Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 #4

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afitzy said:
I don't disagree with your POV that focusing on Chad's/Lori's beliefs here won't directly help us find Tylee and JJ. BUT, understanding how the LDS beliefs might be impacting people that are part of Lori and Chads world's could most definitely IMO help the search if there is something in those beliefs that is stopping them from cooperating with LE to find the 2 missing children. Its hard to detangle the presence of the LDS Church from the participants in this case as members of the church in one way or another touch almost every aspect of this case, including LE (particularly in Rexburg). I am not saying this to condemn the LDS Church but I am surprised that there hasn't been anything vocalised even from the local ward to encourage people that might have know JJ and Tylee to seek out LE with any information. Perhaps this has happened and just hasn't been visible to the public. I do know in missing cases that community involvement and participation is critical.

Understanding the beliefs of the people that might be protecting and sheltering Lori and Chad could however be beneficial. I think it might be easy to simply dismiss Chad/Lori's beliefs as 'fringe' and 'outside the mainstream' of LDS Church, but the fact is that even with their 'fringe' beliefs they still appear to be part of the larger LDS Church and community as they haven't been ex ed. LDS faithful might just think they are sheltering 'one of their own' and see no issue in turning a blind eye to seeing Chad/Lori or the 2 children even? IDK. We haven't heard a statement from anyone associated with the Church in Rexburg or elsewhere condemning the situation and encouraging people to assist LE. Even if a condemning statement about Chad/Lori wasn't made, I do think it might be helpful to encourage people to assist LE to the extent they have information. We have seen none of that, at least publicly. In other cases, we have seen religious organisations actively step up and encourage their members to assist LE and some even organise searches etc. Here in this case we have seen nothing but silence from the community (religious or otherwise) based on MSM. Compared to other missing cases IMO its a bit strange to see no community component or compassion for 2 missing children.

Rexburg is roughly 90% LDS and there are other LDS dominated communities like Rexburg where Chad/Lori might just be. You don't think it's possible that general mistrust of LE by a broader LDS community in a place like Rexburg might just be why JJ who was in school was never reported missing either by his school or anyone that might have known him in Rexburg?

It took his grandparents requesting a welfare check 2 months after the fact to get this case rolling. Why didn't anyone in Rexburg do anything to report the children missing? Why didn't Chad Daybell's family do anything to report the children missing or why didn't Lori Vallow Daybell's parents report their grandchildren missing? Doesn't this all strike you as just a bit strange that not one person in LDS dominated Rexburg didn't realise that an 8 yo. special needs child who was enrolled in school suddenly vanished? I'm not asking the same question about Tylee as I'm not sure who in Rexburg might have had contact with her to report her missing as it wasn't clear that she was enrolled in school. Right now based on limited info it simply appears that nobody in Rexburg noticed or cared that an 8 yo special needs child vanishes. Are there other children in Rexburg that simply vanish and are never reported missing?

We have seen Chad Daybell's children saying they support their father and then make the choice to not assist LE. This is most likely quite detrimental to the investigation to find JJ and Tylee IMO.

MOO
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Those questions have all been addressed in our threads a few times! I know there is so much to read but I think you will find it helpful!
 
Redvines86 said:
I've actually been very worried about Chad's well-being in all of this. His unnatural demise would certainly solve a lot of Lori's problems.
Click to expand...
Possibly elimination of Chad might help Lori if he had information on the whereabouts of the 2 missing children, but he also is the main breadwinner in the relationship and he has the following to hide them while they are on the run. What does Lori really bring to the table to help finance going on the run?

Lori by all accounts has always aspired to not work. It seems unlikely that now with husband 5 she is all of the sudden going to embrace the 9-5 lifestyle and actually do something to make money? IMO, very doubtful. I think by doing away with Chad she would be killing the golden goose which she needs to survive right now.

My guess is that they might just see themselves as a version of 'Bonnie and Clyde'.
 
<modsnip: snipped quote with link to a non-approved source>
So 5 years ago the membership to the main forums was about $50 annual and they had about 3,600 that were paying if I'm guessing what the members versus active members means. If that's right that means about $180,000 in revenue (assume some expenses, so not all profit) for the main forums. Chad was said to run a sub-forum with an additional charge, so presumably less income and presumably less revenue (and I'm going to guess some of that revenue went to the site owners). I can picture him making enough to be a nice income supplement, but he wasn't going get super rich on it either. (I'm guessing he might have seen 10s of thousands, but not too many 10s.)
 
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I don't see how a full scale community search is going to result in anything. The kids could literally be anywhere. And they have been missing for months.

