IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #7

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What if Drew thought that voice message from Elizabeth came in after the girls disappeared and that is the physical evidence they say they have that the girls are alive. And then - they realized it was an old message he had never checked before. I hope that is not the case. What day did he play the voice message for everyone on tv? Because I remember the FBI lady saying on Saturday that something they found Friday gave them reason to believe the girls were alive.
 
In almost every case I've followed over the last 40 years, there has been at least one witness that was not averse to media attention. The vast majority of the time, these witnesses are innocent and merely enjoy media attention.

So far, this is not like the Ward Weaver case, where Weaver sought out media attention. In that case, Weaver was guilty but apparently thought he could successfully bluff the police because he thought he had successfully concealed the bodies.

Weaver was an anomaly. Most of the time, the perpetrator does not seek out media attention (although they may well seek out police and/or family).

I think the Zodiac Killer liked to send letters to media. The only reason I mention this is that I've been wondering if LE might be receiving letters or other communications from the person(s) who have Lyric and Elizabeth? That might explain why they believe the girls are alive.

Just a crazy thought - must be time for bed.
 
What if Drew thought that voice message from Elizabeth came in after the girls disappeared and that is the physical evidence they say they have that the girls are alive. And then - they realized it was an old message he had never checked before. I hope that is not the case. What day did he play the voice message for everyone on tv? Because I remember the FBI lady saying on Saturday that something they found Friday gave them reason to believe the girls were alive.

Thats what i was thinking:-(
 
LE alleges that they have done door to door and checked half the town, but wasn't it just today that Ollipop said they have not been to his home? If that is the case and his home is right by the lake, why would they miss his home? Makes me question if LE is actually doing all they allege they are doing...IMHO

I have relatives that live on elmer avenue, the street that leads directly into meyers lake, although they were a couple of blocks up the street. As of last friday, no one had knocked on their door, or anyone else up and down their street.
 
If we want people to come forward, and we do, then it is not generally a great idea to pounce the moment they appear. People are already frightened about talking to the police -- even as a witness -- and for damn good reason, particularly in a case like this one with no known suspect.

IMO they can just get over themselves.

This isn't about them, it's about two lost frightened little girls who may be being beat, tortured, God knows what, but are most definitely scared witless and crying for home.

If joe public likes to insert a little humour and humanity into a situation which is so horrific, it by poking a little bit of gentle fun at someone's name, well too bad. The alternative is, they turn off. They turn off the news, they log off the websites, they stop spreading the word and being involved, because it is just too goddam awful.

I for one wouldn't give a toss if I was laughed at/frightened of....what exactly? my pride being hurt?... if it helped these babies come home one second sooner.

:moo:

Edit- but I'm Australian and we laugh at everything here.
 
What if Drew thought that voice message from Elizabeth came in after the girls disappeared and that is the physical evidence they say they have that the girls are alive. And then - they realized it was an old message he had never checked before. I hope that is not the case. What day did he play the voice message for everyone on tv? Because I remember the FBI lady saying on Saturday that something they found Friday gave them reason to believe the girls were alive.

I hadn't made that connection, but that could explain why they seemed more optimistic on Saturday than they do now regarding the girls' being alive. JMO.
 
I think the Zodiac Killer liked to send letters to media. The only reason I mention this is that I've been wondering if LE might be receiving letters or other communications from the person(s) who have Lyric and Elizabeth? That might explain why they believe the girls are alive.

Just a crazy thought - must be time for bed.

Oh gosh.

You've just taken things to a whole other level...one that I had simply not allowed myself to go to.

:please:
 
I'm now thinking LE has a theory and some kind of evidence to support whatever it is, that they don't feel it is necessary to go to every house, or necessary to warn parents of a dangerous predator on the loose, or to delve deeply into witness acounts that don't fit their theory, etc., but they haven't been able to locate the girls precisely yet. Hopefully, they are right and hopefully the girls will be shown to be safe. Moo
 
LE did not sound as confident today about the girls being alive...in fact, they did not sound confident at all. Talking about how long it has been, etc...something either changed since the weekend, or they spoke too soon and too optimistically.
 
Things may have changed...they know what they know and they don't like anything about this situation...that much is for sure. Sigh. Moo
 
Oh gosh.

You've just taken things to a whole other level...one that I had simply not allowed myself to go to.

:please:

Sorry if I distressed you with my comment. I wasn't trying to imply that some crazy killer has the girls and is sending taunting letters to LE. What I meant was that if the abductor(s) sent letters/emails to LE, that could be why LE believes the girls are alive. And those letters/emails could be the evidence that was referred to in at least one of the recent pressers (sorry, can't recall which one). JMO

Again, I didn't mean to imply anything sinister.
 
Any of the locals want to take missing posters into the following businesses and ask them if they have been asked by LE for any surveillance video from 7/13?

