ID - Doomsday Cult Victims - Joshua Vallow, Tylee Ryan, Tammy Daybell, Charles Vallow *Arrests* #71

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Summary of tweets for Wednesday, April 26th -

State witness: Dr. Angi Christensen, forensic anthropologist for FBI.


Nate Eaton
@NateNewsNow
·
8h
We are back from the break. Dr. Angie Christensen is the next witness called by the state.

*Angi -- not Angie

Rachel Smith is questioning Dr. Christensen. She is a forensic anthropologist for the FBI in Quantico, Virginia where she has worked since 2004.

Christensen describes her credentials and training. "Forensic anthology is a specialized area that includes the analysis of skeletal remains."

Christensen says a medical examiner would refer skeletal remains to a forensic anthropologist is they wanted a more in-depth exam. She says generally the exam will begin with a visual assessment of the bones & could progress to looking at bones under a microscope or using x-rays

The Ada County Coroner requested help from Christensen. Christensen did the initial visual assessment, measured the bones, looked at some items with a microscope and did a CT scan of the bones. Christensen examined around 100 bones belonging to Tylee Ryan.

Christensen said all major parts of the skeleton were represented when she did the assessment.

Christensen said when she received the remains, they were "fragmented in nature" and a lot of them were burned. Three bones had sharp edges that were likely impacted by a tool.

Christensen asks if she can refer to her notes. Smith asks permission from the judge. The defense is reviewing the notes before permitting them in.

Lori is whispering with her attorneys. They have no problem with the notes and the bailiff gives them to Dr. Christensen. Christensen says at least one bone was bent or hinged.

Christensen says there was evidence the bones were subjected to thermal damage. Burning changes the color of the bone to tan, black and eventually white.

Christensen says she documented her findings in a report and photographs were taken in her exam notes. Smith asks to admit a report as evidence.

Thomas is questioning Christensen about the validity of photos in her presentation.

The photos are admitted into evidence. Christensen says there was one bone that had "carnivore activity" -- some sort of mammal had chewed on it.

The first photo is shown on the big screen. It shows portions of Tylee's left and right femur. On the backside of these bones is where Christensen found the carnivore activity.

We now see a picture of a human skeleton and Christensen shows where the femur is on the body. She points to the legs. The next photo shows three parts of Tylee's skull. On the right side of the face and upper jaw bone, there is a blackened area that was altered from heat.

Lori continues to look down - not at the screen showing her daughter's bones.

Christensen also points out thermal damage to the jaw bone. Christensen has experience in bone trauma. She says there is blunt trauma, sharp trauma & high-velocity trauma. Christensen identified sharp trauma on three of Tylee's bones - the left & right hip bones & back of pelvis

Something with a "small service area" caused trauma to these bones, Christensen says. She is not sure what tool was used to cause the trauma.

The next exhibit is a photo that shows the sharp alterations on the bones. Christensen says there were five areas of sharp trauma on the left hip bone and they were not the result of disease process.

Christensen says an "external force" was imposed on the bone. She has experience looking at bodies that have been dismembered. "Typically sharp trauma in dismemberment cases appear around joints," she says.

Christensen says the images we are saying are not consistent with dismemberment because they are not near joints. "The purpose of dismemberment is to break the body into smaller pieces. In this case, all of the sharp traumas are in the area of the pelvic region."

You can see evidence of the sharp trauma in some bones on both sides - meaning the instrument went all the way through.

We now see images of a CT scan Christensen performed. She points out areas of sharp trauma on the bones in the pubic region.

Court is adjourned for the day.

Sketches from today include FBI Special Agent Steve Daniels, Forensic Pathologist Dr. Garth Warren and FBI Forensic Anthropologist Dr. Angi Christensen.

