IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #22

[Bootsctr]

Okay, I see what you mean.

One relatively easy cause would be if the bodies had been wrapped up into blankets. They were in the shade last summer, so they would have been protected from the high temperatures. Fabric would have wicked up moisture from the ground and gotten wet with dew, so that some evaporative cooling would occur.

Great point. Also, I think the forest canopy protected their bodies somewhat, but just my opinion. Very anxious to read the Medical Examiner's reports if they are ever released. Maybe we will get some details as to how long the bodies were left to the elements. I tend to agree with everyone who thinks they were left there not very long after the abduction.

It seems we could have several crime scenes with the girls which leads me back to if the bicycles were staged... Love reading everyone's comments regarding staged versus unstaged. If the girls' bikes were found pointing south, I think they were staged in an attempt to fool LE. If found helter skelter, I think they were taken from Meyers Lake. If they were indeed pointed in the north direction then they may be as the girls left them. Again, lots of questions, not many answers to be found yet. :twocents:

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

I wouldn't exclude the hunters from the reward just yet. If evidence from the dumping site is used to convict or apprehend the perp(s), they may just get a share of it. Though I think that may be the least of the hunters concerns. I know it wouldn't be a top priority for me. They do not generally dispense with any part of the reward until a capture/conviction takes place.

 

[JaimeInLA]

The hunters exist and they are both devastated. One is male and one is female.
The reward money was for the safe return of the girls, or the arrest and conviction of the person/s involved in the kidnapping/murder.
The hunters who found them would not have been eligible for just finding the bodies.

Just curious how you know this. Do you know them personally or is this info from Facebook?

 

[JaimeInLA]

Thank you for setting the record straight! So many times conspiracies are imagined when it comes to investigations.

I'm just trying to theorize (which is what we do here) why the bodies were located within DAYS of the reward TRIPLING. Is that not odd to anyone else? Sorry, but I have a hard time believing in that coincidence. I think the police have more than we know.

 

[TxLady2]

Last summer, several of those "attempted abductions" turned out to be misunderstandings fuelled by increased tension.

The Washington and Henry Counties white van guy has yet to be identified and, more than that, he has yet to commit a crime. I would like for LE to find out who he is but I'm not yet convinced that he has criminal intentions.

So far, there hasn't been anything to link a white van to Lyric and Elizabeth's disappearance.

BBM: And THAT right there is one reason LE does not issue warnings to the public when a crime such as this happens. They do not want nor need a panic setting in. It causes people to phone in false claims, and make unfounded allegations about innocent people. LE ends up chasing down and investigating things that turn out to be nothing except a parent getting paranoid because of some incident that ordinarily would mean nothing.

 

[Elley Mae]

Great point. Also, I think the forest canopy protected their bodies somewhat, but just my opinion. Very anxious to read the Medical Examiner's reports if they are ever released. Maybe we will get some details as to how long the bodies were left to the elements. I tend to agree with everyone who thinks they were left there not very long after the abduction.

It seems we could have several crime scenes with the girls which leads me back to if the bicycles were staged... Love reading everyone's comments regarding staged versus unstaged. If the girls' bikes were found pointing south, I think they were staged in an attempt to fool LE. If found helter skelter, I think they were taken from Meyers Lake. If they were indeed pointed in the north direction then they may be as the girls left them. Again, lots of questions, not many answers to be found yet. :twocents:

I have always thought that the bikes where taken to the Lake by the perpetrator/s. jmo

 

[Foxfire]

Yep, and I bet that reporter said the information came from "someone close to the case." I'm getting to the point that I don't trust reporters, or much of the media in these cases. Factual reporting is becoming a thing of the past, it seems. It's all for drama, and ratings, and anything to keep the public glued to the t.v.

JVM HLN - Who killed Lyric and Elizabeth?
http://www.hlntv.com/video/2012/12/0...-and-elizabeth


Transcript of 12/07/2012 JVM Show

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...6/ijvm.01.html

(Snipped-read more)
Jon Lieberman, you`ve got new information. Tell us.

 

[Snufamonbobball]

Just curious how you know this. Do you know them personally or is this info from Facebook?

I do know them.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

In 1969, Steven Weiss found a buntline special in the hillside behind his California home and he turned it over to police. While his discovery(through a comedy of LE errors) did not lead to the apprehension of Charles Manson and his murderous family, it was a crucial piece of evidence used during the trial to tie the "family" to the Sharon Tate murders. He received part of the reward money. Another part went to a jail informant who originally alerted police to the family's involvement in the crime. Those rewards were dispensed with after the convictions occurred.

 

[roseofsharon]

Just to clarify, 7 Bridges is a primitive area with no water or electricity, so camping would most likely be by a tent there. I have heard camping and fishing is not that uncommon there, but the area is certainly not a tourist attraction or campground.

With this area being primitive, would park rangers go into the area from time to time to look around and if so, what type(s) of vehicles do park rangers drive?

Would a person need to park and walk to see the site where the girls were found?

Do the Iowa parks hire summer students?

TIA and IMO

 

[pearl]

I am a little confused by how quickly the site was gone over. Thinking back to other cases, specifically Caylee Anthony, recovery can take days in an environment like this.
.

If you are referring to speed of LE reaction, it was instant. Area closed by
HW Patrol and Deputies, FBI response instant with agents (forensic)
dispatched including from Nebraska there next morning, BCI people there
next day, search organised and still being conducted as I write ... this is
being taken very seriously at every level.[/quote]

My take on the rapidity of the response when the two girls were found is that this group of LE has been sitting on "go" for quite a while just waiting for somewhere to go to. LE wants this killer(s). The senseless killing of these two young girls has taken a personal toll on these officers, in my opinion. I, personally, am glad that LE is not releasing all their info because not doing so preserves the integrity of the investigation. I do find it frustrating that we don't know the details. I've followed this case since the girls went missing but haven't posted a lot. I don't have a theory as to what happened to Elizabeth and Lyric. Too many unknowns. I do think that LE knows quite a bit and has for some time. I would think there is a fine line between what you know and what you can prove. I think for many months this is the line that LE has been facing.

