Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #52

[salberg7]

The satellite photo showing Tylee's grave was taken on September 9 by a French satellite Pléiades 1. The resolution was one pixel per 50cm.


Are you thinking the FBI used this picture in June? I’m trying to figure out where this is going.

 

[salberg7]

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you. One point was addressed, and then in later back forth the rest came out to give overview to others here on all of it.

MOO

Thanks for that! I just wasn’t sure where the poster was going. It’s all good. It doesn’t matter if folks disagree with me. We are all different and that’s part of sleuthing.

 

[ivegotthemic]

I think that proving CD and LVD had a long term romantic relationship prior to LVD moving to Rexburg, ID shows premeditation and intent to kill Tylee and JJ. It is part of the whole conspiracy piece.

As for character, cheating on your spouse is probably not a yardstick for "bad" character, but it doesn't look good for CD. And the evidence of the affair could be helpful for a probable cause in charging LVD with conspiracy in Charles Vallow's murder.

I think that proving CD and LVD had a long term romantic relationship prior to LVD moving to Rexburg, ID shows premeditation and intent to kill Tylee and JJ. It is part of the whole conspiracy piece.

As for character, cheating on your spouse is probably not a yardstick for "bad" character, but it doesn't look good for CD. And the evidence of the affair could be helpful for a probable cause in charging LVD with conspiracy in Charles Vallow's murder.

Apologies, I dont think i explained this well... so basically Evidence of a person's character or character trait is not admissible to prove that on a particular occasion the person acted in accordance with the character or trait. So for example if someone lies to his wife and has in the past, it cant be admitted to show that since he lied all those other times in this situation he lied too. also Evidence of a crime, wrong, or other act is not admissible to prove a person's character in order to show that on a particular occasion the person acted in accordance with the character. So If the evidence is offered only to produce the ‘forbidden inference’—that the defendant acted badly in the past, and that the defendant's present, charged actions conform with those past bad acts—then the evidence is inadmissible because it can unfairly prejudice the jury against a defendant. I was basically trying to say From the courts perspective the mere fact that someone is a cheater doesnt mean hes a killer. Bruce v. State, 268 Ind. 180, 375 N.E.2d 1042, 1077–1078, 1 A.L.R.4th 616 (1978) (evidence of sexual conduct admissible to prove identity of killer in murder prosecution). Now there are several exceptions to these rules that apply in very specific circumstances and truly some of the laws are written broadly so admittance its left solely to the judge and that can vary widely. Honestly evidence law is the worst so im sorry if im not explaining it well.

 

[Leader6518]

....and so that made it okie dokey that she bought his bs.. and his reason to bury the children in his yard and marry her afterwards and deny knowing the children were not "safe". etc. etc. etc.



Doesn't matter, just a bunch of yelling SQUIRREL in my opinion.

IMO Prior never really brought any of his questioning to a logical point. It seemed questions were like throwing darts in the dark. He wasn’t performing in front of a jury. He was trying to convince the judge the evidence did not implicate CD. I think it was a hopeless cause, but he had to do something. I think we are confused because Prior didn’t intent to argue the case because he didn’t have a case and he didn’t want to show his defense strategy before trial.

We are all left scratching our heads wondering what he was doing. He was killing time until the trial he knew was inevitable.

 

[ivegotthemic]

IMO Prior never really brought any of his questioning to a logical point. It seemed questions were like throwing darts in the dark. He wasn’t performing in front of a jury. He was trying to convince the judge the evidence did not implicate CD. I think it was a hopeless cause, but he had to do something. I think we are confused because Prior didn’t intent to argue the case because he didn’t have a case and he didn’t want to show his defense strategy before trial.

We are all left scratching our heads wondering what he was doing. He was killing time until the trial he knew was inevitable.

I agree, im sure he was well aware he wasnt going to win before stepping in court so they best he could do for his client was try to call any amount of questionability on what was being presented. I know people thought he was being aggressive, and well i wasnt a fan of his style I did think he did a good job representing his client. If you know you got nothing it doesnt hurt to just throw stuff out there

 

[indicolite22]

This photo was released by the media not the FBI, yes?

“indicolite22 said: ↑
The only satellite photo that I'm aware of was obtained by news media and shows disturbed ground just hours after Tylee was buried on September 9”

Since then you’ve learned there were satellite images used by the FBI to ID the fire pit per SA Daniels per the YouTube videos above.

The fire pit and other general features (buildings, exits) can be easily found on Google Maps or similar. You couldn't see the graves on those images. Existence of a fire pit does not imply that bodies are buried nearby. According to the FBI agent himself, he didn't use aerial imagery to obtain the potential locations of the bodies. The satellite image (taken by a French satellite) I pointed out was taken on a specific date of interest when Tylee's grave was fresh. Images taken 8 months later would very likely not have shown graves.

First you stated you had thought the only clue LE had as to the location of the bodies was AxC cell phone pings.

