ID - Doomsday Cult Victims - Joshua Vallow - Tylee Ryan - Tammy Daybell - Charles Vallow - *Arrests* #68

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
For those of us who have followed this case since Day One, finally having one of them on trial is a great feeling. Remember how we wondered just how much of the fringe religious stuff would be brought up by the prosecution? Well, based on opening statements, it sounds like the prosecution has found a succinct way to bring in some of the crazier aspects.

Imagine being a juror who knew nothing about this case going in. I wonder if their heads are spinning?!?

I was thinking the same thing. All of our minds were blown with this stuff dripping out a little at a time over months to a year/s. Imagine hearing it all at once :eek::eek::eek:
 
I haven’t had a chance to read what transpired after opening statements. I’m still trying to listen to the defense attorney giving his statement and he’s putting me to sleep! The prosecutor LB was clear in her statement and kept me very interested and attentive.
 
Wow, it feels surreal that this trial has actually started.

I've been following from the beginning. I was concerned with what the prosecution had but their opening seemed strong and well put together.

I thought Archibald would be different in style although it's just the beginning.

I haven't been on webslueths for awhile in regards to this case. It's good to be back, I feel like I am home now watching the trial with everyone here.
 
Summary of tweets for Trial Day 1, 4/10/23 - State Witness: Kay Woocock, continued/part 3 (after lunch).


Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
12h
We are back from lunch and Wood will continue questioning Kay Woodcock.

Wood shows JJ's birth certificate on the screen. Kay confirms it is his birth certificate.

Wood shows final decree of adoption and it is admitted into evidence. Kay Woodcock confirms it is the document.

Wood shows Louisiana birth certificate for JJ that says Charles Vallow and Lori Norene Cox are the parents.

Wood shows Kay Woodcock a photo of JJ and she starts to cry. Wood asks Kay what the document is. She responds through tears, "Our beautiful grandson JJ."

Kay Woodcock says the photo of JJ has always been one of her favorites. It's the picture of JJ buckled into Larry's pickup truck. This is the image (we have it on file as evidence is not being released publicly until after the trial is over):

JJ.jpg

Kay describes when she and Larry went to meet with law enforcement after Charles's death. They were very concerned about JJ's wellbeling.

Wood asks Kay if JJ was ever physically with her in November 2019. Kay says no. Kay says on Nov. 8, 2019, she was at home in Louisiana. She had a printer that belonged to Charles and when she woke up that day, she went to figure out how to use the scanner on the printer.

She woke up early and "something" told her to go to her computer where she saw Charles's Gmail account. Charles had given her the password and it worked.

Kay noticed a lot of emails in the account including a confirmation email of an Amazon order that was sent to an address in Rexburg. Kay said after she saw that, she contacted her private investigator and Brandon Boudreaux.

Kay then went into the browsing history of the Amazon account and saw searches for a beach wedding dress, a bathing suit, mens large white linen top and pants, and malachite wedding rings. The date was Oct. 2, 2019.

Kay says she met with Rexburg police in Jan. 2020. She says prior to this situation, she had never heard of Rexburg, Idaho.

At the advice of the FBI, Kay issued a reward for information on JJ. Kay says they reached out to every media outlet they could to get the word out about the missing children.

Kay says she learned Lori married Chad Daybell and Lori was using Charles's Amazon account to order their items. Kay says she became aware that the bodies of JJ and Tylee were found in Chad's backyard in June 2020. Wood is done asking questions, now John Thomas will proceed.

Thomas asking Kay about how long she and Larry cared for JJ and the adoption arrangements for JJ.

Kay says they really wanted to adopt JJ but in talking with Lori and Charles, their atmosphere was a lot more conducive for a baby. Kay says there were no special schools in Lake Charles for children with disabilities.

"Although Charles was five years older than me, he could run circles around a 25-year-old. Lori was 17 years younger than him and my husband Larry was 65. We knew that it was going to be a lot" to care for JJ.

Lori is looking at Kay as she answers the questions. Kay is focused ahead on Thomas.

