ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 28

[Deleted member 110058]

I think they've nothing.
If they had more clues, they'd be using the public for help.

The perp probably did a bit of planning but probably got lucky on multiple factors like no camera saw him, no witnesses, no survivors, no noise.

If LE have no DNA, no witnesses, no video footage, no obvious suspects, then what do they do?

They interview everybody in the various circles around the victims hoping something stands out. Everyone has the same alibi "I was asleep in bed". Can you prove it? "Can you prove I wasn't!?"
But maybe the perp was someone just outside these circles.

After a month all the DNA and digital data has been analysed. Everyone's interviewed.
So it's obvious they've nothing.

The perps feeling cocky. Will probably start planning another massacre.

This is a great objective response.
If LE really has no idea they have to wait for:
1) a critical tip to come in
2) the perp to get cocky and insert himself into the investigation (yes, this happens) or
3) another incident.
It's a terrible place for LE to be.

 

[warbuckle]

 

[Mojito]

Ok something has been bugging me and I feel like it’s been kinda overlooked. What do these 4 people have in common other than living in that house and being roommates? They both shared a long loving relationship with the other person killed with them. X and C were in a relationship as boyfriend/girlfriend and it seemed from all accounts to be a loving relationship. M and K also were like sisters it’s been said. Friend since the 6th grade. They also had that bond of a loving friendship. The other 2 roommates were spared for whatever reason. Motive for the killings could have been a jealousy rage of these relationships they had and this killer feeling rage at not having this.

It’s very strange to me that this house was considers a party house and yet on this 1 weekend night all the roommates got home around the same time and all just went into there separate room and went to sleep. It just seems odd to me.

Also wasn’t K close to the other 2 roommates also? I’ve seen them in party pictures together. Why on the night she comes back into town she only hangs out with M?

I’m not saying other roommates were to blame but I would be curious to find out about the recent dynamics in those friendships. It seems like something was off that specific night about all of their interactions with each other compared to pictures and videos I’ve seen previously.

Obviously just my observation based on information available.

It does stand out huh. I read that the two survivors were each out separately and arrived back home at slightly different times. Probably went to bed and were asleep when the other four got home.

I wonder how late in general the parties lasted when they had them ? I i would guess the parties started early evenings and went until 2 or even 3. Maybe by the time the four victims got home it was too late to start a party. But it is a curious coincidence, all of it.

 

[warbuckle]

I’m trying to imagine the art of crime scene investigation before DNA analysis, cell phone data, and prolific security cameras. What would investigators be focused on if they didn’t have those tools to turn to? Would they be more interested in the “crimes with similarities” in neighboring states?

Victims relationships and similarities

 

[ashhouston]

was that white car in the body cam video they asking about?

 

[indicolite22]

was that white car in the body cam video they asking about?

No.

 

[Bhodie]

I think they've nothing.
If they had more clues, they'd be using the public for help.

The perp probably did a bit of planning but probably got lucky on multiple factors like no camera saw him, no witnesses, no survivors, no noise.

If LE have no DNA, no witnesses, no video footage, no obvious suspects, then what do they do?

They interview everybody in the various circles around the victims hoping something stands out. Everyone has the same alibi "I was asleep in bed". Can you prove it? "Can you prove I wasn't!?"
But maybe the perp was someone just outside these circles.

After a month all the DNA and digital data has been analysed. Everyone's interviewed.
So it's obvious they've nothing.

The perps feeling cocky. Will probably start planning another massacre.

I couldn't disagree more, they have DNA to analyze and separate from each victim, suspect(S), and possibly friends and previous partygoers. Then track down all of that for elimination/exclusion, it is going to take more than a month to do just that part alone even if it is at the top of the list of priorities. They also have to find a pattern in which the murders occurred as that is important. They have a tremendous task at hand one month is not sufficient at all unless the suspect was bleeding all over them too and their DNA just so happened to be in CODIS, which isn't to my knowledge so it's going to take some time.

