ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #28

[katydid23]

Ok, do we know what kind of dogs?

If one was part of lil DeOrr's family, it is hard to believe the dog would not have followed him. Every dog I have had, or known, that had a toddler in the family, kind of claimed protector role, in terms of the child. If a toddler wandered away from a yard or a camp site, I'd think most dogs would have followed and/or barked at him. And at the very least my dogs would have been able to sniff him out at the start when everyone was first looking for him. At least they would go in the general direction at the beginning.


ETA: OK, so I Imagine that the dog may have followed the parents on their lil adventure. Or it was tied up. But even so, wouldn't it have been able to sniff out the initial path of the child?

 

[KatieLiz]

Yes, you're correct. I believe Sheriff Bowerman said that an older couple was camping at the upper campground near the reservoir, which is about .4 mile from the lower campground. At some point, their adult children came and camped also. I would assume one or more of them would have heard a gunshot if they were around at the time.

So did this older couple hear the commotion surrounding the moments the family discovered Deorr missing? Did it catch their attention to see these people assumingly frantic searching for a child? Or were they not aware until emergency vehicles began to arrive? Did VDK go check the reservoir and speak to these people in the time before or after 911 was called? You would think if they were the only other humans in the vicinity they would hear the panicked shrieks of parents discovering their child has vanished and frantically running and screaming Deorr's name (assuming VDK and JM could speak his name then...)

 

[neesaki]

So did this older couple hear the commotion surrounding the moments the family discovered Deorr missing? Did it catch their attention to see these people assumingly frantic searching for a child? Or were they not aware until emergency vehicles began to arrive? Did VDK go check the reservoir and speak to these people in the time before or after 911 was called? You would think if they were the only other humans in the vicinity they would hear the panicked shrieks of parents discovering their child has vanished and frantically running and screaming Deorr's name (assuming VDK and JM could speak his name then...)

Oh yes, they would have heard me from miles away if my child had disappeared. And I wouldn't have shut up until he was found. And God forbid the person that gets between me and my baby. Between me and my dog baby, for that matter. What does that say about parents who don't protect their own children? Parents like that are nothing. They don't deserve to exist. JMO

 

[neesaki]

Come On Klein, it's time to step it up. Go for it !

 

[Jackeee]

Come On Klein, it's time to step it up. Go for it !

Giddy Up!

 

[katydid23]

So did this older couple hear the commotion surrounding the moments the family discovered Deorr missing? Did it catch their attention to see these people assumingly frantic searching for a child? Or were they not aware until emergency vehicles began to arrive? Did VDK go check the reservoir and speak to these people in the time before or after 911 was called? You would think if they were the only other humans in the vicinity they would hear the panicked shrieks of parents discovering their child has vanished and frantically running and screaming Deorr's name (assuming VDK and JM could speak his name then...)

And wouldn't one of them have gone up to those campsites asking any other campers if they had seen the baby? I would have scoped out who else was in the surrounding sites first thing, after looking in the river.

 

[katydid23]

This is really simple, and maybe trivial. But it kind of hit me today. GGP has said that the last time he saw the baby, he was heading down the bank towards the water. So did they go look at the creek first thing? Because I always think of Dad speeding up the road, in his truck, trying to duplicate the call to LE. Wouldn't he be glued down to the river and then to the main reservoir where it spills out? I'd let my wife go call and I would be solely focused on the last place the baby was headed. JMO

 

[CHUCKJ]

Maybe it was this: "I hate camping." Kunz tells PEOPLE in an exclusive interview. "I was looking for any and every excuse to leave."

http://www.people.com/article/deorr-kunz-jessica-mitchell-speak-out-idaho-mountains

thanks, that is correct. JMA also says he doesn't like fishing. as for IR, the last interview, he makes referance to things he can not say, and the reporter says "because they will come out at trial" and IR responds exactly.

 

[Deleted member 278]

a few things which we have not heard about lately...
the four or five areas that LE was going to excavate.
the jacket and cars found at the parents old house.

is there anything else we are waiting on?

