How Did the Side Door Get Opened?/Door Locks/Use of Cinder Block**REVISITED**

[weasel]

Also I think that if she did indeed go out after the kids were asleep, LE should look at the people she came into contact with that night. If Haleigh was abducted, whoever took her knew nobody else except the children were there at that moment.

 

[debs]

I don't think it's odd either, considering she doesn't know what "numerical" means. I will say this though, I think the reason for her confusion and different versions of what happened is that she was not home when it happened. I think she waited for the kids to fall asleep and went out.

Misty said "The miracle, what's that?" She misheard the word "numerical."

 

[fortytwo]

I don't think it's odd either, considering she doesn't know what "numerical" means. I will say this though, I think the reason for her confusion and different versions of what happened is that she was not home when it happened. I think she waited for the kids to fall asleep and went out.

Misty said "The miracle, what's that?" She misheard the word "numerical."

Even if she hadn't misheard I can easily understand her confusion.

I am very familiar with the word "numerical", but I have never heard that usage of it, or in that context, and I'm quite a bit older than Misty.

If the 911 operator had said, "What's the house number?", or "What's the street number?" I suspect that her answer would have been quite different.

"What's the numerical?" is the sort of insider jargon that sounds completely reasonable to the ears of the user, but makes outsiders stop and think to themselves, "Huh? What?" In the pressure of that situation it's understandable that it gave her pause. I suspect most of us would have reacted the same way.

 

[lonetraveler]

IMO, I think that the concrete block has always been used to prop the outside storm door open so it would not swing and hit you as you took the garbage out or used that door with your hands full. This concrete block was most likely originally kept close by to use to prop the door open so that a wheelchair bound person could enter the home. IIRC, it has been stated that the door would swing and slam making a very loud noise. Again, I think that the concrete block was always used to keep the door opened for convenience and to prevent the door from slamming in the wind.

 

[lonetraveler]

Whisper,

I guess we can only speculate on where they smoked or what door was used to go out. My point is, if the screen door or ramp show signs that the door was routinely propped open, it blows the theory that no one ever saw that brick before or we never used that door. I don't think LE took the screen door because of prints, maybe for the lock but my guess it is to prove or disprove the statement. If they ever find Haleigh, I guess they will have some evidence to prove "for or against" Ron and Misty's statements.

--------------
I'm willing to bet that there are probably many cigarette butts lying on the ground at the door indicating who smoked and what door they used.

 

[Skully]

IMO, I think that the concrete block has always been used to prop the outside storm door open so it would not swing and hit you as you took the garbage out or used that door with your hands full. This concrete block was most likely originally kept close by to use to prop the door open so that a wheelchair bound person could enter the home. IIRC, it has been stated that the door would swing and slam making a very loud noise. Again, I think that the concrete block was always used to keep the door opened for convenience and to prevent the door from slamming in the wind.

Ron stated he never saw that block before and Misty said it wasn't that way when she went to sleep (see above 911 call). I don't disagree with you, but I have to wonder if the screen door showed signs that it was routinely propped open with that brick, or can the previous renter say if it was there prior to them moving in? At any rate, the brick tells me, this was planned. Who knows to bring your own brick? Or are you bringing one to the MH to throw off LE? Only time will tell, but I still think she is describing the wrong entrance after looking at photos of the two. JMHO

 

[YellowSubmarine]

IIRC - didn't RC say they very rarely used that door? Only when he washed his car or something like that. It doesn't seem there would be a cinder block there, if that's the case. Plus, RC also had stated he hadn't seen that block before and had no idea where it came from. So, not only did the kidnapper brazenly flip on the kitchen light and snatch Haleigh a couple feet from RJ and MC, but he also wandered around the dark yard looking for something to prop the door open.

 

[Skully]

--------------
I'm willing to bet that there are probably many cigarette butts lying on the ground at the door indicating who smoked and what door they used.

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

Wonderful observation Lonetraveler!!!! I used to smoke but quit and I forgot about how people just grind out a but and toss it........

 

[lonetraveler]

Ron stated he never saw that block before and Misty said it wasn't that way when she went to sleep (see above 911 call). I don't disagree with you, but I have to wonder if the screen door showed signs that it was routinely propped open with that brick, or can the previous renter say if it was there prior to them moving in? At any rate, the brick tells me, this was planned. Who knows to bring your own brick? Or are you bringing one to the MH to throw off LE? Only time will tell, but I still think she is describing the wrong entrance after looking at photos of the two. JMHO

---------------
I believe that the concrete block was used that morning prior to the 911 call to stage the scene to show that a kidnapper used the concrete block to hold the door open so that the intruder could take Haleigh.

 

[lonetraveler]

Ron stated he never saw that block before and Misty said it wasn't that way when she went to sleep (see above 911 call). I don't disagree with you, but I have to wonder if the screen door showed signs that it was routinely propped open with that brick, or can the previous renter say if it was there prior to them moving in? At any rate, the brick tells me, this was planned. Who knows to bring your own brick? Or are you bringing one to the MH to throw off LE? Only time will tell, but I still think she is describing the wrong entrance after looking at photos of the two. JMHO

----------------
I'm thinking that someone working on night shift and trying to sleep in the daytime would be very irritated if the door was slamming in the wind and would most likely look for something to hold the screen/storm door open so that you could still use the exterior door to exit and enter the home (unlocked of course) but the storm door would not make a racket and keep you awake. I do not believe Ron's statement about not ever seeing the block before...................nope.