 

[10ofRods]

That’s a good question. Why wasn’t she hanging out with all her roommates instead of just one

The 6 of them came home from various activities throughout town. They came home to go to bed, IMO. The downstairs women may or may not have come home together - or merely at around the same time (1 am).

The four victims come home later, around 2:30 am IIRC, but not with the intent to party - the intent was to go to bed.

While this house was a "party house," it appears they specialized in "pre-Party" activities (before games or before bigger parties at frat and sorority houses). I'm not saying that they didn't have large parties that go all evening, just typing what I remember from a local article (in the media thread).

Further, almost no one starts to drink more/party at 2-3 am. That's time to wind down, rehydrate, and rest.

K and M were together all evening and went up to bed together, as friends do. X and E were together most of the evening, and then went to bed, as a couple does. The two women downstairs may have gone out together - not sure we know - but they slept in separate rooms, as they usually did.

Everyone behaved normally, IMO.

 

[cottonweaver]

Do you guys think they know who done it at this point?

No
but I think they'll have a few ' persons of interest' but not all of the biological and digital evidence has been analysed or obtained yet

+ They haven't even released the crime scene yet
+ 25-40% of students still hadn't returned ( according to local press, last week) so that might have also complicated face-to-face interviews, local canvassing .

 

[Mojito]

I agree and I don’t think are willing to even name a suspect out of fear this person might run or destroy evidence. I think we will all be surprised

Therre's been so much social media harassment of people that the police put out a notice to please stop pointing fingers and harassing online. So if there was even a wiff of a suspect named by police it would be chaos on social media and surely hurt the case in court. I can just see some of those online people protesting in a front yard of a suspects house etc.

 

[10ofRods]

I couldn't disagree more, they have DNA to analyze and separate from each victim, suspect(S), and possibly friends and previous partygoers. Then track down all of that for elimination/exclusion, it is going to take more than a month to do just that part alone even if it is at the top of the list of priorities. They also have to find a pattern in which the murders occurred as that is important. They have a tremendous task at hand one month is not sufficient at all unless the suspect was bleeding all over them too and their DNA just so happened to be in CODIS, which isn't to my knowledge so it's going to take some time.

I agree with you. Just the DNA alone is going to be difficult. NG reported (I believe she's allowed here) that they did have some perp DNA and that it wasn't in CODIS - but she did not state her source, so I consider that unverified background statements to a reporter. Fox News reported the same thing, but couched their report in hypothetical terms, so I am wondering if NG was doing the same thing.

Presumably, the killer left *some* DNA somewhere in that house.

Then, there are the digital forensics, which again, is a lot of data, could take a couple of months to get anywhere specific.

And many, many interviews, no doubt - following those 5000+ leads.

I just noticed that the Moscow PD page says they have 4000 crime scene photos already taken.

 

[OrangeRhyme]

I’m trying to imagine the art of crime scene investigation before DNA analysis, cell phone data, and prolific security cameras. What would investigators be focused on if they didn’t have those tools to turn to? Would they be more interested in the “crimes with similarities” in neighboring states?

Motive and opportunity were strong factors. Alibi and eye witness also.

 

[Victoria Chambers]

I’m trying to imagine the art of crime scene investigation before DNA analysis, cell phone data, and prolific security cameras. What would investigators be focused on if they didn’t have those tools to turn to? Would they be more interested in the “crimes with similarities” in neighboring states?

I dont believe states shared information back then. That tactic is also known to fail some victims even today.
Having somebody 'verify' an alibi was enough to keep many criminals on the streets. And no doubt, many innocent people were convicted in the past.
Even today though, in a place without CCTV or traffic light cameras..say in a place like Moscow Idaho, it will be very hard to disprove anybody who claims to have been home alone, or with relatives at the time of a particular crime.. alls it would take is for a culprit to leave their cell phone at home to "create" an alibi. Im not sure how LE would get around that situation, even these days. This is why the handing over of doorbell footage and speaking out on anything suspicious could end up being the smoking gun for this investigation imo.