The key here, is that Lori needs to be found. Hopefully, she can be charged with some sort of crime.
 
afitzy said:
I don't disagree with your POV that focusing on Chad's/Lori's beliefs here won't directly help us find Tylee and JJ. BUT, understanding how the LDS beliefs might be impacting people that are part of Lori and Chads world's could most definitely IMO help the search if there is something in those beliefs that is stopping them from cooperating with LE to find the 2 missing children. Its hard to detangle the presence of the LDS Church from the participants in this case as members of the church in one way or another touch almost every aspect of this case, including LE (particularly in Rexburg). I am not saying this to condemn the LDS Church but I am surprised that there hasn't been anything vocalised even from the local ward to encourage people that might have know JJ and Tylee to seek out LE with any information. Perhaps this has happened and just hasn't been visible to the public. I do know in missing cases that community involvement and participation is critical.

Understanding the beliefs of the people that might be protecting and sheltering Lori and Chad could however be beneficial. I think it might be easy to simply dismiss Chad/Lori's beliefs as 'fringe' and 'outside the mainstream' of LDS Church, but the fact is that even with their 'fringe' beliefs they still appear to be part of the larger LDS Church and community as they haven't been ex ed. LDS faithful might just think they are sheltering 'one of their own' and see no issue in turning a blind eye to seeing Chad/Lori or the 2 children even? IDK. We haven't heard a statement from anyone associated with the Church in Rexburg or elsewhere condemning the situation and encouraging people to assist LE. Even if a condemning statement about Chad/Lori wasn't made, I do think it might be helpful to encourage people to assist LE to the extent they have information. We have seen none of that, at least publicly. In other cases, we have seen religious organisations actively step up and encourage their members to assist LE and some even organise searches etc. Here in this case we have seen nothing but silence from the community (religious or otherwise) based on MSM. Compared to other missing cases IMO its a bit strange to see no community component or compassion for 2 missing children.

Rexburg is roughly 90% LDS and there are other LDS dominated communities like Rexburg where Chad/Lori might just be. You don't think it's possible that general mistrust of LE by a broader LDS community in a place like Rexburg might just be why JJ who was in school was never reported missing either by his school or anyone that might have known him in Rexburg?

It took his grandparents requesting a welfare check 2 months after the fact to get this case rolling. Why didn't anyone in Rexburg do anything to report the children missing? Why didn't Chad Daybell's family do anything to report the children missing or why didn't Lori Vallow Daybell's parents report their grandchildren missing? Doesn't this all strike you as just a bit strange that not one person in LDS dominated Rexburg didn't realise that an 8 yo. special needs child who was enrolled in school suddenly vanished? I'm not asking the same question about Tylee as I'm not sure who in Rexburg might have had contact with her to report her missing as it wasn't clear that she was enrolled in school. Right now based on limited info it simply appears that nobody in Rexburg noticed or cared that an 8 yo special needs child vanishes. Are there other children in Rexburg that simply vanish and are never reported missing?

We have seen Chad Daybell's children saying they support their father and then make the choice to not assist LE. This is most likely quite detrimental to the investigation to find JJ and Tylee IMO.

MOO
Click to expand...

This woman is sketchy as he**. I can almost guarantee you that she and Chad had a plan in place before she set foot in Rexburg.

JJ was in school for around a month. And he was one of 500 special need students in the school district. A district with 5,360 students. He also attended an elementary school that serves multiple "married with families" BYUI students, so yes, he could just stop attending and not raise any eyebrows. Students and their families come and go at this particular elementary school. I know because I used to work there.

"Welcome to Madison School District 321’s Special Educational Programs. The Madison School District serves more than 500 students with disabilities and special needs in a wide variety of programs."

Special Education - Madison School District #321

For the 2019-20 school year, there are 10 public schools managed by Madison School District serving 5,360 students in Rexburg, Idaho.

Madison School District (2019-20) | Rexburg, ID

There has not been one verified sighting of Tylee in Rexburg at all.

We don't know that they even attended church here. I'm guessing no.

I REALLY don't get what the citizens of Rexburg and the local members of the church are supposed to be doing about a woman and her kid (kids) that they likely didn't even know existed. Help me understand. I will eat my hat if local LDS people are harboring them or helping them.

Also, there is no local "distrust" of LE in Rexburg. They are very well supported by the entire community including and probably especially by LDS members.

ETA: MOO

Edited again to add: Sorry if it sounds like I am exasperated, but I am. We are all just watching the news like you all and wondering what in the actual heck is going on.
 
