IA - Tyler, Sarah, and Lula Schmidt Killed at Maquoketa Caves State Park Campsite, 2022 *killer dead*

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RickshawFan said:
Do you have other examples of cases where that is true? What would the similarities be? I suppose one category would be incels, but I don’t think we have anything to indicate that’s in play here.
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Some articles on injustice collectors.
www.psychologytoday.com

Injustice Collecting

You can't let go of a grudge, says Nando Pelusi, Ph.D., because there are deep-seated emotional payoffs.
www.psychologytoday.com www.psychologytoday.com
www.psychologytoday.com

On Wound Collectors

What do many mass murderers have in common? Something many see but fail to recognize in advance.
www.psychologytoday.com www.psychologytoday.com
www.lisaescott.com

Are They an 'Injustice Collector?'

Those of us who have grown up with an injustice collecting parent as well as those who are currently in a relationship with a person who's got a "bad" list that's endless, immediately recognize the Injustice Collector. Children who grow up with a parent that collects resentments have to resort...
www.lisaescott.com www.lisaescott.com
 
5W's said:
Something's not right here. What? Did Sherwin's parents suspect him doing something either to himself or others? IDK its hard to say. Yes its strange that a man would knock on a mensroom stall door. There are some mental illnesses where people are imagining harming due to an undiagnosed mental condition that should be reported to mental health professionals so that the imaginary harm is not acted upon. It should be done ASAP IMO. The sooner the better for the one experiencing the thoughts and for obviously potential victims. IDK the situation here so its all MOO.
Click to expand...

jbc said:
With all these red flags, why does the family carry a gun?
Assuming they are storing it properly, are they also trying to prevent the son from having access?
If they know the son might attempt to get it from its secure storage space, why even bring it?
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I know that horrific cases make it easy for us to speculate, but I just want to offer some clarification on what's said above.

What 5W's is talking about is called psychosis and there is no indication this young man was psychotic. There is no indication he had schizophrenia either. He might have, but we don't know that yet. But here's the kicker. Even if you do report psychosis to a mental health professional, unless they detect imminent threat, nothing can be done about it in terms of holding the individual. Mental health treatment is completely voluntary unless they're at imminent risk of harming themselves or harming others. When it comes to random crimes, very rarely is there imminent threat when speaking with a mental health professional. Treatment course is long-term, not acute.

I also must note, people suffering from schizophrenia are more likely to be victims of violent crime than the perpetrators.

I'm waiting for more information to unfold, but to me, this sounds like a troubled young man whose parents may have been in denial about how troubled he was. Was it depression or anxiety or maybe even psychosis? Who knows? Was it just his personality? Or maybe he was on the autism spectrum? We don't know. The bathroom? Not a big deal to me. The dental mix-up points more to a naive and sheltered boy, maybe with some intellectual or developmental delay more than anything else. That isn't paranoia. I'm not seeing the signs of schizophrenia or psychosis. If he had this diagnosis, I'm sure we'll find out eventually.
 
BeginnerSleuther said:
I know that horrific cases make it easy for us to speculate, but I just want to offer some clarification on what's said above.

What 5W's is talking about is called psychosis and there is no indication this young man was psychotic. There is no indication he had schizophrenia either. He might have, but we don't know that yet. But here's the kicker. Even if you do report psychosis to a mental health professional, unless they detect imminent threat, nothing can be done about it in terms of holding the individual. Mental health treatment is completely voluntary unless they're at imminent risk of harming themselves or harming others. When it comes to random crimes, very rarely is there imminent threat when speaking with a mental health professional. Treatment course is long-term, not acute.

I also must note, people suffering from schizophrenia are more likely to be victims of violent crime than the perpetrators.

