ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow #4

[CaptRenault]

There have been a lot of comments about knives and "Ka Bar" or "Ka Bar style" knives.

Unless investigators had already recovered the knife and they think it was the murder weapon, I don't think the particular brand or style of knife is significant. But they haven't done so.

The references to "Ka Bar" are just a shorthand way to use a popular brand name to refer to what otherwise might be called a "combat knife" or "tactical knife," some of which are made by Ka Bar. There are many manufacturers and shapes of such fixed blade knives and all of them would be lethal weapons in the hands of someone who was bent on murder. Any of these 200+ knives from one online seller could be used to commit murder:

https://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_store.html?a=fixed&b=combat&department=203&locktype=Fixed%20Blade&sortType=mostreviewed&min_blade=6&max_blade=25&page=3

So unless and until investigators recover a knife that they think was used in the crime, all we can really say is that the murderer probably used a "combat knife" of some type/brand. In other words, as I have noted before, we got nothin'.

 

[elmomom]

We don't have any information about the knife wounds. Was it some sort of special hunting knife, meaning premeditated, as opposed to a regular kitchen knife from a drawer, meaning more spontaneous. The knife is important. Size, type, one knife or more than one knife. Is it possible multiple perpetrators?

Have they released any information about sexual assault? That is interesting. We have not heard about that. Or if the bodies were staged in any way.

Kabar type knife (large blade, serrated on side, other smooth) per reports of LE visiting local shops to check for recent purchases
no sexual assault. (As per coroner)

 

[Blue_Painting]

right, but you can bypass it because it's your phone. I very highly doubt the killer is calling J...why would he take the chance of picking up one of the girls phones to call one of their male friends... makes no sense.. and I stand by MO that there is no way the killer had both Madison and Kaylee's phone codes. My husband of 28 years doesn't know my phone code.. and I don't know his.

Yes, I agree that the killer wouldn't likely call J or anyone from the girl's phones.

 

[r3d-ros3]

Do we know that Ethan was the one seen by the person who called 911? Or could it have been one of the other victims?

Do we know for sure the 911 caller saw a victim through a window or door but remained outside the entire time?

Or could a friend have arrived, let themselves in (either through keypad or unlocked sliding door), not see anyone in the communal areas and then went to check in a bedroom?

I am just trying to clarify. There have been so many reports, along with so much detailed supposition, that I am getting confused between what is established fact vs guesses.

Thanks for any clarification.

MOO.

There is intentionally little information being released about the 911 caller - LE has not identified to the public who the caller was, but they know the caller's identity. Ethan's dad mentioned at one point that it was a friend of his who called 911, but it's not confirmed. LE has stated that the roommates did not call 911, which is a point of interest for them (why was there such a delay between TOD and the 911 call if the roommates were home?). Roommates are NOT suspects and are cooperating with the investigation.

Here's what we know -- and don't know -- about the killings of 4 University of Idaho students as a suspect has yet to be identified | CNN This source (CNN) has a lot of information about what is known / public at this time. They also mention here that the keypad entry code was likely shared widely (confirmed by K's sister)

 

[Ghostwheel]

No the killer could not be calling J... most phones use face ID or require a code to unlock unless you are calling 911 ( do not think the killer was doing that at 3:00 am) and I highly doubt the killer had such personal information.

That is an assumption on your part, though. Most is not all and a lot of people turn their unlock features off and on depending on where they are. If fingerprint was used, they'd have that. If it happened to be a close friend, they might also have the code. All of my Ds roommates had hers, and she had theirs, they were all very close.

Eta: I have my friends finger pattern. I can unlock her phone, too. We can't simply say it's not something because it's not our personal reality.

 

[KPO]

I've been reading and absorbing since this case broke. With information becoming more stagnant and convoluted with speculation, I've started to consider the way it may have happened.

I had been imagining K and M being on the top floor, X and E being on the middle level, and the surviving 2 roommates being on the lowest level. K and M possibly in the same room/bed - carbonara, calling J, etc. after a night out.

This scenario fits with K and/or M being the targets and killed first. Going down the stairs after stabbing to exit through slider, E may have been encountered, possibly out of bed. X may have awoken also or may have still been asleep but seen through an open bedroom door. This could be why E may have been visible, on the floor, and unresponsive to a friend coming over at noon the following day. The 2 survivors being on the lowest level offset from the noise of the floor above them and spared by the layout.

With the unconfirmed mention of a survivor being on an "upstairs floor" I wonder if the reference is to the middle floor rather than the top floor. "Upstairs" from the lowest level. With 2 bedrooms on each floor, it is possible one of the survivors' rooms was on the middle floor.

IMO/MOO

This outline makes the most sense to me as well. I don't think E&X were targets or planned. One of the girls upstairs may not have been either but my guess is that they were sharing a bed. E may have heard something, opened the door to check and ended up as collateral damage. That would have woken X up which would explain why she had defensive wounds and ended up being killed as well. More of a "you've seen me and I can't leave any witnesses behind".