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BigAl16 said:
So 5 years ago the membership to the main forums was about $50 annual and they had about 3,600 that were paying if I'm guessing what the members versus active members means. If that's right that means about $180,000 in revenue (assume some expenses, so not all profit) for the main forums. Chad was said to run a sub-forum with an additional charge, so presumably less income and presumably less revenue (and I'm going to guess some of that revenue went to the site owners). I can picture him making enough to be a nice income supplement, but he wasn't going get super rich on it either. (I'm guessing he might have seen 10s of thousands, but not too many 10s.)
Click to expand...
I’m speculating that his publishing & books & speaking engagements were the main income & his AVOW income was secret stash.
BigAl16 said:
Secret from who? Do you think Tammy didn't know about it?
Click to expand...

That would be my guess- I had read she was in control of managing money, perhaps he was amassing pieces of income for his current lifestyle. Wouldn’t want that to be known IMO
 
@afitzy

The LDS community is not going to help hide Lori and Chad.

Lori moved from Arizona, so she has probably been lying to everyone from Arizona for months about the kids. She seems to be quite skilled at lying.

Which is why she has been able to get away with evading the "Well Check" on JJ for months. I am actually very impressed with the Rexburg PD for finally nailing her to the wall. Yes, it took awhile, but not that long, really, when you realize that the law is on Lori's side her, she can pull her kids out of school, she has sole custody of her children.

There is no law that can demand a parent to produce a child on demand without cause. So, they had to follow, and track her lies.

The only "error" here, was letting her get away.
 
afitzy said:
Chad has worn the cloak of LDS doctrine for so many years that I'm not sure you can so easily separate Chad from LDS doctrine and the veneer of some respectability that it gives him? I do very much wonder how much Chad values his membership in the mainstream LDS Church? Or, has Chad simply taken a dive into the land of being a prophet and so mainstream LDS Church respectability means nothing? IDK.

Would his present followers be there if he were ex ed from LDS Church? Maybe. How many books of his are sold to mainstream LDS folks who might not be aware of his more radical/fringe views? IDK. How much money does he make from book sales? IDK. Does he make enough money via the paywall people subscriptions to survive? Lori based on her past marriages seems like an 'expensive' wife to keep around!

How many books would Chad have ever sold without being known as a member in good standing of the LDS Church?

I realise that the faithful people behind the paywall might not care too much about Chad LDS standing as they might believe that he is some kind of prophet. But I'm not sure its in the interest of the LDS Church to not strongly condemn people like Chad Daybell who set themselves up as 'prophets'. The doctrine on false teachers and false prophets seems clear which is also why its baffling that a stronger statement about Chad Daybell and his teachings hasn't been made IMO.

MOO
Click to expand...

This is a LE investigation into the disappearance of two children and possible murder of individuals closely associated to both Lori (currently on husband #5) and Chad whose wife appears to have been the brains behind their publishing company.

Instead I would be looking at who financially benefited from these deaths.

A divorce from Tammy would of had significant monetary implications.

Snip:

Tammy was a computer genius who also had a talent for graphic arts. In 2004, she and Chad founded Spring Creek Book Company, and Tammy wore many hats as their company grew, juggling her role as Chief Financial Officer with designing book covers. She was the true backbone of the company, and she was proud of the dozens of books the company published over the years.

Tamara Douglas Daybell
 
155etta said:
This woman is sketchy as he**. I can almost guarantee you that she and Chad had a plan in place before she set foot in Rexburg.

JJ was in school for around a month. And he was one of 500 special need students in the school district. A district with 5,360 students. He also attended an elementary school that serves multiple "married with families" BYUI students, so yes, he could just stop attending and not raise any eyebrows. Students and their families come and go at this particular elementary school. I know because I used to work there.

"Welcome to Madison School District 321’s Special Educational Programs. The Madison School District serves more than 500 students with disabilities and special needs in a wide variety of programs."

Special Education - Madison School District #321

For the 2019-20 school year, there are 10 public schools managed by Madison School District serving 5,360 students in Rexburg, Idaho.

Madison School District (2019-20) | Rexburg, ID

There has not been one verified sighting of Tylee in Rexburg at all.

We don't know that they even attended church here. I'm guessing no.

I REALLY don't get what the citizens of Rexburg and the local members of the church are supposed to be doing about a woman and her kid (kids) that they likely didn't even know existed. Help me understand. I will eat my hat if local LDS people are harboring them or helping them.

Also, there is no local "distrust" of LE in Rexburg. They are very well supported by the entire community including and probably especially by LDS members.

ETA: MOO

Edited again to add: Sorry if it sounds like I am exasperated, but I am. We are all just watching the news like you all and wondering what in the actual heck is going on.
Click to expand...

