ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 56

[Tnowlin]

The 4am part will be easy for him to explain due to the time difference - it was only 1am for him. The neighbors trash is going to be more difficult. Hopefully the FBI took photos of his parent's trash can showing that it was not full.

Maybe he wasn’t familiar with his parents trash vs neighbors. I’m not sure how long they lived there.

 

[Followfacts]

I think he planned this enough to have plastic on his seats so there would be no transfer.

I agree any of the victims dna on him, he prepared for well in advance, he knew he would be transferring it into the car. It’s not but a minute or less to throw on a tyvek suit, shoe coverings, second layer of gloves, and plastic already placed on seats. All this has been disposed of with the knife in a prepared location by BCK, he followed his forensic disposal plan. He brought an extra change of clothes. Probably sprayed himself down with

Want to Get Away With Murder? Use a Special Detergent

Gotta get rid of that evidence, you know?

www.discovermagazine.com

in the woods that eliminates DNA.

This whole process of cleaning the car in PA was a show put on for LE, as well as the glove wearing late night trash disposal. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn he’s planted Unknown dna to the car and trash.
Likely he has an answer for his dna on the sheath and left it behind intentionally. A case of reasonable doubt built before during and after the murders. IMO that’s BCK.

 

[Chris_p_bacon]

Just saying: I appreciate the manager of the restaurant in PA who put the note about Kohlberger in their system. It showed good judgment on his part as to alerting personnel about a potential threat to their safety or "mental health." I also think it will be part of the profile the prosecution is putting together. MO

Someone once told me, you can tell a lot about a person by the way they treat a waiter/waitress. Never has this been more true than with the example you reference above. I do feel at some point he was in the Mad greek resturant and had an interaction of some sort with one of the victims who worked there. He got enamored, and with his lack of social skills decided to start stalking her.

 

[jg580]

Idaho police begin clearing rental home where students were murdered

Idaho State Police began clearing the Moscow home where four University of Idaho students were stabbed to death - a day after their alleged killer was formally charged.

www.dailymail.co.uk

There is a red stain (very possibly blood) that ran down the length of a piece of furniture in one of the photos! I'm shocked they are bringing evidence out in this way.

Was this recent or from the day of the murders? The article makes it sound like this was recent but I'm not sure if i misunderstood because I would have thought they would have removed items like this much earlier.

 

[BelleIsle]

So piecing through the PCA and timeline a bit:

Approx 4am X's doordash is delivered. I'm guessing she goes downstairs to get it, goes back upstairs and eats it in her room while scrolling through TikTok.

at 4:04am BK is attempting to park by the house, fails, completes a three point turn comes back and parks. So at the very earliest, he enters the house maybe at 4:05am. He may have sat in his car for a few minutes getting up the nerve. Eventually he enters through the sliding door on the second floor. We can assume X did not see him so he most likely entered shortly after she retrieved her DD and was eating it somewhere she could not see him.

Approx 4am D wakes up to the sound of "K playing with her dog." We can assume now that this was actually BK upstairs so again, sometime after 4:05am. It seems as though the dog did NOT bark during this time as wouldn't that have been noted on the neighbor's video as well? The dog was also found in K's room when M and K were murdered in M's bed. He may have locked the dog in K's room before or after murdering the girls. Given we know they were both killed in M's bed and there is no mention of D hearing anything upstairs, I am guessing they were both killed in their sleep. Maybe this is why the dog didn't bark - there was no real noise. BK leaves the sheath there.

After the "playing with the dog sounds" D hears someone say "there's someone here." D says she thought it was K but the police speculate it could have been X as X was awake until at least 4:12am. I'm guessing the investigators suspected K was already dead by then which is why they think it was X.

Something to note - X's DD bag was seen by the kitchen sink the next morning so at some point, she was in the kitchen. Maybe it was then that she said "someone's here." Maybe the door in there was open? Maybe she could hear something going on upstairs? She could have said it to herself in the kitchen or maybe went back to the room and said it E.

When D hears "there's someone here" she opens her door and doesn't see anyone. Meaning BK is likely still upstairs. Or if X was in her room when she said this, maybe BK is already around the corner to her bedroom and out of D's sightline.

Now remember X is on Tiktok until 4:12am. So everything next likely comes after that.

D hears crying from X's room. She opens her door again and sees nothing. At this point we can assume BK is in X's room. She hears a male voice say "it's okay, I'm going to help you." Unknown if this was E or BK.