I'm well aware of what brought police to the property. It's in the affidavit. It was Alex Cox's phone pings, Chad's raccoon texts and Tammy's sister's confirmation of the location of the pet cemetery. Ping location was rather specific - pet cemetery and near the tree at the back of the property.

 

[wiggy]

What if Chad wanted to sell the property and move? He would have lost control.

Tammy and Chad’s children, I would bet. There also was a statue of a dog there as well designating it as such. I believe an animal’s remains were found near Tylee.

I just can’t fathom why Chad thought to bury the kids there. I heard the FBI scanned the area from the air and was able to determine areas of more density which in turn led to discovery of the bodies. Unless he really believed that LE would NOT think to search his land because in Chad’s mind it would be too obvious. More irrational thinking on CD’s part.

Makes me think of the YouTube attorney Scott R’s “dumb criminal of the week” feature.


And Tammy was still alive then! What the heck was he thinking?

I also wanted to quote Spartygirl’s post that indicolite22’s replied to (first quote above), but I’m either having some issues with the WS site, or it’s been deleted for some reason. (Since it’s still quoted within indicolite22’s post, I didn’t think it would be deleted?) Anyway, sorry @Spartygirl. I tried to find it—because I totally agree with you that burying the kids on the property was about control and the mistaken belief that they could better avoid discovery of the bodies there.

IMO, Chad and Lori wanted to have an eye on the bodies at all times; they didn’t want any surprises when they turned on the news in the morning. You know that saying, “Keep your friends close, but keep your enemies closer?” In a strange way, that’s what I think was going on here. In this case, the bodies of the children were their enemies because of the repercussions if they were found, including the undoing of their plans and lifestyle. So they kept them close in order to monitor them.

Chad and Lori wanted to keep them on the property because they could theoretically ensure that a search warrant would be required to find them, as long as Chad own of that property. That idea is flawed for a number of reasons, including: (a) the possibility that Chad’s family could accidentally find the children; (b) Chad would need to maintain ownership of that property forever, or future owners could consent to a police search; (c) the potential that police could (and did!) get enough probable cause for a search warrant.

But IMO, the flaws wouldn’t have deterred Chad and Lori because they thought themselves sophisticated criminals. They thought that Chad could handle his family, and they believed that they had covered their tracks well enough that police wouldn’t be able to establish probable cause. However, among other failures, they failed to account for current LE methods and technology for obtaining evidence. They didn’t anticipate the possible use of drones or satellite imagery, for instance. (They anticipated the risks posed by cell phones, but they mitigated those risks terribly, as demonstrated by apparently keeping 60 burners around and allowing Alex to wander everywhere with his cell phone.)

All JMO.

 

[ivegotthemic]

I also wanted to quote Spartygirl’s post that indicolite22’s replied to (first quote above), but I’m either having some issues with the WS site, or it’s been deleted for some reason. (Since it’s still quoted within indicolite22’s post, I didn’t think it would be deleted?) Anyway, sorry @Spartygirl. I tried to find it—because I totally agree with you that burying the kids on the property was about control and the mistaken belief that they could better avoid discovery of the bodies there.

IMO, Chad and Lori wanted to have an eye on the bodies at all times; they didn’t want any surprises when they turned on the news in the morning. You know that saying, “Keep your friends close, but keep your enemies closer?” In a strange way, that’s what I think was going on here. In this case, the bodies of the children were their enemies because of the repercussions if they were found, including the undoing of their plans and lifestyle. So they kept them close in order to monitor them.

All JMO.

God, even in death Lori was still trying to control them. Shes so gross

 

[JujuColumbo]

I think that is why, if the rumor is true, he was shopping for a mobile home trailer.. He could put the trailer directly on top of the burial site and nobody would think to look underneath it...

 

[Boxer]

IMO Prior never really brought any of his questioning to a logical point. It seemed questions were like throwing darts in the dark. He wasn’t performing in front of a jury. He was trying to convince the judge the evidence did not implicate CD. I think it was a hopeless cause, but he had to do something. I think we are confused because Prior didn’t intent to argue the case because he didn’t have a case and he didn’t want to show his defense strategy before trial.

We are all left scratching our heads wondering what he was doing. He was killing time until the trial he knew was inevitable.

He was attempting to tear down witness credibility.
Speaking inaudibley to the hard of hearing DW. Having CD make eye contact with DW mouthing things.
Asking police to do UTC calculations in their head on the stand.
Aggressive tactics on MG.
The different memories of whether LVD went to real estate meeting, came early, left early etc.

Getting evidence excluded is his goal.

Only 4 defenses:

It wasn't me. (Provide alternative theory)

It was me but I was provoked, self defense.

It was me but I was not responsible because I was mentally ill.

The search, arrest or proceedings are fatally flawed.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I think that is why, if the rumor is true, he was shopping for a mobile home trailer.. He could put the trailer directly on top of the burial site and nobody would think to look underneath it...