ABC Liquor & Smoke Shop
Advanced Auto Services
Pro Liner
Casey’s General Store (River Forest)


All listed on a possible route heading south on River Forest Rd:
https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=...lhwId_dB_-g&t=h&dirflg=b&mra=ps&z=15&lci=bike

I also cannot get over people living in houses near the lake not being questioned.
 
Wow...caught up again, finally. Last night of "vacation," lol.

I have been thinking about a possible scenario:

Girls have met and are groomed by someone who lives near the Carpenter's on Lake Ave (or Lake Dr or Lake St or whatever its called - I'm sleepy). They bolt from behind Lederman's, heading to that location. They know the way, they've been going that way a lot recently, therefore the Carpenter's sightings and knowledge of these girls. But today, they enter a garage and never exit. Bikes quickly get tossed into a van/truck, which then backs down Melody Lane into the woods - somewhere its been many times to go fishing so nobody suspects anything if its spotted. The bikes get tossed over the fence, unnoticed, the purse falls off the handlebars and onto the ground on the wrong side. The bikes are no longer at his house, and anyone looking will suspect they went in the lake, or were at the lake.

This scenario also works if the perp lives/caught up with them much closer to home. Bikes go in vehicle, vehicle backs into woods, bikes get tossed over fence, appearing to have been used on that portion of the trail.

Just a thought, just a conjecture.

And maybe TG's sighting is being avoided in hopes a perp will relax too much and slip up.

I will say it is disheartening that at first, gramma said they went riding at 11:30, then she saw them at 12:15, but by 12:30 she was worried enough to drive around for an hour. You can cover a helluva lot of Evansdale in an hour, fwiw.

Also, if I pulled in to the Meyer's Lake parking area, looking for my daughter on a bike, I wouldn't feel the need to completely walk the lake. Most of the trail is visible, and where it isn't I would just feel they'd have to pop out the other side in a minute or two. I'd likely scan the trail from there, wait a few minutes (and ask around), then scan again, then head over to where the trail heads north back towards home.

Also, riding down River Forest is not unheard of...it is rather busy, though. There are sidewalks, etc, however. Doesn't seem like the most likely route, but then, what about this whole situation seemed likely? Maybe River Forest is where something happened.

It's still frustrating that nobody's come to my house, in the way of LE. Maybe they did while we were away, but we had a live-in housewatcher who we assume would have let us know. I've not heard from any neighbors who've had their door knocked on, either, and there are 7 children on my street, each with fairly observant parents. I saw the police in our neighbor's (across the street from us, with property backing up to the lake) back yard, while we were at the lake on 7/14. We went home just in case they stopped by, but they never did.
 
I just finished reading the transcripts from today's presser on the last thread, now I am bawling. :(
Why do you all think the FBI lady was so hopeful and upbeat sounding over the weekend? She sounded more upbeat than normal. IMO
 
Oh carp - anyone know if the alleged bf of Misty has parents/family living right there on the lake on S Evans Rd? I found the same name - living right close to the yellow paddle boat in bing maps.

ETA: Which is almost right next to the wooded area!!

ETA 2: Could this be why the girls were coming down there if they were?
 
If I'm recalling this correctly, Cliff Van Zant and Mark Klass said abducted children are usually no longer alive after the first 48 hours. I've read it's actually a lot less time....usually abducted children are killed within 2 hours . IMHO

Please know these are general stats.
There are children, abducted children, who do come home.

Sick to my stomach. I guess I'm glad I haven't followed cases like this before now. :(
 
Catching up too, and a couple if observations. I agree with ollipop about a possible scenario. I think this happened much closer to home, cuz I think it physically impossible for them to go that distance and be abducted all in 5 minutes. I'm a local just outside of evansdale.

Also, if they headed west to river first road, they went by the trucking company on the corner. Id like to think they have a surveilliance camera. Someone else asked about what that business was. They said today that they have heard of more video available from commercial and residential.

I highly doubt they would have traveled all the way down river first road. And, it's 4 lane, so vehicles would have passed. A more likely route for someone familiar with the town, would be to cut back to ready end, ayers ave, to Elmer. But I don't think they got that far. If they were going somewhere on the sly anyway, they wouldnt want to be seen.

I think they befriended a neighbor and thats the abductor. I think the bikes were dumped, as I've said befit. Ollipop, you can verify this... When you go south on the street next to the collins house, is it sipple? At the end straight ahead is a rather unkempt creepy house. It almost looks abandoned. I'm seriously considering calling the tipline just to ask if that place had been checked out.
 
I just finished reading the transcripts from today's presser on the last thread, now I am bawling. :(
Why do you all think the FBI lady was so hopeful and upbeat sounding over the weekend? She sounded more upbeat than normal. IMO

The only explanation I can think of is, the usual one, that when people think there is still hope, they are more likely to stay interested, wrack their brains, etc...

But today sure was a downer in comparison. Very odd way to handle things.
 
Jules, that's what I was thinking...sent on some kind of errand and when not back quickly, somebody got nervous and started looking for them. Hence the "roadblock". Moo
 
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