 

[Onebest]

This is really simple, and maybe trivial. But it kind of hit me today. GGP has said that the last time he saw the baby, he was heading down the bank towards the water. So did they go look at the creek first thing? Because I always think of Dad speeding up the road, in his truck, trying to duplicate the call to LE. Wouldn't he be glued down to the river and then to the main reservoir where it spills out? I'd let my wife go call and I would be solely focused on the last place the baby was headed. JMO

Go back and read earlier threads maybe? It will give you a lot of the pieces you are asking about. Also, Remember many things that VK stated such as hauling up the road rendition, probably never happened and who knows if GGP actually saw that either. JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

OT but Important

For any members who have not seen Tricia's announcement at the top of this page, and the thread about our dear Bessie here:

Bessie has given her all to this website. We need Bessie and right now Bessie needs us !!

Whatever help any of us can give is so needed and will be so very appreciated.

 

[neesaki]

Here we have a precious 2 1/2 y/o toddler boy, his name is Deorr Kunz, Jr. .... Yes, Jessica Mitchell aka Anderson (wow, that was fast) and Vernal Deorr Kunz........... that is / was his correct age at the time he mysteriously disappeared under your watch. And btw, JMA and VDK did you ever bother to educate yourself ever so slightly regarding child development ? Why not, you had children, didn't you ? Well, just to let you in on a little secret, children are not the same as an adults. There are actually very significant differences, one being, that they are not "little men". And that's only the beginning, small toddler size children take a great deal of care, don't they? But then I bet you experienced that didn't you? Question: Did you resent it ?

So moving on, according to little Deorr's own parents, he mysteriously just disappeared with no common sense explanation, whatsoever. A lot of strange stories, a lot of deviations from strange stories, but never anything that could explain the disappearance of little Deorr Kunz, Jr. ..... their own child.

What is even stranger, is that little Deorr Kunz Jr.'s parents haven't been looking or searching for him. I wonder why that is? Instead, if anything, it seems that they have not only forgotten him, but have just nonchalantly moved on with their lives. How could a parent of a missing child do that ? I say, How?

What I want to know now, is what you, JMA and VDK (yes, you know who you are) would say to little Deorr when you see him in your dreams. Or, when you see him in your nightmares.
And what about the afterlife? What then will you say when you see him?

This little boy needs to be found, to Sheriff Bowerman, an update, something? The voice of this child is calling, his name is Deorr.

To Klein Investigations, if you don't want to give us an update, then please, just post another video snippet or two. We would really appreciate it. The voice of this child is calling, his name is Deorr.

And to Mr. Frank Vilt, I personally appreciate all the work you did on this case. Forget about any criticism, it doesn't matter, your work was invaluable.... And what matters is the victim, and the voice of this child is calling, his name is Deorr. JMO

 

[Dee10]

Nessaki you are so kind hearted and I appreciate following these heart-breaking cases here!

Regarding your wish on a Sheriff Bowerman update; hopefully it won't happen . I say this because it seems LE only comes out IMO if it suites whatever information they need from the public, otherwise they stay "Mum". I have seen this time after time, but it is MO. I believe Klein implies this injuncture is the late stages of the investigation and the prosecution end of things (I believe). If the is true, I don't think we will hear anything at all from LE until an arrest. No news (interviews) from them at this point is good news or perhaps conformation (one can hope) as I wouldn't think it was an unsolvable case? JMO.

 

[CHUCKJ]

Nessaki you are so kind hearted and I appreciate following these heart-breaking cases here!

Regarding your wish on a Sheriff Bowerman update; hopefully it won't happen . I say this because it seems LE only comes out IMO if it suites whatever information they need from the public, otherwise they stay "Mum". I have seen this time after time, but it is MO. I believe Klein implies this injuncture is the late stages of the investigation and the prosecution end of things (I believe). If the is true, I don't think we will hear anything at all from LE until an arrest. No news (interviews) from them at this point is good news or perhaps conformation (one can hope) as I wouldn't think it was an unsolvable case? JMO.

I don't think this case us unsolvable at all. Someone will break.

JMO

IR's statements in the interviews I have watched and picked apart repeatedly, are telling to say the least.

