ID - Doomsday Cult Victims - Joshua Vallow - Tylee Ryan - Tammy Daybell - Charles Vallow - *Arrests* #70

[fred&edna]

As the cult's leader, Chad was clearly a religious authority to them.

I wasn't questioning religious authority, it's not about that. My apologies to anyone who thinks that was the reason for my post.

 

[formerlyme]

ugh, I just want the damned truth.... I want justice served. I don't think that is too much to ask for .

 

[formerlyme]

I think this way too, IMO that is why what the dream was about would be of interest, probably heard a commotion.

It feels suspicious.( ofc I accept that these people were odd and were also up to their necks in a cult - even though they've since been at pains to say that they hadn't bought into it- so they're likely to have odd reactions)

however - what if the nightmare didn't really happen as we've been told? that's even worse. what if they heard a commotion or even that Warwick himself had heard something while he was half asleep which fed into his dream state?
Everybody on WS must have wondered about that, at some point, over the year

 

[Love Never Fails]

It took 45 minutes of YouTube videos and 3 online articles for David Warwick to remember, "Oh yeah, I'm not supposed to be looking at these? Riiiight. /s

That sort of "the rules don't actually apply to me" attitude sounds exactly like LVD & CD.

As much as I want the State to heap all sorts of evidence and testimony on LVD, this guy needs to be thrown out.

MOO. IMO. IANAL.

So David Warwick gets to break the rules?
Gee Judge Boyce, you cannot run your own courtroom.

 

[pizzaman12]

As the cult's leader, Chad was clearly a religious authority to them.

But DW didn't believe what he was saying nor he didn't think CD had the authority to gather the 144k. I wouldn't call that a religious authority. Maybe to MG? But based on what DW stated, seems like an odd fit

 

[indicolite22]

According to DW, JJ was not wearing red pajamas when Alex brought him in during the podcast session. DW recalls JJ wearing shorts and a t-shirt.

 

[cottonweaver]

As the cult's leader, Chad was clearly a religious authority to them.

seems so ( altho today he doth protest too much)

which is probably why I find stuff like this, from Warwick, hard to believe
( that while being hosted by Chad's mistress, he's challenged Chad by mentioning his wife)

https://twitter.com/x/status/1649097665324650499

 

[887sMtreme]

Agreed, I think it is the absurdity of the justification and yet their normal appearance that makes this case so tragic, interesting, and frightening.

It appears LVD charmed and flirted and then manipulated and lied her way into people’s lives and money.
Was she always this way, or did she change from shallow to toxic?

How did she expect this to end? They acted as if there would be a future, no one would notice, what was their end game? Very very strange

JMO

Renember, they thought the End of Days was nigh.

 

[fred&edna]

It feels suspicious.( ofc I accept that these people were odd and were also up to their necks in an offshoot cult - even though they've since been at pains to say that they hadn't bought into it- so they're likely to have odd reactions)

however - what if the nightmare didn't really happen as we've been told? that's even worse. what if they heard a commotion or even that Warwick himself had heard something while he was half asleep which fed into his dream state?
Everybody on WS must have wondered about that, at some point, over the years

I wonder if any jurors have similar thoughts about this "nightmare" that provoked phone calls between MG and LVD/CD on the last night JJ was seen alive.

 

[indicolite22]

seems so ( altho today he doth protest too much)

which is probably why I find stuff like this, from Warwick, hard to believe
( that while being hosted by Chad's mistress, he's challenged Chad by mentioning his wife)

https://twitter.com/x/status/1649097665324650499

Didn't MG testify that Chad asked DW to keep it a secret that he and Lori were having an affair? Chad and Lori tried to convince the cult members that by being married in previous lives they were allowed to be unfaithful to their spouses.

 

[Gut_feeling]

maybe but would still like to know which meds he was buying from Mexico, considering we've heard that he'd not been to a doctor for years

Yes, this has bothered me as well. I read autopsy results for Alex and the only substances found were caffeine in the form of No-Doz, and Narcan, the med given when emergency responders suspect possible opiod overdose. I hadn't heard anything about a possible OD so I researched about Narcan and it turns out it has become very common to administer Narcan when someone MIGHT be OD'ing because it can obviously save their life and if they AREN'T OD'ing apparently it does no harm.

What I thought was odd was that the article I read (I will find it) stated that Zulema reported that Alex had just driven to Mexico (either days before or the day before) for medication since it was cheaper there. But if that's the case, why didn't any other meds show up in his system? If I remember correctly, the autopsy was done pretty quickly after his death because Alex was already on the radar of LE due to Charles's death.

Editing to add the link to Phoenix Fox10's reporter Justin Lum's post containing the autopsy report
Log into Facebook
I should add that I am not on Facebook and I did not need to log in.

 

[indicolite22]

How did she expect this to end? They acted as if there would be a future, no one would notice, what was their end game? Very very strange

JMO

SBM. According to MG, Lori stated that once the apocalypse hit with earthquakes and other calamities, nobody would notice their relatives were gone. Of course Chad and Lori would survive all that.