Kay talks about going to help Charles when he said he wanted a divorce. Lori came in and began arguing with Charles. Melanie Gibb was there and Kay recorded the conversation. Charles then moved to Houston as it was a better place for JJ.

Kay says in 2019, Lori left her husband and her child for 58 days. She knows it was 58 days because Charles kept track. "She never reached out to JJ, she never reached out to Charles."

Thomas asking her about the printer/scanner. Kay says it was "weird" because she never woke up at 4:30 a.m. with the scanner of her mind. She said it was bothering her - "I think it was divine intervention because of what I found when I got everything hooked up - God's hand."

Thomas has no further questions. Prosecution has nothing further. Kay Woodcock is dismissed and next witness will be called. That witness is Brandon Boudreaux.

link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow
 
Summary of tweets for Trial Day 1, 4/10/23 - State Witness: Brandon Boudreaux.


Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
11h
Brandon is sworn in. He's dressed in a white shirt and light purple tie. Brandon was married to melani Pawlowski, Lori's niece. Prosecutor Rachel Smith is questioning him.

Brandon was married to Melani for a little over ten years. They got married in 2008 and have four children.

Smith asking Brandon about Melani's family - her aunts, uncles, grandparents. Brandon says he met many in the family in Arizona and they spent most holidays together.

Brandon said he lived with Lori and Charles for part of his marriage to Melani. They spent a lot of time together and Brandon got to know Lori's children - Colby, Tylee and JJ.

Brandon holding back tears, chokes up when he says his oldest son was very close to JJ and they spent a lot of time together. JJ loved to hang out with Brandon's kids, he says. JJ was fascinated with traveling -- Lori grins -- and he loved hanging out with Braxton, Brandon's son

Brandon says he was close with Tylee and when Tylee was eight, she asked Brandon to baptize her. He performed the baptism into The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Brandon says Melani looked at Lori like a mom figure - she was always trying to be like her. Brandon and Charles both had a passion for business/sales.They both loved their families so "it was easy for us to spend time together." The Vallows & Boudreauxs spent time together often

Brandon says the last Christmas his family spent with Charles and Lori was in 2018. He says other people were there, including Melanie Gibb and her family. Brandon says everything felt different and the relationships were "not very close."

Brandon says when he first married Melani, her religious level was "low" & she didn't enjoy going to church. He says for most of their marriage, he pushed to go to church. In the fall 2018, she started getting "really passionate" about going to church and certain ideas at church

Melani began attending "firesides" -- meetings -- that were not sponsored by the church. "She was coming home with different ideas about what she was going to do to be a faithful member of the church."

Brandon says Lori was at the firesides, but Charles did not attend. Melani told Brandon the firesides were "her thing and was very clear I was not welcome to come."

Brandon says Melani felt a need to go to the temple "every single day - which is a little extreme."

Brandon says during trips to Disneyland, Melani would need to go to the temple & she was focused on the idea that the world was going to end soon. He says they had a disagreement about buying $10,000 worth of food storage because she thought the world was going to end right away

Brandon says things got "more bizarre" into 2019. In Jan., Brandon got a call and text message from Charles that Lori was accusing Charles of infidelity. Brandon says things went from zero to 100 "really quick" and Melani was adamant not to takes side in the Lori/Charles split up

Brandon says in June 2019, he, Melani and kids went to Utah to stay at Melani's parents home. Brandon's grandfather died unexpectedly on June 23. Brandon's mom called to tell him about the death & Melani said she would not go to funeral - "she didn't want anything to do with it."

After an argument, Brandon went on a walk and came home. He says he wanted to break through to Melani and begged her to tell him what was going on. Melani said she had a revelation from God, "she didn't feel safe with me at the house and accused me of being a homosexual."

It ended with Melani going to sleep and Brandon was overwhelmed.

Brandon says he texted Charles and Lori expressing his frustration. Lori never responded but Charles spoke with him on the phone. Brandon went to a counselor and spoke with his bishop about the situation. Brandon tears up while saying this was the last time he spoke with Charles

Brandon never saw Tylee or JJ again. Melani and Brandon used a mediator to get a divorce. They searched out the lowest-conflict way to get a divorce.

