IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #34

[janie]

When the parents of Lyric were hounded by police and media regarding the disappearance, and needed a break, they stayed in a hotel for one night. It didn't solve the problem because police tracked them down anyway.

That does not mean that they were living together when the children vanished. In fact, media reports state that Lyric's parents had been separated for some time - I suppose that happens when parents are in jail. Lyric was in the custody of Wylma. Prior to that she was in the custody of Heather. Dan lived with his mother. Lyric did not grow up surrounded by meth and was not mature for her age. By all appearances, she was a normal 10 year old child that was growing up with extended family members because both of her parents had been in jail for drug related problems.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say that "they weren't supposed to be living together." They were separated and living apart, presumably by choice (perhaps something to do with the domestic assault).

I don’t think that just because at the time the girls went missing and we were informed that Lyric lived with Wylma and Dan and his son lived with Vicki we can assume that is how has always been. In fact, if you look at Lyric’s guardianship entry in Iowacourtsonline you will see that yes, at one point Heather had custody and then after that, Wylma had custody, but if I am reading the records correctly, all of those arrangements ended in 2007. Visitation is also in the record so I assume parents were granted visitation.

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TIndexFrm

ORDER CLOSING PROBATE ZAGER BRUCE B 07/10/2007

FINAL REPORT WALTON DONALD RAY 07/10/2007

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/19/2003 Comments: SUPPLEMENTAL RE VISITATION

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/01/2003 Comments: PETITIONERS PETITION FOR GUARDIAN IS GRANTED

I think it is safe to assume that when Misty was incarcerated, she entrusted Wylma to keep Lyric, but I don’t think it is a stretch to assume that for a period of time after 2007, Dan and Misty had physical custody of the children. In fact, at Lyric’s memorial service there were many photos of her with Dan and Misty.

Since it doesn’t appear Dan and Misty ever quit using drugs, I don’t think it is a stretch to assume the children were exposed to drugs and people in the parent’s drug world. We know from this article that the judge admonished Dan for having exposed his son to both a fake meth drop and that he was also present during the meth house bust in December of 2011. Then look at what the judge said during the comment about Dan’s parenting. He said exposing “THEM” not HIM to that world ("to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.”)

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_6e223240-1c9c-11e3-9c93-001a4bcf887a.html

But prosecutors painted a different picture of Morrissey, stating there was evidence he simply continued his involvement with drugs during the disappearance, not only using them himself but selling them for profit.

“He was doing this activity before, he did it after ... There are reports of his house smelling of chemicals the day that the report was given that they found the bodies. That wasn’t a triggering event. That started before that, to have that chemical smell before the report was even given,” Assistant Black Hawk County Attorney Brad Walz said.

“He is getting pseudoephedrine and lithium and other items for manufacturing methamphetamine while the (Tri-County Drug Enforcement) Task Force is following him around ... He’s doing this where you’d think Mr. Morrissey would have some idea that people might be following him or watching what he’s doing,” Walz said.

Morrissey’s 17-year-old son was with him when police saw Morrissey drop a package of fake meth. He said the son was also at a meth lab at a Kingsley Street home when police raided it in December 2011.

In handing down the 90-year sentence, Judge David Staudt said Morrissey had “affected negatively probably every person” he’d come into contact with.”

“Since you were released from custody after your daughter’s unfortunate event, you were utilizing other women you knew to go to stores to buy or steal pseudoephedrine so you could manufacture methamphetamine,” he said. “The fact that your child was in your home when you were arrested on these events show that you don’t use very good judgment concerning yourself as a parent, to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.”


What is very disturbing to me (from the same article) is detectives reporting to the prosecutor that the day the girl’s bodies were found when they went to tell Dan the bodies were found, the chemical smell in the house was there, indicating he didn’t start using meth again as a result of his grief at the discovery of the girl’s bodies, but that he had been using prior to that, as evidenced by the smell in the house.

Whose house would that have been? I assume since he was living with Vicki it was Vicki’s house. The same house Dan’s son was/is living in? That would mean Vicki was aware and tolerant. If that is how Vicki operates, I give no stock into anything she says or said.

