ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #6

[skinnycat]

Completely off topic and my first post, so I hope I'm not breaking any rules. These kinds of emotionally driven posts drive me crazy. Mountain Lion meat is great, so it's not all about getting a trophy. Also mountain lion populations need to be controlled just like other big game species.

Welcome, and thank you for that answer, because I was upset thinking that the hunters only killed them for the trophy and that the meat would just be thrown away. I have no issues with hunters who use what they kill, I have issues with those that just kill to kill.

 

[jmcgladr]

Completely off topic and my first post, so I hope I'm not breaking any rules. These kinds of emotionally driven posts drive me crazy. Mountain Lion meat is great, so it's not all about getting a trophy. Also mountain lion populations need to be controlled just like other big game species.

Deer are WAY more overpopulated than mountain lions, and mountain lions' primary diet is deer, so I really don't think the mountain lion population is in need of "control." Their natural habitat has already been destroyed by humans to a fairly extreme degree. Deer have become a nuisance species where I live, in part because they have no natural predators like mountain lions. I see no reason why these big cats need to be hunted, and I really don't believe you that it's about the meat.

 

[wondering25]

I wouldn't think being on oxygen 24/7 would keep him from primitive camping with family. Oxygen these days is SO portable and I see people in all walks of life with portable oxygen units. Why couldn't he camp?

All oxygen delivery is dependent on a source of electricity.. even small compressors must be recharged. The latger tanks that you might remember that are also portable last about 3 hours.. the little box type units that pull oxygen from the atmosphere still need to be charged when not plugged in after X amount of hours.. without a source for charging you cannot be in the wild for long.

 

[persimmon]

See my post above about the light blue vehicle.

As far as it wizzing by, I have not heard that. I think it was hypothetical.??

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

Early in the case, I do recall seeing people on SM mentioning a mysterious blue truck but never within any meaningful context, so I dismissed it as pure rumor or. However, I had not seen this article before today but I find it bizarre that this comment was chosen to puncuate this story. Here, the parents suspicion he was abducted provides some very limited context but little else.

What I find fascinating for numerous reasons is the mention of an unknown make or model BLACK TRUCK. I am also wondering why that comment didn't receive more notice given the fact that it actually has context and can be seen as originating from a source other than the four adults present on the camping trip. I'm literally left thinking WTH? Certainly, the writer knew of the store clerk's sighting and the fact that DeOrr Sr. drove a black truck and therefore determined that the clerk was mistaken? Regardless, the choice sas made to use the image as the final word on this mysterious search as it officially scaled back.

This is the first time I have seen another mention of a black truck. I find it meaningful and wonder why its been buried in the efforts to find DeOrr?

 

[katydid23]

Early in the case, I do recall seeing people on SM mentioning a mysterious blue truck but never within any meaningful context, so I dismissed it as pure rumor or. However, I had not seen this article before today but I find it bizarre that this comment was chosen to puncuate this story. Here, the parents suspicion he was abducted provides some very limited context but little else.

What I find fascinating for numerous reasons is the mention of an unknown make or model BLACK TRUCK. I am also wondering why that comment didn't receive more notice given the fact that it actually has context and can be seen as originating from a source other than the four adults present on the camping trip. I'm literally left thinking WTH? Certainly, the writer knew of the store clerk's sighting and the fact that DeOrr Sr. drove a black truck and therefore determined that the clerk was mistaken? Regardless, the choice sas made to use the image as the final word on this mysterious search as it officially scaled back.

This is the first time I have seen another mention of a black truck. I find it meaningful and wonder why its been buried in the efforts to find DeOrr?

I thought the mention of the black truck was very odd as well. Did they get that from the store clerk? I didn't know that story from her came out so early to the public. This seems very strange to me.