Brandon got a rental property and custody arrangements with Melani were "complicated." Melani said she was scared of Brandon and he didn't get a lot of time with his children.

Brandon says on the morning of Oct. 2, 2019, someone shot at him in front of his house. Thomas objects and says this isn't relevant to the issue at hand. Attorneys now meeting in a sidebar conference with the judge.

Court taking a 15-20 minute recess. Be back shortly.

Back from a recess. Judge addressing Thomas's objection before jurors are brought in. Smith says the info. about Brandon being shot at is part of a "common scheme and plan. The defendant with the co-defendant conspired and planned to kill multiple individuals in her world."

Smith says the shooting at Mr. Boudreaux is what got law enforcement involved and interested in the case. Thomas says Smith's argument is "a stretch at best" and asks Boyce to not allow him to testify about the shooting.

Boyce overrules the object and allows Brandon to proceed with his testimony but warns the state that they must show what they have alleged (that there was a common scheme and plan). Jurors are now being brought back in.

Brandon now recounting the events of Oct. 2, 2019. He got the kids ready for school, dropped them off, then took one child to daycare and took the last to Melani's house. Brandon then went to the gym. After he exercised, he left the gym to go to his new house.

Brandon said maybe five people knew where he was living - his neighbors, who helped him move in, and Melani, who he had to tell. As he turned the corner onto the street of his new house, he noticed a Jeep parked really close to a van that was parked on the street.

The Jeep Wrangler had a Texas license plate and there was no tire on the back of the Jeep. Instead, the window was kind of open.

Brandon noticed a gun with a silencer pointed out. Suddenly his window shattered and he head a gunshot. Brandon accelerated the car and called 911 as he parked next to the public pool. Brandon says he saw the Jeep come around the corner and tried to follow it.

The dispatcher told Brandon to park in front of his house and police then arrived.

Brandon met with a detective and remembered that Tylee had a green Jeep Charles had purchased for him with Texas plates. Brandon knew the VIN number so he gave it to law enforcement.

Charles gave the VIN to Brandon earlier as Brandon was an insurance agent and ran insurance quotes for all of their vehicles.

After the shooting, Brandon had some beliefs about who did it and he became concerned. He remembered a bunch of emails Charles sent him before he died about the religious groups Melani was in. Brandon went back to check the emails and most came from a man named Chad Daybell.

Brandon says "in my gut, something felt wrong." He contacted law enforcement after he did a Google search for Chad Daybell's name and found Tammy Daybell's obituary. After talking with police, he realized nobody had seen JJ or Tylee for some time.

Tylee's birth certificate is admitted as evidence.

Photo of Tylee from her teenage years is admitted as evidence.

When asked where Brandon was when he learned the bodies of JJ and Tylee had been found, he chokes up and says, "I was in my parent's home in their garage. It was the day before my wedding." Brandon went to Rexburg on June 11, 2020.

When he arrived in Rexburg, he met with Larry and Kay Woodcock and police asked Brandon to identify JJ.

Brandon is crying, sniffling and wiping tears from his eyes when recalling he was asked by police to identify JJ's body.

Smith is done with her questions. Thomas will now cross-examine Brandon.

Thomas asks Brandon about the Google searches he did after he was shot at. Brandon says he searched for Chad Daybell's name to try and get more information about him.

Thomas asking Brandon why Melani would think he was a homosexual. Brandon: "She told me God had told her I was a homosexual." Thomas follows up by asking Brandon about a video a friend posted on Facebook of him at the Pink Pony - a club in Alabama.

Brandon says that came about because he asked Melani to give him evidence that he was a homosexual -- and she pointed to this video.

Brandon says the Jeep was parked around 20-30 feet away from him when a shot was fired from the vehicle. Brandon says he's positive the bullet came from that Jeep. He did not see the muzzle flash but saw a silencer. "I was looking straight at it."