 

[janie]

That abduction of these two children, without a trace, is very difficult for people to understand. Of the two children, in terms of trying to understand what happened, it is much easier to look at Lyric and focus on the fact that her parents are drug addicts. From there, it doesn't require any logic to leap to a false conclusion that the drug addiction caused the abduction. In fact, if one didn't know better, in viewing the last several pages of this thread, one would almost believe that only one child was abducted ... the child of drug addicts.

Another point is that although both parents are drug addicts and the mother has been in prison for drug related criminal activities, the focus is on the father and his drug related criminal activities. It strikes me as odd and illogical that the focus is only on the father's drug issues. Regardless, the focus has been on the father's drug problems ... case solved by omitting evidence (familial alibis) and half of the victims.

Elizabeth was abducted near her home on a route that she was known to take while visiting friends. Elizabeth's mother said that she often cycled in the evenings before returning home to share ice cream with her mom. Elizabeth was the child that would have been observed cycling unattended on a regular basis in the area of Meyers Lake. At the time that Elizabeth was abducted, her cousin was visiting ... perhaps making it easier for a perp to make contact with the children.

It's easy to focus on Lyric because it's easy for people to look at the drug addiction and believe that they've solved the case. Since this happened in Elizabeth's neighborhood where Elizabeth habitually cycled, I think there has to be a connection to Elizabeth ... and with the "drug theory", there is no connection.

We know this wasn't a familial abduction because police have said as much, and because we (and police) know where the parents were when the children were abducted. On that basis (alibis), police have been able to state that the drug addicted father of one of the victims is not a suspect in the abduction/murder.

I often agree with your posts Otto but I don't remember hearing that anyone is cleared of being a suspect in this case?

I have always believed their abduction and murders was related to someone in the parent's drug world and still believe so. There are sexual deviants in the drug world too, not just roaming bike trails. There is also potential for retaliation by someone in the drug world to a family member, especially to someone who sold them fake meth or narc'd on them.

I can see someone in Misty's and Dan's lives knowing Wylma took Lyric every morning to go clean Heather's house and felt it would be a good chance to grab Lyric in the smaller town where she rode her bike. Maybe one of her parents friends has even spoken to her about what she likes to do and she mentioned going to my cousins house to ride bikes when my Grandma cleans my Aunt's house in Evansdale. I am not going to close my mind to a possible connection to it being someone in Elizabeth's circle, nor am I going to dismiss the possibility of it being someone in Lyric's parent's drug circle.

 

[Aymstriss]

That abduction of these two children, without a trace, is very difficult for people to understand. Of the two children, in terms of trying to understand what happened, it is much easier to look at Lyric and focus on the fact that her parents are drug addicts. From there, it doesn't require any logic to leap to a false conclusion that the drug addiction caused the abduction. In fact, if one didn't know better, in viewing the last several pages of this thread, one would almost believe that only one child was abducted ... the child of drug addicts.

Another point is that although both parents are drug addicts and the mother has been in prison for drug related criminal activities, the focus is on the father and his drug related criminal activities. It strikes me as odd and illogical that the focus is only on the father's drug issues. Regardless, the focus has been on the father's drug problems ... case solved by omitting evidence (familial alibis) and half of the victims.

Elizabeth was abducted near her home on a route that she was known to take while visiting friends. Elizabeth's mother said that she often cycled in the evenings before returning home to share ice cream with her mom. Elizabeth was the child that would have been observed cycling unattended on a regular basis in the area of Meyers Lake. At the time that Elizabeth was abducted, her cousin was visiting ... perhaps making it easier for a perp to make contact with the children.

It's easy to focus on Lyric because it's easy for people to look at the drug addiction and believe that they've solved the case. Since this happened in Elizabeth's neighborhood where Elizabeth habitually cycled, I think there has to be a connection to Elizabeth ... and with the "drug theory", there is no connection.

We know this wasn't a familial abduction because police have said as much, and because we (and police) know where the parents were when the children were abducted. On that basis (alibis), police have been able to state that the drug addicted father of one of the victims is not a suspect in the abduction/murder.

BBM

Since we don't know what actually happened, or caused this heinous crime to occur, how do we know anybody has leaped to a false conclusion?

 

[threecrazykids]

I often agree with your posts Otto but I don't remember hearing that anyone is cleared of being a suspect in this case?