 

[jmcgladr]

This is a really informative source for learning more about mountain lions and the hunting of mountain lions: http://mountainlion.org/FAQfrequentlyaskedquestions.asp#Hunting

 

[Dwbri22]

Deer are WAY more overpopulated than mountain lions, and mountain lions' primary diet is deer, so I really don't think the mountain lion population is in need of "control." Their natural habitat has already been destroyed by humans to a fairly extreme degree. Deer have become a nuisance species where I live, in part because they have no natural predators like mountain lions. I see no reason why these big cats need to be hunted, and I really don't believe you that it's about the meat.

Don't try and put words in my mouth. I said mountain lion meat is great to eat, Not that that is the primary reason to hunt them. Deer may be overpopulated where you live. In Oregon where I live Deer populations are lower than what they should be in a majority of the state, for a number of reasons. One of those reasons being a large increase in the number of cougars in the state. Hound hunting for lions has been banned here since the mid 90's and their numbers are growing exponentially. These animals are so elusive it's hard to get an accurate population estimate. They have no predators other than man, so hunting them is the only practical method of population control. Also that same habitat that you said is being destroyed is the same habitat being used by ungulate populations, also contributing to their decline. So they are getting hit on all fronts. Mountain lions are not the cute cuddly animals you have pictured in your mind they are cold blooded killers. Sorry again to take this thread so far off topic. Hopefully little deorr was not victim to an animal attack. I hope he is found soon.

 

[1&2&3]

I thought the mention of the black truck was very odd as well. Did they get that from the store clerk? I didn't know that story from her came out so early to the public. This seems very strange to me.

Yes, the store clerk mentioned the man with the filthy dirty bawling little boy was driving a black truck. I am repeating the quote as I recall, so it may not be the exact words.

 

[jmcgladr]

Don't try and put words in my mouth. I said mountain lion meat is great to eat, Not that that is the primary reason to hunt them. Deer may be overpopulated where you live. In Oregon where I live Deer populations are lower than what they should be in a majority of the state, for a number of reasons. One of those reasons being a large increase in the number of cougars in the state. Hound hunting for lions has been banned here since the mid 90's and their numbers are growing exponentially. These animals are so elusive it's hard to get an accurate population estimate. They have no predators other than man, so hunting them is the only practical method of population control. Also that same habitat that you said is being destroyed is the same habitat being used by ungulate populations, also contributing to their decline. So they are getting hit on all fronts. Mountain lions are not the cute cuddly animals you have pictured in your mind they are cold blooded killers. Sorry again to take this thread so far off topic. Hopefully little deorr was not victim to an animal attack. I hope he is found soon.

Goodness, I never said cougars were "cute and cuddly," did I? Animals that are NOT cute and cuddly but are native species can still be deserving of protection. I live in BC, there are plenty of cougars here (not in the city where I live, but just up-island a bit), and they sometimes attack people. So I am not ignorant of cougars. Show me the proof that cougars are in need of population control in Idaho, Oregon, BC, or anywhere. Because I don't see that "need" as based on any facts whatsoever, but rather on your support of hunting as a sport.

 

[SweetT]

Deer are WAY more overpopulated than mountain lions, and mountain lions' primary diet is deer, so I really don't think the mountain lion population is in need of "control." Their natural habitat has already been destroyed by humans to a fairly extreme degree. Deer have become a nuisance species where I live, in part because they have no natural predators like mountain lions. I see no reason why these big cats need to be hunted, and I really don't believe you that it's about the meat.

If you're spending 4k to go on a mountain lion hunt it isn't about the meat.

 

[bluesneakers]

This is a really informative source for learning more about mountain lions and the hunting of mountain lions: http://mountainlion.org/FAQfrequentlyaskedquestions.asp#Hunting

Thank you for the link.

There is no legitimate reason to trophy hunt mountain lions: it is purely a recreational sport.

 

[ILOKAL]

All oxygen delivery is dependent on a source of electricity.. even small compressors must be recharged. The latger tanks that you might remember that are also portable last about 3 hours.. the little box type units that pull oxygen from the atmosphere still need to be charged when not plugged in after X amount of hours.. without a source for charging you cannot be in the wild for long.

