IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #33

[Bootsctr]

OT, but for my fellow former Hinkyite, B4Igo4it, and Foxfire in speaking of undeserved and untimely deaths and vengeance from the grave:

Is Evelyn Miller's murderer haunted?

Frederiksen attempted to kill himself with a knife. While he was being driven to the hospital, he said if he could take it back if he would: that he would be dead and Evelyn would be alive, records state.

After Frederiksen’s arrest on child *advertiser censored* charges in the spring of 2006, a fellow inmate at the Linn County Jail overheard him say “I’m sorry, Evelyn.” He told the inmate that Evelyn had told her stepmother that she had been sexually abused.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/co...cle_f7502af2-08e0-11e2-92a4-0019bb2963f4.html

 

[threecrazykids]

Yes I agree, IMO there are three crime scenes, Myers Lake, someplace private where he took them to die, then Seven Bridges. I think carbuff hit the nail on the head when she spoke of people who are opportunists. He saw the opportunity and acted upon it, it seemed everything was quick and convenient. I'm guessing/hoping that they did not suffer long after they were taken. Maybe they need to look at someone who "latches" onto other people lives in order to gain something. I lived with one of those, I won't go into a lot of detail, but after certain things came out he was not allowed to see his daughter till she was 21 years of age. He was never officially charged but that was enough for me to end our marriage. My lawyer actually called him an opportunist, afterwards I recounted certain events in our marriage and realized she had pinned the correct title on him.

As for your thoughts on the purse...we were never told by LE what was in the purse except for the phone. It made me wonder if there were any money in the purse, if there was, possibly the girls thought about stopping at the store for candy. Wish we knew what else might have been in the purse.

I've always wondered if there was maybe a couple dollars/change in the purse too. IMO, unless the family actually KNEW the girls had a couple dollars in the purse when they left, if LE did NOT find any money in there it wouldn't necessarily mean they didn't leave with any in there. LE just didn't mention any money being found with the purse.

I have often wondered if their plan was to stop at the ice cream shop (Four Queens I think it's called?), stopped at Fareway to ask for directions to the lake (rumor of course) and then continued down the nature trail to the Arbutus/Gilbert area. If they took just enough money for whatever they were buying (which it's very possible they would know EXACTLY how much they would need if they frequent the shop) they wouldn't have anything left in the purse (money wise).

 

[Bootsctr]

Yes I agree, IMO there are three crime scenes, Myers Lake, someplace private where he took them to die, then Seven Bridges. I think carbuff hit the nail on the head when she spoke of people who are opportunists. He saw the opportunity and acted upon it, it seemed everything was quick and convenient. I'm guessing/hoping that they did not suffer long after they were taken. Maybe they need to look at someone who "latches" onto other people lives in order to gain something. I lived with one of those, I won't go into a lot of detail, but after certain things came out he was not allowed to see his daughter till she was 21 years of age. He was never officially charged but that was enough for me to end our marriage. My lawyer actually called him an opportunist, afterwards I recounted certain events in our marriage and realized she had pinned the correct title on him.

As for your thoughts on the purse...we were never told by LE what was in the purse except for the phone. It made me wonder if there were any money in the purse, if there was, possibly the girls thought about stopping at the store for candy. Wish we knew what else might have been in the purse.

Glad you and your lawyer caught on to him. I agree with you and carbuff about the perp possibly being a "latcher on" type. As far as the purse, yes I would love to know the entire contents. Always wondered if there was a note in the purse too.

 

[alliemay]

I've always wondered if there was maybe a couple dollars/change in the purse too. IMO, unless the family actually KNEW the girls had a couple dollars in the purse when they left, if LE did NOT find any money in there it wouldn't necessarily mean they didn't leave with any in there. LE just didn't mention any money being found with the purse.

I have often wondered if their plan was to stop at the ice cream shop (Four Queens I think it's called?), stopped at Fareway to ask for directions to the lake (rumor of course) and then continued down the nature trail to the Arbutus/Gilbert area. If they took just enough money for whatever they were buying (which it's very possible they would know EXACTLY how much they would need if they frequent the shop) they wouldn't have anything left in the purse (money wise).

Yes I believe the rumor about them stopping and asking for directions.

 

[Bootsctr]

https://www.facebook.com/GilbertvilleDepot

I just love old buildings. This one is beautiful, hope they restore and use it.

Any connection? I'm clueless. :blushing:

I love old buildings too BunnyHop! Unfortunately, The Depot has a lot of problems to do with water and flooding that I do not believe can be easily corrected. It does seem to be well loved by the community and they fundraise to keep the building kept up as well as it can be.

My connection is that it is part of the Cedar Valley Nature Trail. The building, like I said is creepy from the video. I would not go in that building alone nor without some kind of protection. It was being left unlocked. I assume a homeless person might find it a good place to spend the night or a few days. It has bathrooms and water. They could have easily roamed from The Depot to Evansdale via the bike/hiking trail. If whomever snatched the girls was looking for a place to "be alone with them", The Depot might have provided them this opportunity, although it would be a risk to get them into the building without being seen. Not really a direct connection with The Depot, just thinking if there was a similar place in Evansdale where the girls could have been taken. Can't quit thinking about the secondary crime scene of where the girls were murdered.

