ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 7

[britinsussex]

My apologies if this has been discussed.

When I watched the presser over the weekend, LE listed all the active participants in the case. He mentioned two FBI employees in West VA.

Are they specialists that happen to live in WV?

Are they agents that are investigating in WV?

Is there a WV connection to a suspect?

Just my thoughts.

Otis

I believe they have been called in as extra backup! My uncle is a retired Federal Agent. He worked cases all over the southeast even though he was headquartered in south Florida. One of his first well-known cases was that of Adam Walsh.

 

[ShadyLady]

Does LE ever say publicly...."YES, we have a suspect", or say we have a POI BEFORE an arrest is made?

If they have...I don't remember.

 

[seasideForest]

I agree. Also, the people on the call could be hysterical, visibly upset, describing a gruesome scene. Can you imagine the headlines some “news” outlets would make of the call? It’s kind of like police not releasing crime scene photos - that’s just fodder for clickbait and dehumanizing the victims. I’m guessing eventually it will be released, but I’m glad they haven’t yet. Plus, as you say, there could be very valuable info on it.

Much as many on here would like to hear that call, we have no right to hear it, do we? I don't live in the US so I could be wrong on that. We just have to sleuth with what we do know.

 

[CityKid]

not to play devil's advocate here, but as a college kid, I've had convos with my friends saying I would rather die than get transported to the hospital for alcohol poisoning. like my parents would murder me and overall getting transported is so embarrassing. If they saw e in the hallway and didn't see blood, assumed it was alc poisoning, the surviving roommates may have called other friends for advice or called e's frat brothers to see if they knew what drugs he took or how much he had to drink. When you're young, you would do anything not to get the police or medical professionals involved, especially when x and e were underage.
Living roommates would want to see what steps they could do to possibly prevent an ambulance from being called.

This is the underrated comment I was looking for. Most college kids, especially if there's anything vaguely illegal in their dorm/house, will go to friends before police/medical professionals. E and X were underage.

 

[SMK777]

I'd like to know what happened to the dog too. This thread is moving so fast, it's easy to miss things.

The dog is alive and unharmed, and has been given to the secondary owner.

 

[annpats]

I'd like to know what happened to the dog too. This thread is moving so fast, it's easy to miss things.

The dog was found loose and taken to a shelter, I believe. Then re-united with the co-owner.

 

[Elley Mae]

Victims died in the early hours of the morning, according to Latah County Coroner Cathy Mabbutt. If they were not stabbed with the same knife, it was a very similar one, she said.

University of Idaho murders: Here's what we know

Police revealed slightly more information on Sunday during a press conference about the 911 caller and affirmed the whereabouts of the victims that night.

www.ktvb.com

 

[happyday]

Based on the articles about the dog found mutilated after going missing while on a nighttime potty and a rabbit, usually they are out at night, within 3 miles:



I think it is possible that the dog went missing while out to use the bathroom in the wooded area.

Some dogs go on out on their own and come right back in leading to alarm if they disappear.

Calls to J to help with emergency: share the dog, have dog news, get back to me.

Perp holds dog while girls call to him and look around a bit. Maybe a couple of the calls where while looking in the yard or standing on the porch or deck looking out.

In town, in a cold climate, wandering or penned dogs aren’t as common as ones sent out on their own for a pee and back, imo.

So by noticing dogs sees the girls in passing. They were probably a busy blur and the roommates look enough alike that they could all be the same two blondes to a disorganized killer.

If the dog is known to do a bit of a wander then I might think about leaving a door cracked for him to get in when he comes back.

That is noticed by the perp who abandoned the plans for the dog.








All imo

That’s so scary! And plausible IMO

 

[Missyrocks5]

To me, the locked door scenario makes the most sense. It would explain why 911 wasn’t called immediately. Also why the police were the first on the scene instead of EMT.

Yes. Exactly. Explains why they didn’t call 911 originally and instead called friends. But then, what makes no sense, is how was there no apparent blood anywhere outside the door, on the floor, etc? Unless he changed clothes, showered there if there was a bathroom inside one of those rooms? No bloody footprints? No blood in the doorknob? How?

 

[Manwel]

To me, the locked door scenario makes the most sense. It would explain why 911 wasn’t called immediately. Also why the police were the first on the scene instead of EMT.

Yeah. I'm starting to get this feeling too. Here's the Zillow listing. Note several of the shots of the door handles to rooms. I think the fourth to last image at the bottom is the best look.

