IA - Tyler, Sarah, and Lula Schmidt Killed at Maquoketa Caves State Park Campsite, 2022 *killer dead*

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Re: a man knocking on the men's room door. Did we ever find out definitively if it was a one-stall/family style bathroom or a big bathroom with several individual stalls? If it's the former, I don't think it's odd to knock on the door as opening it might put you in the lap of a man using the toilet. With the big bathroom/individual stalls scenario, is it possible he knocked on an individual stall door within the bathroom? I again wouldn't find that odd. MOO
 
MntnHiker said:
Re: a man knocking on the men's room door. Did we ever find out definitively if it was a one-stall/family style bathroom or a big bathroom with several individual stalls? If it's the former, I don't think it's odd to knock on the door as opening it might put you in the lap of a man using the toilet. With the big bathroom/individual stalls scenario, is it possible he knocked on an individual stall door within the bathroom? I again wouldn't find that odd. MOO
Click to expand...

I didn't think it was odd, either. Also, I don't know if my husband would have recognized his own son's shoes even if he could peer under a door (unless blatantly obvious).
 
Iowa state park to reopen after murder of three family members

The Iowa Department of Natural Resources (DNR) says Maquoketa Caves State Park will reopen to the public for day use at 10 am Thursday.

The Division of Criminal Investigation continues to lead the investigation of the incident. A temporary memorial site will be located at the Maquoketa Caves State Park entrance sign near the Visitor Center.

The park campground will remain closed until further notice. All campers with reservations through July 31 have been notified and refunded.
 
Per the link below, sunrise was at 5:46 the morning of the 22nd. How much light would there be by the time of the shooting at approx 6:15-6:20.

www.timeanddate.com

Sunrise and sunset times in City of Maquoketa

Calculations of sunrise and sunset in City of Maquoketa – Iowa – USA for August 2024. Generic astronomy calculator to calculate times for sunrise, sunset, moonrise, moonset for many cities, with daylight saving time and time zones taken in account.
www.timeanddate.com www.timeanddate.com
 
Here is a map of the campground layout from Iowa’s Dept. of Natural Resources: https://www.iowadnr.gov/portals/idnr/uploads/parks/campgroundmaps/maquoketacavescg.pdf

This shows just one restroom in the area where folks would camp.

View of the overall Maquoketa Caves park here:

It occurs to me that we know the Schmidt family was camping in a tent, but the Sherwood might’ve been in a tent OR a camper, as the park map shows places for both types of camping. The Sherwins being in a camper or similar RV-like vehicle makes more sense, given the mother’s comment about storing the gun in a “secure container behind the driver’s seat.”

EDITED: Sherwins were in a tent. DCI: Killer stayed in tent 75 yards away from Iowa family he later attacked

I agree with others here who suggested that it seems likely that AS intended to target his parents. I wonder if AS woke up early, snuck out of the tent and to his parents’ vehicle, retrieved the gun, and then, upon returning, mistook the Schmidts’ tent for the one where his parents were sleeping? Only 75 yards apart…sounds like it’d have been an easy mistake to make especially in the early morning light.

EDIT 2: Per DCI: Killer stayed in tent 75 yards away from Iowa family he later attacked the Sherwin parents were in a separate tent next to AS’ tent. Sneaking out to the vehicle to get the gun would’ve been easy for AS to do without awakening his folks: “The killer’s parents camped next to him in a separate tent, Mortvedt said. He said that the parents have been cooperating with authorities into the investigation but said that they were unaware of any previous interaction that their son had with the Schmidt family.”
 
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people.com

Iowa Gunman Who Killed Family on Camping Trip Had Never Met Victims Before Shooting: 'Completely Random'

Tyler and Sarah Schmidt, both 42, and their 6-year-old daughter Lula, were shot dead by 23-year-old stranger Anthony Sherwin in their tent while camping
people.com people.com

“Citing agents with Iowa's Division of Criminal Investigations, WHBF-TV reports Sherwin was also camping with his parents at the same campground, 75 yards away from the Schmidts. However, Sherwin and the victims had no interaction with each other prior to the shooting.”
 
realanastasia said:
people.com

Iowa Gunman Who Killed Family on Camping Trip Had Never Met Victims Before Shooting: 'Completely Random'

Tyler and Sarah Schmidt, both 42, and their 6-year-old daughter Lula, were shot dead by 23-year-old stranger Anthony Sherwin in their tent while camping
people.com people.com

“Citing agents with Iowa's Division of Criminal Investigations, WHBF-TV reports Sherwin was also camping with his parents at the same campground, 75 yards away from the Schmidts. However, Sherwin and the victims had no interaction with each other prior to the shooting.”
Click to expand...

Also from your link...