 

[OldCop]

Do you guys think they know who done it at this point?

I think they’re getting closer.

 

[Jbootneil]

Maybe it was a cop or someone in LE who did it. Just speculating but would explain how they have been able to not get caught thus far just a thought

 

[OrangeRhyme]

I couldn't disagree more, they have DNA to analyze and separate from each victim, suspect(S), and possibly friends and previous partygoers. Then track down all of that for elimination/exclusion, it is going to take more than a month to do just that part alone even if it is at the top of the list of priorities. They also have to find a pattern in which the murders occurred as that is important. They have a tremendous task at hand one month is not sufficient at all unless the suspect was bleeding all over them too and their DNA just so happened to be in CODIS, which isn't to my knowledge so it's going to take some time.

They've the FBI helping them so all the lab work is done. You can get paternity results in 48 hours commercially.
Digital evidence also has been collected.
I know they need warrants and whatnot but I think everything's been expedited due to severity of crime.

The probability of solving a murder drops rapidly after a few weeks of no arrest.

I think the loner, psycho, stalker, peeping Tom type perp is what this is.

Someone local but peripheral.

I think Kaylee is the type of charismatic, beautiful person who could make a strong impression on someone.

She charmed and enchanted the wrong person. "If I can't have her, no one else can".

The others were just collateral damage.

Maybe the FBI have a list of these type of guys in Moscow or her hometown but they've no evidence on any of them.

 

[OldCop]

To Ka-Bar or not to Ka-bar

Here are LE's offical words on the murder weapon/s. Please note "KA-BAR" is never mentioned.

"Although no weapons have been located, based on preliminary information, investigators believe that an edged weapon such as a knife was used. Autopsies are scheduled to be completed later this week and will hopefully provide more definitive information on the exact cause of the deaths." (Nov 15)

"Additionally, detectives have contacted local businesses to determine if a fixed-blade knife had been recently purchased." (Nov 19)

"Weapon: There has been much conversation about the terminology used to describe the weapon. The type of knife thought to be used in the attacks is believed to be a fix-blade knife. Detectives continue to look for the weapon." (Nov 22)

"Local businesses were contacted to determine if a fixed-blade knife had been recently purchased." (Dec 6)

Moscow, ID | Official Website

www.ci.moscow.id.us

I think people use Ka-Bar like they use Kleenex. Instead of using the generic tissue, they say Kleenex. A large, lethal, fixed blade knife is now being referred to as a Ka-Bar.

 

[eclecticcowboy]

That’s a good question. Why wasn’t she hanging out with all her roommates instead of just one

When I was in college, I lived in what would be considered a "party house". Some of my best friends that I grew up with, and at the same college, lived in other houses considered "party houses". However, we all had other friends and other interest. Very seldom did I hang out with my roommate's, unless we had a party. Even then it wasn't totally uncommon for one of the roommates to have other plans and not be present. IMO there is nothing unusual about them not all being together that night. Also, the two roommates on the 1st floor in this case are under 21. M & K were at a bar....

 

[indicolite22]

They've the FBI helping them so all the lab work is done. You can get paternity results in 48 hours commercially.
Digital evidence also has been collected.
I know they need warrants and whatnot but I think everything's been expedited due to severity of crime.

The probability of solving a murder drops rapidly after a few weeks of no arrest.

I think the loner, psycho, stalker, peeping Tom type perp is what this is.

Someone local but peripheral.

I think Kaylee is the type of charismatic, beautiful person who could make a strong impression on someone.

Paternity test is done against a known sample. How do you know there wasn't unidentified DNA found at the scene?

 

[Trouble1321075]

Do you guys think they know who done it at this point?

I have not seen anything from them that indicates that they do. Moo.