ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #24

[Dee10]

From Day 1 info has been withheld and distorted by the parents. Their very first story is simply not believable - we are out in the wilderness, with poor cell coverage and a 45 minute drive to civilization, but we're going to "explore" without our 2 year old who is probably the most curious to explore than any of them, and we're going to leave the 2 year old with his elderly great grandpa who is oxygen dependent and in "poor health", and oh, our campsite is just yards from a steep embankment at the bottom of which is a creek, and great grandpa couldn't possibly catch him if he took off in that direction. Oh, we also didn't make absolutely certain that grandpa knew he was in charge of the two year old, because what could go wrong in that scenario?

Responsible parents do not do that. When you're in a new place with a toddler you're hyper-vigilant.

You don't do interviews in which you lavish praise on the searchers who haven't actually found the kid yet. Yes, thanking them for their efforts is appropriate but not gushing on and on about how amazing they are. They can't be that amazing if the boy is still missing.

They actively rejected efforts to help them, including Vilt offering up $20K of his own money as a reward. Seriously?! Who turns down that kind of assistance? Oh, I know...someone who already knows where the child is, that's who.

They declined to talk to the media because they didn't want their words twisted - BS. They didn't want it to be so damn obvious that they couldn't keep their stories straight.

They let his eye color go uncorrected on the missing poster for MONTHS.

They have angrily reacted publicly to the accusations that they know more than they're saying, but the local law enforcement agency, the FBI, and two private investigators have come to the conclusion that they are lying.

None of their actions since he disappeared have been geared towards finding him, but many of their actions have been geared towards preventing him being found.

There's nothing about them that is NOT suspicious, in my opinion. I think even their loyal families have begun to doubt their innocence, despite their statements of total belief in them.

Thank you, your whole post is, it is succulently put & brilliantly layout (hint to a prosecutor). The line that I bolded, to me is hopefully a no-brainier to a potential jury.

Also, just throwing it out there, we can read the news & form an opinion. Judgement happens in court rooms.

 

[courtneyb]

From Day 1 info has been withheld and distorted by the parents. Their very first story is simply not believable - we are out in the wilderness, with poor cell coverage and a 45 minute drive to civilization, but we're going to "explore" without our 2 year old who is probably the most curious to explore than any of them, and we're going to leave the 2 year old with his elderly great grandpa who is oxygen dependent and in "poor health", and oh, our campsite is just yards from a steep embankment at the bottom of which is a creek, and great grandpa couldn't possibly catch him if he took off in that direction. Oh, we also didn't make absolutely certain that grandpa knew he was in charge of the two year old, because what could go wrong in that scenario?

Responsible parents do not do that. When you're in a new place with a toddler you're hyper-vigilant.

You don't do interviews in which you lavish praise on the searchers who haven't actually found the kid yet. Yes, thanking them for their efforts is appropriate but not gushing on and on about how amazing they are. They can't be that amazing if the boy is still missing.

They actively rejected efforts to help them, including Vilt offering up $20K of his own money as a reward. Seriously?! Who turns down that kind of assistance? Oh, I know...someone who already knows where the child is, that's who.

They declined to talk to the media because they didn't want their words twisted - BS. They didn't want it to be so damn obvious that they couldn't keep their stories straight.

They let his eye color go uncorrected on the missing poster for MONTHS.

They have angrily reacted publicly to the accusations that they know more than they're saying, but the local law enforcement agency, the FBI, and two private investigators have come to the conclusion that they are lying.

None of their actions since he disappeared have been geared towards finding him, but many of their actions have been geared towards preventing him being found.

There's nothing about them that is NOT suspicious, in my opinion. I think even their loyal families have begun to doubt their innocence, despite their statements of total belief in them.

I really believe that JM is the one who didn't want to speak with the media. Probably because she couldn't keep VDK telling the same story twice. This seems likely to me because it is apparent VDK thinks he is adept at explaining things away and keeps embellishing things and trying to divert attention by placing emphasis on points that are largely irrelevant.

I agree with everything you posted, as I have come to know over the past couple years that I usually will. I appreciate your direct, yet level headed explanations. [emoji4]


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[DexterMorgan]

It seems like we all want justice for baby Deorr. So I will root for the possible hidden adoption theory for now. Jmo.

But since phone or Internet records would have supported this by now; Then I doubt a hidden adoption took place. Jmo

 

[Tr.]

Today is Mother's Day in the UK - I can't stop thinking about little DeOrr :baby:

Happy Mums Day to UK Moms

 

[neesaki]

I haven't lived in Eastern Idaho for a few years so I can't say what it's like in the community in real life, but I have followed the media and SM regarding DeOrr and I think it would be difficult to get a jury for a trial, especially in Salmon (Lemhi County seat).

I understand this is especially difficult in high profile cases all over. I don't think the Framers anticipated Facebook. :laughing:

What? Are you serious? :hills:

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

What? Are you serious? :hills:

The Framers of the Constitution?

 

[neesaki]

]When I think about his body being buried out there alone in the wilderness, it seems so macabre like a Steven King novel. [/B]And I wonder if the parents forgot - left some bit of evidence with him - that haunts them, makes them bolt awake at night knowing that when his body is found, it will tell the tale of his death.

Similar to how Scott Peterson felt when his baby washed ashore.

Re: bolded, Yes, this is so heartbreaking. And you're right, it is much to much like a Stephen King novel. :cry:

 

[Tr.]

Oh, we also didn't make absolutely certain that grandpa knew he was in charge of the two year old, because what could go wrong in that scenario?