In the interview where he is cought off guard at the door, he doesn't state, but agrees when asked that DKJ was with him and GGP when he went missing. I don't know that this is the case, just that he was half asleep and being evasive in general. I think he just wanted to get the reporter off his door step. The only truths he told in the 1st interview is that (keep in mind you have to read between the lines when he slips up) GGP brought booz, but then he tries to correct after stating clearly that GGP drank the night they showed up, he say's "Oh waite, Bob doesn't drink, he just brings it in case someone wants to have a drink." GGP was drunk as a skunk the night they showed up. IR also tied one on the night they showed up. IR also mentions "they met us there" as if they did not all drive up togeather. again not forsure, but to me he uses several phrases that imply they did not all plan to go on this trip togeather. One of the few truths I believe he states is that DKJ was playing around the fire the night they all arrived.
From IR's comments, I don't believe he ever saw DKJ the day he supposedly went missing. IR says he woke up that morning and then went back to bed until around noon. Later he states that he went to show VDK DKJ and JMA a spot he and BOB had been fishing earlier. JMA makes the call at 14:26. by this time she claims DKJ had been missing an hour. I guess he woke up at noon grabbed his pole and took off with bob to fish. At this point IPB JMA was distracting IR as not to alert him to what ever had happened to DKJ. IR says he thought VDK adn DKJ were with them, yet they never showed up. JMA walked back towards camp, and met up with VDK where they decided to go explore this other area. This is where the story and the tims or conflicting times about how long they were gone start to break down. One says they were gone 20min, another say 5 maybe 10. My question is where was VDK with DKJ before JMA walked back up and met him. Did she meet him at camp or on his way to where her and IR were fishing. By this time IR was already moving closer to camp at another fishing spot. VDK says he thought GGP was watching DKJ, but why. I have not heard anyone suggest that there was an exchange between VDK or JMA and GGP regarding DKJ. Was GGP drunk off his rocker when all this went down, asleep maybe. Did they walk off and leave DKJ there or had somthing already happened....I believe somthing already happened. Im not even sure if somthing didn't happen that prompted the trip as a cover up. IR says little Deorr was throwing things in the fire, but even looks puzzled as he's sayig it as if he has reason to believe thats the truth, but is not sure. Was he already wasted when VDK and JMA arrived. If so, was he in his tent. Did he hear VDK telling Deorr to get out of the fire or stop playign in it. Was it a ploy to give the impression the child was there. I believe they showed up much later than IR and Bob, with the intent to cover up an accident/murder. Everything after that was a ruse. In hinesigt I think IR realizes he fell for a snowjob. He and his attoruney Im sure have worked through it and are going to throw the whole clan under the bus if this thing ever gets to court.

 

[Paulas88]

I don't think this case us unsolvable at all. Someone will break.

JMO

IR's statements in the interviews I have watched and picked apart repeatedly, are telling to say the least.

In the interview where he is cought off guard at the door, he doesn't state, but agrees when asked that DKJ was with him and GGP when he went missing. I don't know that this is the case, just that he was half asleep and being evasive in general. I think he just wanted to get the reporter off his door step. The only truths he told in the 1st interview is that (keep in mind you have to read between the lines when he slips up) GGP brought booz, but then he tries to correct after stating clearly that GGP drank the night they showed up, he say's "Oh waite, Bob doesn't drink, he just brings it in case someone wants to have a drink." GGP was drunk as a skunk the night they showed up. IR also tied one on the night they showed up. IR also mentions "they met us there" as if they did not all drive up togeather. again not forsure, but to me he uses several phrases that imply they did not all plan to go on this trip togeather. One of the few truths I believe he states is that DKJ was playing around the fire the night they all arrived.
From IR's comments, I don't believe he ever saw DKJ the day he supposedly went missing. IR says he woke up that morning and then went back to bed until around noon. Later he states that he went to show VDK DKJ and JMA a spot he and BOB had been fishing earlier. JMA makes the call at 14:26. by this time she claims DKJ had been missing an hour. I guess he woke up at noon grabbed his pole and took off with bob to fish. At this point IPB JMA was distracting IR as not to alert him to what ever had happened to DKJ. IR says he thought VDK adn DKJ were with them, yet they never showed up. JMA walked back towards camp, and met up with VDK where they decided to go explore this other area. This is where the story and the tims or conflicting times about how long they were gone start to break down. One says they were gone 20min, another say 5 maybe 10. My question is where was VDK with DKJ before JMA walked back up and met him. Did she meet him at camp or on his way to where her and IR were fishing. By this time IR was already moving closer to camp at another fishing spot. VDK says he thought GGP was watching DKJ, but why. I have not heard anyone suggest that there was an exchange between VDK or JMA and GGP regarding DKJ. Was GGP drunk off his rocker when all this went down, asleep maybe. Did they walk off and leave DKJ there or had somthing already happened....I believe somthing already happened. Im not even sure if somthing didn't happen that prompted the trip as a cover up. IR says little Deorr was throwing things in the fire, but even looks puzzled as he's sayig it as if he has reason to believe thats the truth, but is not sure. Was he already wasted when VDK and JMA arrived. If so, was he in his tent. Did he hear VDK telling Deorr to get out of the fire or stop playign in it. Was it a ploy to give the impression the child was there. I believe they showed up much later than IR and Bob, with the intent to cover up an accident/murder. Everything after that was a ruse. In hinesigt I think IR realizes he fell for a snowjob. He and his attoruney Im sure have worked through it and are going to throw the whole clan under the bus if this thing ever gets to court.