Brandon explaining why he had the Jeep's VIN. Charles asked him to price auto insurance plans for his vehicles.

Thomas asks Brandon why police had him identify JJ. "I think I was as close to JJ as Larry and Kay. We were all family." Brandon says they may have asked Larry but "it was a pretty overwhelming task to do."

Thomas has no further questions. Smith says Brandon does not live in Idaho and asks if he can be released from his subpoena. Nobody opposes. Boyce suggests we break for the day before the next witness - Rexburg Police Det. Ray Hermosillo. Court is dismissed for the day.

link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow
 
Tuesday, April 11th:
*Trial continues (Day 2) (@ 8:30am MT) – ID – Joshua Jaxon (JJ) Vallow (7) & Tylee Ashlyn Ryan (16) (JJ last seen Sept. 23, 2019 & Tylee on Sept. 9, 2019, Rexburg; found June 9, 2020 buried in Daybell’s yard in Salem, ID) – *Lori Norene Vallow aka Lori Norene Daybell (46/now 49) arrested (in Kauai, Hawaii on 2/20/20) & indicted & charged (5/25/21) & re-arraigned (4/19/22) with Count 1 (for Tylee): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder & grand theft by deception (for Daybell, Vallow & Alex Cox) & other co-conspirators. Count 2 (for Tylee): 1st degree murder. Count 3 (for JJ): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder & grand theft by deception. Count 4(for JJ): 1st degree murder. Count 5 (for Tammy): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder. Count 6: Lori only: Grand theft (related to social security survivor benefits allocated for the care of minors Tylee & JJ). Plead not guilty. DA will not seek DP. Was transferred to Ada County jail on 3/22/23. Fremont County
Conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration or concealment of evidence charges dismissed without prejudice on 7/29/21. Fremont County
Resisting or obstructing LE, solicitation of a crime & contempt of court. All charges were dismissed on 1/3/22. Madison County
Trial began on 4/3/23 with jury selection & ended 4/7/23. 12 jurors & 6 alternates-10 men & 8 women.
Trial set to begin on 4/10/23 (thru 6/9/23) @ 8:30am to 3:30pm. Trial will be held in Ada County. (will last about 10 weeks) Trials have been severed.

Arrest & Grand Jury & Competency & Court info from 3/5/20 thru 3/30/23 & Jury Selection Day 1-5 (4/3-4/7/23) reference post #534 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/t...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-27

4/10/23 Monday, Trial Day 1: Opening statements by Fremont County Lindsey Blake.
For more info see post #657 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-33
Opening statement by defense attorney James Archibald.
For more info see post #644 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-34
State witness: Kay Woodcock, JJ’s grandmother.
For more info see post #696 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-35
For more info see post #708 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-36
For more info see post #865 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-44
State witness: Brandon Boudreaux, was married to Melani Pawlowski, Lori's niece.
For more info see post #866 here:
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-68.671199/page-44
Trial continues on Tuesday, 4/11/23 @ 8:30am & end every day at 3:30pm.

*Chad Guy Daybell (53/now 54) – Pretrial motions hearing on 3/2/23. Trial was set to begin on 4/3/23 was vacated.
 
I didn't hear that quote earlier so I my apologies. Since no link, I assumed that was your opinion/comment.

I don't think it's been stated prior so I'm curious if that's the state's theory or if the autopsy did come back as asphyxiation by strangulation? (or similar) That would certainly be a big win in both trials.

Sorry for the confusion from my link fail, I blame multi-tasking, sketchy typing skills, and trail day 1. Here you go:

Tammy Daybell, it was revealed Monday, died by asphyxiation at the hands of another person, the prosecutor told the jury.

 
Last edited:
The Daybell children already knew this.

“They (authorities) told me that she’d been asphyxiated…but we never saw an autopsy,” Garth Daybell told ’48 Hours.’

Mark Daybell added, “Asphyxiation doesn’t necessarily mean smothered. According to my understanding, it just means the breath was interrupted. And in the end, she wasn’t able to breathe.”

