Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 #4

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Not sure if we any of us have commented about Lori being on a program where Chad was a guest in January this year—according to the awesome timeline that was posted—and shortly after, Charles files divorce papers on Lori and Chad claims “family emergency” as to why he cancels an event. Thinking this might be when things spark up between the 2 and also I think it is the same time Lori was accused (by Charles’ sister on Gray’s Youtube show) of going missing for a month or so. If this is when the alleged affair started, then Chad would have had nothing to do with Joe Ryan’s death in 2018 (assuming not accidental). I am wondering if Chad or anyone close to him (but not loyal to Lori) is reading all this bad history on Lori. Doubt he knew all this crazy stuff about her past. She is also probably figuring out he is not a prophet by now (if she ever believed he was one).
I can see her getting lots of fan mail in prison, divorcing Chad (or having him killed),remarrying (from prison) some clueless rich dude and then maybe having him taken out too. MOO
 
AceOndaCase said:
Not sure if we any of us have commented about Lori being on a program where Chad was a guest in January this year—according to the awesome timeline that was posted—and shortly after, Charles files divorce papers on Lori and Chad claims “family emergency” as to why he cancels an event. Thinking this might be when things spark up between the 2 and also I think it is the same time Lori was accused (by Charles’ sister on Gray’s Youtube show) of going missing for a month or so. If this is when the alleged affair started, then Chad would have had nothing to do with Joe Ryan’s death in 2018 (assuming not accidental). I am wondering if Chad or anyone close to him (but not loyal to Lori) is reading all this bad history on Lori. Doubt he knew all this crazy stuff about her past. She is also probably figuring out he is not a prophet by now (if she ever believed he was one).
I can see her getting lots of fan mail in prison, divorcing Chad (or having him killed),remarrying (from prison) some clueless rich dude and then maybe having him taken out too. MOO
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I've actually been very worried about Chad's well-being in all of this. His unnatural demise would certainly solve a lot of Lori's problems.
 
I wonder if child abandonment was being considered at the time, in order to terminate Lori's parental rights somehow. She was gone for almost two months.

"Larry said things changed about 2 to 3 years ago as Lori grew distant and abandoned her family in February 2019.

“Lori just simply vanished,” he said. “(For) 58 days she was completely gone,” said Kay.

She said Lori told Charles she no longer cared about him or JJ shortly before leaving. During that time, they believe Lori had Tylee stay with other relatives."

Grandparents Of One Of Missing Rexburg Children Speak Out
 
Countem said:
Do we have any information concerning the makes and models of Chad’s and/or Lori’s current vehicles?

I only ask because I recall reading in an earlier post in this series of threads that Lori referenced driving off of a cliff, and I saw the following news article today including footage of an unidentified SUV driving off of a cliff in California.

SUV drives off California cliff – but neither vehicle nor occupants has been found, authorities say

There is an almost 0% chance that the incidents are related, but it would be helpful to know the vehicle makes and models in case similar crashes are reported in the MSM.

EDIT: Here is a MSM article with the “driving off of a cliff” quote.

Former friend of missing woman, kids speaks of her complicated marital past, with two husbands dead
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I came here to post the same article! My first thought was this case!
 
Redvines86 said:
I was saying people that break the law lose their membership. If any laws have been broken, they will be out of the church. We know nothing about Tylee and JJ's relationship to the church. I certainly think Chad and Lori are headed down a criminal path. Chad has said he was a prophet in the AVOW second paywall, I don't remember where we saw it. I'm just saying, as others are, the traditional LDS church doesn't have a lot to do with this. Chad and Lori are in an extremist fringe group. I think focusing our efforts on things like Chad's beliefs, Lori's belief's, Alex's whereabouts, etc., will help us find Tylee and JJ.
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Just curious, if someone’s parents are excommunicated do their children remain in good standing assuming they haven’t done anything wrong? And does the answer change if the children are minors?
 
