ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 27

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Wow. I hadn’t heard of a struggle before either. Could explain the victims not all being in their beds comment from the coroner. But I wonder why that hasn’t been widely reported? Seems like a very significant detail if true.

“Investigators have learned that a physical struggle took place before the murders happened…”

It was also mentioned that investigators were in the backyard putting down evidence markers, digging through the leaves, pulling things out… I wonder what they found - maybe blood?

MOO

IMO strange that this hasn't been discussed since. I wonder if the 'defensive wounds' led to the assumption? It was sure quieted down, however, imo.
 
If that was the case, wouldn't it be much simpler for LE to share the plate number that doesn't match?

I don't understand the desire to read between the lines of official news releases for some hidden meaning. They statements seem pretty straight forward to me, so why not take MPD at their word? They're "interested in speaking with the occupant(s) of a white 2011-2013 Hyundai Elantra, with an unknown license plate".
I’d just like to add that retrieving a license plate number from a security camera is difficult enough during daylight hours.

Factor in that this was likely late night footage, and that the vehicle was likely moving, means that the probability of obtaining a plate number is ridiculously small.
 
Offering an expert opinion about this is far different than stating facts to which the person has no access. The idea that there is no DNA or fingerprints flies in the face of common sense. It was a party house. There's DNA and fingerprints everywhere. The problem is determining which matter and which don't. That may be sort of what he meant, but it's not what he said.
yeah, potentially. I'm not guessing. I took what he said and hypothesized - if this, then potentially that. lots about this flies in the face of common sense, so we'll see, I guess.
 
They would enter data to see if any owners had criminal convictions or if any household members had convictions.

They would look to see if there were any police calls in the neighborhood of the owner’s
Sorry, not seeing how that gets you any closer to finding the correct Elantra.
 
Re: the roommates sleeping thru the crime - when I was their age I could have slept thru a bomb going off in the next room, especially if I'd been out partying the night before. Unfortunately, I don't sleep so soundly anymore.
 
I 100% agree with every last word, Crimesnooper. I breathed a huge sigh of relief when my kids started to register that they weren't invulnerable which only happened after a male popped up in the backseat of my good-looking blonde daughter who also had a good-looking blonde roommate (K and M remind me of them too much) and grabbed my daughter by the throat. She had black bruises from his fingers for more than a week. We did our best to prepare her which was enough martial arts to earn a black belt plus a cell phone before they became common. And I told her to never, ever get the car with anyone no matter how heinous the threat. (Ted Bundy was operating at this time). She managed to pry the attacker's fingers loose and stagger out of the car. He came right after her, and she had just enough air left to kick him in the groin with a right foot that could break two inch oak boards held higher than her head, and when he went down, a double knife hand strike at the base of his skull. She sped away, then got scared, so drove back around the block to see if he was dead. He was still laying there, but she went home when she should have called 911 for ambulance and police. She was afraid she'd get in trouble (lack of maturity on her part, not realizing her neck damage was all the proof she needed). Plus she had been drinking underage but, thank God, not enough to fully impair her. This was the moment she learned true fear, along with a degree of confidence. The reason he was lurking in her backseat was she chose not to lock her car. She learned her lesson, but I've always wondered if he did. Or did he move on to hurt someone else?
OMG Thank God your daughter made it out alive.No doubt the martial arts paid off. How terrifying for her and you and her dad as parents.
When I think of the stupid stuff I did in college.. hitchhiking... drinking...so lucky.
I worked as a crime reporter as my second career.My first was as a Licensed social worker. So my best guess is that your daughter's attacker didn't stop. Most likely he continued until arrested or killed.
Thank heavens her skill bravery and guts kicked in ( literally!,) when she needed them. I have no doubt he would have killed her.
 
I’d just like to add that retrieving a license plate number from a security camera is difficult enough during daylight hours.

Factor in that this was likely late night footage, and that the vehicle was likely moving, means that the probability of obtaining a plate number is ridiculously small.
Yes, thanks for mentioning that. I agree completely.
 
A few years ago, a girl named Sierra Lamar was kidnapped in California. Police gave a description of the car. It was found.


So obviously, although this car was more distinctive , an unknown car can be found,
 

IMO strange that this hasn't been discussed since. I wonder if the 'defensive wounds' led to the assumption? It was sure quieted down, however, imo.

Likely, this is the struggle:

“Stab wounds on the hands of at least one victim appear to be defensive wounds, according to Mabbutt. She said there was no sign of sexual assault on the bodies during the autopsies.

In their Friday evening update, police said “some” of the victims had defensive wounds.”


 

IMO strange that this hasn't been discussed since. I wonder if the 'defensive wounds' led to the assumption? It was sure quieted down, however, imo.
You know what - I wonder if MSNBC took that “struggle before the killings” wording from CNN’s article — This is one of the headers in that article:

How the physical struggle unfolded remains unclear​

The paragraph goes on to talk about defensive wounds, no word of a physical struggle before the killings as MSNBC worded it. And as has been mentioned here the defensive wounds could just be instinct, it’s not for certain a struggle took place.

MOO

ETA: link to CNN article Here's what we know -- and don't know -- about the killings of 4 University of Idaho students as a suspect has yet to be identified | CNN
 
Likely, this is the struggle:

“Stab wounds on the hands of at least one victim appear to be defensive wounds, according to Mabbutt. She said there was no sign of sexual assault on the bodies during the autopsies.

In their Friday evening update, police said “some” of the victims had defensive wounds.”


I agree. IMO I just think that's kind of a leap for the media to make
 
You know what - I wonder if MSNBC took that “struggle before the killings” wording from CNN’s article — This is one of the headers in that article:

How the physical struggle unfolded remains unclear​

The paragraph goes on to talk about defensive wounds, no word of a physical struggle before the killings as MSNBC worded it. And as has been mentioned here the defensive wounds could just be instinct, it’s not for certain a struggle took place.

MOO

ETA: link to CNN article Here's what we know -- and don't know -- about the killings of 4 University of Idaho students as a suspect has yet to be identified | CNN

agree. imo that was the logic leap they made.
questionable cause logical fallacy.
lots of them in play, List of fallacies - Wikipedia
 
Offering an expert opinion about this is far different than stating facts to which the person has no access. The idea that there is no DNA or fingerprints flies in the face of common sense. It was a party house. There's DNA and fingerprints everywhere. The problem is determining which matter and which don't. That may be sort of what he meant, but it's not what he said.

It would be hard to believe there was no perp's DNA left. It is possible that it hasn't been found yet. It is even more likely - JMO - that samples are being processed. There are ways to separate mixed samples, but they are time- and energy-consuming. It being a party house, I suspect the samples were very mixed. This is why I am not surprised that LE may not have any answers yet, as forensic work is amazing, but requires a lot of patience.
 
Agreed.

I think the car is a red herring.
The car can go to the soup pot, but I have questions about that dog...when was he locked up, was it his default sleeping location, and if no one knows how he got locked in the non-crime scene room then it might have been the killer...who knew house and dog well enough to do it without setting off a lot of barking and door scratching, maybe even chewing if young enough to still have some separation anxiety.
 
Do we know what the four victims were studying? Were any of them taking a class/classes that might have brought them into contact with dangerous people?

(Mostly thinking law or psych classes. Social services? I mean, there are cases where people have gotten killed because they got in the middle of child custody or domestic violence.)
 
Looks like some history with the Idaho Dept of Lands and was quoted as California Inter Agency PIO in July.

Excellent research!

And very curious to me.
 
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