The children say Tammy had been in failing health. During their interview, Garth Daybell said he was in his bedroom the night his mother died when he heard a “thump.” His dad called out for him “with the most panic I’d ever heard in his voice.”

But manner was news AFAIK.

At trial, it was clear she died "at the hands of another." It wasn't "natural" or "accidental."

MOO
 
I didn't hear that quote earlier so I my apologies. Since no link, I assumed that was your opinion/comment.

I don't think it's been stated prior so I'm curious if that's the state's theory or if the autopsy did come back as asphyxiation by strangulation? (or similar) That would certainly be a big win in both trials.

There is obviously at least one victim for whom it is not clear the cause of death.

No surprise if that's the case for Tylee-

It could also be true for Tammy. If they found some damage to her body like neck bruises or little burst blood vessels or a broken hyoid, the Dr. Who did the autopsy might say strangulation. If there are injuries that make it seem like she was fighting being smothered with a pillow, such as injuries inside the mouth caused by trying to turn head side to side, the Dr. Might say suffocation. Also, evidence recovered at the scene could say suffocation, like a pillow or bag with her snot and spit on it to excess- maybe a face indent.

But the Dr. Could have just found clues at the scene or on her body that she fought death, was restrained, etc. to make them confident she died at the hands of another, and she was asphyxiated, but the don't know how the killing was done.

MOO
 
Summary of tweets for Trial Day 1, 4/10/23 - State Witness: Brandon Boudreaux.


Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
11h
Brandon is sworn in. He's dressed in a white shirt and light purple tie. Brandon was married to melani Pawlowski, Lori's niece. Prosecutor Rachel Smith is questioning him.

Brandon was married to Melani for a little over ten years. They got married in 2008 and have four children.

Smith asking Brandon about Melani's family - her aunts, uncles, grandparents. Brandon says he met many in the family in Arizona and they spent most holidays together.

Brandon said he lived with Lori and Charles for part of his marriage to Melani. They spent a lot of time together and Brandon got to know Lori's children - Colby, Tylee and JJ.

Brandon holding back tears, chokes up when he says his oldest son was very close to JJ and they spent a lot of time together. JJ loved to hang out with Brandon's kids, he says. JJ was fascinated with traveling -- Lori grins -- and he loved hanging out with Braxton, Brandon's son

Brandon says he was close with Tylee and when Tylee was eight, she asked Brandon to baptize her. He performed the baptism into The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Brandon says Melani looked at Lori like a mom figure - she was always trying to be like her. Brandon and Charles both had a passion for business/sales.They both loved their families so "it was easy for us to spend time together." The Vallows & Boudreauxs spent time together often

Brandon says the last Christmas his family spent with Charles and Lori was in 2018. He says other people were there, including Melanie Gibb and her family. Brandon says everything felt different and the relationships were "not very close."

Brandon says when he first married Melani, her religious level was "low" & she didn't enjoy going to church. He says for most of their marriage, he pushed to go to church. In the fall 2018, she started getting "really passionate" about going to church and certain ideas at church

Melani began attending "firesides" -- meetings -- that were not sponsored by the church. "She was coming home with different ideas about what she was going to do to be a faithful member of the church."

Brandon says Lori was at the firesides, but Charles did not attend. Melani told Brandon the firesides were "her thing and was very clear I was not welcome to come."

Brandon says Melani felt a need to go to the temple "every single day - which is a little extreme."

Brandon says during trips to Disneyland, Melani would need to go to the temple & she was focused on the idea that the world was going to end soon. He says they had a disagreement about buying $10,000 worth of food storage because she thought the world was going to end right away

Brandon says things got "more bizarre" into 2019. In Jan., Brandon got a call and text message from Charles that Lori was accusing Charles of infidelity. Brandon says things went from zero to 100 "really quick" and Melani was adamant not to takes side in the Lori/Charles split up

Brandon says in June 2019, he, Melani and kids went to Utah to stay at Melani's parents home. Brandon's grandfather died unexpectedly on June 23. Brandon's mom called to tell him about the death & Melani said she would not go to funeral - "she didn't want anything to do with it."

