Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #49

[Dorothy Jane]

Regarding JJ being alive or not when MG and DW saw AxC carry him in, I just keep thinking that carrying a dead body in front of two people not involved in the whole thing seems like something even this merry band of idiots wouldn't do. What if the head/neck or one of the limbs ended up flopping out of the "cozy sleepy" position in Alex's arms? I just don't think they had enough up close and personal experience with dead bodies to be comfortable parading one in front of people to pass it off as alive.

I would believe that JJ was sedated in his uncle's arms.

When I heard about all the duct tape and how the body was positioned with the duct tape, it made me think this was some sort of ceremonial thing. If Joe Ryan was cremated, and one of those documents CD provided LV on the darkness levels of people around her referenced JR as "sealed away," or something similar, here's my thought. If Tylee and JJ were both "zombies," they tried to cremate Tylee's body to also "seal it away." But upon seeing how much time it took and how difficult it was to burn a body completely, they couldn't do the same with JJ--not with Tammy sleeping in the house or soon to return from work. So perhaps the duct tape was used to create something almost like the wrappings of a mummy, to "seal" him away as well.

But then I was watching Court TV tonight and they had on someone from FSU who was a certified crime scene investigator, and he suggested that the elaborate taping was done to "contract" the body, to make it fit into a tight space and to better ensure it didn't move much later as it decomposed, so the ground above it wouldn't cave in. This makes sense to me. Also, I thought that having the body basically all taped together like that would make it more difficult for an animal to dig up the body and make off with singular bones. They wanted that body to go underground and stay there in one piece. JMO

That is exactly what I thought. It was to make the body more compact.

 

[ab-initio]

1- MG call- It was obviously scripted and even LV mentioned if you’re recording this for the police, etc…MG was 100,000,000,000% covering herself. She said she talked to Al, your brother…Really? She was obviously prepared. Her questions were pointed and while her responses were smooth, it was clear she had an agenda on the call and was called out for it. I’m happy the 2 people on the other end were dumb enough to keep the dialogue going…even when it’s clear they sensed a motive. Who does that???

Totally scripted.

Why did she call CD's phone when she intended to talk to LV? I found that bit a little ... strange.

Also, I felt once they started going back and forth on scripture talk, LV was very leading in what happened to JJ. If you listen, she talks about burying, and I don't think that's an accident. She draws MG's attention to it several times. Then, the fact that MG says her conscience is clear -- gross. A child was clearly in danger; whereabouts unconfirmed, mom lying to LE ... how strong was the Kool Aid that these 2 were pouring that MG thought she was not complicit by not taking action?

Yes. I wondered also that Tylee was burned alive then dismembered.
These murderers were telling each other they were killing evil spirits. Showing an evil spirit no mercy seems part of their program.

There was talk about that during the taped call, too. Inaction by MG is really hard for me to forgive right now.

Interesting that LV called her dead husband her ex husband in the LE bodycam audio. Also, that she said AlC was at the house earlier with HIS friend, CD. Zero mention of her own relationship with him.
Yet CD's lawyer was attempting to make very clear that LE never SAW CD at the residence with AlC --- leads me to believe this is where the blame is going to be laid.

Lastly -- what the hell is with LV trying to get their friend to take JJ by telling her she had breast cancer??? A child who was as 'significantly special needs' as she claims he was in her body cam audio would not bounce a child around ... especially to another woman who allegedly has a high needs child as well.

I loathe all of the players here.


EDIT: formatting the multi-quotes ... it's been a little while since I've sleuthed, and this has brought me back. Hi, everyone!

 

[Lionsanddandelions]

Regarding JJ being alive or not when MG and DW saw AxC carry him in, I just keep thinking that carrying a dead body in front of two people not involved in the whole thing seems like something even this merry band of idiots wouldn't do. What if the head/neck or one of the limbs ended up flopping out of the "cozy sleepy" position in Alex's arms? I just don't think they had enough up close and personal experience with dead bodies to be comfortable parading one in front of people to pass it off as alive.