I have always believed their abduction and murders was related to someone in the parent's drug world and still believe so. There are sexual deviants in the drug world too, not just roaming bike trails. There is also potential for retaliation by someone in the drug world to a family member, especially to someone who sold them fake meth or narc'd on them.

I can see someone in Misty's and Dan's lives knowing Wylma took Lyric every morning to go clean Heather's house and felt it would be a good chance to grab Lyric in the smaller town where she rode her bike. Maybe one of her parents friends has even spoken to her about what she likes to do and she mentioned going to my cousins house to ride bikes when my Grandma cleans my Aunt's house in Evansdale. I am not going to close my mind to a possible connection to it being someone in Elizabeth's circle, nor am I going to dismiss the possibility of it being someone in Lyric's parent's drug circle.

So are you thinking that maybe this IS a sexual offense, but it just happens to be someone who was also connected via the drug world?

 

[janie]

So are you thinking that maybe this IS a sexual offense, but it just happens to be someone who was also connected via the drug world?

I didn't really think about it being sexually related with the drugs until Misty's best friend was in the paper last week. While I realize this person assaulted boys, I've had some communication with local people who are more familiar with the meth world than I am and I was given the impression pedo rings sometimes are involved in the meth world too as it helps pay for the drugs.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/cr...cle_b761fb1f-18d7-593d-aafe-f6890509000d.html

 

[threecrazykids]

I often agree with your posts Otto but I don't remember hearing that anyone is cleared of being a suspect in this case?

I have always believed their abduction and murders was related to someone in the parent's drug world and still believe so. There are sexual deviants in the drug world too, not just roaming bike trails. There is also potential for retaliation by someone in the drug world to a family member, especially to someone who sold them fake meth or narc'd on them.

I can see someone in Misty's and Dan's lives knowing Wylma took Lyric every morning to go clean Heather's house and felt it would be a good chance to grab Lyric in the smaller town where she rode her bike. Maybe one of her parents friends has even spoken to her about what she likes to do and she mentioned going to my cousins house to ride bikes when my Grandma cleans my Aunt's house in Evansdale. I am not going to close my mind to a possible connection to it being someone in Elizabeth's circle, nor am I going to dismiss the possibility of it being someone in Lyric's parent's drug circle.

FYI - here is one of many articles that state that they (BOTH sets of parents) are not considered suspects.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/07/missing-iowa-girls-year-later/2497109/

SBM
Lyric's father, Dan Morrissey, is in jail, awaiting sentencing on several drug and assault charges.

Evansdale Police Chief Kent Smock said that although family members were interviewed and allegations against them were followed "long and hard," no one is considered a suspect.

"At this point, they're grieving family members missing their daughters and nieces," he said.

Again...if you read this with a slanted eye...they are again only referring to Dan (and Misty)...because those are the only people who have had allegations against them.

I have YET to find any article where there is even one remote reference to Heather and Drew being cleared. Every single one I've been able to find (in reference to someone being cleared) always is prefaced with the point that Dan is facing drug charges etc.

If you can find one article where Smock states Heather and Drew Collins have been cleared as suspects I would greatly appreciate it...because every single one I've found about "clearing" names references Dan and Misty.

 

[SapphireSteel]

BBM

Since we don't know what actually happened, or caused this heinous crime to occur, how do we know anybody has leaped to a false conclusion?

Second guessing LE is useless. They've given us absolutely nothing on this case.

That doesn't mean there isn't a perp or a "most likely", it just means there hasn't been an arrest yet.

:cow:

 

[SapphireSteel]

FYI - here is one of many articles that state that they (BOTH sets of parents) are not considered suspects.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/07/07/missing-iowa-girls-year-later/2497109/

SBM
Evansdale Police Chief Kent Smock said that although family members were interviewed and allegations against them were followed "long and hard," no one is considered a suspect.

"At this point, they're grieving family members missing their daughters and nieces," he said.

^^This is the important part of this quote.

"At this point" = things might change.

 

[Aymstriss]

In my opinion "not being a suspect" is not the same as "being cleared".

 

[threecrazykids]

^^This is the important part of this quote.

"At this point" = things might change.

I agree completely. I am just pointing out that the ONLY people who are ever mentioned as being "cleared" (even "at this point") are Dan and Misty.

