ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #16

[ILOKAL]

I try to be careful to use imo (in my opinion) or to state "I think" or "I believe" when discussing cases. Granted, there are times I slip up.

IMO...the critical part of the timeline is something they would need to get straight not who ate breakfast and when. Yes, it is my opinion that what they did and when they did it over a period of a week prior is part of the overall picture...but not the critical part. It begins and ends with the last time someone laid eyes on DeOrr Jr. and when they discovered him missing and how it relates to everyone else...IMO.

I just don't think the specific time you're talking about can even possibly be answered in a meaningful way without the answers to those other questions. But, if THAT'S the ONLY part of the timeline Klein is also talking about, I don't see how he could have 90% without ever speaking to IR.

And, if that portion is all that's critical, then why do we have over 16,000 posts, most of which talk about everything BUT that?!

 

[Elle*Bee]

Exactly. That in itself is interesting given the proclivities of Generation Y to document their daily lives. And also because it's simply natural at any age to take pix when you're traveling away from home. Something to share with relatives and friends.

I don't know.... I guess I'm at the bottom of the Baby Boomers (I'm 50). I take and post more photos than any of my three sons (ages 14-20). If you look at their Facebook walls, probably 40% of the posts are when they're tagged by me, 50% when they're tagged by other friends and maybe 10% are their own posts. It's become a bit of a running joke when my oldest is traveling. If I don't hear from him. directly, I can usually tell he's safe (and eating well) thanks to his friends' posts.

Maybe JM and DK don't share as much online, or if they do, perhaps not regularly? Or perhaps they don't share photos until returning home (I do this so people don't know my house is empty while I'm away). Just a thought.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Exactly. That in itself is interesting given the proclivities of Generation Y to document their daily lives. And also because it's simply natural at any age to take pix when you're traveling away from home. Something to share with relatives and friends.

With most people I know personally, it is very normal to take photos with their phones or cameras especially on a trip with children. People, particularly of their age group, tend to document the small moments of their lives more than ever before. Facebook is enough proof people like to share those details...imo.

There are tons of photos of DeOrr being shared on Facebook and other places (IMO since my idea of tons probably doesn't match another's idea of tons). I don't know where anyone would get the idea JM and DK are so different than other people their age with kids. They both had cell phones so one would assume they also had cameras. They obviously had access to cameras on trips because I have seen the pics which also underscores they do take candid shots of DeOrr Jr often...IMO.

I think some people would take shots of the landscape on the way up to the campsite and maybe even at the store at Leadore, IMO. I believe the store would be a great place for photos as it is, imo, a very interesting place in the middle of nowhere.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I just don't think the specific time you're talking about can even possibly be answered in a meaningful way without the answers to those other questions. But, if THAT'S the ONLY part of the timeline Klein is also talking about, I don't see how he could have 90% without ever speaking to IR.

And, if that portion is all that's critical, then why do we have over 16,000 posts, most of which talk about everything BUT that?!

Maybe because what we have heard so far sounds like nonsense...IMO?

 

[pepelepolecat]

Well, here' a poster that says it's not normal to not take pictures of your families vacations, especially of your child.

Except that's not actually what I said. I didn't say that I did not ever take pictures. I said that I often get caught up in doing whatever we're doing and forget to take them. Our family vacation pictures tend to be taken randomly when I think about it -- so no, I don't document french fries for Instagram, my period for Facebook or my kid's dirty diaper for Twitter.

This was technically the first full day of their vacation. It wouldn't surprise me if they only had one or two shots at that point -- maybe a sleeping car picture or something similar.

*all this is my opinion only*

 

[giagreen]

I refuse to base the guilt of two parents based on the amount of pictures they took not even a full 24 hours into their vacation.

 

[AmyPond]

I'm blown away!:happydance: Yeah, I remember how earlier people were talking about how you don't wear shirts under a hoodie, that's just not done in the wilderness . . and LOOK! He was wearing a t-shirt!

I haven't been following the threads that closely. People said that shirts aren't worn under hoodies? I've never heard of that. Sounds like the completely opposite of everyone I know.

As for pictures...I don't think all people of a certain age can be lumped together really. For example, I take and post photos all the time. Of very mundane things. My brother is only 2 years older than me. He and his wife rarely post photos on social media. It's just not their "thing." So the lack of photos doesn't mean much to me really.