At 4:17 the neighbor's camera picks up whimpering from X's room, a thud and a dog barking. Let's assume this is the murder of X and E which fits with X being on TikTok until 4:12am.

D opens her door a third time and sees BK walking towards her with a mask on. She shuts her door and locks it. Police have stated he likely left through the sliding glass door immediately after this. His car is seen pulling away at 4:20 so he probably walked out around 4:19am (fits with the 4:17 sounds).

Did BK encounter X in the kitchen? Maybe M was the target, K was killed because she was in the bed and X was awake and spotted. Maybe X ran back to her room, BK followed her and killed her and E. The interesting thing is it doesn't seem as though X ever screamed. I feel if she'd spotted him in the kitchen and ran to her room, she would have screamed at some point. Maybe BK heard her say "there's someone here" and attacked her because of that. Or maybe he intended to kill her and E as well and went to their room intentionally.

The timeline is so tight, it's unbelievable. I feel so awful for D having to hear that. I hope she gets the help she needs to recover from this.

What do other people think about the sequence of events?

This sounds about right. I do wonder if E was the in bathroom and that was when X stated to him that someone was in the house. It seems like she would have had to state it either to herself (in the kitchen) maybe hoping that D would hear, or, to E.

If E was with her, there would likely have been a response (from him), or maybe they would have left the house together, or knocked on D's door. That didn't happen.

So, maybe E was in the bathroom, X mentions someone being in the house loudly enough for him to hear & heads back to her room. We don't know if she locked her door or not. It's possible that BK was already in the room. If she was murdered right then, E might have come from the bathroom, said to her that he would help and was then killed by BK who was lurking nearby. That bedroom is so small, I don't remember if there is even a closet in there.

Or, when X returned to her room E was already deceased, BK grabs her when she enters, covers her mouth and says a creepy line about being there to help before killing her.

I am guessing that if BK entered the room and E & X were both awake and in bed, there would have been a lot more noise and screaming, yelling etc..

It's all disturbing and I feel like 1 or more of the women was an intended target, not all 4 people, especially at once. I do think he stalked them for months with the intent of drawing this out, he was enjoying having control over when he might actually interact with them.

Also, I don't know much about TikTok. Can the app just be open and running & this is why they said X was actively on it? Maybe she fumbled with her phone trying to call out and hit the app, or was looking at it as she entered the room. Maybe it was accidentally opened. It will be interesting to see any additional information on this and how it affects the timeline.

I haven't really been on here since the summer of the Watts case. I've seen a few other posters who returned due to this case. I'm saying hello!

 

[Cassady]

I think this sheath fits!!!

If the Defendant"s DNA is on the sheath it sure does and IMO that evidence alone would lead to a conviction with a death penalty qualified jury in Idaho.

Also, the government has likely collected additional evidence since the PCA was written...IMO.

If the Defendant's DNA is on the sheath, the defense attorneys will first focus on when the DNA sample on the sheath was collected and by whom. If it was collected before the defendant was on LE's radar, then there probably is not much to work with. If it was collected after the defendant was known to LE, then they will scrutinize that more closely...IMO

IMO...the government will give the defendant a short time to accept a plea for life and if that is rejected it will proceed as a DP case.

 

[Bhodie]

That's a good example of inductive reasoning, and a perfectly valid way of doing research - when you can test your hypothesis and prove it.

But we can't run tests to find out what was in someone's mind when they decided to do a, b, or c, or not do x, y or z. There is the big question of why someone would kill 4 people, IMO that's a reasonable question to ask why, but of course that's purely personal opinion and conjecture, and based on personal views about good and evil, etc.

To answer the killing 4 question. Just a random scenario and I'm not even saying I'm on board with this but its a thought. Perhaps he never planned to kill 4 maybe he went after 1 on the 3rd floor found 2 in bed at least one woke up and there is #2. X was just up due to Door Dash, now I don't know how fast she eats and falls asleep but lets say she was outside her room for whatever reason and he's coming down and catches her like a deer in headlights or he walks up behind her and stabbed her in a lung she probably couldn't talk, whimper possibly and most likely heading to her room to E and she's 3 and then there is E in the room and there is 4. Maybe he didn't see D I cannot explain why there was not 5. Again just throwing it out there have not really thought too much on it because this is all just kinda crazy from the jump.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I have nearly the exat same theory, including that Kaylee was initially in her own room.

If his first intention was to rape M by threatening her with the knife that would explain how the sheath ended up in the bed next to her. He unbuckled his belt. I feel that K interrupted him and that started the killings.