I would believe that JJ was sedated in his uncle's arms.

When I heard about all the duct tape and how the body was positioned with the duct tape, it made me think this was some sort of ceremonial thing. If Joe Ryan was cremated, and one of those documents CD provided LV on the darkness levels of people around her referenced JR as "sealed away," or something similar, here's my thought. If Tylee and JJ were both "zombies," they tried to cremate Tylee's body to also "seal it away." But upon seeing how much time it took and how difficult it was to burn a body completely, they couldn't do the same with JJ--not with Tammy sleeping in the house or soon to return from work. So perhaps the duct tape was used to create something almost like the wrappings of a mummy, to "seal" him away as well.

But then I was watching Court TV tonight and they had on someone from FSU who was a certified crime scene investigator, and he suggested that the elaborate taping was done to "contract" the body, to make it fit into a tight space and to better ensure it didn't move much later as it decomposed, so the ground above it wouldn't cave in. This makes sense to me. Also, I thought that having the body basically all taped together like that would make it more difficult for an animal to dig up the body and make off with singular bones. They wanted that body to go underground and stay there in one piece. JMO

Agree with all of this! You've summarized quite a few threads of thought I had as well, but which I couldn't fully tie together and articulate.

 

[Michael0808]

It's a community property state and while no one knows the exact details of CV policy, it does seem as thought the odds are she would have been entitled to 1/2 (even if CV made KW the beneficiary) unless LV would have signed that over which obviously didn't happen. In my opinion, I think she would have gotten $500k had she pursued it differently

This was discussed at length and was an awesome topic but it may have been before you were on this thread. If you look at thread #32 and #33 there is some excellent info. I'm just going to post a starting point but you can go back/forward however you'd like Found Deceased - ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #32

ETA @KonaHonu since we haven't seen him in a bit

Well, I spent time as a life insurance agent. And it’s not community property when a beneficiary is named by the owner of the policy.
Perhaps the idea of community property may come into play as far as the value of a variable or whole life policy at the time of divorce as they do accrue value over a lifetime.
But upon death, the beneficiary is the beneficiary. If CV made KW the beneficiary there is no way for Lori Daybell to pursue or claim any amount from that policy. That’s just how life insurance works.
Jmo

 

[nodamselindistress]

Totally scripted.

Why did she call CD's phone when she intended to talk to LV? I found that bit a little ... strange.

She stated before she could not get in touch with Lori on her 3 phones, she never knew which phone Lori was using; She said in the Nate Eaton interview that she got in touch with Lori on Chad's phone (guessing they did not think that one was being followed)

 

[Boxer]

Totally scripted.

Why did she call CD's phone when she intended to talk to LV? I found that bit a little ... strange.

Also, I felt once they started going back and forth on scripture talk, LV was very leading in what happened to JJ. If you listen, she talks about burying, and I don't think that's an accident. She draws MG's attention to it several times. Then, the fact that MG says her conscience is clear -- gross. A child was clearly in danger; whereabouts unconfirmed, mom lying to LE ... how strong was the Kool Aid that these 2 were pouring that MG thought she was not complicit by not taking action?



There was talk about that during the taped call, too. Inaction by MG is really hard for me to forgive right now.

Interesting that LV called her dead husband her ex husband in the LE bodycam audio. Also, that she said AlC was at the house earlier with HIS friend, CD. Zero mention of her own relationship with him.
Yet CD's lawyer was attempting to make very clear that LE never SAW CD at the residence with AlC --- leads me to believe this is where the blame is going to be laid.

Lastly -- what the hell is with LV trying to get their friend to take JJ by telling her she had breast cancer??? A child who was as 'significantly special needs' as she claims he was in her body cam audio would not bounce a child around ... especially to another woman who allegedly has a high needs child as well.

I loathe all of the players here.


EDIT: formatting the multi-quotes ... it's been a little while since I've sleuthed, and this has brought me back. Hi, everyone!

