ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #7

[kammiemc]

Some people/posters immediately begin to accuse the parents of nefarious/criminal behavior as soon as a child goes missing no matter under what circumstances. Just recently, the first few posts that one JMO, of course.

I think in THIS case I'll chalk it up to some kind of boredom by those who are disappointed with the level of news. Do I think more information should be forthcoming? No! Do I feel we are somehow "entitled" to know more than we do? Absolutely not! Are there any reasons whatsoever that the parents/family of little Deorr should even be suspected of hurting him in ANY way - NONE at all! JMO, and thanks for hearing me out.

I don't think it's posters being convoluted . The facts are convoluted. There is a discrepancy in the arrival date. MSM says the parents reported a Fri arrival while the PI indicates a Thurs eve arrival. Maybe he misspoke and meant to say "IN the morning" but that's not what he said. I don't feel comfortable adding a word (IN) to his sentence that changes the entire meaning of what he said. (Why assume he forgot to add such a critical word that would come naturally if he actually meant to say it? He seems articulate and clear in his communication.)

It's one thing to give the parents the benefit of the doubt and not assume they are covering up something, but it's another to try to rewrite the words stated by their own PI so that it doesn't complicate things in our minds or insinuate that they might have given conflicting accounts or been misinterpreted. IMO




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[4senthia]

This brings up a question in my mind for anyone who can answer--
is there anytime of year that the roads are still passable that one cannot camp there?
IOW is there strictly a specified "camping season".
TIA for any direction on this.
jmho

 

[kammiemc]

This brings up a question in my mind for anyone who can answer--
is there anytime of year that the roads are still passable that one cannot camp there?
IOW is there strictly a specified "camping season".
TIA for any direction on this.
jmho

I don't know, but I am interested in what it could mean! (If you don't mind?) I would think a "no camping season" would be in winter, but are you thinking it could be fire season-related?


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[4senthia]

I'm not really sure where I'm going w/my thoughts on an official camping season. Fire season should bring any effected areas into a no camping situation. That's just logical.
Just thinking and wondering about if there is a season so to speak or if the roads are passable and there is no other specific danger, could a person camp anytime of the year?
jmho

 

[ILOKAL]

afternoon is any time around 1201. The parents left for the store at 1pm and were back before or around 2 give or take and called 911 at 238. Does this make sense to anyone? In the meantime campfire is lit.. IR is fishing and grandpa is all settled in. Let's say it takes 1/2 hour either way to get to the store.. so, as i said AFTERNOON is 1201pm.. 911 is called at 238.. all this .. setting up camp, going to store, returning.. exploring the campsite then searching for baby occurred in 2 hours and 38 minutes? nah jmo

IIRC, I believe they got BACK from the store at about 1:00.

 

[kammiemc]

Speaking for myself, and I'd bet most of the others here @WS, we aren't angry/disturbed because we want more "action". Or because we are bored. Within TOS we are here to sleuth.
I genuinely care. No one owes me any answers. But IMO every missing child deserves attention. Every single one of them.
Past experiences w/these cases make us wary and they should.
JMHO

I agree. It's society's responsibility to look out for the little ones. And while every person (parent) should be treated fairly and given the benefit of the doubt, we can't completely ignore that some parents can and do harm their children, either inadvertently or purposefully. Otherwise no one would ever alert LE when concerned about a child's welfare and that would be a problem.


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[ILOKAL]

I'm not really sure where I'm going w/my thoughts on an official camping season. Fire season should bring any effected areas into a no camping situation. That's just logical.
Just thinking and wondering about if there is a season so to speak or if the roads are passable and there is no other specific danger, could a person camp anytime of the year?
jmho

Go to the website where it gives the dates.

 

[TxJan1971]

afternoon is any time around 1201. The parents left for the store at 1pm and were back before or around 2 give or take and called 911 at 238. Does this make sense to anyone? In the meantime campfire is lit.. IR is fishing and grandpa is all settled in. Let's say it takes 1/2 hour either way to get to the store.. so, as i said AFTERNOON is 1201pm.. 911 is called at 238.. all this .. setting up camp, going to store, returning.. exploring the campsite then searching for baby occurred in 2 hours and 38 minutes? nah jmo

According to what DK Sr. said, I'm not convinced they left the campground for the store at 1:00 p.m. It is my opinion that they were at the campground from 1-2 doing who knows what (setting up camp? Hanging out?)