 

[Kaley Smith]

I would add loner, militia or survival training, obsessive, controlling and possibly influenced by Cult with hardcore ideas about women.
He planned and prepares for this, IMO.

Yes. I think he was a jealous, grievance-collecting incel.

 

[bonniejeanne17]

When Mark Furhman issued that statement about a stalker to Fox News that everyone else has picked up, he qualified it. He said it was told to a person who told the person that told him. Hearsay through two people. It is possible it is true but it is also very much possible it isn’t. Unfortunately, the only thing that ever gets repeated is that there was a stalker. No one ever bothers to repeat what Furhman himself added about it being, basically, gossip. Furhman inserts himself into investigations from the outside, his knowledge and opinions are no more valuable than anyone else’s.

It is easy to believe that two gorgeous girls like that, in a college town, would have many admirers, and probably a few stalkers.

 

[Mslove717]

Is the FBI involved in this case?

FBI usually only get involved if 1) it’s believed the case crosses state lines or is a federal case in some way, or 2) if they are invited in by the local law enforcement agency.

There’s a comment a ways back that other agencies, including the state police and FBI, HAVE been brought in on the case

 

[Vaderman]

different era where crazy stuff didnt happen on a regular basis

Shoot, it continues even today. At my previous place of employment, we had key fobs to gain access. We had the same lecture and yet it was always disregarded (strangers allowed in, propped open).

Ironically, now I work for a college and am the one who makes sure the doors are all securely locked when our office closes lol

Edited for grammar

 

[KPO]

That is an assumption on your part, though. Most is not all and a lot of people turn their unlock features off and on depending on where they are. If fingerprint was used, they'd have that. If it happened to be a close friend, they might also have the code. All of my Ds roommates had hers, and she had theirs, they were all very close.

I don't believe it was the killer using their phones but as devil's advocate, if you're using a phone that has face recognition to unlock and you've just killed those 2 people, you have access to use their faces.

Has anything been released about whether their phones were in the home? I'm assuming that they were because it hasn't been mentioned that the killer took the phones.

 

[tobiasfunque]

Anyone else hung up on the ride home? It’s been said it wasn’t an Uber. Why even tell us that?

I see a car pull up in the reflection at 3:50:00 (twitch video time) M and K leave frame at 3:53:30. Car pulls away at 3:53:55.

Can anyone enhance the tail lights?

 

[late1]

No the killer could not be calling J... most phones use face ID or require a code to unlock unless you are calling 911 ( do not think the killer was doing that at 3:00 am) and I highly doubt the killer had such personal information.

I also think (IMO) it is more likely the victims made the calls, but we don't really know, do we? Couldn't a phone be face ID unlocked by pointing at a victim?

EDIT: Sorry, I see KPO posted the same thing before me

 

[SortaSleuthy]

The two roommates that were NOT attacked had bedrooms on the first floor. Several WS-approved sources have quoted LE that the dead victims were on the two upper floors of the three floor house.
Here is one of the sites:

A timeline of the killings of four University of Idaho students | CNN

The killings of four University of Idaho students Sunday in their off-campus home has brought in the investigative powers of the local Moscow Police, state police and the FBI. A preliminary timeline reveals some of their final hours as well as the investigative response.

www.cnn.com

(Idaho State Police Communications Director Aaron Snell)
“The victims were found on the second and third floors of their home, Snell told CNN.”

 

[sun16]

If I had to make a bet today, IMO I’d say the killer is an early 20-something college guy. I just don’t think this is a woman or some older/random man. I think this is someone who knows these people.

 

[tokyorose]

That is an assumption on your part, though. Most is not all and a lot of people turn their unlock features off and on depending on where they are. If fingerprint was used, they'd have that. If it happened to be a close friend, they might also have the code. All of my Ds roommates had hers, and she had theirs, they were all very close.

Eta: I have my friends finger pattern. I can unlock her phone, too. We can't simply say it's not something because it's not our personal reality.

That is why I said it was only my opinion and yes my assumption. It makes no sense why the killer would call J at 3:00 am why would they do such a thing? it will remain my opinion that the killer did not call J using the girls phones

 

[late1]

The calls started 45 minutes after they got home. What were they doing until then?

IMO the calls started 30 min after getting home at 2 am. Then: Bathroom, dog, eat pasta (IMO)

 

[sds71]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1594052554228649984

 

[AgithaBoots]

I think it's weird to be calling your boyfriend frantically on the night you're murdered. And your best friend calling him, too, and you're both murdered.

To me this indicates the M and K may have known something was amiss when they got home and felt scared.

JMO

Agree!!!

 

[Blue_Painting]

Anyone else hung up on the ride home? It’s been said it wasn’t an Uber. Why even tell us that?

I see a car pull up in the reflection at 3:50:00 (twitch video time) M and K leave frame at 3:53:30. Car pulls away at 3:53:55.

Can anyone enhance the tail lights?

I think it's meaningful because it is likely easy for LE to answer who drove the girls home, yet, they do not. imo