While I'm not convinced whether there might be some good that could come from someone at a higher level in the church speaking out or taking some action, as some have suggested, I'm in total agreement with what you're saying here about at the local level. I'd be amazed if any of the players had shown their face locally in Rexburg that LE wouldn't have immediately been called.

Also, if Rexburg is 90% Mormon (true, or pretty darn close) then I'm going to guess the vast majority of the members of LE are also Mormon. Trust of LE is going to be as good or (I suspect) even better here than in a town of comparable size anywhere in the country. MOO.
 
155etta said:
This woman is sketchy as he**. I can almost guarantee you that she and Chad had a plan in place before she set foot in Rexburg.

JJ was in school for around a month. And he was one of 500 special need students in the school district. A district with 5,360 students. He also attended an elementary school that serves multiple "married with families" BYUI students, so yes, he could just stop attending and not raise any eyebrows. Students and their families come and go at this particular elementary school. I know because I used to work there.

"Welcome to Madison School District 321’s Special Educational Programs. The Madison School District serves more than 500 students with disabilities and special needs in a wide variety of programs."

Special Education - Madison School District #321

For the 2019-20 school year, there are 10 public schools managed by Madison School District serving 5,360 students in Rexburg, Idaho.

Madison School District (2019-20) | Rexburg, ID

There has not been one verified sighting of Tylee in Rexburg at all.

We don't know that they even attended church here. I'm guessing no.

I REALLY don't get what the citizens of Rexburg and the local members of the church are supposed to be doing about a woman and her kid (kids) that they likely didn't even know existed. Help me understand. I will eat my hat if local LDS people are harboring them or helping them.

Also, there is no local "distrust" of LE in Rexburg. They are very well supported by the entire community including and probably especially by LDS members.

ETA: MOO

Edited again to add: Sorry if it sounds like I am exasperated, but I am. We are all just watching the news like you all and wondering what in the actual heck is going on.
Click to expand...
Thanks for giving your insight into the school system and coming here.
 
David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee, kidnappers of Elizabeth Smart, were also quote, "LDS", but no one would think that anyone in the LDS church had a "responsibility" to say that they were crazy.

I put Chad and Lori Daybell in the same category as David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee, LDS...maybe...but they are all as far on the continuum of whacked and crazy, far more than being "LDS".
 
mickey2942 said:
David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee, kidnappers of Elizabeth Smart, were also quote, "LDS", but no one would think that anyone in the LDS church had a "responsibility" to say that they were crazy.

I put Chad and Lori Daybell in the same category as David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee, LDS...maybe...but they are all as far on the continuum of whacked and crazy, far more than being "LDS".
Click to expand...
Agree- Add Josh Powell to the list and the guy from that Netflix doc Abducted in Plain Sight
 
Leney said:
This is a LE investigation into the disappearance of two children and possible murder of individuals closely associated to both Lori (currently on husband #5) and Chad whose wife appears to have been the brains behind their publishing company.

Instead I would be looking at who financially benefited from these deaths.

A divorce from Tammy would of had significant monetary implications.

Snip:

Tammy was a computer genius who also had a talent for graphic arts. In 2004, she and Chad founded Spring Creek Book Company, and Tammy wore many hats as their company grew, juggling her role as Chief Financial Officer with designing book covers. She was the true backbone of the company, and she was proud of the dozens of books the company published over the years.

Tamara Douglas Daybell
Click to expand...
Following the money is usually a viable line of inquiry.

Interesting theory you have about Tammy but its unclear that the publishing business made all that much money or it was where Chad's heart was focused at the moment.

I believe we read the other day that Chad had been pushing to shut down the publishing business while Tammy wanted to keep it going. I'm not sure we have much visibility on financial status of the publishing business unfortunately to even know if it had any value without Tammy running it? If Tammy was the backbone of the company and Chad didn't have the skills needed to keep it going, I'm not sure how killing Tammy might help Chad?

Perhaps there was conflict within the Daybell family about whether to keep the business going or not? Perhaps there was conflict also as to which authors to support? Could Chad have been pushing in a more fringe oriented direction that was threatening to Tammy's perhaps more mainstream LDS beliefs? Maybe the couple were at a total impasse as to the the future of the publishing business?

Perhaps Lori agreed with Chad completely about the future direction of his writing and publishing activities and so Tammy no longer was as 'necessary" as she had been in the past?

Lots of possibilities here but sadly no information to see how it might figure into motive?
 
NvrEndgStry said:
Agree- Add Josh Powell to the list and the guy from that Netflix doc Abducted in Plain Sight
Click to expand...

Actually, wasn't the reputation of the guy from Abducted in Plain Sight good until he had already moved on? It seems like he got arrested in the town he moved to after leaving Idaho.
 
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