ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 30

[GhostGhost]

I posted this awhile back of the timeline including the time the murders possibly took place.

Approximately 2:30 to 3 a.m. Goncalves’ repeated calls to ex-boyfriend go unanswered. Family members say this was not unusual, and police say he is not connected to the crime. <mod note - named of ex-boyfriend redacted>

Approximately 3 to 5 a.m. The four students, who were believed to be sleeping at the time, are killed in the house. The coroner later states some had defensive wounds, and each was stabbed multiple times. There was no sign of sexual assault.

Shortly before noon: Two surviving roommates wake up. After finding one of the victims on the second floor unresponsive, they call friends over to the house.

Source:

Timeline: Retracing the final night of murdered Idaho university students

“There’s a lot of anxiety and a lot of people not knowing what to do to keep their friends and family safe,” one student told NewsNation.

wgntv.com

We know from other cases, they don’t narrow it down to an hour via normal means. 1 hour never made sense, and it came from a Politician Mayor.

3:00 - 5:00 am makes sense.

And the neighbor’s first story should be believed, if any. When he heard nothing.

MOO.

 

[RookQueen]

Funny, I just double checked: I am indeed a male and I once drove an Elantra.

What even is this conjecture?

I quoted the person that said it didn't seem like a car a man would drive so back just a bit. I merely stated an opinion based off of an earlier conversation that I read on here regarding whether or not the perp would have to have been a big guy to have had to fight off (or something to that effect) both E an X while trying to kill them. IMO any kind of small car would not be ideal for a tall guy.....that's all.

 

[Helechawagirl]

Not if they are afraid.. This person used a giant knife to kill 4 people in their sleep, may have an alibi and a lawyer. If you talk, and this person finds out you may die. I'd be pretty quiet. MOO

And I sure as heck wouldn’t be driving around taking photos of people in Elantra’s

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

After a month having watched this case regularly, I am baffled that the timeline regarding possible time of deaths seems to keep moving
Why 2-5AM?

Why two AM? The calls went as late as 2:30 if I remember correctly
Why 5AM? Sunrise is near 6:45AM

2:50-6:30AM if you stop at dawn- they were not found until noon so 2:50-Noon is time none of the victims have calls or sightings or texts, condition of bodies would suggest death much earlier- maybe that is evidence for deaths prior to 5AM?

JMO

idk, just spitballing, but is it possible that he killed X and E earlier and waited in their room until K & M went to bed? do we know with certainty that the four arrived at home together? Maybe they didn't all see each other. Maybe X and E were already in bed, and K & M assumed X and E were having a little private couple time. Probably not, but possible?

 

[Charlot123]

I see. So to throw off LE. My first thought was that it wouldn't be possible because they wouldn't have the phone's unlock code. But I have a son, 2nd year in college and none of those kids even have passwords on their phones. They're on them so often that it''s too much of a pain to constantly unlock it.
So this theory is certainly possible.

Depending on what they used to unlock, it is quite possible, but someone needed to know the girls well to mimic the writing style.

This could move the time of the murders, of course, and establish, or ruin, alibis. Moving the murder time to earlier could fill in gap in X+E's schedule.

 

[RookQueen]

No, there really aren't. Trucks and SUV's of similar years and condition are ALWAYS going to be more expensive then entry level sedans. Especially in an area that gets snow and poor road conditions.

Well I checked before making that statement on both Autotrader and cars.com.......

 

[lucidium]

Local news station for chicago ..... if thats unacceptable i apologize

I'm not saying that station in particular is unacceptable or that the article you linked is inaccurate. It's just that there's a lot of misinformation out there, and I no longer trust anything that I'm unable to trace back to official sources. Sometimes individual reporters use poor wording that changes the meaning of what MPD actually says. Other times it seems like various news organizations copy unverified info from one another. The only sources I trust without additional confirmation are: (1) original written statements from MPD, and (to a lesser degree) MPD press conferences and interviews.

 

[MassGuy]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1603227045907296257

 

[Emerald1328]

This is an interview from Nov 17th. I’m assuming the coroner, Mabbutt, got the 2am time from the ME and the ME probably didn’t know about the text messages. There have been several posts about rigor mortis - maybe that’s how the ME determined the deaths were during the night (I’m guessing after 5am is considered early morning.)

“In an interview with NBC News Nov. 17, Mabbutt said the autopsy gave a clearer picture of what time the four were killed, their “extensive” wounds, and what the murder weapon was.

"It would have been early in the morning, sometime after 2 a.m., but still during the night," Mabbutt said”

Coroner Has New Details About Fatal Slaying of 4 U of Idaho Students After Autopsies

The four students were found stabbed to death inside a home in Moscow, Idaho, on Nov. 13.

www.today.com

MOO

I just went down a rabbit hole for 30 minutes on this 2am to 5am thing. The only article I can find that has the 2am to 5am timeframe is from the Idaho Statesman and says this:

“2 a.m. to 5 a.m. This is when Latah County Coroner Cathy Mabbutt said the homicides occurred. Moscow Mayor Art Bettge previously told the Statesman that police told him they believed the deaths were 3-4 a.m.”

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article268898017.html

The words “Cathy Mabbutt said” is underlined and links to another article from the Moscow-Pullman Daily News, which says this:

“She said the time of death for Ethan Chapin, Xana Kernodle, Madison Mogen and Kaylee Goncalves is likely in the early morning hours Sunday.”