Yes, detectives must have been very challenged to have to parsed out and unraveled so much lying.

 

[pizzaman12]

How so?
ETA life insurance is not an entitlement. The beneficiary is the beneficiary named in the contract paid for by the owner of the contract.

BBM- I replied earlier but saw you added...The "beneficiary is the beneficiary" is not always the case. Community property states (where there are not alot of) are a whole different raccoon...I mean animal

 

[Michael0808]

She stated before she could not get in touch with Lori on her 3 phones, she never knew which phone Lori was using; She said in the Nate Eaton interview that she got in touch with Lori on Chad's phone (guessing they did not think that one was being followed)

There is so much to unwrap in that phone call. Surreal!

 

[ab-initio]

She stated before she could not get in touch with Lori on her 3 phones, she never knew which phone Lori was using; She said in the Nate Eaton interview that she got in touch with Lori on Chad's phone (guessing they did not think that one was being followed)

Ahh, thank you. I didn't catch that.

 

[Forever Young]

Which I still think LV would have been entitled to 1/2 of it

I have thought about this, as well. Had JJ been kept alive and in the good care of Lori, CV's will could have been challenged in court.

Lori surely knew this, but didn't want to mess around with it. This, and the manner in which Tylee and JJ were killed lead me to still think that Lori did have delusional thinking that they were zombies.

 

[Michael0808]

I have thought about this, as well. Had JJ been kept alive and in the good care of Lori, CV's will could have been challenged in court.

Lori surely knew this, but didn't want to mess around with it. This, and the manner in which Tylee and JJ were killed lead me to still think that Lori did have delusional thinking that they were zombies.

This wasn’t a will. It was a life insurance policy. The beneficiary is the person the owner of the policy assigns.
ETA Clearly CV had amazing foresight in changing the beneficiary of his policy. And perhaps hoped that JJ would be taken care of. That man fought like hell for JJ. Even through that act.
Jmo

 

[Forever Young]

How so?
ETA life insurance is not an entitlement. The beneficiary is the beneficiary named in the contract paid for by the owner of the contract.

Most states provide at least 50% survivor's benefit of all assets to the spouse. The insurance policy was an asset. JMO

 

[Michael0808]

Most states provide at least 50% survivor's benefit of all assets to the spouse. The insurance policy was an asset. JMO

<modsnip> A life insurance policy is a private contract between the insured and the insurer. The beneficiary is the beneficiary.
It’s only an asset while the insured is living. As in a whole life or universal policy that builds cash value. Upon death, only the beneficiary has claim.
Jmo

 

[Joey2407]

Believe me, I know. I agree. I'm not on CD's side. I'm just viewing the evidence presented and how Prior is going to spin it. Prior made sure to stress that it may have been Alex's device, but there's no proof it was Alex using it. I fear he may do the same concerning the text. It may have been Chad's device, but there is no proof it was Chad that used it. This is all a huge take down of one person only. Things are NOT looking good for Lori at all.

Maybe it was the non-existent raccoon playing tricks with their phones! Sorry, I couldn't resist!

 

[TTF14]

What I mean by that is he seemed to have a deep fascination with the proceedings of court, paying attention to every little detail and word that was said. Even though he sat stone cold through most of the hearing, betraying little emotion, there was an intense look of interest and even thrill with the whole courtroom experience. It's as if he wasn't there as a defendant, but rather as an author witnessing the courtroom drama, soaking it in and gathering source material for his next book.

rsbm

Agree, but nothing, nobody, nowhere, ever could rival Mark Sievers' display during his trial. He was Chad Daybell on crack, taking furious notes and even smiling and cracking jokes.

 

[Boxer]

Liked and agree with much but drowning TD?

MOO drowned in her own fluids. A savage way to go,

"According to colleague Mandy Fowler, the day after her friend's death, she met with Tammy's daughter Emma - who shared concerns with her and others about having seen her dead mother with pink foam coming out of her mouth, the East Idaho News reports."