 

[ClaireNC]

Just a thought I had while reading posts about timelines and photos at the campsite...if the timelines were perfectly coordinated with no discrepancies, some would wonder if that indicated a nefarious intent to get all their stories straight. If there were photos of DeOrr at the campsite, some would view that through the same suspicious lens as JM's text to her Mom.

Personally, I expect timelines to be messy. Who keeps perfect track of time or sequence of events in the normal course of a day? If my dh disappeared I doubt I could give an accurate account of the hours or minutes leading up to that event. Regarding the lack of photos made public, I doubt they had the time or inclination to take cute photos if they made a trip back to town for feminine supplies. There would have been plenty of time later for photo ops if DeOrr hadn't disappeared.
JMO

BBM - That is my thought on the photo "issue". They hadn't really gotten started on their camping weekend yet when he disappeared. They arrived late Thursday evening, slept, got up and did whatever morning things they did before needing to run into town. IMO, The real "vacation" part of the trip would have just gotten started when they got back to the campsite and got settled in for the weekend. That's when the phone or camera would come out and picture taking would begin.

Also wasn't it said someplace that one of them needed to buy a cell phone charger while at the store? Or did I just dream that?

 

[iluvmua]

Here is my theory: Either IR is covering for JM/DK or JM/DK are covering for him.

jmo

 

[ClaireNC]

Here is my theory: Either IR is covering for JM/DK or JM/DK are covering for him.

jmo

Why would JM/DK cover for him???

 

[ILOKAL]

BBM - That is my thought on the photo "issue". They hadn't really gotten started on their camping weekend yet when he disappeared. They arrived late Thursday evening, slept, got up and did whatever morning things they did before needing to run into town. IMO, The real "vacation" part of the trip would have just gotten started when they got back to the campsite and got settled in for the weekend. That's when the phone or camera would come out and picture taking would begin.

Also wasn't it said someplace that one of them needed to buy a cell phone charger while at the store? Or did I just dream that?

And to add to that, what's more important, spending that special time with your little boy and his great-grandpa, or taking photos willy-nilly to "show" to others. I dread the day when smell-photos hit the market.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I went away for a few days with 7 friends recently, all my age (40ish), all female.

2 took no photos at all
3 took less than 10
2 took about 40-50
1 took over 100

I've known these girls for years and it's always been the same, some take loads of pics, some not so much.

My point is - everyone is different and we can't read too much into Jessica's photos of the trip. We don't even actually know if she did or didn't take any, there could be dozens of pics on her camera/phone that we don't know about.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

The only possible thing that may make me a bit suspicious or dig a little deeper would be for example a phone with hundreds of pictures going back months without a day of no pictures
but on the last day or two before something bad happening, there are none.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

The only possible thing that may make me a bit suspicious or dig a little deeper would be for example a phone with hundreds of pictures going back months without a day of no pictures
but on the last day or two before something bad happening, there are none.

Exactly! Until we know how many pics she normally took, we can't possibly speculate whether there was anything unusual that day.

 

[4senthia]

In my opinion, it would have been normal for a woman who already had a social media proclivity to take pictures of her son and post them online.
And that's just:moo:

 

[ILOKAL]

The only possible thing that may make me a bit suspicious or dig a little deeper would be for example a phone with hundreds of pictures going back months without a day of no pictures
but on the last day or two before something bad happening, there are none.

Well then, that should rule out any concern over a possible lack of pictures for that one day, no? JM and DK haven't posted a FB picture every day, have they, for the prior two years?

 

[pepelepolecat]

Here is my theory: Either IR is covering for JM/DK or JM/DK are covering for him.

jmo

Except I can't for the life of me imagine any parents under any circumstances covering for a virtually unknown third party who deliberately or accidentally hurt their child.

*moo*

 

[4senthia]

I think it was abnormal that the correct timeline including arrival wasn't given out for a long time, if I recall correctly.
That was unthinkable if DeOrr was abducted, which I no longer think he was.
JMHO

 

[ILOKAL]

I think it was abnormal that the correct timeline including arrival wasn't given out for a long time, if I recall correctly.
That was unthinkable if DeOrr was abducted, which I no longer think he was.
JMHO

From what SB said, it doesn't sound like JM and DK were responsible for the arrival day confusion.

 

[Dee10]

From what SB said, it doesn't sound like JM and DK were responsible for the arrival day confusion.

What did he say to make you think that? I recall him saying through the course of the investigation they arrived Thursday night and didn't say how or by who. Nate stated he got info. from police that it was Friday when they arrived.