 

[janie]

I wouldn't exclude the hunters from the reward just yet. If evidence from the dumping site is used to convict or apprehend the perp(s), they may just get a share of it. Though I think that may be the least of the hunters concerns. I know it wouldn't be a top priority for me. They do not generally dispense with any part of the reward until a capture/conviction takes place.

On Thursday's KWWL enening news they reported they had received viewer comments asking if the hunters could receive the reward and Ron Steele replied it was his understanding they may be eligible.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

Excellent post, Pearl. My gut is that this case will be solved.

 

[tlcya]

Hello, I have been following this case as I moved from Waterloo about 5 months ago to West Des Moines. I have been following these forums about these missing girls and I have decided to create an account to share my thoughts.

Has anyone followed up at all about the creepy craigslist posting about the bridge? That seems like a smoking gun almost in regards to this case. Also, there is some very curious happenings on the Waterloo, Rants and Raves on Craigslist as well, seems as someone keeps posting poems and seems very troubled psychologically. This could also provide a large clue.

I feel that the perp or perps who has done this quite possibly is looking for their chance at "fame" and wants to be caught, but does not want to make it too obvious. I believe there is something more to the Craigslist activity, thoughts?

Stil reading to catch up with posts after I logged off last night but wanted to say :welcome:

Glad to have you join us!

 

[dadgum]

Pearl..what I originally referred to was the days and days of sifting, searching, etc. for scattered bones, plant material. Because the girls were recovered very quickly in comparison, it makes me (and others) wonder if they were not scattered, which would imply lack of animal interference, and a shorter time in the elements. Seems to me a wildlife area close to water would be frequented by..wildlife.

That's all. No one said anything about LE being slow. They want to solve this case, and put the right person in prison.

 

[Fukiyama]

http://www.cbs2iowa.com/shared/newsroom/top_stories/videos/kgan_vid_12108.shtml

- The father of one of the two missing Iowa cousins is expected to soon learn whether he will be put on trial next week for domestic abuse or drug charges, raising the possibility that he could be sent to prison even as the search continues.

That is old news. Dan was given a continuance.

 

[cindersoot]

IIRC, a young boy was fishing at Meyers Lake the day the girls were abducted and he was asked if he had seen the girls, but hopefully LE will now ask this boy if he remembers anyone else fishing at Meyers Lake that day.

I don't remember ... did LE or the FBI provide a criminal profile, at the time of the abduction.

Maybe someone can correct me, but I really don't think LE provided the public with a criminal profile.

 

[Foxfire]

I'm sure the autopsy results will be released soon enough, maybe not every detail but enough to assist the general public in the area to be aware of what to look for.
But in all honesty, it's not our job to find this perp. We should let LE do their jobs and not interfere with their investigation. Too much "help", even with good intentions, tends to slow them down. If they have to chase down leads generated by tips from the public that turn out to be nothing, then it doesn't help anyone. There are nearly always crackpots who love to insert themselves into cases, or confess to the crime for attention, so knowing details that have not been made public helps them to weed out those nutcases.

TXLady, I have to respectfully disagree with you about the worthless public tips and the too much "help" by the public comment. Many if not most missing/murdered persons cases are solved due to an aware public's tips. The American public is a very valuable resource in missing/murdered persons investigations.

America's Most Wanted in cooperation with Law Enforcement has been credited for more Top 10 fugitive captures due to public tips than any individual Unit of the FBI. (aprox - 1200 Fugitives)

http://abcnews.go.com/US/11-facts-fbi-top-ten-fugitive-list/story?id=16329221#4

Public Awareness
153 FBI Top 10 Fugitives have been captured as a result of tips and assistance from the public.


http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/fbi-...ed-list-arrest/story?id=17812495#.UMNdIYPAe8A
FBI to Fill Vacancy on Top 'Ten Most Wanted' List Following Arrest of Murder Suspect in Mexico



Accused child pornographer Eric Toth, kidnapper Adam Mayes and murder suspect Fidel Urbina all made the list this year. Toth replaced Osama bin Laden on the list. Mayes shot himself when officials found him and the two young girls he abducted one day after he was added to the list.

The Most Wanted list is a way for the FBI to crowd source the American public, giving the names of dangerous criminals attention they might not otherwise receive to help track them down.

More than a quarter of criminals on the list were captured thanks to media promotions. Only two captures came from the Internet so far.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/11-facts-fbi-top-ten-fugitive-list/story?id=16329221#

11 Facts About the FBI Top-10 Fugitive List

Although FBI top-10 fugitive Adam Mayes, wanted for murder and kidnapping two Tennessee girls, was apprehended after only being on the FBI's Top 10 Most Wanted list for 29 hours, his case was not one of the fastest to be closed. (VIDEO)
(Edited by me: Mayes & the 2 Bains sisters were located due to a citizen's tip)

The FBI has named 497 suspects as most wanted since a reporter first asked for a list of their "toughest guys" in 1950, according to their records. Eight of those wanted - less than 2 percent - have been women.

 

[Fukiyama]

But in all honesty, it's not our job to find this perp. We should let LE do their jobs and not interfere with their investigation.

The administrators need to rename the sight then.

 

[cindersoot]

JMO, From LE referring as the finding of the remains as, "bodies", instead of remains leads me to think they were not there too long. I also think the reason the bodies lay far apart is because the perp first carried one body in and came back to his vehicle than carried the other body in, but not as far. Maybe he got spooked and didn't take it in as far.