Daniels.jpg Warren.jpg Angi.jpg


link: https://twitter.com/NateNewsNow
 
Thursday, April 27th:
*Trial continues (Day 12) (@ 8:30am – 3:30pm MT) – ID – Joshua Jaxon (JJ) Vallow (7) & Tylee Ashlyn Ryan (16) (JJ last seen Sept. 23, 2019 & Tylee on Sept. 9, 2019, Rexburg; found June 9, 2020 buried in Daybell’s yard in Salem, ID) – *Lori Norene Vallow aka Lori Norene Daybell (46/now 49) arrested (in Kauai, Hawaii on 2/20/20) & indicted & charged (5/25/21) & re-arraigned (4/19/22) with Count 1 (for Tylee): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder & grand theft by deception (for Daybell, Vallow & Alex Cox) & other co-conspirators. Count 2 (for Tylee): 1st degree murder. Count 3 (for JJ): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder & grand theft by deception. Count 4 (for JJ): 1st degree murder. Count 5 (for Tammy): Conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder. Count 6: Lori only: Grand theft (related to social security survivor benefits allocated for the care of minors Tylee & JJ). Plead not guilty. DA will seek DP. Was transferred to Ada County jail on 3/22/23. Fremont County
Conspiracy to commit destruction, alteration or concealment of evidence charges dismissed without prejudice on 7/29/21. Fremont County
Resisting or obstructing LE, solicitation of a crime & contempt of court. All charges were dismissed on 1/3/22. Madison County
Trial began on 4/3/23 with jury selection & ended 4/7/23. 12 jurors & 6 alternates (10 men & 8 women).
Trial began on 4/10/23 (thru 6/9/23) @ 8:30am to 3:30pm. Trial will be held in Ada County. (will last about 10 weeks) Trials have been severed.

Arrest & Grand Jury & Competency & Court info from 3/5/20 thru 3/30/23 & Jury Selection Day 1-5 (4/3-4/7/23) & Trial Day 1-10 (4/10-4/25/23) reference post #518 here:
ttps://www.websleuths.com/forums/th...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-71.675381/page-26

4/26/23 Wednesday, Trial Day 11: State witness: FBI Special Agent Steve Daniels, Evidence Response Team (ERT) (returns on stand).
For more info see posts #652 here:
ttps://www.websleuths.com/forums/th...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-71.675381/page-33
State witness: Dr. Garth Warren, forensic pathologist; did autopsy of JJ & Tylee.
For more info see posts #702 [pg 36] & 840 here:
ttps://www.websleuths.com/forums/th...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-71.675381/page-42
State witness: Dr. Angi Christensen, forensic anthropologist for FBI.
For more info see posts #841 here:
ttps://www.websleuths.com/forums/th...bell-charles-vallow-arrests-71.675381/page-43
Trial continues on Thursday, 4/27/23 @ 8:30am & ends every day at 3:30pm.

*Chad Guy Daybell (53/now 54) – Pretrial motions hearing on 3/2/23. Trial was set to begin on 4/3/23 was vacated.
 
How is JJ not trying to pull the bag off before his hands are duct-taped? You'd need someone to handle the head, and another person to handle the hands IMO.
He is, as per testimony yesterday. I think the initial stages were done when JJ was still asleep, but now agree that two people were most likely involved.
 
Because the brutality of it was the point.

What happened to JJ was my worst case scenario, what I hoped against but expected had happened the moment I heard about the bag. All I could think of was the Otero family. It's slow, and it's cruel, and it's painful, and it's terrifying.

I know a lot of what they said about Tylee revolved around the fact that they couldn't be certain. I had hoped she had been shot or sedated before any of the other stuff happened. I am so relieved she was unlikely to have been burnt alive; I hadn't even gone there. But the other tool marks on her bones that don't fit with a purely practical dismemberment give me pause and make me fear that, like JJ, her death was closer to torture than anything else. That maybe that's why they tried to destroy her so entirely. Given the trappings of this case, it makes my brain go to the darker, more brutal sides of Mormon history, like blood atonement, for example. It makes me wonder if there was something ritual here, if only for 'show' to convince Alex that it was a righteous action.

If they had wanted to kill these kids quick, clean and painless, they could easily have. They had plenty of guns, they had access to drugs, and the kids were completely trusting and dependent on them. They could have dosed them then shot them in their sleep. Instead they chose methods of pure sadism, depravity, and prolonged terror. Then they disposed of them like garbage or wild animals.

MOO
I’m not so sure. It could be that the ‘tool’ (pick axe?) was used to break up the body whilst it was burning. That’s what I’m hoping the pathologist will say today.
 