Good post CHUCKJ.

 

[CHUCKJ]

Good post CHUCKJ.

IR admittedly goes off in the hills (a good distance from camp) looking for DKJ. JMA make referance to the fact that IR went missing in her estimation for over an hour while they are supposedly looking for DKJ.
She says it as if she's implying IR could have done somthing with DKJ in that hour. Hide the body or somthing. Break that down for a minute. In all the commentary from VDK and JMA, I can place them more than 50 yards from the camp looking for DKJ. To me, it sounds like IR may have been the only one really looking, while VDK and JMA kickd around the flat ground and shrubs, and made it all the way down to where the creek starts just by camp. Why would anyone have remembered if they seen anyone else for a particular length of time while they were frantically searching for their lost child? Because the werent. They were sitting around cooking up a story, or finalizing their story. It was obvious how long IR had been gone. IR says GGP was paceing up on the bank. Right where JMA had just come from. From looking at the pictures of the campsite. JMA came out of the woods within eyeshot of camp. Where did her and VDK meet up? What was GGP doing when VDK assumed he was watching DKJ. Was DKJ 2 foot from GGP. Was he 20feet from GGP. What was GGP preocupied with? The one interview with GGP and Klein, GGP can't really tell you anything. All he can tell you is that VDK and JMA couldnt, wouldn't have done anything to this child.

 

[The Apparition]

We are all in the same boat on this case, trying to glean little bits of truth from a variety of statements. I am of the mindset to ignore almost all of the camp stories because there are so many different versions and timelines. It makes the parents look guilty as hell but also is why LE has spent 1+ year investigating. I agree with ChuckJ that Jessica is trying to throw shade on Issac, someone "frantically" searching for their kid should have no idea where a non-family member is during a search such as this. I would imagine that Issac could have walked around naked singing Sweet Home Alabama during this time and parents searching for a missing toddler wouldn't have even noticed.

I believe that Issac has given the police some good testimony and they have used that to further the investigation, I also believe that he will be slaughtered on cross examination so some real proof is very important. If this case comes down to some circumstantial evidence and Issac as the star witness I won't be very confident of any convictions.

 

[CanManEh]

Im not a export on this GGP but what i can say is that going by what i seen on interviews alone he isn't walking more then 20 feet before he needs help the guy is using a heavy oxygen tank I dont think he left the camp site to look or to do anything ...

 

[renarde]

There's an interesting post on Chelsea Brentzel's Facebook (Chelsea Brentzel, KIFI KIDK).

 

[mommylicious]

Just returned from a camping trip and DeOrr was heavy on my mind the whole time. My littlest is just months older than him. I thought of DeOrr as I packed her brightly colored clothes in case she wandered (she was never out of sight). I thought of him when she asked if we could get little cars to take with us during our grocery store stock up (she NEVER plays with cars, it was odd for her to ask). I especially thought of him when a little girl wandered into our campsite yesterday morning (thankfully we were able to find her very tired but nonetheless distraught mother in short order).

I was really hoping to come home to good news. Keeping little DeOrr in my thoughts as we head into yet another weekend.