IL - Lt. Charles 'Joe' Gliniewicz, 52, found dead, Fox Lake, 1 Sep 2015 - #2

[vestigare]

IF this turns out to be determined to be a suicide, I would imagine that they would want to insure they actually are able to determine with 100% confidence before announcing their findings. They know the stakes. Once they make an announcement one way or the other there is no going back. It will be world news. People will be upset angry sad etc... I am sure they would want every rock turned over before completing their investigation. It has only been about 2 weeks. Why the impatience? If they were to announce something and be wrong they'd be criticized yet many are criticizing them for doing everything with due diligence. The family, the community, and Joe deserve that.


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I agree about the rush to judgement but the problem for me as well as some others I have spoken to who understand the typical police investigation of a gunshot is the huge double standard here.

Lawyers, orgs, investigators,and families have been trying for decades to get LE to stop assuming every thing is a suicide. Being a member of webslueths I am sure you have seen your fair share of cases where the police assumed it was suicide or accident while the family pleaded that it wasn't. Forensics is lost, time is lost, and perps get away because of this assumption when later it is proven oops this was murder.


In this case they not only appear to have assumed homicide, contrary to any other proof besides the word of the deceased, but they went completely above any investigation they would ever do to catch the murderers for any non LEO.

So, I agree no rush to judgemnet is a good thing, but double standards are bad and disregarding all evidence to the contrary while playing double standards is really bad.

Also under normal circumstance preliminary GPR and toxicology would have been returned within days and they would have interviewed family.

 

[cady]

OOPS guess I'm wrong again. First I thought that Rudd conducted the autopsy, then I thought that the pathologist who actually did, worked for Rudd, NOW I read that the pathologist was independent. Filenko sure hoped to keep Rudd in the dark, didn't he? This is so silly. Now they have a full-blown PR nightmare to deal with. All they had to do was follow normal procedure, to avoid that. JMO

 

[Tillicum]

So..what if the three were meeting someone else there and the one they were meeting came in behind CG?

 

[cady]

So..what if the three were meeting someone else there and the one they were meeting came in behind CG?

Also, on foot? JMO

 

[cady]

So..what if the three were meeting someone else there and the one they were meeting came in behind CG?

Also, on foot? JMO

 

[bessie]

Please keep scanner discussion in the scanner is thread.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=290243

Thank you

ETA: A couple of posts already have been moved.

 

[Tillicum]

Also, on foot? JMO

IDK I haven't thought that far

 

[cady]

IDK I haven't thought that far

Nevermind, lol, my thought process was following a post which was deleted, including my response to it...............JMO

 

[vestigare]

Also, on foot? JMO

And leaving nothing for dogs to follow?

 

[vestigare]

Nevermind- found relevant rules post.

 

[Tillicum]

And leaving nothing for dogs to follow?

By the time the dogs got there, there was enough scent from other responders to throw everything off IMO. Everything had already been disturbed by that time IMO. Any dog trainer will tell you the least people, movement present, the less chance of confusion for the dogs and better chance of positive performance.

 

[vestigare]

By the time the dogs got there, there was enough scent from other responders to throw everything off IMO. Everything had already been disturbed by that time IMO. Any dog trainer will tell you the least people, movement present, the less chance of confusion for the dogs and better chance of positive performance.

Dogs don't really work that way. Sort of how drug mules think they can hide drugs inside other smelly stuff and it will confuse the drug dog. It doesn't.

They had DHS, FBI AND US Marshalls with dogs. These were some fairly well trained handlers with specialised dogs. They can pick a speck out of two hundred people in a room.

 

[Chuz Life]

There is obviously enough evidence and reason for investigators to believe this was not a murder/ homicide and that it was most likely self inflicted.

If LE had any reason to believe that cop killing suspects were still at large, THEY would be the ones trying to make the case for the manhunt to continue. Like they did for the escaped prisoners in New York for example.

There is a good reason for why LE has ended the manhunt and downgraded the supposed 'suspects' to mere 'persons of interest.'

 

[vestigare]

There is obviously enough evidence and reason for investigators to believe this was not a murder/ homicide and that it was most likely self inflicted.

If LE had any reason to believe that cop killing suspects were still at large, THEY would be the ones trying to make the case for the manhunt to continue. Like they did for the escaped prisoners in New York for example.

There is a good reason for why LE has ended the manhunt and downgraded the supposed 'suspects' to mere 'persons of interest.'

Exactly!

Considering they started pulling out on the 4th also tells me they knew pretty quick that the manhunt wasn't adding up because there wasn't anyone to hunt.

 

[katydid23]

Dogs don't really work that way. Sort of how drug mules think they can hide drugs inside other smelly stuff and it will confuse the drug dog. It doesn't.

They had DHS, FBI AND US Marshalls with dogs. These were some fairly well trained handlers with specialised dogs. They can pick a speck out of two hundred people in a room.

But we do not know if they picked up any scent trails or not. I have not seen anyone say there were no signs of any scent trails. All we know is that they didn't corner anyone or find anyone hiding. but they could have trailed a scent that stopped--perhaps where a car was waiting?

 

[Japple]

There is obviously enough evidence and reason for investigators to believe this was not a murder/ homicide and that it was most likely self inflicted.

If LE had any reason to believe that cop killing suspects were still at large, THEY would be the ones trying to make the case for the manhunt to continue. Like they did for the escaped prisoners in New York for example.

There is a good reason for why LE has ended the manhunt and downgraded the supposed 'suspects' to mere 'persons of interest.'

What is the evidence of suicide at this point? What are reasons for suicide that isn't just pure speculation at this point?

Lack of known evidence for a homicide does not create evidence of a suicide.

 

[Keefer]

What is the evidence of suicide at this pointe? What are reasons for suicide that isn't just pure speculation at this point?

Lack of known evidence for a homicide does not create evidence of a suicide.

Not unless you presume it's a suicide and then try to fit everything into that narrative.

 

[Tillicum]

Dogs don't really work that way. Sort of how drug mules think they can hide drugs inside other smelly stuff and it will confuse the drug dog. It doesn't.

They had DHS, FBI AND US Marshalls with dogs. These were some fairly well trained handlers with specialised dogs. They can pick a speck out of two hundred people in a room.

I didn't say the dogs would be too confused to find drugs there, if they were looking for drugs IMO they still would've found them. And yes I know these are specially trained dogs and I know their capabilities as well as their limitations. I am speaking from experience and familiarity with training and I respectfully disagree.

 

[vestigare]

What is going to really suffer, if this turns out to be suicide, is the general publics faith in LE because the next time an officer is killed in the line of duty it is going to cause more people to question the narrative and investigation.

 

[Keefer]

Cui Bono? How does the task force benefit if this is ruled murder?
Who would benefit if it was ruled suicide?
The battle between Rudd and Flienko is interesting at least to me.
Joey battalia is interesting too.
Kristin K. Is interesting.
The whole thing is interesting.