No, sorry, would take too long to re-find, he said it in week 1 but there'll be a news clip somewhere online

alternatively, the last link I posted to an STS commentary show - the one with Greg & Chris on panel- has Greg Skordas attorney discussing it. Hellis has also talked about it in her interviews
 
I’m not so sure. It could be that the ‘tool’ (pick axe?) was used to break up the body whilst it was burning. That’s what I’m hoping the pathologist will say today.
That's what I've been thinking all along. It sounded like the damage was to her pubic area. That's just too sick for me to think was intentional. I'm thinking randomly trying to break up the body at the biggest bones. Still pretty sick of course but keeps me from having to go "there."
 
I don’t understand why they wouldn’t have chosen a gun shot to the head as opposed to dealing with complicated resistance from them. Why worry with a bag over the head, duct tape, body parts manipulation?
LV had said something about binding and burning being ways to cast out the evil spirits. When I first heard one child was burned and the other was bound that’s the first thing i thought about. But I am not sure that binding one alive and burning the other after death is what they were doing or not.

Another thing that has me puzzled is that I think AC was only at the Daybell property for a couple of hours the day Tylee would have been buried - from around 930 to 11 something I think. I don’t know what to make of her injuries or where she was when she was killed, but i would think burning a body and then burying the remains would take longer than a couple of hours.

I think LV & CD will try to make this all look like AC did it and all they did was cover it up. But I think the timeline and the autopsies show they were involved every step of the way.
 
LV had said something about binding and burning being ways to cast out the evil spirits. When I first heard one child was burned and the other was bound that’s the first thing i thought about. But I am not sure that binding one alive and burning the other after death is what they were doing or not.

Another thing that has me puzzled is that I think AC was only at the Daybell property for a couple of hours the day Tylee would have been buried - from around 930 to 11 something I think. I don’t know what to make of her injuries or where she was when she was killed, but i would think burning a body and then burying the remains would take longer than a couple of hours.

I think LV & CD will try to make this all look like AC did it and all they did was cover it up. But I think the timeline and the autopsies show they were involved every step of the way.
After Alex left Chad's property on Sept 9, Chad sent the infamous raccoon text to Tammy, implying that the burial was finished. It does look like that it took some time before they realized that they would not be able to destroy the remains by burning to the degree they anticipated.
 
JJ's aunt (KW's daughter):

Prior to his vanishing in September 2019, Kresha said she noticed that Lori wasn't keeping JJ's fingernails clipped and that he had "longer nails" than usual.

"I’ve always pictured him clawing and fighting until the bitter end," she added.

"I pray there’s DNA under his nails and it nails Chad and Lori both.


 
Did the court sketch artist depict locations of the cuts in this drawing?

FurXnEyaEAEJLBE

 

Ethanol (alcohol) is also a naturally occurring substance post mortem. This was most recently discussed in the Kiely Rodin case IIRC. They couldn’t ascertain whether the levels in her blood were due to drinking before death, or metabolites after she died.
 
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I’m not so sure. It could be that the ‘tool’ (pick axe?) was used to break up the body whilst it was burning. That’s what I’m hoping the pathologist will say today.

Yes hopefully we'll get more info today
- 'tool' damage before the pyre or after ( or maybe it's impossible for the forensic path to say?)
- is there no way to determine from teeth marks the type of mammal involved? ( rodents do tunnel and burrow & consume underground, other animals more likely to dig up up remains to consume)
- is it possible that there were several attempts at burning parts or impossible to determine? ( That neighbour said big bonfire in fall and a couple in the spring)

re JJ, would have been interested to hear
- whether finger clipping scrapings returned any results ( because we've been discussing struggle & poss of sedation)
- matching of duct tape types to those found in Alex's possession or via receipts etc ( am assuming there wasn't)
- about the bruising on the fingers & what that is specifically suggestive of as in Nate's tweet (trodden, trapped?)

evidence from previous days


also in Nate's tweets from 14 April 2023, re seeking bogus, extra justification for the next murder: 'Lori told Melanie that Moroni appeared to her in a temple on Sept. 22. Melanie says the last time she saw JJ was on Sept. 22 as Alex was taking JJ upstairs.'
 
Did the court sketch artist depict locations of the cuts in this drawing?

FurXnEyaEAEJLBE

not sure whether that's meant to be a depiction of the right or left pelvic bone

anyway, this also stands out 'You can see evidence of the sharp trauma in some bones on both sides - meaning the instrument went all the way through.' ( Nate's tweet of her evidence)
To a layperson that sounds like it requires a very sharp tool but it's hard to ascertain due to the brevity of testimony.

