ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow #3

[Cedarsage]

Thank you for including this.

Moscow is 1 hr behind AZ, so it does leave the question of whether around midnight means Dad's time or Xana's time.

Good question!

 

[Warwick7]

What??!

1. "Potentially they are witnesses,

2. potentially they are victims,” Snell said in an interview with ABC’s Kayna Whitworth.

3. “Potentially they’re the key to this whole thing.

4. "Snell said no one has been “included or excluded as a person of interest and/or a suspect."

5. Investigators hope the roommates will help them “figure out what occurred and why. That’s their story to tell,” he said.

University of Idaho students were 'likely asleep' before being attacked, police say as search for answers intensifies | CNN

The four University of Idaho students who were found stabbed multiple times in their off-campus home were "likely asleep," before they were attacked, Moscow, Idaho, police said in a Friday evening update.

www.cnn.com

I think the "key" is in what they heard, saw, etc.... I don't think they are suspects. But, I do feel they know "things." MOO

 

[Manwel]

As much as I admire and respect you, that isn't was LE stated. LE stated no one was excluded at POI or suspects.

University of Idaho students were 'likely asleep' before being attacked, police say as search for answers intensifies | CNN

The four University of Idaho students who were found stabbed multiple times in their off-campus home were "likely asleep," before they were attacked, Moscow, Idaho, police said in a Friday evening update.

www.cnn.com

To be far it has been really hard to track exactly where LE stands on anything. Snell made the boldest statement that says anyone could be a suspect. Chief Fry hemmed and hawed over that part.

 

[Emerald1328]

Update here:

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Moscow Homicide Update
November 18, 2022 4:40 PM

MOSCOW, Idaho – The Moscow Police Department is providing the following information to update the public on the known facts surrounding the four murders that occurred on November 13th in Moscow, Idaho.

On the evening of November 12th, Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen were at a local bar called The Corner Club at 202 N. Main Street, in downtown Moscow, between 10 p.m. and 1:30 a.m. on November 13th. At approximately 1:40 a.m., Kaylee and Madison were seen on video at a local food vendor called the “Grub Truck” at 318 S. Main Street and used Uber from downtown to arrive at their 1122 King Road residence at 1:45 a.m.

Investigators have determined that Ethan Chapin and Xana Kernodle were seen at the Sigma Chi house on the University of Idaho Campus at 735 Nez Perce Drive. At approximately 1:45 a.m., Ethan and Xana are believed to have returned to the residence at 1122 King Road. It was previously reported that Ethan resided at the home; however, it has been determined that he was only visiting. Two other roommates were at the residence that night.

On November 13th, at 11:58 a.m., officers responded to the residence after a 911 call reported an unconscious individual. Upon arrival, officers discovered Kaylee, Madison, Xana, and Ethan deceased inside the residence.

Autopsies were conducted on November 17th. The Latah County Coroner confirmed the identity of the four murdered individuals and their cause and manner of death as homicide by stabbing. The coroner stated that the four victims were likely asleep, some had defensive wounds, and each was stabbed multiple times. There was no sign of sexual assault.

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime. Additionally, online reports of the victims being tied and gagged are not accurate. The identity of the 911 caller has not been released.

As part of the investigation, detectives seized the contents of three dumpsters on King Road to locate possible evidence. Additionally, detectives have contacted local businesses to determine if a fixed-blade knife had been recently purchased.

At the time of this release, detectives have received nearly 500 tips which are being processed, investigated, and cleared. Thirty-eight interviews have been conducted with individuals who may have information about the murders. Anyone with information about this crime is asked to call 208-883-7180 or tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.

The Moscow Police Department is utilizing assistance from the Idaho State Police, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Latah County Sheriff’s Office.

