...[???]...that's why she couldn't confess or testify because that would surely be homicide or manslaughter plus child endangerment.

I've always felt that the chloroform was a red herring. JB, in his closing statement, passionately emphasized Yuri Melich's testimony that investigators were completely unable to find any connection with Casey or the Anthony home with the presence or possession of chloroform: no one bought it, no bottles contained it, no chemicals for making it were found. The only links to chloroform were the searches for it that were discredited in court and the presence of it in the trunk in a concentration that the experts could not agree on. JB successfully dashed the chloroform as an agent of Caylee's death on the rocks in his closing statement, and in my opinion, with very good reason. Strike one on the State's COD.

The jurors were not convinced about the duct tape either because of (1) the general disordered state of the remains six months after Caylee's disappearance, and (2) that they might have been disturbed by at least one person [Kronk] who Ashton acknowledged in his closing statement did not tell a consistent story to LE about how he found or manipulated the remains in December. Remember Ashton saying in the closing statement that Kronk liked to "tell a good tale" to explain away his inconsistencies or embellishments? The moment he said that, Kronk's involvement in potentially disturbing the crime scene (and the duct tape, maybe?) became even more suspect. Whether he actually did this became less important than the possibility that he could have. Strike two on the State's COD.

I think what you wrote in your quote is essentially correct. Caylee died because of something that Casey did that killed her. She may not have intended to kill her, but whatever caused the child's death was a criminal act that she was responsible for. Otherwise, there was no logical reason for her to have covered up Caylee's death until Cindy called the police. She has a personality disorder, but that does not mean that she did not manifest a consciousness of guilt in the 31 days as well. (One does not exclude the other.)

I know that Casey and the Anthonys are all about denial, but if Caylee died because of an accident that was not due to a criminal act, there would have been absolutely no reason for LE not to be notified immediately--none.

There are a lot of families more bizarre and dysfunctional than the Anthonys that suffer terrible accidents (like drowning) in which children die every day in this country--and those accidents are uniformly reported because that's what people do. To suggest that the Anthonys would do this differently because of their "family issues" borders on the mythological.

Casey did this all on her own, maybe not intentionally.

 

[Chrishope]

To people who think there was reasonable doubt, what alternative explanation could there have been for the computer searches for chloroform and neck breaking?

Not trying to give anyone a hard time. I'm honestly really asking.

A week or so ago, I was doing a search for "hit man" and another for "arsenic poisoning". My reasons were simple, I write detective fiction (nothing published, or eve submitted but maybe some day)

If my wife turns up dead next week, this does not mean I put arsenic in her food or hired a hit man to kill her.

 

[mrye4709]

But, a negligent accident would never be forgiven by CA. If KC and her friends had made a crude concoction of cloroform and it was in a gatorade bottle in the car Caylee could have gotten it while KC wasn't paying attention. How would she explain that? Maybe she did put Caylee in the trunk and that's when she got it. It wouldn't have been unusual for her to not have Caylee, maybe she went with TonE and forgot she was in there. When she realized what happened she went home, bagged her up and borrowed the shovel, couldn't dig the hole and loaded her back up. Too close when George came towards the car, she takes her down the road and tosses her without realizing that fluids leaked into the trunk. The car starts stinking so she puts trash in and parks by the dumpster hoping it would go away, but it got towed and she got cornered by her mother. Since she told her the nanny had her, the kidnapping was born. Only I am still bothered by the "don't worry I didn't tell them anything" statement.

I think she is without a doubt guilty, just not sure what happened. The only way we will ever know is if KC talks and you and I and the rest of the world know, that even if she did we wouldn't know when to believe her. She knew her mom wouldn't let her get the DP. I think she was as shocked as we were with the verdict. Now she will be unstoppable in her mind. Look what I did, I am that good.

This is like the JonBenet case, I wish we had answers. What has the world become?