I only ask because Alex had samurai swords & some were found in townhomes closet ( naturally I don't think AC would have cleaned a sword & put it back in closet but did he have a wider collection? Ditto tactical knives were also found in storage unit)
 
not sure whether that's meant to be a depiction of the right or left pelvic bone

anyway, this also stands out 'You can see evidence of the sharp trauma in some bones on both sides - meaning the instrument went all the way through.' ( Nate's tweet of her evidence)
To a layperson that sounds like it requires a very sharp tool but it's hard to ascertain due to the brevity of testimony.

I only ask because Alex had samurai swords & some were found in townhomes closet ( naturally I don't think AC would have cleaned a sword & put it back in closet but did he have a wider collection? Ditto tactical knives were also found in storage unit)
In the recording the expert described several cuts on the picture of the left pelvic bone and the shape also points to the left one, unless it's the back of the bone.

Also Gigi's tweet:
Sharp trauma: 1. Left pelvic bone with arrows point to the sharp tool marks on the front and back of the bone. She identified 5 sharp traumas.


IMO one of the Chad's tools was most likely used, perhaps a pick axe.
 
Alex texted ZP on Sept 1 that Tylee was a dark portal. Then they were joking about creating an inner tornado for her (ZP thought she could manipulate the weather). IMO he probably knew before they left Arizona that Tylee would be murdered. Alex believed everything Chad and Lori said about zombies.

disgusting. need to eliminate Tylee possibly as early as spring?

I got through the full Attwood interview & in that Attwood says that LV described her as a plague ( you tube link) Unclear due to informality of the LEO, whether LV used this specific word or whether it's Attwood's. Attwood also says wtte of zombie Tylee was interfering w LV's mission & this started in spring.

( Also notice that at the same time, 22nd Sept, LV is claiming visions of Moroni at temple -Gigi's tweet. Firing-up Alex with claims of revelations?)


To not leave any evidence of a bloody dismemberment in that barn must have have taken full planning. Full tarps & drapes? No receipts? ( AC knew he could readily buy plastic drop cloths from Walmart cause he went there with Zulema in November)
 
In the recording the expert described several cuts on the picture of the left pelvic bone and the shape also points to the left one, unless it's the back of the bone.

Also Gigi's tweet:
Sharp trauma: 1. Left pelvic bone with arrows point to the sharp tool marks on the front and back of the bone. She identified 5 sharp traumas.


IMO one of the Chad's tools was most likely used, perhaps a pick axe.

yes while I recall the DNA on the pick axe, those piercings in the illustration look elongated & the forensic path says she cannot say ( The ' Body Farm' databases of their trials & experiments?)
Hopefully somebody like Jo Scott Morgan will do a podcast of his thoughts on what he's heard
 
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also in Nate's tweets from 14 April 2023, re seeking bogus, extra justification for the next murder: 'Lori told Melanie that Moroni appeared to her in a temple on Sept. 22. Melanie says the last time she saw JJ was on Sept. 22 as Alex was taking JJ upstairs.'
SBM. Was that Moroni appearance in 2018? It would have been before Lori and Chad's first meeting. Did it happen when Lori gave testimony at MG's house in October 2018 (pre-Chad)? It contained her first Nephi/murder reference (this time about Joe Ryan):

“I was going to murder him,” Daybell said in the audio. “I was going to kill him like the scriptures say. Like Nephi (another Book of Mormon prophet) killed … just to stop the pain and to stop him coming after me and to stop him coming after my children.”


It appears Lori independently believed that scripture gave her permission to kill (even before she became untouchable as the leader of the 144k) and compared herself to Nephi in both Joe's and Charles' cases. But only Charles was deemed a zombie.
 
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SBM. Was that Moroni appearance in 2018? It would be before Lori met Chad but was it after she met MG?
no 2019, same date that Tylee was seen alive, according to Nate

( re previous claims of visitations, Zulema testified that the very first time Z was introduced to LV, by MG, LV was already claiming she'd been visited by Moroni & other angels and had personally seen Jesus Christ. I haven't looked for any examples which pre-date Chad)
 
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