According to the station, Mortvedt would not provide details on how Arlo made it out alive.
"It's tough," Mortvedt told WHBF. "So heartbreaking on every level."
 
fred&edna said:
Per the link below, sunrise was at 5:46 the morning of the 22nd. How much light would there be by the time of the shooting at approx 6:15-6:20.

www.timeanddate.com

Sunrise and sunset times in City of Maquoketa

Calculations of sunrise and sunset in City of Maquoketa – Iowa – USA for August 2024. Generic astronomy calculator to calculate times for sunrise, sunset, moonrise, moonset for many cities, with daylight saving time and time zones taken in account.
www.timeanddate.com www.timeanddate.com
Click to expand...
I live fairly close by and it is very light out by 6:15 - pretty much full daylight.
 
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The theory that the shooter meant to target his parents makes sense to me, but I feel like 75 yards is quite a distance to be off. Especially when his own campsite had two tents close together, it would be hard to confuse it with a single tent site, if it was as light as it seems to have been. Of course, if he was having some kind of issue or episode, that might not even matter.

I grew up visiting Maquoketa Caves and still live somewhat close. It is hard to wrap my mind around this senseless violence in such a beautiful, peaceful spot.
 
I've been following this horrible and mysterious story since it happened. I feel terrible for everyone involved in both families. I've been trying to come up with an explanation as far as a motive for this senseless act and I thought of a couple of possibilities:

1. Sherwin's parents leave for their early morning walk, and Sherwin decides to take a look at the family gun. He's playing around with it and it accidentally discharges. He runs outside and sees that the bullet has gone into the neighboring tent, killing Sara and Lula Schmidt with one shot. Tyler Schmidt sees Sherwin come in the tent holding the gun, and he attacks him in self-defense and in retribution for killing his wife and daughter. Sherwin then shoots Tyler. (Only two shots were fired according to witnesses). When Sherwin sees what he's done, he is overcome with fear and runs into the woods, where he shoots himself rather than face the consequences.

2. Sherwin had his eye on either Sara or Lula Schmidt and intended to abduct and molest/rape them at gunpoint while his parents were on their early morning walk, but he met with resistance and he opened fire, then ran off and shot himself in guilt and fear. Perhaps he planned to wake one of the females and lead her into the woods silently at gunpoint?
 
PacoElFlaco said:
I've been following this horrible and mysterious story since it happened. I feel terrible for everyone involved in both families. I've been trying to come up with an explanation as far as a motive for this senseless act and I thought of a couple of possibilities:

1. Sherwin's parents leave for their early morning walk, and Sherwin decides to take a look at the family gun. He's playing around with it and it accidentally discharges. He runs outside and sees that the bullet has gone into the neighboring tent, killing Sara and Lula Schmidt with one shot. Tyler Schmidt sees Sherwin come in the tent holding the gun, and he attacks him in self-defense and in retribution for killing his wife and daughter. Sherwin then shoots Tyler. (Only two shots were fired according to witnesses). When Sherwin sees what he's done, he is overcome with fear and runs into the woods, where he shoots himself rather than face the consequences.

2. Sherwin had his eye on either Sara or Lula Schmidt and intended to abduct and molest/rape them at gunpoint while his parents were on their early morning walk, but he met with resistance and he opened fire, then ran off and shot himself in guilt and fear. Perhaps he planned to wake one of the females and lead her into the woods silently at gunpoint?
Click to expand...

Those are all possible scenarios for this tragedy. I have one that I am leaning towards:

I think he had been thinking about using that gun for months---imagining killing his parents and then himself. He finally decided that the camping trip would be the time he would do it.

He sneaks to the car while his parents are still asleep so he can secretly get the weapon. Then he gets nervous and cold feet about actually doing the killing. While he nervously hides out in the treeline area, he hears or sees his parents out looking for him and calling his name. He may have even seen them look in their vehicle and see the weapon was missing.

At that point he knew he had to act quickly. But they were no longer laying in the tent like sitting ducks. They were actively searching for him and he knew time was running out.

In crazy desperation, he switched up his horrid plan and decided to shoot up a random tent instead of his parent's tent---maybe so they would be alive long enough to finally understand how he felt for so long?
 
Many American campgrounds especially in state parks have a loop-style layout where you drive in and pay or check in with the park ranger at the front, then there is a narrow paved road that takes you around to the different campsites. If this happened at one of those, mistaking the tent for his parents would make sense - I have gone camping many times and it can be really disorienting to try and find your own site when everyone's tents and gear looks pretty much the same.

But that was not the style of this campground so I feel like it makes much less sense that he mistook it for his parents' tent - unless he was possibly under the influence of something? Stayed up all night drinking, waiting for his parents to go to bed?
 
flower_girl said:
Many American campgrounds especially in state parks have a loop-style layout where you drive in and pay or check in with the park ranger at the front, then there is a narrow paved road that takes you around to the different campsites. If this happened at one of those, mistaking the tent for his parents would make sense - I have gone camping many times and it can be really disorienting to try and find your own site when everyone's tents and gear looks pretty much the same.

