GUILTY IL - Sheila von Wiese Mack, 62, in suitcase in Bali, 12 Aug 2014 *fnd guilty in Bali* #6

[otto]

I'm left wondering whether Claypool is the lawyer for the woman who claims to be Sheila's friend Diana in LA; the friend who planned with Mack since 2016 to make a murder movie about Sheila's suitcase coffin.

Who pays for Claypool? Is it Sheila's former friend Diana in LA? We know the plan was that Mack, her daughter and the daughter's foster mother would fly to LA, tuck in with Diana. Was Claypool the legal boss for Diana's movie?

Bali immigration and FBI said no to Diana and Claypool's LA plan. FBI boarded Mack's plane when it landed in Chicago. Imagine what her six year old daughter thought watching her vacation ruined while her mother is put in hand cuffs and taken off the plane. What a vacation!

Mack, the foster mother and their lawyer clearly lack understanding of young children. Who in their right mind would under-estimate a six year old and think that describing "deportation" as "vacation" is a good idea?

 

[Niner]

Okay so it appears that HM will be locked up until January at least. So what happens with Stella? KW will get her day in court soon but if she’s not awarded temporary guardian, will Stella be spending the holidays with VF’s family after OS returns home?

Per one of the articles posted:

Court records show a Cook County probate judge issued an emergency order Tuesday appointing one of Mack’s attorneys, Vanessa Favia, as the girl’s guardian.

 

[BUF]

Heather Mack comes face-to-face with mother’s siblings, will remain in federal custody

But soon after the hearing began, a prosecutor told the judge that both sides had agreed to Mack’s ongoing detention. She is free to ask for her release again in the future, but former federal prosecutors have told the Chicago Sun-Times the odds of her release are slim.
…….
Despite having just been released after serving seven years in an Indonesian prison, Mack should be prepared for another long stay, this time in the Federal Bureau of Prisons. Assistant U.S. Attorney Terry Kinney told Norgle Wednesday that evidence in Mack’s case is “truly, truly voluminous.” Her defense attorneys will need time to review it.

 

[LinasK]

Exactly. The lawyer who arranged care for Stella is Mack's lawyer, so the woman in charge of Stella is not impartial; not 100% focused on best interests of the child. She might be acting on Mack's behalf, which means she's acting for the foster mother as caregiver (I assume). Mack did say that she wanted her daughter to remain with the foster family in Bali.

Doesn't that leave this as a debate between Mack's lawyer, who has control of the child, and Schaefer's mother, who seems unable to provide a healthy environment?

Have the courts assigned an amicus curiae, or whatever it's called in Chicago, where the child is appointed a lawyer to act on her behalf? This cannot be a lawyer that was hired by the mother, even if the mother hired the lawyer when the child was born. We have 6 years of the lawyer giving authority to Mack for Stella. That lawyer cannot claim today that she acts for the child independent of the mother.

Isn't the legal term Guardian Ad Litem? Gitana, can you help us out here?

 

[ajaylee]

Heather Mack waives detention hearing, will be held without bond on federal conspiracy charges stemming from mother’s Bali slaying

Lawyers for Heather Mack waived her right to a detention hearing Wednesday on federal murder conspiracy charges stemming from the 2014 slaying of her mother at a Bali vacation resort.

The decision means Mack, who was arrested by the FBI last week after being deported from Indonesia, will be held in custody while the charges are pending, though her lawyers could renew a request for bond at any point.

Heather Mack waives detention hearing, will be held without bond on federal conspiracy charges stemming from mother’s Bali slaying

I wonder (hope) if this means HM has no way to make bail, so there's no point in asking for it right now.

 

[ajaylee]

Heather Mack comes face-to-face with mother’s siblings, will remain in federal custody

But soon after the hearing began, a prosecutor told the judge that both sides had agreed to Mack’s ongoing detention. She is free to ask for her release again in the future, but former federal prosecutors have told the Chicago Sun-Times the odds of her release are slim.
…….
Despite having just been released after serving seven years in an Indonesian prison, Mack should be prepared for another long stay, this time in the Federal Bureau of Prisons. Assistant U.S. Attorney Terry Kinney told Norgle Wednesday that evidence in Mack’s case is “truly, truly voluminous.” Her defense attorneys will need time to review it.

HM has been counting on Stella as a shield and a checkbook. I think she's been a celebrity in her own mind in Kerobokan for so long, she's a bit out of touch with reality.