Coroner: Autopsies confirm cause of death for UI students was stabbing. 'It would have had to been a large knife'

Following Wednesday’s autopsy of the four University of Idaho students found dead Sunday near campus, the Latah County coroner confirmed the cause of death was murder by stabbing.

dnews.com

No mention of the 2am to 5am. Under the headline it does show the article was updated the same day it was written. The Idaho Statesman has had great, fact-based coverage on this case IMO, so here’s my theory. The article from the Moscow-Pullman Daily News stated the coroner estimated the time of death from 2am to 5am, thus the Idaho Statesman including that on their timeline. However, at some point the Moscow-Pullman Daily News updated their article and changed “2am to 5am” to “early morning hours”. Whether due to inaccurate reporting/interpretation of what the coroner told them or maybe request by LE, or some other reason, I don’t know.

In summary, we have no idea when it happened.

IMO

 

[Allabouttrial]

THANK YOU! I know how much work goes into these things. I just did a little part and it wore me out.

I saw and it finally prompted me to finish it, to put you out of your misery !

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Not if they are afraid.. This person used a giant knife to kill 4 people in their sleep, may have an alibi and a lawyer. If you talk, and this person finds out you may die. I'd be pretty quiet. MOO

I'd get the h-e-double-toothpick out o town and have LE on the horn while I was driving. I'd be smart enough to know it wasn't a matter of if I'd be murdered in cold blood by that person, just a matter of when.

 

[layer]

I just went down a rabbit hole for 30 minutes on this 2am to 5am thing.

I did it earlier and gave up. I found a couple minor publications that attributed the 3-4 timeline to the coroner, but never any source to back it up.

 

[Esdaniel]

Did KG's family speak out about this?

“Kristi Goncalves said her family has not heard from the surviving roommates since the murders.”

Taken from the link I provided.

Parents of slain Idaho student desperate for answers: 'Where are you? Who are you?'

The parents of 21-year-old Kaylee Goncalves, one of the four slain University of Idaho students, are desperate for answers.

abcnews.go.com

 

[layer]

Not if they are afraid.. This person used a giant knife to kill 4 people in their sleep, may have an alibi and a lawyer. If you talk, and this person finds out you may die. I'd be pretty quiet. MOO

One of the most perceptive posts I've read lately.
An alibi and a lawyer and a giant knife indeed.

 

[mccaslandashley]

We know from other cases, they don’t narrow it down to an hour via normal means. 1 hour never made sense, and it came from a Politician Mayor.

3:00 - 5:00 am makes sense.

And the neighbor’s first story should be believed, if any. When he heard nothing.

MOO.

I guess I am missing something. I thought I heard that the crime scene was horrific or something to that effect. I did see the blood dripping in the photo from outside the house. If each pair were sleeping together, meaning four people, two beds. How on Earth did the roommate think one individual was simply just passed out?

 

[girlrx]

One of the most perceptive posts I've read lately.
An alibi and a lawyer and a giant knife indeed.

It sounds like a good lifetime movie to me! JMO

 

[Jealoushe]

I think it's an Elantra or Veloster at the mobil. It's interesting she said LE came in twice. Tues was the 2nd time they came to watch the tape

I saw a Veloster 3 times today and I agree it really looks like one! The one I saw was also white, and I saw a white Elantra too! They are everywhere here lol

 

[Trouble1321075]

Very interesting. Would you mind expanding on this? Why would the killers have made the calls? The texts show that they were asking the x boyfriend to come over. Why would the killer have done that?

Moo...

If they list the window for the time of death between 2-5am and the calls were made between 2:30-3:00am I don't see many other ways to explain that. If what we think we know about the time of calls is accurate then either they were alive at least till 3am or someone else made the calls.

If there are texts asking the BF to come over it might of been the killers attempt to lure a 5th victim to the scene or maybe the killer wanted the BF to be the one to discover the bodies.

Without more information the possibilities are almost endless. For instance I have heard people speculate that the girls were calling her BF because they were scared. That might be true but my gut says they would of called others, like the police if he did not answer and they were afraid. They would of also locked their bedroom door. That is another thing we don't know. There's no report of forced entry but the police are not reporting anything.

We have also heard the girls were asleep when they were attacked. If they were scared I don't think they would fall asleep too easily.

All these possibilities raise questions...

1. Were the calls made at the time we think?

2A. Who made the calls?
2B. If the calls were made by someone other than the phones owner how did that person unlock the phone?

3. Why would the TOD be as early as 2am if they have physical evidence like a voicemail after 2AM? Not saying they left a voicemail. Only using that example to illustrate my point that if they think the deaths occurred as early as 2am then they are not sure the girls made those calls between 2:30 and 3:00am.

 

[BlueTunes]

Has it been revealed what E and X were doing in the hours long gap before the murders? Anything?

 

[chipwhitley]

I’m with you. I think there’s a possibility something was going on with the dog and whatever that something was could have been due to the threat. I think that could be why K called the ex-bf in regard to “We share a dog together.” Was the dog loose in the neighborhood or acting up? Did they have to put it outside the room to get to sleep? We know the perp did not want to be fooling around with a dog so he either had to put it somewhere to contain it or let it loose outside the home. If he leaves after the murders AND leaves the door open then the dog can wander back inside on its own once it’s done running the neighborhood. Or just be in it’s room. I have to think that the dog would have been impacted by the murders unless it was put outside.

Maybe K put the dog in her room while she hung out with M in her room but she ended up falling asleep in there.