ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - # 25

[LietKynes]

Marking my spot.. Hoping warm weather/thawing comes quickly.
I believe there will be answers, and there many who haven't given up on baby DeOrr Jr., for that I'm thankful.

 

[Jackeee]

I think he is a little off in the head. If you read his termination letter to the family it's clear he leans towards something with a less happy ending.

I don't think IR has given us anything terribly useful. His famous naked interview was only slightly less informative than his fully clothed sit down with Eaton. Now I understand at that time he had a lawyer and possibly also was under the advice of LE to not say much but he really gave little substantial information . He doesn't ever say "I saw Deorr alive and well". I don't have the transcript handy but I remember thinking nothing of real substance came out of that interview. Not to pick on the local buy but Eaton is a terrible interviewer. He embeds answers in his questions, leads, doesn't probe, and asks compound questions. I would love to see what a real interviewer would have done to VDK during his famous day 3 interview.

Yowza!

 

[bessie]

The sheriff is running this case while the dad paid fed taxes while working; Which should mandate the feds to be responsible as well . Jmo

Now please remember. Our Irs taxes help pay the fbi. So if your kid goes missing and you are a irs tax payer.

Shouldn't you have the choice of making sure the fbi helps you out and takes over the case ; regardless of state or fed jurisdiction? Jmo.

In 2014, the Justice Department appropriated $2.3 billion to subsidize state, local and tribal law enforcement programs.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/jmd/legacy/2013/09/01/state-local.pdf

 

[kammiemc]

I think he is a little off in the head. If you read his termination letter to the family it's clear he leans towards something with a less happy ending.

I don't think IR has given us anything terribly useful. His famous naked interview was only slightly less informative than his fully clothed sit down with Eaton. Now I understand at that time he had a lawyer and possibly also was under the advice of LE to not say much but he really gave little substantial information . He doesn't ever say "I saw Deorr alive and well". I don't have the transcript handy but I remember thinking nothing of real substance came out of that interview. Not to pick on the local buy but Eaton is a terrible interviewer. He embeds answers in his questions, leads, doesn't probe, and asks compound questions. I would love to see what a real interviewer would have done to VDK during his famous day 3 interview.

So the funny thing about Vilt's adoption theory is that it was based on the fact that Utah adoption laws allow a woman to adopt out a child legally without the bio dad's consent.

But why would JM quietly go through a legal adoption process only to create a huge illegal hoopla by staging DeOrr's disappearance?

And if JM had pulled the wool over DK's eyes and adopted their son out in Utah, why would he be a lying fool on his poly's?

IMO, Vilt's theory has more holes than a sieve.




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[haven71]

Does anyone know how long Deorr's first marriage lasted? Did he have any stepchildren?

 

[The Apparition]

LOL.yea, Eaton is pretty bad. Especially with the very first one with the parents where she is holding the blanket. Ugh..VDK ran that show.

But I don't see anything "off" about Vilt's letter. He probably didn't major in English, but I think it's intelligently written. As for IR, yes I certainly discount the "naked" interview. But with the sit-down with NE, he came across as almost child-like. He likes to fix bikes, he likes to help people, etc. I just see him as a good and gentle soul who was earnestly trying to help as much as he could. The only thing substantive that came out of the interview was that he confirmed he saw DeOrr at the cg. But's that's very important info. And, as far as being coached, I don't think he would be a good candidate for remembering scripted answers. He wasn't really comprehending what he should or shouldn't answer. Vilt just seems to think JM doesn't want kids. I don't think she's fighting over her other two and Vilt said she had her tubes tied, so she obviously doesn't want to get pregnant again. I dunno. A lot of theories floating around and I didn't think his was far-fetched. Just a thought.

I think we are mostly in agreement. Vilt's letter is fine a fun read, I think he's off because he thought JM might have adopted Deorr out from under VDK's nose on the low-low up in the mountains. That theory is about 85th on my list, it comes in just behind a barren but loving bigfoot couple stole Deorr to raise as their own.

I have no problems with IR he seems like a fine enough guy. I don't blame him that he couldn't say much during the interview, I just thought more would come out of it. Once again too lazy to look it up but did HE ever say HE saw Deorr alive at the campground? Eaton bless his soul has a habit of telling people the answer in the guise of a question "so Deorr was with you and GGP right". The more reluctant someone is to speak or just plain malleable, the more likely they will "parrot" answers back or just agree.