I'm waiting for more information to unfold, but to me, this sounds like a troubled young man whose parents may have been in denial about how troubled he was. Was it depression or anxiety or maybe even psychosis? Who knows? Was it just his personality? Or maybe he was on the autism spectrum? We don't know. The bathroom? Not a big deal to me. The dental mix-up points more to a naive and sheltered boy, maybe with some intellectual or developmental delay more than anything else. That isn't paranoia. I'm not seeing the signs of schizophrenia or psychosis. If he had this diagnosis, I'm sure we'll find out eventually.
Click to expand...
Its too early to tell in the investigation yet I'm sure. If it was an illness it may have been an undiagnosed one. But, I have to disagree if there is imaginary harm being thought of then mental health professionals will look into it. So are you suggesting that they wouldn't do anything and allow the individaul to continue imagining harm scenarios and then act upon them? I think not. Plus the father knocking on the bathroom stall door is unusual and gives an indication that the father is concerned about something and wants to know if the suspect is upto anything (maybe a detemination from the answer the suspect gave to his father all MOO.) Why is his father looking for him? It can't be that urgent that he has to find him in the bathroom. Doesn't the suspect carry a cellphone where the family can reach him? I'm sorry but their are indications something wasn't right here.
 
Didn't the knock on the bathroom came after the shooting and before police arrived, while the Sherwins were looking for Anthony, unsuspecting that he was the shooter?

I agree with Beginnersleuther that nothing we know about Sherwin indicates psychosis or paranoia and he may have been on the autism spectrum. He seems to have had little in the way of self-perception, judging from his photograph. His over-reaction to the insurance incident also seems like the reaction of a high-functioning autistic person, as does the manner in which his mother speaks of him. Not to mention that not many neurotypical young men of 23 would go camping with mom and dad... and, none of his peers, friends or coworkers have come forward with statements about him, indicating he may have had none due to his condition.

Because there was no connection or interaction noted with the Schmidt family, no indication of any warning signs noted by Sherwin's parents, and the facts that the shootings took place on the spur of the moment in the midst of a family vacation and the suspect did not attempt to shoot any other victims, as well as his flight and suicide, I think the shooting may have begun with an accidental discharge caused by the suspect playing with the family gun.

I posted this theory earlier in the thread. Basically, suspect plays with gun while his parents are not present. Gun goes off, bullet goes into Schmidt tent, killing one adult and the little girl. Suspect enters the tent to see what happened, still holding the gun. Surviving Schmidt adult engages suspect in combat, thinking he is there to finish them off, then suspect impulsively shoots that person to stop the attack. Suspect runs away into the woods, then some time later shoots himself as he cannot cope with the enormity of the situation.
 
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PacoElFlaco said:
Didn't the knock on the bathroom came after the shooting and before police arrived, while the Sherwins were looking for Anthony, unsuspecting that he was the shooter?

I agree with Beginnersleuther that nothing we know about Sherwin indicates psychosis or paranoia and he may have been on the autism spectrum. He seems to have had little in the way of self-perception, judging from his photograph. His over-reaction to the insurance incident also seems like the reaction of a high-functioning autistic person, as does the manner in which his mother speaks of him. Not to mention that not many neurotypical young men of 23 would go camping with mom and dad... and, none of his peers, friends or coworkers have come forward with statements about him, indicating he may have had none due to his condition.

Because there was no connection or interaction noted with the Schmidt family, no indication of any warning signs noted by Sherwin's parents, and the facts that the shootings took place on the spur of the moment in the midst of a family vacation and the suspect did not attempt to shoot any other victims, as well as his flight and suicide, I think the shooting may have begun with an accidental discharge caused by the suspect playing with the family gun.

I posted this theory earlier in the thread. Basically, suspect plays with gun while his parents are not present. Gun goes off, bullet goes into Schmidt tent, killing one adult and the little girl. Suspect enters the tent to see what happened, still holding the gun. Surviving Schmidt adult engages suspect in combat, thinking he is there to finish them off, then suspect impulsively shoots that person to stop the attack. Suspect runs away into the woods, then some time later shoots himself as he cannot cope with the enormity of the situation.
Click to expand...
Respectfully, I appreciate your thoughts but posting it twice doesn't make it a stronger theory.

We don't know very much at all. When I look at his photo, I don't see what you see.

IMHO accidental discharge is highly unlikely.

If his parents thought he might act out with the gun in some way (based on prior history we know nothing of), they have potential culpability in my opinion. Did they always travel with this gun? Why? I am interested in the parents' reasoning for having a weapon with them & the type & caliber. We need the ballistics info re: a match with what killed the suspect.

This case is very, very quiet. A week after the murders, I would expect good reporting to have revealed more about the suspect & his parents: education & employment, how long they had lived in NE, why they traveled to the park (the obvious or ?), any local connections near the park (relatives, friends), had they camped at the park before?.....add your own here.