After an argument, Brandon went on a walk and came home. He says he wanted to break through to Melani and begged her to tell him what was going on. Melani said she had a revelation from God, "she didn't feel safe with me at the house and accused me of being a homosexual."

It ended with Melani going to sleep and Brandon was overwhelmed.

Brandon says he texted Charles and Lori expressing his frustration. Lori never responded but Charles spoke with him on the phone. Brandon went to a counselor and spoke with his bishop about the situation. Brandon tears up while saying this was the last time he spoke with Charles

Brandon never saw Tylee or JJ again. Melani and Brandon used a mediator to get a divorce. They searched out the lowest-conflict way to get a divorce.

Brandon got a rental property and custody arrangements with Melani were "complicated." Melani said she was scared of Brandon and he didn't get a lot of time with his children.

Brandon says on the morning of Oct. 2, 2019, someone shot at him in front of his house. Thomas objects and says this isn't relevant to the issue at hand. Attorneys now meeting in a sidebar conference with the judge.

Court taking a 15-20 minute recess. Be back shortly.

Back from a recess. Judge addressing Thomas's objection before jurors are brought in. Smith says the info. about Brandon being shot at is part of a "common scheme and plan. The defendant with the co-defendant conspired and planned to kill multiple individuals in her world."

Smith says the shooting at Mr. Boudreaux is what got law enforcement involved and interested in the case. Thomas says Smith's argument is "a stretch at best" and asks Boyce to not allow him to testify about the shooting.

Boyce overrules the object and allows Brandon to proceed with his testimony but warns the state that they must show what they have alleged (that there was a common scheme and plan). Jurors are now being brought back in.

Brandon now recounting the events of Oct. 2, 2019. He got the kids ready for school, dropped them off, then took one child to daycare and took the last to Melani's house. Brandon then went to the gym. After he exercised, he left the gym to go to his new house.

Brandon said maybe five people knew where he was living - his neighbors, who helped him move in, and Melani, who he had to tell. As he turned the corner onto the street of his new house, he noticed a Jeep parked really close to a van that was parked on the street.

The Jeep Wrangler had a Texas license plate and there was no tire on the back of the Jeep. Instead, the window was kind of open.

Brandon noticed a gun with a silencer pointed out. Suddenly his window shattered and he head a gunshot. Brandon accelerated the car and called 911 as he parked next to the public pool. Brandon says he saw the Jeep come around the corner and tried to follow it.

The dispatcher told Brandon to park in front of his house and police then arrived.

Brandon met with a detective and remembered that Tylee had a green Jeep Charles had purchased for him with Texas plates. Brandon knew the VIN number so he gave it to law enforcement.

Charles gave the VIN to Brandon earlier as Brandon was an insurance agent and ran insurance quotes for all of their vehicles.

After the shooting, Brandon had some beliefs about who did it and he became concerned. He remembered a bunch of emails Charles sent him before he died about the religious groups Melani was in. Brandon went back to check the emails and most came from a man named Chad Daybell.

Brandon says "in my gut, something felt wrong." He contacted law enforcement after he did a Google search for Chad Daybell's name and found Tammy Daybell's obituary. After talking with police, he realized nobody had seen JJ or Tylee for some time.

Tylee's birth certificate is admitted as evidence.

Photo of Tylee from her teenage years is admitted as evidence.

When asked where Brandon was when he learned the bodies of JJ and Tylee had been found, he chokes up and says, "I was in my parent's home in their garage. It was the day before my wedding." Brandon went to Rexburg on June 11, 2020.

When he arrived in Rexburg, he met with Larry and Kay Woodcock and police asked Brandon to identify JJ.

Brandon is crying, sniffling and wiping tears from his eyes when recalling he was asked by police to identify JJ's body.

Smith is done with her questions. Thomas will now cross-examine Brandon.

Thomas asks Brandon about the Google searches he did after he was shot at. Brandon says he searched for Chad Daybell's name to try and get more information about him.