 

[gliving]

LOL.yea, Eaton is pretty bad. Especially with the very first one with the parents where she is holding the blanket. Ugh..VDK ran that show.

Snipped and agreed.

I don't think Nate is so bad. He opens the interview by asking them "take us back, what happened that day?" To which Vernal proceeds to give his very lengthy account. Nate gives him full rein to describe the events of the day. It's a really good capture of both parents.

 

[gliving]

August 18th, 2015

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/08/lemhi-sheriff-opens-up-about-deorr-kunz-case/
sbm

"Early in the investigation, there were conflicting reports about when the family arrived at the Timber Creek Campground in Leadore. Authorities had said the group arrived Friday, July 10, but Bowerman said the group actually arrived late on Thursday, July 9. The next morning, DeOrr’s parents said they took their son to a store about 20 minutes from the campsite.

“I don’t believe the store has a surveillance (system), but we have a receipt that shows they purchased certain items,” Bowerman said. “The time was stamped on the receipt, so we believe that’s where they went.”

When asked if the family was anywhere else during the trip, Bowerman said they stopped for diesel fuel traveling from Idaho Falls to Leadore, but the gas station doesn’t have surveillance video either."

I want to know about the diesel fuel purchase. SB pretty much says they filled up a vehicle. He says they stopped for fuel. So, were they driving Vernal's grey truck? Does he still own it?

 

[cujenn81]

I'm going to call this OT: Interesting website.
Thats a very specific interpretation that I would say not all agree with, including myself.
It also says
"Americans are facing the stark reality that their Constitutional rights have been canceled. The Homegrown Terrorism Bill is only the latest evidence of the direction of government. Nearly every action taken by the Federal government today violates the Constitution and it is that document that sheriffs and the military take an oath to defend.

Might want to talk to some Oregonians to see if they agree with this .

The constitution, in its original framework, was solely designed to limit the powers of each branch of government. This provided a system of checks and balances and is the only way this country would remain truly "free" from its government. However, in today's world, Congress does not quite operate in the same way the framers had intended (nor does the Supreme Court, for that matter). So much power has been delegated to an ever expanding and overreaching government that rules and regulations are being enacted at such a rapid pace that we couldn't possibly keep up with them all.

The federal government, which was to operate with few defined grants of power, (to quote Mark Levin) "is now our nation's largest creditor, debtor, lender, employer, consumer, contractor, grantor, property owner, tenant, insurer, health-care provider, and pension guarantor. Moreover, with aggrandized police powers, what it does not control directly it bans or mandates by regulation. For example, the federal government regulates most things in your bathroom, laundry room, and kitchen, as well as the mortgage you hold on your house. It designs your automobile and dictates the kind of fuel it uses. It regulates your baby's toys, crib, and stroller; plans your children's school curriculum and lunch menu; and administers their student loans in college. At your place of employment, the federal government oversees everything from the racial, gender, and age diversity of the workforce to the hours, wages, and benefits paid. Indeed, the question is not what the federal government regulates, but what it does not."

James Madison wrote in Federalist 45, "the general government is not to be charged with the whole power of making and administering laws: its jurisdiction is limited to certain enumerated objects, which concern all members of the republic, but which are not to be attained by the separate provisions of any."

So, technically, the constitution is written such that the state should and does have legal jurisdiction over its citizens, but I feel like they often cave under pressure to resolve the case and ask the FBI to come in and take over. That's also why the FBI often says they'll only step in if they are asked to (unless, of course, a federal crime has been committed or if the criminal act crosses state lines, which would then make it a federal issue).

 

[La Louve]

Has anyone in their sleuthing of the parents come across any anti-vaxxer rhetoric or posts?

Just read this article and it made me wonder about little DeOrr. https://www.yahoo.com/news/toddler-dies-anti-vaxxer-parents-154300579.html

 

[kammiemc]

Has anyone in their sleuthing of the parents come across any anti-vaxxer rhetoric or posts?

Just read this article and it made me wonder about little DeOrr. https://www.yahoo.com/news/toddler-dies-anti-vaxxer-parents-154300579.html

Never! At least not yet!