JMO

 

[Spacemonkey1975]

He returned THE SAME DAY. 5 hours after murders and 3 hours before 911 was called and the murders reported.

He was either curious because he wasn't hearing anything on the news or what I think is he realized his knife sheath was missing and he desperately wanted it back but there were just too many people around for him to enter the house, too risky.

When I first read the pca that’s my mind went first went to him

That hasn’t been officially “revealed” that I know of, but I do think its the case that she didn’t know they were dead until waking up later.ikewise

 

[Helechawagirl]

Xana was not asleep. Clearly. She was active on TikTok at 4:12. At 4:17 a camera 50 ft from her room detected "whimpering and a thud." BK was spotted on camera leabing the area at 4:20.

Coroner said they were found in their bedrooms which some erroneously reported as asleep.

 

[10ofRods]

I thought the same, personally whenever typing something important I read it once or twice before sending, though it was so many pages it’s easy to overlook.

I also noticed yesterday (I think?) a court document was stamped with the time - 8:13am but it was only 8am Moscow time when it was posted on Twitter. Got me wondering if Moscow ever goes with daylight savings (assuming not since it’s PT?) and if whatever they use to stamp it was set with that timing…

Idaho is divided into two time zones, I believe.

Moscow is PST.

It is unusual.

https://www.nationsonline.org/oneworld/map/US-timezone_map.htm

 

[Friday Fan]

I think Ethan was killed before Xana based on where the bodies were found. It's likely that he could have been asleep.

 

[Bhodie]

Was this recent or from the day of the murders? The article makes it sound like this was recent but I'm not sure if i misunderstood because I would have thought they would have removed items like this much earlier.

Recent I believe the defense requested the evidence in the home be secured and the home to remain in evidence IE: empty and crime tape but no police presence. I can only assume the moved the beds and stuff to preserve them in a secure location.

 

[accordn2me]

I am not sure. 50 feet away? With walls in between? Maybe. That's a pretty good thud. Most people who pass out (dying or not) do not make a big thud. A thump instead.

I wonder if something else happened in those few minutes, something not expected by BCK. But maybe a body could make that much noise in the "fishbowl" where sound is amplified (said the noise complaint officer).

I wonder if X might have been getting the DD delivery as BCK slipped into the house. Maybe she heard the commotion upstairs and called out to E “someone’s here” then started moving toward the bedroom and BCK could have body slammed her, killed E, then told X he was going to help her….

All speculation on my part.

 

[Helechawagirl]

When I first read the pca that’s my mind went first went to him

I wonder if he went back to get the roommate who saw him?

 

[Rinbea1]

I've been reading all the posts and am confused about the sheath that he left behind. He walks into M's room with his knife in the sheath and it falls off the knife onto her bed? So did he unsheath his knife while he was standing over her bed or did it become unsheathed during a struggle? I guess I'm confused because if he walked in there with the intentions of murdering her, wouldn't he already have his knife ready and out of the sheath? What was his original plan? To walk in her room (knife sheathed), then quietly unsheathed it once he was standing over her? (That seems a little risky on his part.) If the sheath was not attached to his body or clothes, then what was his plan to do with the sheath once he removed it from the knife (put it in a pocket?) A lot of people with a knife and sheath have it strapped to themselves (waist, belt, shoulder, etc.) So could it have been attached and one of the girls struggled and displaced it from him? The whole sheath thing seems odd to me.

 

[Gardenista]

I assume they collected the neighbor’s trash? And how were they surveying him at that point?

Hopefully they collected the trash and I'm not sure how they were surveilling him. I can't see them sitting in a van close to their house, so I'm wondering if they installed a camera on a light pole. Or maybe the neighbor has a camera and they caught him that way.

 

[zoomom2]

I'm not arguing with you. Just bringing up something I keep thinking about.

Just because he dropped a kabar knife sheath doesn't mean conclusively he owns that knife, does it? Maybe it's a different brand.

Mr. Kohberger, do you now or have you ever owned a kabar knife?
Nope.

Maybe he thinks he's throwing in a plot twist.

JMO

Someone here on WS posted last night (The thread that got shut down late last night), that they sell those ka bar knives at an Army - Navy Surplus store OR a Military Supply Store (something like that) about 20 miles from either the house or his house. I will go back and try to find it.

That just jumped out at me.

I'm just saying this because he could have used cash, and there would be no record of who purchased the knife (maybe it wasn't a gift or vintage.)