Moscow Police Department:
• 4 Detectives
• 24 Patrol Officers
• 5 Support Staff
Federal Bureau of In Investigators:
• 22 investigators in Moscow
• 20 assigned agents located out of Treasure Valley, ID, Salt Lake City, Utah, and West Virginia
• 2 Behavior Analysis Unit
Idaho State Police:
• 20 investigators
• 15 troopers
• Public Information Officer
• ISP Forensics Services and mobile crime scene team
• 15 uniformed troopers to assist with community patrols

Currently, there are no suspects in custody, and the weapon has not been found.

Anyone who observed suspicious behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders, is asked to call the Tip Line at 208-883-7180 or email tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.
The Moscow Police Department thanks our community for their continued support, understanding of the limited information we can share, and patience during this difficult time.

Only 38 interviews? That seems really low to me.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Uber.
But we haven’t heard how X and E got home or how anyone knows they were also there by 1:45, except maybe from the statement of Xana’s father that they were home at 12 chilling out when he last heard from her.

Do we know if there have there been any reports that the Uber driver has been interviewed by LE?

 

[zencompass]

Thank you for including this.

Moscow is 1 hr behind AZ, so it does leave the question of whether around midnight means Dad's time or Xana's time.

Dear @late1 ,

Great catch! The one hour time difference! Thank you.

Slain University of Idaho Student Fought to Defend Herself, Dad Says: 'She's a Tough Kid'

Jeffrey told Arizona's Family that the autopsy showed that his daughter fought her killer based on bruises she sustained during the attack.

people.com

"Now the father of one of the victims is speaking out about who his daughter was — and how she courageously fought with her attacker."

"She just liked having fun," Xana Kernodle's father Jeffrey Kernodle told Arizona's Family."

"Jeffrey said that Xana was in constant communication with her family and that he last heard from his daughter around midnight on Sunday."

"I think midnight was the last time we heard from her, and she was fine," he told the outlet."

 

[mysteryfan96]

It’s good they’ve released this. But I’ve kind of lost hope that they actually had an idea of a/or possible suspect(s). This statement clears things up but is also somewhat disheartening as there is not really any new info either. It doesn’t mean they have nothing, but I thought they’d announce they have solid leads or something to give the public some reassurance. IMO JMO MOO and all that.

Maybe I’m just being overly optimistic or hopeful, but I have a suspicion that the police, despite their bungling of many of their messages so far, are saying that they have no leads or suspects whatsoever in order to lull the perpetrator(s) into a false sense of security. If they were to say they were closing in on the killer and about to solve it, it might spook him/her into an undesired action such as other violence or fleeing the area or something of that nature. MOO.

 

[Cedarsage]

Can you point out where he said she was home at midnight? I’ve read he said that he talked to her at midnight and she was fine then. But I must have missed where he said she was definitely at home then.

He said that he “thinks” he spoke to her around midnight.

“Kernodle said Xana stayed in regular communication with her family. "I think midnight was the last time we heard from her, and she was fine," he told the station, adding that he doesn't understand why his daughter and her roommates were killed in their own home.

"They were just hanging out at home. Xana was just hanging out at home with her boyfriend," he said.”

University of Idaho students were stabbed to death in their beds and likely asleep, coroner says

 

[chipwhitley]

I'm glad to see that the roommates and food truck guy have been cleared, but it does seem like they don't have much else to go on. Hopefully the email tips will lead to something.

 

[dienermom]

Update here:

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Moscow Homicide Update
November 18, 2022 4:40 PM

MOSCOW, Idaho – The Moscow Police Department is providing the following information to update the public on the known facts surrounding the four murders that occurred on November 13th in Moscow, Idaho.

On the evening of November 12th, Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen were at a local bar called The Corner Club at 202 N. Main Street, in downtown Moscow, between 10 p.m. and 1:30 a.m. on November 13th. At approximately 1:40 a.m., Kaylee and Madison were seen on video at a local food vendor called the “Grub Truck” at 318 S. Main Street and used Uber from downtown to arrive at their 1122 King Road residence at 1:45 a.m.