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[Tr.]

The more reluctant someone is to speak or just plain malleable, the more likely they will "parrot" answers back or just agree.

Seemed like he realized that IR wasn't going to come off of much info so he was trying to get him to divulge something/anything even if it meant by parroting.
It would have been great to see more interviews by interested parties but I guess we take what we can get.

 

[Beezneez]

I think we are mostly in agreement. Vilt's letter is fine a fun read, I think he's off because he thought JM might have adopted Deorr out from under VDK's nose on the low-low up in the mountains. That theory is about 85th on my list, it comes in just behind a barren but loving bigfoot couple stole Deorr to raise as their own.

I have no problems with IR he seems like a fine enough guy. I don't blame him that he couldn't say much during the interview, I just thought more would come out of it. Once again too lazy to look it up but did HE ever say HE saw Deorr alive at the campground? Eaton bless his soul has a habit of telling people the answer in the guise of a question "so Deorr was with you and GGP right". The more reluctant someone is to speak or just plain malleable, the more likely they will "parrot" answers back or just agree.

So Vilt is 85th? On a scale of 100? Where do you rank the mountain lions? (Sorry- we've all got some comeuppance if that is what actually happened. Dear lord!)
I actually considered the theory that this little one was an imaginary child created to disappear solely to promote EIN/NE on a national news level. It was maybe 2 days after EIN was created that Deorr went missing. Who has benefitted the most from this? Aside from goodwill towards SB, it is NE. He's been on Nancy Grace, he's milked this for all its worth. Admittedly Deorr is a real little one & he really is gone, that theory is totally in line with the overall crazy level of the whole situation.

 

[Beezneez]

Has anyone in their sleuthing of the parents come across any anti-vaxxer rhetoric or posts?

Just read this article and it made me wonder about little DeOrr. https://www.yahoo.com/news/toddler-dies-anti-vaxxer-parents-154300579.html

Oh wow. Poor kid. It really takes all kinds. Anti-vaxxers are usually pretty loud about their opinion. SB could've been fishing for odd medical beliefs & treatments when he asked for witnesses of interactions between Deorr & JM/DK or things they may have shared with friends & family. There are a lot of antivaxxers here, I think ID is #1 in the US for vaccine exceptions at kindergarten registration (I don't know my source, but I'm a nurse & educator, it is something I read from some peer reviewed journal at some health fair last flu season). DoTerra salespeople touting the miracles of plant oils as a miraculous cure-all are also a frequent encounter. I'm just fine with a little lavender in my bath, but others take things to another level.
It's always fun trying to explain to a parent that their child is being admitted because they cannot breathe without help, because they as the parents don't believe in shots.

 

[Tr.]

Snipped and agreed.

I don't think Nate is so bad. He opens the interview by asking them "take us back, what happened that day?" To which Vernal proceeds to give his very lengthy account. Nate gives him full rein to describe the events of the day. It's a really good capture of both parents.

Totally agree. And at that time the parents were not suspects so the interview was not geared toward punching holes in their story. It was designed to hear their story...and what a story it was imo.

I'm just going to throw this in to this post;
I too have confidence in LE and their ability to handle this case properly. Just as I do the other agencies handling all of the missing children cases in this country, some of which are years and decades old with no body recovery and in many cases no arrest. I'm sure those cases are being handled properly (by the book) but in many cases with little in the way of results.

Hopefully, in this case SB will embrace the willingness of third party entities and utilize their resources if need be to help accomplish his search goals while maintaining the integrity of his investigation. I believe this is easily achievable if everyone is truly working towards one common goal..finding Deorr and/or relative evidence.

With that said, I wonder if VDK and JM did some last minute ditching of evidence in or around the camp...something that maybe IR has alluded to. And maybe that's what was possibly over-looked if they are in fact searching the campsite area again.

 

[desert-blue]

August 18th, 2015

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/08/lemhi-sheriff-opens-up-about-deorr-kunz-case/
sbm

"Early in the investigation, there were conflicting reports about when the family arrived at the Timber Creek Campground in Leadore. Authorities had said the group arrived Friday, July 10, but Bowerman said the group actually arrived late on Thursday, July 9. The next morning, DeOrr’s parents said they took their son to a store about 20 minutes from the campsite.