Let's not forget it was Lil' Deorr's nap time. -per VDK . "He usually takes his nap about two o'clock." So, why walk off instead of laying him down first and waiting for him to fall asleep? Why only one diaper mentioned? Toddlers that age go through em'.
There's just a host of lies, half-truths, almost partial truths, and most of all misdirection in this case.
I probably haven't looked at this case as long as you as I only took interest in January. But I remember hearing the initial news reports back in July. People I know heard them so word got around. Thinking back to that moment and my first impression, it was..."they're lying" because of the "gone not even 20 min", "looked back, looked back", and left w/ grandpa bs.
Then later I caved to the theory of Deorr wandering off and a possible animal attack..etc..because it's true that some animals see little kids as food and also because that's how it was being reported and searchers were searching in that manner.
But after digging in here at WS and following the discussions, seeing the interviews, and considering the info from SB and Klein it all became more clear step by step.
I believe JM loved/ loves her son. If pictures tell a story then I believe that's true. She's not evil or sinister.imo. At the same time there's something cold and steely about her that let's her go along with VDK's psychotic plan of covering up Deorr's death and what I believe will ultimately turn out to be Involuntary Manslaughter. I wonder what she understands the truth to be as to cause of death...and if we heard it would we know or believe it.
So imo the only way to know the truth is to find the remains and hope that the evidence is there. VDK won't talk .imo and I think VDK knows what Deorr's remains will show and his biggest fear is that we will find them and that alone explains his cyoa behavior.
This isn't that complicated anymore..at least in my thinking of it.
I think Kleins strategy to get JM's family to make her talk almost worked..maybe it still can..idk...i doubt it.

 

[Blue Skies]

Just to clarify - Browning/JM/VDK didn't hire Klein, Dennis DeOrr Knuz, Vernal's father, hired Klein.

No one is feeling sorry for JM but if she was terminated from her employment due to Klein running his mouth about her being child killer, then Klein is in the wrong.

Seriously? Even if she IS a child killer?

 

[TeaTime]

Is it strange that there was only one dirty diaper for all of Thursday night through Friday afternoon? Hmmm.

 

[Karinna]

Seriously? Even if she IS a child killer?

Where has it been proven beyond reasonable doubt that she in fact did kill her child? Sorry but i haven't seen it yet.
And if they are covering an accident because of negligence or whatever, then that still doesn't make them guilty of killing their child, but makes them guilty of a different type of crime.

 

[Karinna]

Is it strange that there was only one dirty diaper for all of Thursday night through Friday afternoon? Hmmm.

In my view Deorr wasn't an infant and some toddlers can use a toilet at 2 yrs. of age. That is usually around when they start being potty trained at 2 yrs. old.

 

[MBK]

http://www.med.umich.edu/yourchild/topics/toilet.htm

The physical maturity and readiness skills needed for successful toilet learning appear at the same time in girls and boys-between 18 and 30 months of age. The average age for girls to be toilet trained is 29 months, and for boys it's 31 months. Keep in mind that these are averages. Ninety-eight percent of kids are trained by 36 months of age.

We really don't know, but statistically, boys are toilet trained at a slightly later age than girls. Of course, it stands to reason that being in a strange place, with a very strange potty . . . that mom would have wanted to bring plenty of diapers. Seems to me that there would have been one soiled diaper left from the long car ride, one from overnight, at the very least . . .

 

[PainExpress]

It's camping. No need for nappies (diapers ) except at night.

Kids can just pee on the ground or on a tree or in the creek or against the truck tyre etc.

 

[pomegranate]

It's camping. No need for nappies (diapers ) except at night.

Kids can just pee on the ground or on a tree or in the creek or against the truck tyre etc.

It doesn't work that way unless the child doesn't need diapers to begin with. If a child isn't potty trained, that means they are used to peeing in a diaper. I don't think that a child who pees in his or her pants is capable of choosing to pee on the ground or on a tree. So it would all depend on what stage of potty training he had reached.

 

[Karinna]

Deorr went missing in July which would of made him almost 31 months old if his birthday was in December. I would imagine at that age he would of had some control over his bodily functions by then and able to let his parents know if he needed to go to the potty/toilet? At that age i would think nightime diapers but not so much during the day.
All children are different when it comes to toilet training and it's not recommended to try them before 18 mnths. of age.

 

[12madelyn]

this^^^^^

Ditto! It was that Nate Eaton interview where she was holding the blanket that I knew they were guilty. He was bouncing off the walls saying stupid stuff - "I went hauling down the road cuz I didn't think one bar was gonna get it and by the grace of God she got through with only one bar" and he says they called 911 at 1:26 and she very meekly corrects him that it was 1:36. And, as you said, over the top praise of the searchers. I mean who gives a shyte about details of bars on a cell phone and the exact moment they called 911 They're supposed to be distraught and crying.
And she's a total piece of work. Pretending to be grieving, but all she accomplishes is looking pissed off, not at all bereaved. And, of course, never has she shed one tear. Pieces of work.

 

[giagreen]

Is it strange that there was only one dirty diaper for all of Thursday night through Friday afternoon? Hmmm.

Not really. If they got there at nine and changed him then that would be that dirty diaper. So that kinda makes me think something happen that night or morning tho.

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[MzOpinion8d]

Thanks to all who gave me positive feedback on my rant post from last night. I woke up this morning afraid maybe I'd run off at the mouth a bit much. For some reason, this case and little Cooper Harris' hot car death have me much more emotionally invested than I probably should be. I want justice for them both.

 

[pepelepolecat]

Is it strange that there was only one dirty diaper for all of Thursday night through Friday afternoon? Hmmm.

I'm of two minds about this. If he were potty training, maybe not. Potty training kids might only wear diapers at night (also, potty training kids are at a really high risk of being victims of violence). Or ... maybe there were more diapers, but they just weren't mentioned.