Colorado303 said:
Just curious, if someone’s parents are excommunicated do their children remain in good standing assuming they haven’t done anything wrong? And does the answer change if the children are minors?
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Children aren't going to pay for the parent's sins. Technically the kids would be recorded in church records, but wouldn't be full fledged members until baptism which traditionally happens at 8 years old, so definitely wouldn't have for JJ, but probably has for Tylee.
 
Redvines86 said:
My point here is just 1. Tammy's kids, we know nothing. If they are helping the FBI or not, we don't know. 2. Chad, Lori, the followers being the people that pay to get behind the second paywall in AVOW, some guy in SLC telling them to be good now isn't going to mean anything, you're in Chad's camp of authority at that point.
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Chad has worn the cloak of LDS doctrine for so many years that I'm not sure you can so easily separate Chad from LDS doctrine and the veneer of some respectability that it gives him? I do very much wonder how much Chad values his membership in the mainstream LDS Church? Or, has Chad simply taken a dive into the land of being a prophet and so mainstream LDS Church respectability means nothing? IDK.

Would his present followers be there if he were ex ed from LDS Church? Maybe. How many books of his are sold to mainstream LDS folks who might not be aware of his more radical/fringe views? IDK. How much money does he make from book sales? IDK. Does he make enough money via the paywall people subscriptions to survive? Lori based on her past marriages seems like an 'expensive' wife to keep around!

How many books would Chad have ever sold without being known as a member in good standing of the LDS Church?

I realise that the faithful people behind the paywall might not care too much about Chad LDS standing as they might believe that he is some kind of prophet. But I'm not sure its in the interest of the LDS Church to not strongly condemn people like Chad Daybell who set themselves up as 'prophets'. The doctrine on false teachers and false prophets seems clear which is also why its baffling that a stronger statement about Chad Daybell and his teachings hasn't been made IMO.

MOO
 
Colorado303 said:
Just curious, if someone’s parents are excommunicated do their children remain in good standing assuming they haven’t done anything wrong? And does the answer change if the children are minors?
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It does not affect the kids, spouse, etc. I have known people that got excommunicated, it didn't really change anything. Many times, someone that gets excommunicated wants to be. Or, they are for a while and then they get re-baptized. Mostly, you would have no idea if someone was. But it has no impact on the membership of a family.
 
We need to get back to the part about 2 kids missing and the FBI saying in danger. The people in question are obviously not part of the mainstream LDS membership. Think about why this story is so bizarre and caught the attention of MSM...The majority of the church membership are normal people...We are people who have created major companies like Marriott or JetBlue or maybe the head coach of the Kansas City Chiefs and so on.. Normal law abiding people who would/will be there to help you in an emergency or crisis. What you are reading about is a fringe group of people a who are mixing a small amount LDS teachings with whatever Chad is saying as they now see him as a prophet. So there ya go with my opinion and thank you for coming to my Ted Talk...Sorry ..find the kids and worry about these peoples church standing after..
 
BigAl16 said:
I think someone was trying to figure out who they were and whether they were alive, but don't remember if they were able to. I think someone figured out who her siblings were, but my memory is saying there were only two siblings, one, a sister, was MB's mother who died in 1999, I think. And then her brother Alex, who is said to have killed Charles and subsequently died himself. But status of the parents remains up i the air, I think.
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Lori has 2 brothers and 2 sisters, 1 brother and 1 sister are deceased, her parents are very much alive and well, but as we are not allowed to sleuth them, I won’t name names.
 
Guys, truly, I can almost promise, whether or not Chad was excommunicated or not has not all that much to do with the case at hand. Someday, when we all go out to lunch and discuss all of this, if I am proved wrong I will say I'm sorry in person lol. The main point is that Chad had his own little group with their own little beliefs. Excommunicated or not, not a big deal really. Let's move forward.
 