But that was not the style of this campground so I feel like it makes much less sense that he mistook it for his parents' tent - unless he was possibly under the influence of something? Stayed up all night drinking, waiting for his parents to go to bed?
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Good theory. I wonder what the toxicology will say? I also wonder if the media will ever find girlfriends, friends or classmates of AS to interview?

Was he a loner and if so what was that like for him? Was he developing schizophrenia?

I am afraid logic is going to have very little to do with this tragic crime.

Not diagnosing AS but this article gives insight into symptoms & innovative treatments for schizophrenia. Especially interesting to me is the discussion of family dynamic and modification of family response to someone experiencing symptoms.

www.npr.org

Halting Schizophrenia Before It Starts

Schizophrenia typically starts in the late teens or early 20s. But if you could stop that first psychotic break, could you stop the mental illness in its tracks? Some doctors think so.
www.npr.org www.npr.org

McFarlane believes that psychosis can be prevented with a range of surprisingly low-tech interventions, almost all of which are designed to reduce stress in the family of the young person who is starting to show symptoms.

McFarlane cites research done at UCLA suggesting that certain kinds of family dynamics — families that don't communicate well, or are overly critical — can make things worse for a young person at risk of schizophrenia.
....
"Our theory," says McFarlane, "was that if you could identify these young people early enough, you could alter some of those family patterns. Then you could work with the family to start behaving not just normally, but in a way that was smarter."

BBM & JMO
 
PacoElFlaco said:
I've been following this horrible and mysterious story since it happened. I feel terrible for everyone involved in both families. I've been trying to come up with an explanation as far as a motive for this senseless act and I thought of a couple of possibilities:

1. Sherwin's parents leave for their early morning walk, and Sherwin decides to take a look at the family gun. He's playing around with it and it accidentally discharges. He runs outside and sees that the bullet has gone into the neighboring tent, killing Sara and Lula Schmidt with one shot. Tyler Schmidt sees Sherwin come in the tent holding the gun, and he attacks him in self-defense and in retribution for killing his wife and daughter. Sherwin then shoots Tyler. (Only two shots were fired according to witnesses). When Sherwin sees what he's done, he is overcome with fear and runs into the woods, where he shoots himself rather than face the consequences.

2. Sherwin had his eye on either Sara or Lula Schmidt and intended to abduct and molest/rape them at gunpoint while his parents were on their early morning walk, but he met with resistance and he opened fire, then ran off and shot himself in guilt and fear. Perhaps he planned to wake one of the females and lead her into the woods silently at gunpoint?
Click to expand...

There is no evidence that the Sherwin parents took an “early morning walk,” though, is there?

Comments from family members of the victims and in the press suggest that Sherwin ENTERED the tent of the Schmidts, which makes it seem less likely that AS mistook their tent for his parents’ tent. See, for instance, Triple Homicide at Iowa Campground Was 'Random,' Officials Say
 
realanastasia said:
There is no evidence that the Sherwin parents took an “early morning walk,” though, is there?

Comments from family members of the victims and in the press suggest that Sherwin ENTERED the tent of the Schmidts, which makes it seem less likely that AS mistook their tent for his parents’ tent. See, for instance, Triple Homicide at Iowa Campground Was 'Random,' Officials Say
Click to expand...
I've read so many news stories about this that I can't find the one that mentioned the Sherwins taking a morning walk, but one article did mention that they were just returning to their tent after a morning walk without Anthony when the surviving 9 year-old boy approached Mrs. Sherwin to tell her that "a man in black had just shot his family".

I'm not convinced that the shooter intended to kill his parents. I'm actually unconvinced that he even intended to shoot anyone at all at first. The way he ran off into the forest and shot himself doesn't really gibe with what we have seen in other mass shooters. It seems more like an impulsive act of fear and remorse. If he intended to kill people, why would he stop with the Schmidt family when he had free run of an early morning campground? Mass shooters don't usually kill themselves until they are cornered by police and unable to continue the massacre. I've never heard of one that fled the scene unopposed and shot himself in another location.

I'm leaning more to the first shot being fired accidentally into the Schmidt tent, killing two simultaneously, then Sherwin entering the tent still holding the gun and getting into a fight with the surviving adult, and using the gun impulsively to stop the attack. He then runs away and eventually shoots himself because he cannot deal with what happened.

It's pretty likely that Sherwin's thought processes deviated from the norm. We can base this on his overreactions to the insurance incident that has been mentioned, and his unusual appearance in his photograph. Also, the way his mother speaks about him sounds like he may have had some special life circumstances to deal with. An irrational reaction to an unintentional firearm discharge while he was playing with the family's gun would not be out of the question.
 
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general comment about the gun: it's not at all uncommon for people anywhere in the US to carry a handgun behind or under the driver's seat or in the driver's side door pocket. It might or might not be legal, it might or might not be kept in an appropriate case, which might or might not be appropriately locked. Especially common for people who have to drive long distances at night or in rural areas, or with valuable cargo.
 
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