“I don’t believe the store has a surveillance (system), but we have a receipt that shows they purchased certain items,” Bowerman said. “The time was stamped on the receipt, so we believe that’s where they went.”

When asked if the family was anywhere else during the trip, Bowerman said they stopped for diesel fuel traveling from Idaho Falls to Leadore, but the gas station doesn’t have surveillance video either."

I want to know about the diesel fuel purchase. SB pretty much says they filled up a vehicle. He says they stopped for fuel. So, were they driving Vernal's grey truck? Does he still own it?

I'm curious about the diesel stop as well. I thought they were supposedly driving a black truck, but perhaps they were in a gray truck? I wonder which one uses diesel?

It's also interesting that the stop at the Silver Dollar was omitted.

 

[sirensong]

I just wanted to jump in and say I find it very unusual that IR, as far as we know, is still a POI, but after a couple of interviews, no longer needs an attorney. I don't have the link, but it was just said recently. He claims he saw the baby when his parents got back from the store around one on Friday, but many believe the baby was never there. I am also confused by the 2 different stories that he was with GGP when they were supposed to be watching the baby, but I swear I also heard him say he was down by the water not far from the parents. These are a few things bouncing around in my mind, especially him not needing an attorney anymore? Say what? Why?

 

[Arnie M]

I just wanted to jump in and say I find it very unusual that IR, as far as we know, is still a POI, but after a couple of interviews, no longer needs an attorney. I don't have the link, but it was just said recently. He claims he saw the baby when his parents got back from the store around one on Friday, but many believe the baby was never there. I am also confused by the 2 different stories that he was with GGP when they were supposed to be watching the baby, but I swear I also heard him say he was down by the water not far from the parents. These are a few things bouncing around in my mind, especially him not needing an attorney anymore? Say what? Why?

.

Original story .... (the sheriff being interviewed)

--- back from the store trip (1:00 pm) ..... IR tells VDK he had seen some fish in the creek
--- VDK then asked IR to show him .... so JM VDK and IR headed down to the creek
--- DeOrr stayed with GGF
--- VDK and JM went on to explore other areas for 20 minutes or so , and IR went off by himself to a different part of the creek
--- then VDK said he saw some minnows and went back to the campsite to get DeOrr to show him , but the boy was missing.
--- GGF said he looked away for a few seconds , the boy was gone , and assumed he went to parents
--- they searched for the boy but could not find him and called 911 around 2:30 pm.

Listen from 4:20 to 5:50 http://www.truecrimeradio.com/radio...d-bowerman-john-kelly-radio-archive-oct-2015/

 

[Jamaica Me Crazy]

I'm curious about the diesel stop as well. I thought they were supposedly driving a black truck, but perhaps they were in a gray truck? I wonder which one uses diesel?

It's also interesting that the stop at the Silver Dollar was omitted.

The Silver Dollar has been mentioned a lot but I can't recall how we know about it. Was it mentioned by name by LE or the PIs or is it just assumed that they went there to get (or tried to get) something to eat?

ETA: Rebecca Cox, the owner of the SD was interviewed early in the case but she never said the family was there.

 

[Gibbs]

.

Original story .... (the sheriff being interviewed)

--- back from the store trip (1:00 pm) ..... IR tells VDK he had seen some fish in the creek
--- VDK then asked IR to show him .... so JM VDK and IR headed down to the creek
--- DeOrr stayed with GGF
--- VDK and JM went on to explore other areas for 20 minutes or so , and IR went off by himself to a different part of the creek
--- then VDK said he saw some minnows and went back to the campsite to get DeOrr to show him , but the boy was missing.
--- GGF said he looked away for a few seconds , the boy was gone , and assumed he went to parents
--- they searched for the boy but could not find him and called 911 around 2:30 pm.

Listen from 4:20 to 5:50 http://www.truecrimeradio.com/radio...d-bowerman-john-kelly-radio-archive-oct-2015/

So in this version of events, the parents state Deorr was with GGF/GGP and even he admits he was in charge of Deorr and went missing on his watch, correct?

Since LE has said the parents can't tell the same story twice, I'm wondering about GGP. Did he actually admit to being in charge of Deorr, looking away and he was gone or is this statement just a reflection of what JM and VDK said?