The media talked to some visitors in the park after it reopened.

I WANT TO HEAR FROM SOMEONE WHO KNEW ANTHONY. Other than his parents: a relative, a school friend, an online contact. AS did not live in a vacuum of no contact. Or did he & if so, WHY?

www.google.com

Iowa community grapples with loss after campground shooting

The community hopes the dark cloud that looms over the town will soon pass and the beautiful park will once again find peace.
www.google.com www.google.com

MOO
 
This just dropped today.

Sources: Suspect in Iowa state park shooting used homemade 'ghost gun'
Anthony Sherwin had an encrypted phone and was using sophisticated computer equipment to build a business, said his parents, who doubt police account.

Paywalled :( Could someone with a subscription summarize for us?
TIA
 
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www.google.com

What is a ghost gun?

These untraceable firearms can be made at home with no background check or serial numbers, and officials say they're contributing to a rise in gun violence.
www.google.com www.google.com

"Ghost guns are unregistered and untraceable homemade weapons that can be made with a 3D printer or assembled from a kit. According to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, such weapons are contributing to a rise in gun violence, reported CBS News' Jeff Pegues in February. The weapons can be produced for less than $200, though officials have put the average price at around $500."

Ghost Guns Aren't Hard To Make. New Laws Won't Restrict Them

www.google.com www.google.com
 
https://eu.desmoinesregister.com/st...-sherwin-used-homemade-ghost-gun/10188465002/

No autopsy results on three members of the Schmidt family or their alleged shooter will be released over the weekend, according to Iowa authorities. They also said no update into the triple homicide was expected before Monday.
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We need to patiently wait then.

Investigative sources, however, have told the Des Moines Register that the suspected killer, Anthony Orlando Sherwin, 23, of Nebraska, used a homemade weapon — known as a ghost gun — to commit the slayings before turning the gun on himself.
Ghost guns are untraceable weapons that can be constructed with parts bought at a store or purchased online. Some states have moved to outlaw them.
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I take it, then , that it wasn't the gun Sherwins kept in that secure thingy?

their son did have a fascination with guns at one point. But Joseph and Cecilia Sherwin, his parents, wrote in an email to the Register that the fascination had passed.
Click to expand...

Well, it seems they are wrong.

Then Anthony's parents went to say that they did not let him buy a gun, but thought building one would be fine and were amazed when Anthony finally put a gun together. Overall it increases my impression they were treating their full grown son like he was still a child. That's some really weird family dynamic going on in here.

They also called Anthony a genius and said he had super sophisticated computer, which he used to set up a business. They do not say what kind of business it was. During the trip something broke in that compuer and that's why Anthiony was eager to come home. He was taking online college classes. Anthony's father, Joseph, teaches physics at the very same college, which stated Anthony was their student from 2017 til February this year.
 
Hexe said:
https://eu.desmoinesregister.com/st...-sherwin-used-homemade-ghost-gun/10188465002/



We need to patiently wait then.



I take it, then , that it wasn't the gun Sherwins kept in that secure thingy?



Well, it seems they are wrong.

Then Anthony's parents went to say that they did not let him buy a gun, but thought building one would be fine and were amazed when Anthony finally put a gun together. Overall it increases my impression they were treating their full grown son like he was still a child. That's some really weird family dynamic going on in here.

They also called Anthony a genius and said he had super sophisticated computer, which he used to set up a business. They do not say what kind of business it was. During the trip something broke in that compuer and that's why Anthiony was eager to come home. He was taking online college classes. Anthony's father, Joseph, teaches physics at the very same college, which stated Anthony was their student from 2017 til February this year.
Click to expand...
Thanks so much for the summary!

The gun! The parents' denials! The computer! AS's "business".

I wonder if LE is having to trace AS on the dark web?
 
Obits of Tyler, Sarah & Lula Schmidt


"Tyler was an Eagle Scout and played trumpet, ran cross country and was on the swim team in high school. He worked for K-Mart, UPS and for over 18 years worked for TreviPay. Tyler married Sarah Morehouse on June 22, 2002 at St. John Lutheran Church in Cedar Falls, and they honeymooned for 10 days in the Boundary Waters. He enjoyed going to Okoboji Lutheran Church camp for family reunions, camping and canoeing, board and card games, hiking and snowshoeing, had a love of computers and teaching Arlo coding, and was an excellent cook."