That baffles me. Not because I think there is necessarily any evidence pointing clearly one way or another...but why haven't Heather and Drew been mentioned as cleared?

 

[janie]

I agree completely. I am just pointing out that the ONLY people who are ever mentioned as being "cleared" (even "at this point") are Dan and Misty.

That baffles me. Not because I think there is necessarily any evidence pointing clearly one way or another...but why haven't Heather and Drew been mentioned as cleared?

I took his words to be both sets of parents ("At this point, they're grieving family members missing their daughters and nieces," he said.)

Everything is plural,
They're grieving family members (plural)
their daughters and nieces (plural)

 

[threecrazykids]

I don’t think that just because at the time the girls went missing and we were informed that Lyric lived with Wylma and Dan and his son lived with Vicki we can assume that is how has always been. In fact, if you look at Lyric’s guardianship entry in Iowacourtsonline you will see that yes, at one point Heather had custody and then after that, Wylma had custody, but if I am reading the records correctly, all of those arrangements ended in 2007. Visitation is also in the record so I assume parents were granted visitation.

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TIndexFrm

ORDER CLOSING PROBATE ZAGER BRUCE B 07/10/2007

FINAL REPORT WALTON DONALD RAY 07/10/2007

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/19/2003 Comments: SUPPLEMENTAL RE VISITATION

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/01/2003 Comments: PETITIONERS PETITION FOR GUARDIAN IS GRANTED

I think it is safe to assume that when Misty was incarcerated, she entrusted Wylma to keep Lyric, but I don’t think it is a stretch to assume that for a period of time after 2007, Dan and Misty had physical custody of the children. In fact, at Lyric’s memorial service there were many photos of her with Dan and Misty.

Since it doesn’t appear Dan and Misty ever quit using drugs, I don’t think it is a stretch to assume the children were exposed to drugs and people in the parent’s drug world. We know from this article that the judge admonished Dan for having exposed his son to both a fake meth drop and that he was also present during the meth house bust in December of 2011. Then look at what the judge said during the comment about Dan’s parenting. He said exposing “THEM” not HIM to that world ("to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.&#8221

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_6e223240-1c9c-11e3-9c93-001a4bcf887a.html

But prosecutors painted a different picture of Morrissey, stating there was evidence he simply continued his involvement with drugs during the disappearance, not only using them himself but selling them for profit.

“He was doing this activity before, he did it after ... There are reports of his house smelling of chemicals the day that the report was given that they found the bodies. That wasn’t a triggering event. That started before that, to have that chemical smell before the report was even given,” Assistant Black Hawk County Attorney Brad Walz said.

“He is getting pseudoephedrine and lithium and other items for manufacturing methamphetamine while the (Tri-County Drug Enforcement) Task Force is following him around ... He’s doing this where you’d think Mr. Morrissey would have some idea that people might be following him or watching what he’s doing,” Walz said.

Morrissey’s 17-year-old son was with him when police saw Morrissey drop a package of fake meth. He said the son was also at a meth lab at a Kingsley Street home when police raided it in December 2011.

In handing down the 90-year sentence, Judge David Staudt said Morrissey had “affected negatively probably every person” he’d come into contact with.”

“Since you were released from custody after your daughter’s unfortunate event, you were utilizing other women you knew to go to stores to buy or steal pseudoephedrine so you could manufacture methamphetamine,” he said. “The fact that your child was in your home when you were arrested on these events show that you don’t use very good judgment concerning yourself as a parent, to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.”


What is very disturbing to me (from the same article) is detectives reporting to the prosecutor that the day the girl’s bodies were found when they went to tell Dan the bodies were found, the chemical smell in the house was there, indicating he didn’t start using meth again as a result of his grief at the discovery of the girl’s bodies, but that he had been using prior to that, as evidenced by the smell in the house.

Whose house would that have been? I assume since he was living with Vicki it was Vicki’s house. The same house Dan’s son was/is living in? That would mean Vicki was aware and tolerant. If that is how Vicki operates, I give no stock into anything she says or said.