 

[wnk]

interesting - see my previous post - where LE were told that Chad was absolutely not authorised to give a patriarchal blessing ( I gave the audio link where LE says that he's been informed by LDS that it was unauthorised)

Right. A patriarchal blessing (like CD gave AC) is different than a blessing of comfort and counsel (like MG wanted CD to give DW). The LDS is a very top-down religion, where the priesthood "keys" (which they believe were lost during the Great Apostacy after the Apostles' death and were only restored by Joseph Smith) play an important role in who's allowed to do what and who has authority over who. Men hold the "keys" over their own families; bishops hold the "keys" over the local congregations, and the prophet holds the "keys" over the entire church."


(SOURCE - highlighting mine)

 

[indicolite22]

But DW didn't believe what he was saying nor he didn't think CD had the authority to gather the 144k. I wouldn't call that a religious authority. Maybe to MG? But based on what DW stated, seems like an odd fit

DW did say that it was MG's idea to get a blessing from Chad. MG clearly believed that Chad had special powers. So did ZP and probably even Chad's family.

 

[Ruminations]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1649105769152004107

https://twitter.com/x/status/1649106205560958977

https://twitter.com/x/status/1649106207280619525

Right I. A really good host means you couldn't possibly murder. I get it./s

In seriousness, I'm trying to put together why Melanie seemed to discourage investigators to even try with David. She (who was extremely scattered, manic and forgetful) claimed that David couldn't remember anything that weekend. As if it were possible to be more forgetful than Melanie.

David didn't testify forgetfully.

He did seem hard to believe on points. Like- why go to the site where land was for sale at all when you were the one with the connections to developers, and you don't do business on Sunday?

He tried to frame the "crazy" as all Melanie's. Like he just indulged her getting Chad for a blessing. He also claimed that "others" call him a visionary; it's not his self- proclaimed gift. Yet, he gave an answer of sorts to distinguish dreams and visions.

Pizza man had me laughing- it is hard to stand out in this group. Yet, David is a contendah MOO

IMO.

 

[Cedars]

As the cult's leader, Chad was clearly a religious authority to them.

I get the impression DW didn't like or trust Chad, and kind of made that clear . But he knew MG was being influenced by him...at least through Lori. So if I were in those shoes, I'd tiptoe around it too, and not want to upset my girlfriend by creating a scene in my hostesses home.

I personally believe in and have experienced intuition in sensitive people. I've met people who I found creepy and it turned out later to be matched by their actions. Others have talked about this, that the first time they met someone, the hair stood up on the back of their head...and that person was a murderer. Chad's sister in-law Heather, talks in interviews on youtube, about how she never trusted him, she had a very bad feeling, but she didn't know why.

I don't believe MG was in on any conspiracy, otherwise in the phone call she recorded, Chad and Lori would not have said they knew where JJ was, but it wasn't safe to tell MG. They would have said 'hey, you know where JJ is, why are you acting dumb?

JMO

 

[LinasK]

Alex didn't die of a heart attack, it was a pulminary embolism. Its seems that Alex's death is just a weird coincidence.

Except that pulmonary embolisms can be induced by injecting air into veins.

 

[cottonweaver]

Didn't MG testify that Chad asked DW to keep it a secret that he and Lori were having an affair? Chad and Lori tried to convince the cult members that by being married in previous lives they were allowed to be unfaithful to their spouses.

I can't remember. ( This is the problem with following cases which take so long to get to trial)

'Chad and Lori tried to convince the cult members that by being married in previous lives they were allowed to be unfaithful to their spouses.'
That does sound very familiar because I recall them saying that the rules didn't apply to them.
However, as Melanie was 4.1 or 4 ( on Chad's levels charts, past probations etc) why do Melanie & David have to be given their own bedrooms in Lori's house? )

 

[Tortoise]

I get the impression DW didn't like or trust Chad, and kind of made that clear . But he knew MG was being influenced by him...at least through Lori. So if I were in those shoes, I'd tiptoe around it too, and not want to upset my girlfriend by creating a scene in my hostesses home.

I personally believe in and have experienced intuition in sensitive people. I've met people who I found creepy and it turned out later to be matched by their actions. Others have talked about this, that the first time they met someone, the hair stood up on the back of their head...and that person was a murderer. Chad's sister in-law Heather, talks in interviews on youtube, about how she never trusted him, she had a very bad feeling, but she didn't know why.

I don't believe MG was in on any conspiracy, otherwise in the phone call she recorded, Chad and Lori would not have said they knew where JJ was, but it wasn't safe to tell MG. They would have said 'hey, you know where JJ is, why are you acting dumb?

JMO

I've missed a lot of posts, so might be repeating a point, but it all fits that Chad said to MG on that call that she was being influenced against them by David.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

But what are the chances that he would quickly become dark if he contradicted Chad?

Guess we gotta ask Chad.