Sarah: "She graduated from Washington High School in Washington, Missouri, Truman State University, where she was a Truman Scholar, and earned her MA from the University of Kansas. Sarah worked several years for Monarch Watch. After marrying Tyler, Sarah became a mother and had been working at the Cedar Falls Public Library this past year. She played percussion, piano and was in the high school marching band. Sarah enjoyed knitting, sewing Halloween costumes, crafting, making hand made greeting cards, being outdoors, birding, entomology, gardening, snowshoeing, cake decorating, and pottery at the Hearst Center for the Arts."

Lula: "Like her parents, Lula enjoyed outdoor activities, playing with her cousins, art, reading, and animals. She "swam like a fish" and was known to be a "spitfire"....She had a great sense of humor, helped her parents cook and her brother with his animation scripts."

Such a dear family.
RIP
 
WingsOverTX said:
This just dropped today.

Sources: Suspect in Iowa state park shooting used homemade 'ghost gun'
Anthony Sherwin had an encrypted phone and was using sophisticated computer equipment to build a business, said his parents, who doubt police account.

Paywalled :( Could someone with a subscription summarize for us?
TIA
Click to expand...

This is interesting. I couldn't get past the paywall, but I started down the ghost gun rabbit hole. For those who don't have familiarity, the "Ghost Gun" is an exploit of the gray area between raw material and manufactured gun. They are marketed as "buy build shoot" kits, or "80% lowers," etc. Until recently, they did not meet the criteria of a manufactured firearm, so they do not have serial numbers required by law. A recent ruling appears to change that, and it looks like that ruling will go into effect later this summer. I suspect as consumer "maker" skills improve, kits will scale back to avoid meeting the new criteria, etc.

Here's the ruling: https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/1493431/download

I'm not much of a gun enthusiast anymore, but I'm always fascinated by gray areas and similar complexities in the law.
 
5W's said:
Its too early to tell in the investigation yet I'm sure. If it was an illness it may have been an undiagnosed one. But, I have to disagree if there is imaginary harm being thought of then mental health professionals will look into it. So are you suggesting that they wouldn't do anything and allow the individaul to continue imagining harm scenarios and then act upon them? I think not.
Click to expand...

Well, I'm not guessing here. This is what I do for a living. If an individual is paranoid (and nothing in this case thus far has revealed paranoia), depending on the extent of the paranoia and whether there is imminent risk, yes they may let them go. Imminent risk means that they are about to hurt themselves or hurt others. There are a lot of paranoid individuals who cannot be legally detained by doctors or police. People are allowed to be paranoid without being locked up. I'll give examples:

PERSON A: People are listening to my calls, they're bugging my phone and put a tracker on my car. I bet it's the FBI.
DOCTOR: What do you think you should do about it?
PERSON A: I don't know, but I'm scared. They have no right to bug my phone!
DOCTOR: Do you have weapons at home?
PERSON A: No, do you think I need weapons?
DOCTOR: No.

PERSON B: People are listening to my calls, they're bugging my phone and put a tracker on my car. I bet it's the FBI.
DOCTOR: What do you think you should do about it?
PERSON B: I have my gun. I'm going to find out who it is and teach them who's boss.

In the above scenarios, PERSON A would be sent home with a safety plan, meaning a plan to call a crisis center or the doctor before acting on anything. Medications would also be adjusted. PERSON B can be involuntarily committed because he has a gun and a plan to use it on others. If PERSON A were committed based on the above interview, the doctor would have broken the law. Laws are set up like this to protect the mentally ill because mentally ill people are more likely to be victims than perpetrators.


5W's said:
Plus the father knocking on the bathroom stall door is unusual and gives an indication that the father is concerned about something and wants to know if the suspect is upto anything (maybe a detemination from the answer the suspect gave to his father all MOO.) Why is his father looking for him? It can't be that urgent that he has to find him in the bathroom. Doesn't the suspect carry a cellphone where the family can reach him? I'm sorry but their are indications something wasn't right here.
Click to expand...

When I was 19, I went on a trip with my family. We rented a condo for a week and we had 10 people there. One morning, I went for a run before anyone woke up. I guess I was gone longer than I thought and my parents were worried about me and went looking for me.