Just adding confusion to the mix...:floorlaugh:...according to THIS article Lyric's brother lived with Grandma Wylma Cook. :facepalm:

http://qctimes.com/news/local/servi...cle_09ef603a-453e-11e2-8659-0019bb2963f4.html

SBM

The girls' grandmother, Wylma Cook, along with Lyric's mother, Misty Morrissey, and aunt, Tammy Brousseau, are planning a service after Christmas --- possibly in January. They said Wednesday that plans call for Lyric's remains to cremated and placed in an urn from a monastery in Dubuque. Lilacs will be present at the funeral, as Lyric's favorite colors were purple and blue, Brousseau said.

"Lyric will not be forgotten," Cook said.

In a brief statement to The Courier, Morrissey, who has not spoken publicly yet about her daughter's death, said, "I'm glad she's with our Lord."
[...]

The discovery of the bodies also has been hard on Misty Morrissey and her Lyric's brother, Dillin Morrissey, 16, who lives with Cook. Misty Morrissey remains the Waterloo Residential Facility, stemming from a 2003 methamphetamine conviction.

I'm not saying that Dan was not with DM that day...but just throwing it out there that I think these kids were tossed between homes on a regular basis, regardless of who had LEGAL custody of them.

 

[threecrazykids]

I took his words to be both sets of parents ("At this point, they're grieving family members missing their daughters and nieces," he said.)

Everything is plural,
They're grieving family members (plural)
their daughters and nieces (plural)

I would wholeheartedly agree with you if ever there was a reference to Heather and Drew exclusively. I have yet to find and article that doesn't mention Dan and Misty's past in immediate reference to Smock stating that "they've been cleared". Every article references Dan and Misty's past drug connections (rightfully so in regards to reporting) - but I was just hoping to read somewhere along the lines where BOTH sets of parents without a reference to one or the other were cleared on their own accord.

Although they were taken together their families appear to be in completely different realms in regards to circle of acquaintences. Focusing simply on the drug connection may or may not bring about a suspect...but to exclude the Collins' side simply because they don't appear to be involved in a drug related past would be ignorant, no?

 

[janie]

Just adding confusion to the mix...:floorlaugh:...according to THIS article Lyric's brother lived with Grandma Wylma Cook. :facepalm:

http://qctimes.com/news/local/servi...cle_09ef603a-453e-11e2-8659-0019bb2963f4.html

SBM

The girls' grandmother, Wylma Cook, along with Lyric's mother, Misty Morrissey, and aunt, Tammy Brousseau, are planning a service after Christmas --- possibly in January. They said Wednesday that plans call for Lyric's remains to cremated and placed in an urn from a monastery in Dubuque. Lilacs will be present at the funeral, as Lyric's favorite colors were purple and blue, Brousseau said.

"Lyric will not be forgotten," Cook said.

In a brief statement to The Courier, Morrissey, who has not spoken publicly yet about her daughter's death, said, "I'm glad she's with our Lord."
[...]

The discovery of the bodies also has been hard on Misty Morrissey and her Lyric's brother, Dillin Morrissey, 16, who lives with Cook. Misty Morrissey remains the Waterloo Residential Facility, stemming from a 2003 methamphetamine conviction.

I'm not saying that Dan was not with DM that day...but just throwing it out there that I think these kids were tossed between homes on a regular basis, regardless of who had LEGAL custody of them.

Good catch and I agree they must have been tossed between homes. We have film of Vicki saying Lyric's brother lived with her and Misty saying he lived with Wylma? Maybe both were correct. Or, unless it was a reporter error? I don't see "living with Cook," as a quote, just as a statement?

 

[otto]

I often agree with your posts Otto but I don't remember hearing that anyone is cleared of being a suspect in this case?

I have always believed their abduction and murders was related to someone in the parent's drug world and still believe so. There are sexual deviants in the drug world too, not just roaming bike trails. There is also potential for retaliation by someone in the drug world to a family member, especially to someone who sold them fake meth or narc'd on them.

I can see someone in Misty's and Dan's lives knowing Wylma took Lyric every morning to go clean Heather's house and felt it would be a good chance to grab Lyric in the smaller town where she rode her bike. Maybe one of her parents friends has even spoken to her about what she likes to do and she mentioned going to my cousins house to ride bikes when my Grandma cleans my Aunt's house in Evansdale. I am not going to close my mind to a possible connection to it being someone in Elizabeth's circle, nor am I going to dismiss the possibility of it being someone in Lyric's parent's drug circle.