That only hides one body, though. Jmo

 

[Forever Young]

I agree, im sure he was well aware he wasnt going to win before stepping in court so they best he could do for his client was try to call any amount of questionability on what was being presented. I know people thought he was being aggressive, and well i wasnt a fan of his style I did think he did a good job representing his client. If you know you got nothing it doesnt hurt to just throw stuff out there

He was able to establish a few points. He established that 3 of the 4 people in this group had known, or known of each other for up to 5 years. They shared the same world view and met up on forums and at prepper meetings. The trouble began with the introduction of Lori Vallow into the group.

He established that MG was taken in by LV and devoted to her to the point of lying to police.

He established that MG and DW have different accounts of the weekend that JJ disappeared.

He drew a firm distinction between Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow, separating them in the minds of listeners.

 

[JujuColumbo]

That only hides one body, though. Jmo

Good point...maybe he thought he could put the trailer over one and pour concrete over the other one..who knows what goes through the mind of a killer..

 

[JujuColumbo]

DBM

 

[Forever Young]

I also wanted to quote Spartygirl’s post that indicolite22’s replied to (first quote above), but I’m either having some issues with the WS site, or it’s been deleted for some reason. (Since it’s still quoted within indicolite22’s post, I didn’t think it would be deleted?) Anyway, sorry @Spartygirl. I tried to find it—because I totally agree with you that burying the kids on the property was about control and the mistaken belief that they could better avoid discovery of the bodies there.

IMO, Chad and Lori wanted to have an eye on the bodies at all times; they didn’t want any surprises when they turned on the news in the morning. You know that saying, “Keep your friends close, but keep your enemies closer?” In a strange way, that’s what I think was going on here. In this case, the bodies of the children were their enemies because of the repercussions if they were found, including the undoing of their plans and lifestyle. So they kept them close in order to monitor them.

Chad and Lori wanted to keep them on the property because they could theoretically ensure that a search warrant would be required to find them, as long as Chad own of that property. That idea is flawed for a number of reasons, including: (a) the possibility that Chad’s family could accidentally find the children; (b) Chad would need to maintain ownership of that property forever, or future owners could consent to a police search; (c) the potential that police could (and did!) get enough probable cause for a search warrant.

But IMO, the flaws wouldn’t have deterred Chad and Lori because they thought themselves sophisticated criminals. They thought that Chad could handle his family, and they believed that they had covered their tracks well enough that police wouldn’t be able to establish probable cause. However, among other failures, they failed to account for current LE methods and technology for obtaining evidence. They didn’t anticipate the possible use of drones or satellite imagery, for instance. (They anticipated the risks posed by cell phones, but they mitigated those risks terribly, as demonstrated by apparently keeping 60 burners around and allowing Alex to wander everywhere with his cell phone.)

All JMO.

That all makes sense and possibly very true, but don't you think that as time went by Chad would have done anything to NOT have the kids buried on his property? It could be that it was nothing more than the closest and only place available at the time, and time was of the essence.

 

[ivegotthemic]

He was able to establish a few points. He established that 3 of the 4 people in this group had known, or known of each other for up to 5 years. They shared the same world view and met up on forums and at prepper meetings. The trouble began with the introduction of Lori Vallow into the group.

He established that MG was taken in by LV and devoted to her to the point of lying to police.

He established that MG and DW have different accounts of the weekend that JJ disappeared.

He drew a firm distinction between Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow, separating them in the minds of listeners.

Your absolutely right. I honestly think hes a good lawyer, he accomplished what he needed to during the proceedings and not going to lie I think he was having a little bit of fun poking at the witnesses and the prosecutor... and I mean I cant judge him for that, mine as well have fun with it

 

[Boxer]

That only hides one body, though. Jmo

MOO JJ murder was standard murder.
Probably due to JJ being increasingly unmanageable.
MOO apparently his meds were stopped and MOO likely they tried to faith heal him.
He was getting a bit bigger and an un-medicated autistic boy with no sturdy behavior plan can be extremely difficult.
Tylee looked like she loved JJ and had the smarts and interest in him and created a coherent peaceful world for him.

 

[ivegotthemic]

That all makes sense and possibly very true, but don't you think that as time went by Chad would have done anything to NOT have the kids buried on his property? It could be that it was nothing more than the closest and only place available at the time, and time was of the essence.

I mean, He was planning a honeymoon after all and God knows trying to get refunds on the plane tickets would have been a nightmare if they have to push it back ........(since theres no winky face emoji I thought I should mention this is total sarcasm and am merely mocking the horrible choices of Daybell and also I agree with your point)

 

[Love Never Fails]

T

$15-$20 per phone from displays I see if they got the cheap ones. My point is while they may have been thinking CV's life insurance proceeds were theirs, it wasn't. They did get TD's. Im wondering when these phones were purchased. Jmo

Lori had them in AZ. Tylee told her she looked like a drug dealer. MG commented on them also.

 

[indicolite22]

Lori had them in AZ. Tylee told her she looked like a drug dealer. MG commented on them also.

IIRC MG said that Lori had three phones. If she used one to talk to Chad and another for everyone else, what was the third phone for?