Investigators have determined that Ethan Chapin and Xana Kernodle were seen at the Sigma Chi house on the University of Idaho Campus at 735 Nez Perce Drive. At approximately 1:45 a.m., Ethan and Xana are believed to have returned to the residence at 1122 King Road. It was previously reported that Ethan resided at the home; however, it has been determined that he was only visiting. Two other roommates were at the residence that night.

On November 13th, at 11:58 a.m., officers responded to the residence after a 911 call reported an unconscious individual. Upon arrival, officers discovered Kaylee, Madison, Xana, and Ethan deceased inside the residence.

Autopsies were conducted on November 17th. The Latah County Coroner confirmed the identity of the four murdered individuals and their cause and manner of death as homicide by stabbing. The coroner stated that the four victims were likely asleep, some had defensive wounds, and each was stabbed multiple times. There was no sign of sexual assault.

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime. Additionally, online reports of the victims being tied and gagged are not accurate. The identity of the 911 caller has not been released.

As part of the investigation, detectives seized the contents of three dumpsters on King Road to locate possible evidence. Additionally, detectives have contacted local businesses to determine if a fixed-blade knife had been recently purchased.

At the time of this release, detectives have received nearly 500 tips which are being processed, investigated, and cleared. Thirty-eight interviews have been conducted with individuals who may have information about the murders. Anyone with information about this crime is asked to call 208-883-7180 or tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.

The Moscow Police Department is utilizing assistance from the Idaho State Police, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Latah County Sheriff’s Office.

Moscow Police Department:
• 4 Detectives
• 24 Patrol Officers
• 5 Support Staff
Federal Bureau of In Investigators:
• 22 investigators in Moscow
• 20 assigned agents located out of Treasure Valley, ID, Salt Lake City, Utah, and West Virginia
• 2 Behavior Analysis Unit
Idaho State Police:
• 20 investigators
• 15 troopers
• Public Information Officer
• ISP Forensics Services and mobile crime scene team
• 15 uniformed troopers to assist with community patrols

Currently, there are no suspects in custody, and the weapon has not been found.

Anyone who observed suspicious behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders, is asked to call the Tip Line at 208-883-7180 or email tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.
The Moscow Police Department thanks our community for their continued support, understanding of the limited information we can share, and patience during this difficult time.

Thank you for this very important update by LE which states “At this time in the investigation, *detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime.*” Hopefully the media and others will move on from insinuating that the roommates are involved.

 

[Curiosa20]

I'm no expert, but this is what my gut says:

Someone unknown to any of the victims (or the other 2 housemates who were not physically harmed) was stalking at least one of them, unbeknownst to any/all of the victims.

I think this person has killed before, likely with the same weapon that was used. This is not the kind of weapon an inexperienced or opportunist killer chooses at random - and is successful with! - to commit their first (4) murder (2). They successfully killed 4 young adults (i.e. prime physical condition) with a knife. IMO, they knew exactly what they were doing, how it would feel to do it, how much pressure to use, how much time it would take, etc.

Also possible they've used that knife to cut food (or other bodies - sorry! - after prior murders). I think this knife is the perpetrator's companion!

Either this is their weapon of choice (my main theory) OR the perp is barred from purchasing a firearm and that's why they chose the knife. If the latter, this, to me, indicates the perpetrator is likely a loner - because if they had other nefarious friends who might have guns, someone could give/loan them a gun or they'd steal/borrow it.)

Knives are more difficult to trace than guns because there are no bullet casings left behind. The killer knew this.

When LE says it was a targeted crime, I think that means they believe the perpetrator chose a person to attack, watched them, stalked them (probably unnoticed), planned the attack including how to get away.

I think they are indicating that there's not much of a risk the perpetrator will kill someone randomly - but that doesn't mean they don't have other PLANNED targets in town.


Having stalked them, I think the perpetrator knew there would be multiple people in the home and was prepared to kill any/all of them. But I think they killed ONLY those that they'd witnessed coming back to the house during those early morning hours. I imagine the killer lurked nearby in the wooded area starting sometime after dark, watched as the couple and the two friends returned home from hanging out and attacked them because they saw them/knew they were in the house.