Re: Dan is not a suspect:

I posted this yesterday:

"Lyric's father Dan Morrissey was investigated as a person of interest shortly after the girls disappeared because of his ties to the local methamphetamine trade.

But authorities have said he [Dan] is not considered a suspect in the girls' disappearance."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...orrissey-Elizabeth-Collins.html#ixzz2feGQW3xW

It's possible that the person responsible for the abductions/murders is a meth head, but that doesn't mean that the murders have some connection to Lyric's father. In fact, since police have said that Dan is not considered a suspect ... I see no reason to refuse to believe that.

Wylma could not have taken Lyric to Heather's house every morning to clean because Lyric would normally be in school. Those visits could only have happened for a maximum of 10 days in early July. That's not enough to set a pattern such that a meth head is going to recognize a pattern and target a little girl in another town.

ETA: I see that TCK already posted the link ... thx

 

[dotr]

Was any further info. gleaned from the coffee cup that was found at the lake shortly after the girls first went missing?

 

[otto]

Was any further info. gleaned from the coffee cup that was found at the lake shortly after the girls first went missing?

I don't think we've heard anything about forensic tests ... but given the sightings of the boxy, older SUV, first along Arbutus between the two bike sins and later near the trees along the lake, I doubt that anyone was lurking at the bike location with a coffee.

Additionally, if there was DNA on the cup and if that person's DNA was in the system, that person could be interviewed, but there would still be no way to say when the coffee cup was left at that location.

 

[song22]

The news that Klunder had/has a brother in Waterloo is certainly interesting. He is probably top of my list right now. I think Klunder was sexually motivated, whether he was thwarted in the past or not, and I believe he is a sexual predator. I think the girls may have been sexually assaulted, based on Heather and Drew's recent advocacy for sex trafficking interventions and RSO awareness. But they may only be guessing.

In the beginning, it seemed very likely that with the drug use of Misty and Dan, drugs were somehow involved. I do believe that Meth trafficking is very scary and not just small-town stuff and it seems totally reasonable to me that people involved with Meth could abduct and kill two little girls. With Occam's razor and all that, In the beginning to me there seemed to be a possible straight line from Dan and Misty's criminal lives to L&L's abduction. Where there's smoke there's fire and all that.

Otto mentions the focus on Dan and why not Misty? I thought more of Misty (NOT as a suspect) at first because of her involvement in the big sting operation that brought down her boss and coworkers. I looked up one of those players online and found a picture of him wearing a Friday the 13th mask that spooked me. But then, it was Friday the 13th and there were probably a lot of people wearing said mask for kicks. I still called it in. I also did not like what I was seeing with Misty's lack of appropriate emotion (my opinion) and the rumors (twitter photos in bars and facebook) and scanner thread info. Her emotional reaction (a lot of smiles and giggles etc) could easily be explained by her drug use, however, and people here have done a fine job making that case. (also, some posters have asked what Heather has to forgive Misty for, since Misty didn't kill Elizabeth. I personally think it has to do with this behavior some of us were following behind the scenes and Misty's continued substance abuse--It would be really hard for me to have a relationship with a sister who behaved that way after her daughter and my daughter were murdered--really hard. I might understand it intellectually, drugs drugs and drugs, but it would be incredibly painful.)

In the beginning of the case, It did seem to me that D and M were acting like they were romantically involved. The night in the hotel. scanner thread info. Also, I don't understand why Lyric would have packed her bags to leave after Dan yelled at her if Dan wasn't there? She might be mad, but to me, if you pack your bags to run away you are trying to get away from that person. If he didn't live there--then what was that all about? I think he probably was in and out of the house when he wasn't supposed to be, so there was some level of "living there", if not official or extended. My opinion only.

I have never suspected H and D and I don't believe LE mentions them at all, because there is no reason to even go there, BUT I do suspect friends of H and D, anyone in their sphere involved in drugs, sexual deviancy, or having serious mental health issues-- I have a couple on my private list. Serious, committed Christians are often thought of as being judgmental toward others, but I have found that they also can extend forgiveness to people with sketchy pasts and are very willing to overlook past behaviors if they feel the person is now following Christ. Not judgmental enough, sometimes. I worry about that (Kind of like the leader of the faith-based rehabilitation program vouched for Klunder). There's often a desire to see God's redemptive power at work and so folks overlook possible red flags.