Redvines86 said:
I was saying people that break the law lose their membership. If any laws have been broken, they will be out of the church. We know nothing about Tylee and JJ's relationship to the church. I certainly think Chad and Lori are headed down a criminal path. Chad has said he was a prophet in the AVOW second paywall, I don't remember where we saw it. I'm just saying, as others are, the traditional LDS church doesn't have a lot to do with this. Chad and Lori are in an extremist fringe group. I think focusing our efforts on things like Chad's beliefs, Lori's belief's, Alex's whereabouts, etc., will help us find Tylee and JJ.
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I don't disagree with your POV that focusing on Chad's/Lori's beliefs here won't directly help us find Tylee and JJ. BUT, understanding how the LDS beliefs might be impacting people that are part of Lori and Chads world's could most definitely IMO help the search if there is something in those beliefs that is stopping them from cooperating with LE to find the 2 missing children. Its hard to detangle the presence of the LDS Church from the participants in this case as members of the church in one way or another touch almost every aspect of this case, including LE (particularly in Rexburg). I am not saying this to condemn the LDS Church but I am surprised that there hasn't been anything vocalised even from the local ward to encourage people that might have know JJ and Tylee to seek out LE with any information. Perhaps this has happened and just hasn't been visible to the public. I do know in missing cases that community involvement and participation is critical.

Understanding the beliefs of the people that might be protecting and sheltering Lori and Chad could however be beneficial. I think it might be easy to simply dismiss Chad/Lori's beliefs as 'fringe' and 'outside the mainstream' of LDS Church, but the fact is that even with their 'fringe' beliefs they still appear to be part of the larger LDS Church and community as they haven't been ex ed. LDS faithful might just think they are sheltering 'one of their own' and see no issue in turning a blind eye to seeing Chad/Lori or the 2 children even? IDK. We haven't heard a statement from anyone associated with the Church in Rexburg or elsewhere condemning the situation and encouraging people to assist LE. Even if a condemning statement about Chad/Lori wasn't made, I do think it might be helpful to encourage people to assist LE to the extent they have information. We have seen none of that, at least publicly. In other cases, we have seen religious organisations actively step up and encourage their members to assist LE and some even organise searches etc. Here in this case we have seen nothing but silence from the community (religious or otherwise) based on MSM. Compared to other missing cases IMO its a bit strange to see no community component or compassion for 2 missing children.

Rexburg is roughly 90% LDS and there are other LDS dominated communities like Rexburg where Chad/Lori might just be. You don't think it's possible that general mistrust of LE by a broader LDS community in a place like Rexburg might just be why JJ who was in school was never reported missing either by his school or anyone that might have known him in Rexburg?

It took his grandparents requesting a welfare check 2 months after the fact to get this case rolling. Why didn't anyone in Rexburg do anything to report the children missing? Why didn't Chad Daybell's family do anything to report the children missing or why didn't Lori Vallow Daybell's parents report their grandchildren missing? Doesn't this all strike you as just a bit strange that not one person in LDS dominated Rexburg didn't realise that an 8 yo. special needs child who was enrolled in school suddenly vanished? I'm not asking the same question about Tylee as I'm not sure who in Rexburg might have had contact with her to report her missing as it wasn't clear that she was enrolled in school. Right now based on limited info it simply appears that nobody in Rexburg noticed or cared that an 8 yo special needs child vanishes. Are there other children in Rexburg that simply vanish and are never reported missing?

We have seen Chad Daybell's children saying they support their father and then make the choice to not assist LE. This is most likely quite detrimental to the investigation to find JJ and Tylee IMO.

MOO
 
Redvines86 said:
Guys, truly, I can almost promise, whether or not Chad was excommunicated or not has not all that much to do with the case at hand. Someday, when we all go out to lunch and discuss all of this, if I am proved wrong I will say I'm sorry in person lol. The main point is that Chad had his own little group with their own little beliefs. Excommunicated or not, not a big deal really. Let's move forward.
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So totally agree! A little curiousity is OK. I'm not LDS, not do I know much about it.
I don't see how all of these religious details are relevant to this case.

But do you know that there are millions of excommunicated Catholics in the US?
 
BigAl16 said:
Children aren't going to pay for the parent's sins. Technically the kids would be recorded in church records, but wouldn't be full fledged members until baptism which traditionally happens at 8 years old, so definitely wouldn't have for JJ, but probably has for Tylee.
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Thank you!
 
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