Personally, I'm convinced that the other 2 housemates were in the house/asleep from much earlier in the night and weren't killed simply because the killer did not see them THAT night. I think the killer knew for a fact that those 4 were home because they were watching the house but didn't bother to search for additional housemates.

As creepy as this is, I think it's also possible they did this to scare the other housemates, as in they killed these 4 to send a message to one of the other 2 (who is their REAL target - psychologically).

As creepy as this is, I think it's also possible they did this to scare the other housemates, as in they killed these 4 to send a message to one of the other 2 (who is their REAL target - psychologically).
I have wondered the same. A twisted control and intimidation message to the others. Maybe they are not so outgoing, public, independent.. and he intends to control the others through cunning brutality. A collector?
Someone must know something helpful.
At the same time, I belueve he really had it out for Madison and Kaylee for an Avenging reason.
Did they reject him? Were they violating some religious or moral code of his? Definitely some powerful motivation involved, it seems MOO IMO

 

[Warwick7]

To be far it has been really hard to track exactly where LE stands on anything. Snell made the boldest statement that says anyone could be a suspect. Chief Fry hemmed and hawed over that part.

True. It's always safe for them to say anyone could be a suspect. However, I think the "key" is in what they heard, saw, etc.... I don't think they are suspects. But, I do feel they know "things." MOO

 

[saltlakerino]

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime.

These seems like the biggest revelations to me from this afternoon's updates.

 

[annpats]

This is bizarre to me. I'm listening to the local news report linked here: It says,
If- BIG IF - the two surviving roommates were home at the time of the attack, but not in the house when the bodies were discovered, then does that mean they slept through at we've been speculating, then got up in the morning and left and never even realized all their other roommates had been murdered? I'm sure based on the layout of the house that is plausible. And if so WHOA! I can't imagine learning all that went on and you had no idea.

I'm guessing the 2 surviving housemates got up on Sunday morning, went about their business and then left the house using the main front door - while the murdered 4 were upstairs on the 2nd and 3rd floors. The 2 surviving housemates probably assumed the other 4 were upstairs still sleeping.

 

[LeBlack]

I agree but there are cases:

Pennsylvania wife ambushes husband's lover and kills herself​

https://www.bbc.com › world-us-canada-43899187





Apr 26, 2018 — Jennair Gerardot, 48, broke into the house of Meredith Chapman, 33, and ambushed her as she returned home on Monday evening. Investigators say ...

and the astronaut diaper case:

Astronaut Love Triangle: Lisa Nowak 'Is Finally at Peace' 15 ...​

https://people.com › crime › astronaut-love-triangle-lisa...





Jun 29, 2022 — Shipman had recently begun dating Bill Oefelein, an astronaut who had once dated Nowak.

but statitically, these are rare, and I do not know of one that was not really "targeted"... there is the cyclist case still with its own thread here somewhere

Arrest Made in Murder of Pro Cyclist Anna Moriah Wilson​

https://people.com › crime › feds-arrest-kaitlin-marie-ar...





Jun 30, 2022 — Kaitlin Marie Armstrong will be deported and returned to the U.S., where she's accused of killing Anna Moriah Wilson.

These are cases where the women took it to (THE ONE) who they believed to be the source of their problems. Not FOUR people.

 

[Astro71]

IMO LE has the suspect(s) on their radar big time and if it’s true that they were killed as they slept then my radar has shifted big time. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Thank you for this very important update by LE which states “At this time in the investigation, *detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime.*” Hopefully the media and others will move on from insinuating that the roommates are involved.

Yeah, it's an unfortunate reality that rumors spread like wildfire in a case like this. I'm glad law enforcement is responding, but wish they had done it sooner.

 

[mysteryfan96]

He said that he “thinks” he spoke to her around midnight.