Spotlight on wife's mysterious death after children's remains found

Pink foam symptoms, shown up in many deaths, But I think all include the lungs filling with fluid.

Overdose
Cardiopulmonary arrest
Sarin poisoning
Carbon dioxide poisoning
Secondary drowning

 

[Onsdag]

One thing that has bothered me for a long time now, ever since Chad was arrested, charged, and the probable cause affidavit was released, is why is there no information or evidence concerning Chad's cell data? It's clear they have data pinning Alex' exact location and times at Lori's place and Chad's house during the children's disappearance and burials, but why haven't they provided Chad's? He obviously texted Tammy with an alibi about killing and burying a raccoon on their property on one of the days, so his cell data should be quite incriminating in that regard. And yet such information has been disturbingly absent from both the probable cause affidavit and also now at the preliminary hearing. They spent so much time today entering in Alex' cell data as evidence, but nothing on Chad's.

I just don't understand why they wouldn't want (or be able) to bring forth evidence of Chad's whereabouts during the times in question and instead try relying upon Alex' data in order to try incriminating Chad. Anyone know why this is? Are they trying to keep his data as a secret ace up their sleeves for the trial itself? Might they not have it for some reason? Something else?

 

[Michael0808]

One thing that has bothered me for a long time now, ever since Chad was arrested, charged, and the probable cause affidavit was released, is why is there no information or evidence concerning Chad's cell data? It's clear they have data pinning Alex' exact location and times at Lori's place and Chad's house during the children's disappearance and burials, but why haven't they provided Chad's? He obviously texted Tammy with an alibi about killing and burying a raccoon on their property on one of the days, so his cell data should be quite incriminating in that regard. And yet such information has been disturbingly absent from both the probable cause affidavit and also now at the preliminary hearing. They spent so much time today entering in Alex' cell data as evidence, but nothing on Chad's.

I just don't understand why they wouldn't want (or be able) to bring forth evidence of Chad's whereabouts during the times in question and instead try relying upon Alex' data in order to try incriminating Chad. Anyone know why this is? Are they trying to keep his data as a secret ace up their sleeves for the trial itself? Might they not have it for some reason? Something else?

I have this same question! For instance if they are going to try to claim Chad wasn’t there when the children were horrifically disposed of, wouldn’t his cell phone data show otherwise?
Or maybe that’s why the defense spent so much time trying to establish that devices present don’t mean person present. Just some thoughts. It’s a lot to digest.

 

[Emi]

[URL='https://twitter.com/ericgrossarth']Eric Grossarth @ericgrossarth 1h[/URL]

This is the phone call played in court today where Melanie Gibb confronts Chad and Lori Daybell about her two missing kids. I will be back to the courthouse early tomorrow morning for day two of the #ChadDaybell preliminary hearing. #CrimeWatch


LISTEN: Melanie Gibb confronts Lori and Chad Daybell in phone call | East Idaho News
ST. ANTHONY — A phone confrontation between Melanie Gibb and former friends Chad and Lori Daybell was streamed around the world Monday during Chad Daybell’s preliminary hearing in Fremont County. The...
eastidahonews.com

 

[kshultz06082]

I have this same question! For instance if they are going to try to claim Chad wasn’t there when the children were horrifically disposed of, wouldn’t his cell phone data show otherwise?
Or maybe that’s why the defense spent so much time trying to establish that devices present don’t mean person present. Just some thoughts. It’s a lot to digest.

IMO it's being saved for either this trial or hopefully, eventually, the murder/conspiracy trial. IMO RW wants to save CD and LVs reactions to this info for a jury. Also, I think by sharing ACs, he is testing out what the defense will do with this type of info. ACs phone info is a safe bet because IMO even if it gets thrown out somehow, he will know better how to play his hand with the other co-defendants cell phone data and yes, I do 100% believe he has the data from all the 60+ phones and is going to drop that info and make a crater sized hole in both their defense plans.

Jmo.