Whoever did this could have locked the bodies in the rooms. Surviving Roommates wake up, go to someone's room, don't get answers. Find it locked. They try calling. All the doors are locked. They pound the doors. Nothing. So at this point yeah, I get why you might call someone else and be like, "All these doors are locked and I can't find anyone or get a response." There's also the potential that you can hear victims' phones in all their rooms. So they're scared but they don't know exactly what to be scared of yet.

So friends arrive to diagnose the situation. Perhaps someone takes a peek in a window and on the basis of someone visible but not moving they call because "unresponsive" but they can't see enough into the room to discern stabbing.

That is highly plausible and maybe the detail about locking the doors is what the police want to keep secret because it's unique enough for the killer to know that someone else wouldn't immediately assume.

 

[Data Sleuth]

I’m assuming the killer locked the doors to those rooms and closed them before he left. That’s why the surviving girls would have knocked on the door and not gotten an answer and may be called friends. But what I don’t understand is how could there not be apparent signs of blood outside the room and in the house? How could there not be, assuming the doors were locked and closed, blood on the door knob, foot prints on the floor, on and on? Did the killer clean up and shower and change clothes before he left? And if so, that certainly lends to premeditation and planning.

We do not know if bloody footprints, handprints,trail etc were or were not present in areas of the building. I have not read or heard official LE reports regarding any evidence left by the killer(s).

 

[Manwel]

Yes. Exactly. Explains why they didn’t call 911 originally and instead called friends. But then, what makes no sense, is how was there no apparent blood anywhere outside the door, on the floor, etc? Unless he changed clothes, showered there if there was a bathroom inside one of those rooms? No bloody footprints? No blood in the doorknob? How?

If they were all stabbed while asleep, bed absorbs most. Possibly killer tried to stand behind them when he did it, or away from any blood spray.

Also, if they had blankets up over most of their bodies, I would think stabbing through a blanket would result in the blanket absorbing the majority of the spray. There'd be a lot less castoff I would assume.

 

[rrg0323]

There are many commenting that the actions or behaviors of these kids seems 'strange' to them and speculating on dark scenarios based on their unfamiliarity with those actions or behaviors. In my experience and in the experiences of many other posters, all these kids were behaving exactly as US college students do on a Saturday night in 2022. There was nothing nefarious or odd. The four victims and their roommates were out on a Saturday night and came home right about the time bars were closing - 1:45. They were out on the town for hours according to the times stated by LE, bar crawling, drinking, getting food post-bar crawl so you can soak up the alcohol you drank, catching a ride home with someone, going to frat parties or dances; roommates trying to sleep and maybe using earbuds to block out noisy roomies, locking their doors so someone visiting doesn't barge in and wake them up, sleeping in late after a night out, leaving a door open for someone without a key; drunk-dialing an ex over and over. All of the above are normal! They were college kids on a Saturday night. The end of that night took a terrible and dark turn. That's what IS abnormal. Up until they were killed, everything was normal. moo

I couldn't agree more...people asking why the other two roommates were not with the victims and claiming that as really weird...really?

 

[nightowl2728]

That's easy to say but it is very important for young people reading this thread to know that if your friend is having a medical emergency, the right answer is to call for medical attention immediately. It's not being judgmental, it is objectively the right thing to do. Calling friends, siblings, classmates before 911 is the wrong decision. We all make wrong decisions but it is important to learn from them going forward.

Pretending like "who could have known?" about calling 911 when someone is unconscious is being disingenuous.

Totally agreed on this! I recently hit my head and was bleeding all over at a rec sport game and my teammates (and the ref) kept trying to give me "bandages" from a first aid kit. I literally had to insist they call 911, because I didn't want to lose a lot of blood then pass out. I ended up needing 9 stitches. Some people don't react well in a crisis, or downplay it, but it's much better to overreact and be wrong then to underreact and not get someone the proper medical attention!

 

[nocturnes]

I agree. Also, the people on the call could be hysterical, visibly upset, describing a gruesome scene. Can you imagine the headlines some “news” outlets would make of the call? It’s kind of like police not releasing crime scene photos - that’s just fodder for clickbait and dehumanizing the victims. I’m guessing eventually it will be released, but I’m glad they haven’t yet. Plus, as you say, there could be very valuable info on it.