I imagine a similar scenario here. AS could have been gone for a while and parents were like "where'd he go?" Or they may have just been talking about going on a hike and he disappeared. They're wondering if they should wait for him and so they wait and he doesn't come by and they wonder where he is. So father knocks on the bathroom door. There are all kinds of reasons this could have happened.
 
WingsOverTX said:
Respectfully, I appreciate your thoughts but posting it twice doesn't make it a stronger theory.

We don't know very much at all. When I look at his photo, I don't see what you see.

IMHO accidental discharge is highly unlikely.

If his parents thought he might act out with the gun in some way (based on prior history we know nothing of), they have potential culpability in my opinion. Did they always travel with this gun? Why? I am interested in the parents' reasoning for having a weapon with them & the type & caliber. We need the ballistics info re: a match with what killed the suspect.

This case is very, very quiet. A week after the murders, I would expect good reporting to have revealed more about the suspect & his parents: education & employment, how long they had lived in NE, why they traveled to the park (the obvious or ?), any local connections near the park (relatives, friends), had they camped at the park before?.....add your own here.

The media talked to some visitors in the park after it reopened.

I WANT TO HEAR FROM SOMEONE WHO KNEW ANTHONY. Other than his parents: a relative, a school friend, an online contact. AS did not live in a vacuum of no contact. Or did he & if so, WHY?

www.google.com

Iowa community grapples with loss after campground shooting

The community hopes the dark cloud that looms over the town will soon pass and the beautiful park will once again find peace.
www.google.com www.google.com

MOO
Click to expand...

I hate guns and I say that not to encourage the gun debate but to make it clear I'm not defending guns. But many people travel with guns and especially when on camping trips because they're not protected by the four walls of a house and locked door. I think many, many take guns when they go hiking in case they run into any unsavory characters on the trail, not just people but animals too. For example, people who grow up in rural areas in the country are taught from a adolescence to never go hiking without a weapon to fight off bears or other potentially deadly animals. So I don't think it's unusual they traveled with a gun.

I do agree that if their son had red flags (like many of the shooters in the school shooting cases), then parents are partly culpable.
 
Hexe said:
They also called Anthony a genius and said he had super sophisticated computer, which he used to set up a business. They do not say what kind of business it was. During the trip something broke in that compuer and that's why Anthiony was eager to come home.
Click to expand...

RSBBM

Wondering now....since AS's computer was on the fritz, and he was so eager to get home.....if Mr Schmidt had a computer at his campsite? Hmmmm...

Wonder just what the business exactly was?
 
5W's said:
Its too early to tell in the investigation yet I'm sure. If it was an illness it may have been an undiagnosed one. But, I have to disagree if there is imaginary harm being thought of then mental health professionals will look into it. So are you suggesting that they wouldn't do anything and allow the individaul to continue imagining harm scenarios and then act upon them? I think not. Plus the father knocking on the bathroom stall door is unusual and gives an indication that the father is concerned about something and wants to know if the suspect is upto anything (maybe a detemination from the answer the suspect gave to his father all MOO.) Why is his father looking for him? It can't be that urgent that he has to find him in the bathroom. Doesn't the suspect carry a cellphone where the family can reach him? I'm sorry but their are indications something wasn't right here.
Click to expand...

BBM

I camp a lot. Campgrounds aren't enormous, and there are limited places you would think to look for a person within a campground -- you've typically got one or more bathrooms, maybe a shower facility, a place to bring garbage and recycling, sometimes a shack for boating and lifeguard gear, a building to house equipment like lawn mowers, chainsaws, etc., maybe a common building for people to congregate and play games or a pavilion for picnicking, and the caretaker's quarters. It isn't illogical to think that if a member of your party isn't in the tent or your vehicle, then they're probably in the bathroom or shower. Almost every time I've camped within a formal campground I've experienced someone usually bellowing into the bathroom "Hey So-and-So, are you in there?" Last year I even inadvertently freaked a woman out when I yelled back that I was the only one in there, not realizing her young child was quietly standing at the sink waiting for me to finish peeing so I could turn on the water. Knocking on a stall door doesn't seem weird to me at all, nor does choosing that as a place to look for someone.

As soon as I reach any campsite, the first thing I do is lock my phone in the glovebox. Not everyone carries a phone when they camp.
 
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