Just think, if he locked the exterior door so that the children would not run in and out of it keeping him awake and securing the storm door so that it would not make noise keeping him awake, then he just might be able to sleep......

 

[lonetraveler]

Ron stated he never saw that block before and Misty said it wasn't that way when she went to sleep (see above 911 call). I don't disagree with you, but I have to wonder if the screen door showed signs that it was routinely propped open with that brick, or can the previous renter say if it was there prior to them moving in? At any rate, the brick tells me, this was planned. Who knows to bring your own brick? Or are you bringing one to the MH to throw off LE? Only time will tell, but I still think she is describing the wrong entrance after looking at photos of the two. JMHO

----------
It has always aggravated me that the front door is totally ignored although it supposedly was the only one used on a regular basis, per Ron. If the side door was as hard to open as Ron stated, wouldn't you break into the front door instead of the side door? The front door is more private with the screened in porch covering it. It would be impossible to see someone breaking into the front door in the dark inside of a screened in porch, KWIM?

 

[Skully]

----------
It has always aggravated me that the front door is totally ignored although it supposedly was the only one used on a regular basis, per Ron. If the side door was as hard to open as Ron stated, wouldn't you break into the front door instead of the side door? The front door is more private with the screened in porch covering it. It would be impossible to see someone breaking into the front door in the dark inside of a screened in porch, KWIM?

Yes, I do and that is why I think she is confused in the call. KWIM? She knew a door would be staged and she heard "backdoor" but in her mind she is see "front door" and got it mixed up....If I was LE I would have jumped on this along with the dozen other things that ain't right....

 

[YellowSubmarine]

---------------
I believe that the concrete block was used that morning prior to the 911 call to stage the scene to show that a kidnapper used the concrete block to hold the door open so that the intruder could take Haleigh.

I completely agree that the block was staged. Not sure by who, though.

1. The kidnapper had to search around a dark yard for the block, according to RC's statement

2. Why would he automatically prop the door? I've got a couple doors that when unlocked, I can easily open them with an elbow. How would someone know if they could do that or not? How would the person know the door would slam shut?

3. The person could've easily carried Haleigh and still freed a hand to open the door.

Of course anything is possible, but the evidence we know of says the kidnapper had gone through several unneeded steps that could've easily gotten him caught. I'm just not buying it. So, the question becomes, WHO staged the block?

 

[lonetraveler]

IIRC, Ron stated that he is the only one with a key to the house. My suspicion is that Misty was in the habit of keeping the front door not locked so that she would not be locked out when she was either smoking or even leaving the home. The front door may have been just left in the unlocked position that night due to her having a gigantic hangover and not being the "protective" little mother that she is purported to be. Or, did she give the children a little something to make them sleep and leave the house, maybe to get a little something to help her get over the weekend? Was Haleigh missing when Misty returned?

 

[fortytwo]

----------
It has always aggravated me that the front door is totally ignored although it supposedly was the only one used on a regular basis, per Ron. If the side door was as hard to open as Ron stated, wouldn't you break into the front door instead of the side door? The front door is more private with the screened in porch covering it. It would be impossible to see someone breaking into the front door in the dark inside of a screened in porch, KWIM?

(bold above by me)

I don't recall Ron making a statement other than suggesting it would be difficult for a small child to manipulate the deadbolt because the receiver (bolthole) was not well aligned, making the deadbolt hard to turn. Is that what you meant?

 

[YellowSubmarine]

This may be a silly question, but is it possible to prove the door had indeed been broken in to? Can you pick a dead bolt? And if they can prove or disprove that theory, where do they go from there? R & M have been so adamant the door was locked, I don't know how they could go back and say "Oh, well maybe it wasn't"

 

[debs]

This may be a silly question, but is it possible to prove the door had indeed been broken in to? Can you pick a dead bolt? And if they can prove or disprove that theory, where do they go from there? R & M have been so adamant the door was locked, I don't know how they could go back and say "Oh, well maybe it wasn't"

They were the first also to suggest a "pick lock artist or lock bumping" as possibilities.

 

[Skully]

IIRC that side door was to take the trash out too. I remember the ramp had bags of trash set down beside it and against the MH. Where I live in FL, we have 3 trash days. Two are for trash pickup because of the heat it is twice a week and one day is recyclables.... So even if you didn't recycle you could be using the door twice a week to take out the trash, especially with 4 people in the MH. My point is, it is possible they propped the door to even get the trash out, or if not, they knew it slammed back if your hands are full. Would an intruder? I just don't buy it, sorry.

 

[fortytwo]

This may be a silly question, but is it possible to prove the door had indeed been broken in to? Can you pick a dead bolt? And if they can prove or disprove that theory, where do they go from there? R & M have been so adamant the door was locked, I don't know how they could go back and say "Oh, well maybe it wasn't"

The question isn't silly, it's perfectly reasonable.

Yes. A deadbolt can be picked. The one on that door probably wouldn't have been all that difficult. They can also be "key bumped", a technique which is not the same as "lock picking" and unlike it requires very little training or experience.

Under most circumstances neither method will leave any signs which are noticeably distinguishable from normal use of the lock, so there wouldn't be any reliable way to prove that it had been done, or not.

 

[fortytwo]

They were the first also to suggest a "pick lock artist or lock bumping" as possibilities.

I'm not trying to pick a fight, or really even trying to disagree, but can you provide some references to support that?

Just as food for thought, if the "staged scene"scenario is to be considered, isn't it a bit tough to account for both insisting that the doors were locked and not providing any signs of forced entry? Either one would have been relatively simple to incorporate into a "plot".