 

[Bootsctr]

I've always wondered if there was maybe a couple dollars/change in the purse too. IMO, unless the family actually KNEW the girls had a couple dollars in the purse when they left, if LE did NOT find any money in there it wouldn't necessarily mean they didn't leave with any in there. LE just didn't mention any money being found with the purse.

I have often wondered if their plan was to stop at the ice cream shop (Four Queens I think it's called?), stopped at Fareway to ask for directions to the lake (rumor of course) and then continued down the nature trail to the Arbutus/Gilbert area. If they took just enough money for whatever they were buying (which it's very possible they would know EXACTLY how much they would need if they frequent the shop) they wouldn't have anything left in the purse (money wise).

I think the girls might of had to have asked for directions too. It's just not possible that no one beside the lawn-watering guy saw them. Ice cream would be a perfect treat and the perfect reason for a bike ride.

 

[Foxfire]

I was noticing that the Black Hawk County Fair was held in late July 2012. Preregistration began on July 15, 2012; two days after L & L's abduction. The Swine exhibit and Big Boar contest are big draws for the fair..
MJK worked in the swine industry and may have manned a booth at the BHC fair for his employer..imo

 

[Foxfire]

http://www.kwwl.com/story/22985419/...-updated-evansdale-family-pleased-with-change

AMBER Alert Criteria Updated, Evansdale family pleased with change(video & article/interview)

Posted: Aug 01, 2013 12:31 AM EDT

BLACK HAWK COUNTY (KWWL) -
Three little letters could have made all the difference to Lyric Cook and Elizabeth Collins, the Evansdale girls that were kidnapped just over a year ago.

When they went missing, an AMBER Alert was never issued. Since officers had no suspect or description of the vehicle --

"Their hands were tied," said Heather Collins, Elizabeth's mother.

Tied by the wording of the Iowa AMBER Plan Criteria.

But now, Wednesday, on what would have been Elizabeth Collins' 10th birthday, the State amended these criteria. When Heather heard of the change, she was ecstatic.

"What a great birthday gift for her, even though she's not here with us," she said.
read more-

 

[B4igo2it]

Boots Post #652; these have been my thoughts this morning! Are we getting signs from above? Wondering what cosmic energy at the moment. I am hoping we are nearing an arrest!!!

 

[B4igo2it]

I was noticing that the Black Hawk County Fair was held in late July 2012. Preregistration began on July 15, 2012; two days after L & L's abduction. The Swine exhibit and Big Boar contest are big draws for the fair..
MJK worked in the swine industry and may have manned a booth at the BHC fair for his employer..imo

yes yes yes! good thinking. Does his wife have a child in 4-H? I know her family owns a lot of land. LE should check fair records/registration .... maybe this should be called in? Just thinking out loud here! :twocents:

 

[Foxfire]

http://www.kwwl.com/story/22985419/...-updated-evansdale-family-pleased-with-change

<sniped & BBM for focus>
Trelka has been advocating for change in the code for almost a year. He even attended an AMBER Alert conference with Drew Collins, Elizabeth's father.

Still, Trelka said the timing of this decision is amazing.

"To have the state come out with the changes in criteria, today on Elizabeth's birthday, just sends shivers down my spine," he said. "I mean, wow."

He said a clearer policy allows officers to act more quickly to save missing children, so the change is a move in the right direction.

Because time is of the essence in child abduction cases,

"What's sad is when a child is abducted, their chance of being murdered in the first three hours is significant," he said.

For Elizabeth's mother, on what would have been her daughter's tenth birthday, this change was the answer to her prayers.

"When I woke up today and I was praying, 'Lord, let something happen big today, even if it's not huge, huge, just something that will&#8230;" she said. "Just to show that what we're doing is what we should be doing."

 

[carbuff]

Yes, I think Lyric could have had a "crush" on a boy or was beginning to notice boys. However, whatever happened the week prior which had Aunt Tammy giving tips about stranger danger and to escape an abductor, I believe had more to do with Aunt Tammy's daughter being followed/meeting up with a "creepy" older person (CMF/JJB?). However, that person was known to Lyric. Same for Aunt Tammy's daughter. She would not have considered this person a threat.

Why did Elizabeth take her purse if the girls were going on a quick bike ride? Does not make sense to take her purse if the girls were going to ride around the block. It seems the girls would have told someone where they were going if they were leaving their known boundaries. :facepalm: Elizabeth taking her purse with her cell phone that she played games on and perhaps a little money indicates to me she knew she and Lyric were going somewhere specific. Whom did the girls encounter?