Here are the possibilities as I see it, since we KNOW (I think) that GGP WAS primitive camping. He has more than one portable unit; he has a generator; he's not on oxygen 24/7.

 

[neesaki]

Completely off topic and my first post, so I hope I'm not breaking any rules. These kinds of emotionally driven posts drive me crazy. Mountain Lion meat is great, so it's not all about getting a trophy. Also mountain lion populations need to be controlled just like other big game species.

But most people who hunt them, hunt them for the trophies, jmo. I had a girl do my hair once, and only once. Because she was bragging about going on a hunt to kill a Mountain Lion. It was all about ego with her and her husband. I never went back to her after that. It's despicable, IMO. I hope we can agree to disagree.

ETA: I don't know why, but for the last several days I've had problems with double posts, anyway I deleted the other one. Sorry .

 

[ILOKAL]

Thank you for the link.

Just an attempt to be well informed about mountain lions, that source is an organization whose sole purpose is to save every mountain lion in existance as well as any future lions. However, there are many MANY sites, many scholarly, that have statistics as well, stating the importance of controlling the overpopulation of mountain lions. Just a reminder that they live in virtually every state (not just 14); they easily live in all types of environments; they are apex predators; their young have a very good survival rate because they stay with their mothers so long that by the time they leave to find their own territory, they are ALSO apex predators except, at times, those who fall prey to another lion.

 

[ilovepierre]

I have nothing new to really contribute....I just want DeOrr found!

IMO, he wandered off and either fell into the creek and drowned or he wandered too far into the woods and succumbed to the elements.
Animal attack is on my list as well. ILOKAL has done tons of research on mountain lions, and it does seem possible for one to have taken DeOrr.

ETA: I live in a town of about 25 000, and there have been cougar sightings in town in the last couple years. In fact, one was lounging in some guy's open garage! Not sure how they got here, since there isn't a whole lot of forested area. but anywho...you'd think they'd stay away from well populated areas, but they don't.

 

[Jackeee]

Just ask Walter Palmer.

Thank you bluesneakers and SweetT.

 

[neesaki]

All oxygen delivery is dependent on a source of electricity.. even small compressors must be recharged. The latger tanks that you might remember that are also portable last about 3 hours.. the little box type units that pull oxygen from the atmosphere still need to be charged when not plugged in after X amount of hours.. without a source for charging you cannot be in the wild for long.

So maybe Gramps and the friend weren't there for overnight, maybe just there for a visit during the day?

 

[bluesneakers]

Just an attempt to be well informed about mountain lions, that source is an organization whose sole purpose is to save every mountain lion in existance as well as any future lions. However, there are many MANY sites, many scholarly, that have statistics as well, stating the importance of controlling the overpopulation of mountain lions. Just a reminder that they live in virtually every state (not just 14); they easily live in all types of environments; they are apex predators; their young have a very good survival rate because they stay with their mothers so long that by the time they leave to find their own territory, they are ALSO apex predators except, at times, those who fall prey to another lion.

I'm on board with that.

 

[Dwbri22]

Goodness, I never said cougars were "cute and cuddly," did I? Animals that are NOT cute and cuddly but are native species can still be deserving of protection. I live in BC, there are plenty of cougars here (not in the city where I live, but just up-island a bit), and they sometimes attack people. So I am not ignorant of cougars. Show me the proof that cougars are in need of population control in Idaho, Oregon, BC, or anywhere. Because I don't see that "need" as based on any facts whatsoever, but rather on your support of hunting as a sport.

You didn't have to say it. Sure all species deserve protections, and cougars ARE protected everywhere that I know of. They also need to be managed just like all other animals.

 

[katydid23]

I'm on board with that.

If you were a farmer or a rancher then you might not be as enthusiastically onboard. It is very hard to protect calves, foals, goats, chickens, pigs, and family pets once a mountain lion has begun picking them off. My uncle only killed 'nuisance' predators, that would not leave his animals alone. He would shoot in the air, use bullhorns and alarms, and protective fencing. But it is impossible to totally protect the livestock and sometimes killing the predator is the only option left.