During interview:
DK: It was me, but it, but they claim it was at 6:00 that evening and I, we, we still were with Search and Rescue until, what [turning to JM] a quarter till four?

JM: Yeah, from . . .

DK: We didn't never, we never . . . we haven't left the camp since 1:00 that afternoon. So it's just a lot of hearsay . . . and . . .
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...2-Timber-Creek-Campground-10-July-2015/page20


At 2:00 p.m. dad says he last saw Deorr playing with GGP and they were off to explore.

Dad said they were gone 10-15 minutes

2:00 to 2:15 approx. - Parents exploring less than 50 yards awayper dad

2:15 - Parents return ask GGP, Where's Deorr?

2:15 to 2:35 - Searched for Deorr Jr x 20 minutes per Dad

2:35 - 911 Called

Everything lines up from there as far as what dad says.

I just don't know what happened from 1-2 p.m. I would like that piece confirmed.

 

[concernedmother]

That area is so primitive I wonder if they even have pit toilets there or you have to squat in the woods and wipe with leaves? I like to camp but not that kind of camping.

 

[Jules71]

Per Harry Oakes fb page, Deorr has not hired him for his SAR services. (As of about 5:48 pm Pacific)

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[katydid23]

Per Harry Oakes fb page, Deorr has not hired him for his SAR services. (As of about 5:48 pm Pacific)

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As much as I want the little guy found, this might be a good thing. IDK

 

[ClaireNC]

That area is so primitive I wonder if they even have pit toilets there or you have to squat in the woods and wipe with leaves? I like to camp but not that kind of camping.

The campground has a pit toilet.

 

[rkf]

The paragraph that begins, "The child's parents, . . . .
Contains six lines. The last two words of the last line are . . . .
"Bowerman said."

Unless Reuters sent a reporter to Leadore or called to interview Bowerman, they're recycling reports from local media. Makes me crazy! JMO

 

[scmom]

Per Harry Oakes fb page, Deorr has not hired him for his SAR services. (As of about 5:48 pm Pacific)

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Interesting.

 

[La Louve]

I don't know, but I am interested in what it could mean! (If you don't mind?) I would think a "no camping season" would be in winter, but are you thinking it could be fire season-related?


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They might close whole camping areas if there were approaching forest fires. More typical in my experience of back country camping in the northwest is that they (county/state/national park rangers) just institute bans on campfires - usually starting in July. All *national* forest roads that have back-country camping sites are posted with bright orange signs warning about the campfire bans.

ETA I think if that Timber Creek campsite had a no-camping season it would be in the winter and spring. IIRC it's over 7000 feet in elevation. It probably doesn't stay above freezing at night until mid-June or even into July.

*ETA #2

 

[rkf]

If Gpa has dementia, can he take a polygraph? Same question for Issac, if he's not
(Idk if is or isn't) 100% all there... would they give him a poly?

Polygraph results are not reliable if someone has consumed any mind-altering substances, prescription or non-prescription. I don't know about mental illness or deficits. JMO

 

[webweaved]

Interesting.

Hmm. Why haven't they asked SAR to search? Would you turn down any help at this point? Odd. JMO.

 

[4senthia]

DeOrr's family may not be able to pay this particular for-profit SAR guy's fees. He charges for fuel, for room and food, for searching (by the hour on that I think).
jmho

 

[La Louve]

Because that particular SAR (Mr. Oakes) is a for-profit operation. If you search his name and Longview WA you can read about some other concerns about him. Though apparently he was helpful in finding Ward Weaver's two victims.

 

[starfire]

Right. But if they arrived in the dark on Thursday at bedtime, they might have just stopped wherever, and parked and went to sleep. Much better to look for a good campsite in the daylight, imo.

Yes, this especially makes sense if a camper was involved. And they may have done this at the actual campsite and didn't move elsewhere. Who knows, not a lot of elderly people like to sleep on the ground. Maybe the great-grandfather owned a small camper and slept in there and the parents simply threw some sleeping bags in the back of the pickup and slept there. If they did this, maybe that is where Deorr's blanket was left on Friday morning -- in the bed of the pickup with the sleeping bags/blankets and not inside the cab.