Except that after the press conference yesterday, police put out this statement on Facebook. Police have described this as one of the most gruesome scenes ever seen in 30 years on the job…how was it possible to see one of the victims and the main concern is that they aren’t waking up? If you were going to get help to try and wake them up, why would you call friends from off-site to come over instead of going to get your other roommates to come help? Very odd circumstances about this. Also strange they decided to release this info immediately after the press conference where fewer details were provided : https://m.facebook.com/100082550200493/

 

[taylorss]

Does LE ever say publicly...."YES, we have a suspect", or say we have a POI BEFORE an arrest is made?

If they have...I don't remember.

IMO I feel like when there are public statements expressing more certainty than seems warranted, they often turn out to be a ruse / misdirection aimed at a suspect…

Not saying that’s the case here! And maybe this kind of ploy is too cynical anyway for small-town LE who haven’t handled horrible mysteries like this before …

It’s just whenever I see LE declaring anyone “cleared” as they’re still begging for info, it raises an eyebrow MOO

 

[Manwel]

We do not know if bloody footprints, handprints,trail etc were or were not present in areas of the building. I have not read or heard official LE reports regarding any evidence left by the killer(s).

There have been those statements that the killer "left a mess" but it was clearly within the rooms and not throughout the house, otherwise Surviving Roommates likely would have reported a robbery/breakin from the outset. And it's still unclear what is meant by mess. The victims and gore or the rooms themselves and items in them?

It would be a VERY interesting detail if the killer stabbed other things in the room or used a knife on the walls or on photos and other things of that nature. That could point toward that early "personal" or "targeted" statement.

 

[nightowl2728]

I couldn't agree more...people asking why the other two roommates were not with the victims and claiming that as really weird...really?

I don't understand why people here are focusing on the 911 call not being released and the surviving roommates' behavior around the call/the night before so much. It's pretty typical college house behavior to sleep during parties, loud noises, lock your door, etc. and also how/when 911 is called in as a result of such a traumatic scene is not that bizarre either to be handled poorly. Edit: Also in most states they don't have to release 911 calls if the call is the subject of an ongoing investigation or would be against the public interest, etc. There are legal protections that would be in play right now. It's been stated multiple times by LE that they are not considered suspects. Why are people allowed to speculate on that while others are not allowed to speculate about people close to the victims who were *not* officially cleared by police, but are mentioned in pressers? Wouldn't police "clear" those people to avoid speculation? MOO

 

[TootsieFootsie]

'Sloppy' Idaho killer left 'mess of evidence' at 'chaotic crime scene'

Devastated parents of one of the victims of the University of Idaho massacre said killer was 'sloppy' - with cops blaming the Thanksgiving break for lack of leads.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Police have not confirmed if they have DNA from the suspect but have set up a mobile unit at the scene of the bloody crimes to try to speed things up.

Officers are also seeking surveillance footage from two ‘areas of interest' in Moscow as part of their hunt for the killer.

They are urging members of the public to come forward with any tips or footage in parts of the city between 3am and 6am on November 13.

Anyone with footage or stills covering West Taylor Ave, West Palouse River Drive, Highway 95 south to the 2700 block of Highway 95 S and the Arboretum and Botanical Garden are asked to contact cops.

 

[Snoopster]

If the killer was familiar with the home and its occupants, he would have likely gone after the other roommates. That's why I don't feel it was a known person to the victims, nor a person who has been to the home to party or otherwise. Rather, I feel like the home was likely stalked from the outside, either the night of or recently prior, or he targeted either Ethan/Xana or Kaylee/Madison from wherever they were the night of and followed them back.

My opinion.

Or a peeping Tom/stalker who watched the house from the hillside (probably for more than one night). From the hillside you can't see the rooms on the first floor. Their windows face away from the hillside and much of the first floor is hidden and embedded against the hillside. It's almost as if they don't exist. Maybe the killer didn't know the layout and what was in the 'basement' and wasn't going to go downstairs to check it out.

If a stalker arrived at 1:30 or 2:00 to watch he would have seen...saw the 4 victims in the home and hang around in the kitchen for a while before heading to bed. Then he could have waited until the lights had been out for a little bit before entering by the sliding door.

As an aside, the video of LE inspecting the backyard, it looks like a window screen on the ground below one of the kitchen windows. Could this have been an access area?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1594527972043948033

ETA: ooops, sorry @NatKingCola . I see you posted this same thought earlier than me but I hadn't caught up to that point in the thread yet.