I have been thinking about the secondary crime scene as I do not believe the girls were killed at Meyers Lake nor at 7-Bridges. Somewhere is a second crime scene where the girls were killed. Was the empty house on Meyers Lake examined as a crime scene? Anybody wonder if The Depot in Gilbertville could be a secondary crime scene? I watched a video here someone was so kind to post regarding The Depot. Very creepy place and wide open for anyone to enter and leave at will. Lots of bikes that looked like anyone could "borrow" them for a ride. ullhair: :HHJP:

BBM

I honestly don't think the purse has that much significance. The younger girls around here carry their purses e-v-e-r-y-w-h-e-r-e! The girl across the street used to wear hers slung across her body while she was riding her scooter up and down the street with her sister after school. She even wanted to wear it into the pool It's a sign of independence or something.

As for the secondary crime scene -- this is purely a hunch, but my gut feel that is whoever took the girls (and this includes some of the hinkier scenarios) killed them in the car. Some of the hinkier scenarios make me wonder whether they might have been sedated, then killed painlessly (pillow over the face, perhaps). Again, strictly speculation.

 

[Squeeze]

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/ye...cle_d6ce0ba3-b046-5cd6-ade4-ab16e1b603d7.html

Rodger is in today's paper. What a stand-up guy he is, to continue raising money in his sister's name for Angel's Park and the National Center for Missing & Exploited Children.

 

[BunnyHop]

I love old buildings too BunnyHop! Unfortunately, The Depot has a lot of problems to do with water and flooding that I do not believe can be easily corrected. It does seem to be well loved by the community and they fundraise to keep the building kept up as well as it can be.

My connection is that it is part of the Cedar Valley Nature Trail. The building, like I said is creepy from the video. I would not go in that building alone nor without some kind of protection. It was being left unlocked. I assume a homeless person might find it a good place to spend the night or a few days. It has bathrooms and water. They could have easily roamed from The Depot to Evansdale via the bike/hiking trail. If whomever snatched the girls was looking for a place to "be alone with them", The Depot might have provided them this opportunity, although it would be a risk to get them into the building without being seen. Not really a direct connection with The Depot, just thinking if there was a similar place in Evansdale where the girls could have been taken. Can't quit thinking about the secondary crime scene of where the girls were murdered.

Why the heck would they leave it unlocked after spending $100,000?
That just invites vandalism and (?) :banghead:

 

[Sunlight]

Just a thought.

Why would the girls stop to ask for directions to the lake, when the Carpenters reported that they (at least Elizabeth) were seen riding by their house which is right near the lake, frequently? Elizabeth already knew the way to the lake apparently.

MOO

 

[Sunlight]

Perhaps the 12:27 call from the bathrooms was made prior to the bikes ending up at the trail. Perhaps the girls stopped at the park for water or the ice cream truck on Gilbert and Elmer around 12:30 and then the bikes with or without the girls subsequently ended up on the trail. If the girls, as Abben said, were last seen at 12:23 on Brovan, then they could have made it down to the park at the lake on Gilbert and Elmer between 12:30 and 1:00 and then been seen riding past Mr. Carpenters house and down to the lake, where the abduction may have taken place....abducted into a white vehicle with a bike rack on it that may have been parked that morning on Arbutus.

ETA: The counter call to report them missing was made at 2:47 approximately IIRC. The bikes were found by a firefighter between 3:30 and 4:00.

MOO

 

[B4igo2it]

What do you all think; could this be the white SUV?

Evansdale bike trail part 2 - YouTube

look at 2:35+ on this video
The narrator states: on Brovan - to River Forest RD and before East End

(I was reviewing post 278 , thread 25, page 12)

 

[threecrazykids]

Just a thought.

Why would the girls stop to ask for directions to the lake, when the Carpenters reported that they (at least Elizabeth) were seen riding by their house which is right near the lake, frequently? Elizabeth already knew the way to the lake apparently.

MOO

I asked that question myself...from what I was told if you were riding over on Lake Ave (say, just riding to a friends house from the trail) that you can't readily see the lake. I believe that tree line (Maiden Lane area) covers a large part (if not all) visibility of the lake from that area.

I haven't driven in that area though, so I can't say for certain.

What also makes me wonder if the girls (rumor of course) actually asked for directions to "the lake" OR if they had actually asked for directions to a specific street/house/etc. that happened to be on the lake/near the lake. Then when stories were changed/condensed/told time and time again...that it was somehow changed to "they asked for directions to the lake".

 

[B4igo2it]

MISTY COOK-MORRISSEY, MOTHER OF 10-YEAR-OLD LYRIC COOK: From my understanding, they do not know that area. Maybe Elizabeth and some friends had ridden down there at one time.

BROUSSEAU: One time.

COOK-MORRISEY: But no, it's not an area that they frequented. They didn't go far from home, either of the girls. They mainly stayed around the Evansdale area that my sister lives in, so it's just not kind of like them to go that far.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...17/cnr.03.html

 

[Sunlight]

The rumor I heard was that a man and 2 girls that fit the description of the girls (bearing in mind that there was no description of what they were wearing available, per Abben, as late as the 16th). Anyway, that a man and two girls came into Fareway to ask directions to the lake, however, and I can't substantiate it, I think it was ruled out as being the girls..it was two girls with their father, and I think the directions asked were not to the lake. This is my opinion only and is not a fact. MOO and all that. I don't believe the rumor.