Going to go back and find the post.

 

[jepop]

So piecing through the PCA and timeline a bit:

Approx 4am X's doordash is delivered. I'm guessing she goes downstairs to get it, goes back upstairs and eats it in her room while scrolling through TikTok.

at 4:04am BK is attempting to park by the house, fails, completes a three point turn comes back and parks. So at the very earliest, he enters the house maybe at 4:05am. He may have sat in his car for a few minutes getting up the nerve. Eventually he enters through the sliding door on the second floor. We can assume X did not see him so he most likely entered shortly after she retrieved her DD and was eating it somewhere she could not see him.

Approx 4am D wakes up to the sound of "K playing with her dog." We can assume now that this was actually BK upstairs so again, sometime after 4:05am. It seems as though the dog did NOT bark during this time as wouldn't that have been noted on the neighbor's video as well? The dog was also found in K's room when M and K were murdered in M's bed. He may have locked the dog in K's room before or after murdering the girls. Given we know they were both killed in M's bed and there is no mention of D hearing anything upstairs, I am guessing they were both killed in their sleep. Maybe this is why the dog didn't bark - there was no real noise. BK leaves the sheath there.

After the "playing with the dog sounds" D hears someone say "there's someone here." D says she thought it was K but the police speculate it could have been X as X was awake until at least 4:12am. I'm guessing the investigators suspected K was already dead by then which is why they think it was X.

Something to note - X's DD bag was seen by the kitchen sink the next morning so at some point, she was in the kitchen. Maybe it was then that she said "someone's here." Maybe the door in there was open? Maybe she could hear something going on upstairs? She could have said it to herself in the kitchen or maybe went back to the room and said it E.

When D hears "there's someone here" she opens her door and doesn't see anyone. Meaning BK is likely still upstairs. Or if X was in her room when she said this, maybe BK is already around the corner to her bedroom and out of D's sightline.

Now remember X is on Tiktok until 4:12am. So everything next likely comes after that.

D hears crying from X's room. She opens her door again and sees nothing. At this point we can assume BK is in X's room. She hears a male voice say "it's okay, I'm going to help you." Unknown if this was E or BK.

At 4:17 the neighbor's camera picks up whimpering from X's room, a thud and a dog barking. Let's assume this is the murder of X and E which fits with X being on TikTok until 4:12am.

D opens her door a third time and sees BK walking towards her with a mask on. She shuts her door and locks it. Police have stated he likely left through the sliding glass door immediately after this. His car is seen pulling away at 4:20 so he probably walked out around 4:19am (fits with the 4:17 sounds).

Did BK encounter X in the kitchen? Maybe M was the target, K was killed because she was in the bed and X was awake and spotted. Maybe X ran back to her room, BK followed her and killed her and E. The interesting thing is it doesn't seem as though X ever screamed. I feel if she'd spotted him in the kitchen and ran to her room, she would have screamed at some point. Maybe BK heard her say "there's someone here" and attacked her because of that. Or maybe he intended to kill her and E as well and went to their room intentionally.

The timeline is so tight, it's unbelievable. I feel so awful for D having to hear that. I hope she gets the help she needs to recover from this.

What do other people think about the sequence of events?

Yes,the timeline is incredibly tight and if BK was still looking for park at 4.04am I wouldn't put him entering the house until closer to 4.08-4.10am. Just now I speculated this scenario:

ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 56

Apologies if this was said already, was it revealed that DM didn't realize a murder had occurred until later? I don't blame her for not calling 911 either way (trauma will do that to you), but I'm wondering if maybe she didn't even realize her friends were murdered until BF woke up? Implied...

www.websleuths.com

 

[everybodhi]

I’m a bit shocked that it seems LE knew he may be dangerous, and yet PD along the route were not informed. Either of those traffic stops could have become complicated- if BK had been in a different kind of mood and felt trapped.

JMO

I feel the opposite, I can’t imagine FBI informing all the state cops on traffic duty between ID and PA details of their undercover investigation of a single suspect in a mass murder. I don’t see what the purpose would be, I do see the risk of leaks it would create, though.
I also don’t see high risk of BK having a shootout with cops with his father in the car over a traffic violation or how telling local LE that BK was a suspect would have changed police procedures. If anything, it could cause them to over-react. “I thought he was reaching for a gun”.
It’s not like the FBI was in “dead or alive” apprehension mode, they wanted him alive while they collected evidence for probable cause to make an arrest.
Jmo