Thomas asking Brandon why Melani would think he was a homosexual. Brandon: "She told me God had told her I was a homosexual." Thomas follows up by asking Brandon about a video a friend posted on Facebook of him at the Pink Pony - a club in Alabama.

Brandon says that came about because he asked Melani to give him evidence that he was a homosexual -- and she pointed to this video.

Brandon says the Jeep was parked around 20-30 feet away from him when a shot was fired from the vehicle. Brandon says he's positive the bullet came from that Jeep. He did not see the muzzle flash but saw a silencer. "I was looking straight at it."

Brandon explaining why he had the Jeep's VIN. Charles asked him to price auto insurance plans for his vehicles.

Thomas asks Brandon why police had him identify JJ. "I think I was as close to JJ as Larry and Kay. We were all family." Brandon says they may have asked Larry but "it was a pretty overwhelming task to do."

Thomas has no further questions. Smith says Brandon does not live in Idaho and asks if he can be released from his subpoena. Nobody opposes. Boyce suggests we break for the day before the next witness - Rexburg Police Det. Ray Hermosillo. Court is dismissed for the day.

link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow

Many thanks for this. For whatever reason none of the tweets kindly posted by members here would load for me yesterday so having the chance to catch up in this way is super helpful.

Hard to believe this trial is actually happening. Here's hoping that LVD stays untranslated long enough to face la musique.
 
But manner was news AFAIK.

At trial, it was clear she died "at the hands of another." It wasn't "natural" or "accidental."

MOO

True -- a very clear statement of what many here suspected. Just possible also that she didn't return from the dead to instruct CD to shack up ASAP with LVD and spend her ill-gotten life insurance on a tacky Hawaii wedding.

I may have missed this, but is Tammy's potential murder part of LVD's trial, or CD's trial, or both?
 
There is obviously at least one victim for whom it is not clear the cause of death.

No surprise if that's the case for Tylee-

It could also be true for Tammy. If they found some damage to her body like neck bruises or little burst blood vessels or a broken hyoid, the Dr. Who did the autopsy might say strangulation. If there are injuries that make it seem like she was fighting being smothered with a pillow, such as injuries inside the mouth caused by trying to turn head side to side, the Dr. Might say suffocation. Also, evidence recovered at the scene could say suffocation, like a pillow or bag with her snot and spit on it to excess- maybe a face indent.

But the Dr. Could have just found clues at the scene or on her body that she fought death, was restrained, etc. to make them confident she died at the hands of another, and she was asphyxiated, but the don't know how the killing was done.

MOO

IMO regarding Tammy, it seems to me very difficult to determine with certainty that her death was homicide.

For one, the coroner first declared her death to be natural.

Next, the account of Tammy's children (see below link) seem to indicate to me they were home when Tammy died and that Chad Daybell seemed obviously distraught.

However, the idea of homicide (has her death certificate been revised to indicate she dies of homicide?) is supported by the fact that she was attacked by a man with a "paintball gun" (likely Alex with a silenced pistol) before her death.

Working against this is the fact that the police did not recover any bullet embedded in the exterior o the house?

I look forward to the part of the trial where Tammy's death is discussed.

 
IMO regarding Tammy, it seems to me very difficult to determine with certainty that her death was homicide.

For one, the coroner first declared her death to be natural.

Next, the account of Tammy's children (see below link) seem to indicate to me they were home when Tammy died and that Chad Daybell seemed obviously distraught.

However, the idea of homicide (has her death certificate been revised to indicate she dies of homicide?) is supported by the fact that she was attacked by a man with a "paintball gun" (likely Alex with a silenced pistol) before her death.

Working against this is the fact that the police did not recover any bullet embedded in the exterior o the house?

I look forward to the part of the trial where Tammy's death is discussed.


The first coroner did not perform an autopsy - rather took Chad at his word
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
78
Guests online
1,380
Total visitors
1,458

Forum statistics

Threads
598,532
Messages
18,082,792
Members
230,653
Latest member
distrustHUMANS24
Back
Top