“Kernodle said Xana stayed in regular communication with her family. "I think midnight was the last time we heard from her, and she was fine," he told the station, adding that he doesn't understand why his daughter and her roommates were killed in their own home.

"They were just hanging out at home. Xana was just hanging out at home with her boyfriend," he said.”

University of Idaho students were stabbed to death in their beds and likely asleep, coroner says

I read that more as they were at home hanging out when they were murdered as opposed to when he called. Plus, it’s entirely possible she could have just told her dad she was at home for a quiet night so as not to worry him about his daughter being out late at night. Wouldn’t be the first time a kid fibbed to his/her parents about whereabouts at a late. Maybe she knew she would be home soon anyway, so she just told her dad they were already there.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Update here:

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Moscow Homicide Update
November 18, 2022 4:40 PM

MOSCOW, Idaho – The Moscow Police Department is providing the following information to update the public on the known facts surrounding the four murders that occurred on November 13th in Moscow, Idaho.

On the evening of November 12th, Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen were at a local bar called The Corner Club at 202 N. Main Street, in downtown Moscow, between 10 p.m. and 1:30 a.m. on November 13th. At approximately 1:40 a.m., Kaylee and Madison were seen on video at a local food vendor called the “Grub Truck” at 318 S. Main Street and used Uber from downtown to arrive at their 1122 King Road residence at 1:45 a.m.

Investigators have determined that Ethan Chapin and Xana Kernodle were seen at the Sigma Chi house on the University of Idaho Campus at 735 Nez Perce Drive. At approximately 1:45 a.m., Ethan and Xana are believed to have returned to the residence at 1122 King Road. It was previously reported that Ethan resided at the home; however, it has been determined that he was only visiting. Two other roommates were at the residence that night.

On November 13th, at 11:58 a.m., officers responded to the residence after a 911 call reported an unconscious individual. Upon arrival, officers discovered Kaylee, Madison, Xana, and Ethan deceased inside the residence.

Autopsies were conducted on November 17th. The Latah County Coroner confirmed the identity of the four murdered individuals and their cause and manner of death as homicide by stabbing. The coroner stated that the four victims were likely asleep, some had defensive wounds, and each was stabbed multiple times. There was no sign of sexual assault.

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime. Additionally, online reports of the victims being tied and gagged are not accurate. The identity of the 911 caller has not been released.

As part of the investigation, detectives seized the contents of three dumpsters on King Road to locate possible evidence. Additionally, detectives have contacted local businesses to determine if a fixed-blade knife had been recently purchased.

At the time of this release, detectives have received nearly 500 tips which are being processed, investigated, and cleared. Thirty-eight interviews have been conducted with individuals who may have information about the murders. Anyone with information about this crime is asked to call 208-883-7180 or tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.

The Moscow Police Department is utilizing assistance from the Idaho State Police, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Latah County Sheriff’s Office.

Moscow Police Department:
• 4 Detectives
• 24 Patrol Officers
• 5 Support Staff
Federal Bureau of In Investigators:
• 22 investigators in Moscow
• 20 assigned agents located out of Treasure Valley, ID, Salt Lake City, Utah, and West Virginia
• 2 Behavior Analysis Unit
Idaho State Police:
• 20 investigators
• 15 troopers
• Public Information Officer
• ISP Forensics Services and mobile crime scene team
• 15 uniformed troopers to assist with community patrols

Currently, there are no suspects in custody, and the weapon has not been found.

Anyone who observed suspicious behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders, is asked to call the Tip Line at 208-883-7180 or email tipline@ci.moscow.id.us.
The Moscow Police Department thanks our community for their continued support, understanding of the limited information we can share, and patience during this difficult time.

Thank goodness MPD provided this update.

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the two surviving roommates or the male in the Grub Truck surveillance video are involved in this crime.

 

[LeBlack]

My guess … the killer didn‘t know of the two basement bedrooms.

The "basement bedrooms" back up to the parking area. Looks like it could have been a converted garage. IME, garages are soundproofed.