These are all just my random thoughts after reading everyone's comments. All my opinion, of course.

 

[dotr]

Video concerning zip ties and how to escape from them if abducted..

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=958_1357781195&comments=1

 

[otto]

I don’t think that just because at the time the girls went missing and we were informed that Lyric lived with Wylma and Dan and his son lived with Vicki we can assume that is how has always been. In fact, if you look at Lyric’s guardianship entry in Iowacourtsonline you will see that yes, at one point Heather had custody and then after that, Wylma had custody, but if I am reading the records correctly, all of those arrangements ended in 2007. Visitation is also in the record so I assume parents were granted visitation.

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TIndexFrm

ORDER CLOSING PROBATE ZAGER BRUCE B 07/10/2007

FINAL REPORT WALTON DONALD RAY 07/10/2007

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/19/2003 Comments: SUPPLEMENTAL RE VISITATION

OTHER ORDER FISTER JON 08/01/2003 Comments: PETITIONERS PETITION FOR GUARDIAN IS GRANTED

I think it is safe to assume that when Misty was incarcerated, she entrusted Wylma to keep Lyric, but I don’t think it is a stretch to assume that for a period of time after 2007, Dan and Misty had physical custody of the children. In fact, at Lyric’s memorial service there were many photos of her with Dan and Misty.

Since it doesn’t appear Dan and Misty ever quit using drugs, I don’t think it is a stretch to assume the children were exposed to drugs and people in the parent’s drug world. We know from this article that the judge admonished Dan for having exposed his son to both a fake meth drop and that he was also present during the meth house bust in December of 2011. Then look at what the judge said during the comment about Dan’s parenting. He said exposing “THEM” not HIM to that world ("to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.”)

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_6e223240-1c9c-11e3-9c93-001a4bcf887a.html

But prosecutors painted a different picture of Morrissey, stating there was evidence he simply continued his involvement with drugs during the disappearance, not only using them himself but selling them for profit.

“He was doing this activity before, he did it after ... There are reports of his house smelling of chemicals the day that the report was given that they found the bodies. That wasn’t a triggering event. That started before that, to have that chemical smell before the report was even given,” Assistant Black Hawk County Attorney Brad Walz said.

“He is getting pseudoephedrine and lithium and other items for manufacturing methamphetamine while the (Tri-County Drug Enforcement) Task Force is following him around ... He’s doing this where you’d think Mr. Morrissey would have some idea that people might be following him or watching what he’s doing,” Walz said.

Morrissey’s 17-year-old son was with him when police saw Morrissey drop a package of fake meth. He said the son was also at a meth lab at a Kingsley Street home when police raided it in December 2011.

In handing down the 90-year sentence, Judge David Staudt said Morrissey had “affected negatively probably every person” he’d come into contact with.”

“Since you were released from custody after your daughter’s unfortunate event, you were utilizing other women you knew to go to stores to buy or steal pseudoephedrine so you could manufacture methamphetamine,” he said. “The fact that your child was in your home when you were arrested on these events show that you don’t use very good judgment concerning yourself as a parent, to subject them to those conditions, to those situations, to those individuals and to that behavior is certainly not good parenting.”


What is very disturbing to me (from the same article) is detectives reporting to the prosecutor that the day the girl’s bodies were found when they went to tell Dan the bodies were found, the chemical smell in the house was there, indicating he didn’t start using meth again as a result of his grief at the discovery of the girl’s bodies, but that he had been using prior to that, as evidenced by the smell in the house.

Whose house would that have been? I assume since he was living with Vicki it was Vicki’s house. The same house Dan’s son was/is living in? That would mean Vicki was aware and tolerant. If that is how Vicki operates, I give no stock into anything she says or said.

Lyric was 10 years old when she vanished. The orders you quote were defined in 2003, when Lyric was an infant. First she was raised by Heather, and the Wylma. She was still living with Wylma in 2012 when she vanished. I don't see where she would have been exposed to a life of meth ... and I don't believe that Wylma and Vicki were providing their homes as meth labs.