I thought there was a good chance the feds would go after her, even if only for pragmatic reasons. They went through all the evidence before they convicted RB, so it's a budget-friendly likely-win case. I really hope this goes to trial and she doesn't just take a plea.

 

[ajaylee]

Okay so it appears that HM will be locked up until January at least. So what happens with Stella? KW will get her day in court soon but if she’s not awarded temporary guardian, will Stella be spending the holidays with VF’s family after OS returns home?

I can't see HM trusting anyone, other than perhaps OS, to have custody of Stella.

Mainly because I think OS is the only person HM trusts to share Stella's money with her.

HM is so delusional. She really thinks she and Stella can live large on the money that's likely left in the estate? It's a lot of money, but for someone with HM's tastes and ignorance, it wouldn't last long.

 

[Kamille]

Per one of the articles posted:

Court records show a Cook County probate judge issued an emergency order Tuesday appointing one of Mack’s attorneys, Vanessa Favia, as the girl’s guardian.

Just jumping off your post Niner. Regarding VF being appointed guardian, it has become pretty apparent that HM isn’t getting out of jail anytime soon. So is her plan to take Stella in and raise her with her family? And to continue to represent HM and allow her access to Stella?

Seems like there is a lot of conflict of interest in this arrangement. Let’s not forget how VF started down this path. Instead of advocating for HM and TS to give up the baby for adoption for the best possible life, she was trying to drum up money to help facilitate HM keeping the baby in prison.

Fundraiser launched for unborn child of Oak Park teen suspected of Bali murder - Oak Park

MOO

 

[BUF]

Looks like her court appointed attorney is officially on record now. Welcome to the US and the real world HM…orange jumpsuit, shackles, locked up, no trust fund, and all. Now if only they could get things moving on the best interest of Stella…

Heather Mack to remain in federal custody - Chronicle Media

Judge Norgle also notified attorney Keith Spielfogel that he had been formally appointed to be Mack’s defense attorney.

 

[SouthAussie]

Looks like her court appointed attorney is officially on record now. Welcome to the US and the real world HM…orange jumpsuit, shackles, locked up, no trust fund, and all. Now if only they could get things moving on the best interest of Stella…

Heather Mack to remain in federal custody - Chronicle Media

Judge Norgle also notified attorney Keith Spielfogel that he had been formally appointed to be Mack’s defense attorney.

Does this mean that the US taxpayer is paying for HM's defense?

Keith Spielfogel is an experienced death penalty lawyer (among other things) and back in 2005 was court-ordered to be paid $160 per hour as a court-appointed attorney.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg...r-20038/pdf/USCOURTS-mied-1_04-cr-20038-1.pdf

 

[Curious Me]

Looks like her court appointed attorney is officially on record now. Welcome to the US and the real world HM…orange jumpsuit, shackles, locked up, no trust fund, and all. Now if only they could get things moving on the best interest of Stella…
Heather Mack to remain in federal custody - Chronicle Media
Judge Norgle also notified attorney Keith Spielfogel that he had been formally appointed to be Mack’s defense attorney.

I'm delighted with how this is turning out for Heather. The holidays will be so heart warming for her-- she'll be sitting in a maximum security Metropolitan Correctional Center in downtown Chicago. Please, come January, they can't allow her bail. Hopefully, Stella will get placed in the right place with the right guardians.

Heather Mack to remain in federal custody - Chronicle Media (chronicleillinois.com)
"Mack will next be in court on Jan. 18 at which point the court may be asked to grant her bail."

 

[Kamille]

Looks like her court appointed attorney is officially on record now. Welcome to the US and the real world HM…orange jumpsuit, shackles, locked up, no trust fund, and all. Now if only they could get things moving on the best interest of Stella…

Heather Mack to remain in federal custody - Chronicle Media

Judge Norgle also notified attorney Keith Spielfogel that he had been formally appointed to be Mack’s defense attorney.

I wonder if Mr Spielfogel volunteered for the honour. How long before HM starts manipulating for her defense attorney of choice.

 

[Kamille]

Does this mean that the US taxpayer is paying for HM's defense?

Keith Spielfogel is an experienced death penalty lawyer (among other things) and back in 2005 was court-ordered to be paid $160 per hour as a court-appointed attorney.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg...r-20038/pdf/USCOURTS-mied-1_04-cr-20038-1.pdf

Yes, the US taxpayers will be paying for HM’s defense. Even if Claypool manages to get on the case, he’ll still collect the going rate for a public defender since HM has no income or assets. Since this isn’t a death penalty case, Mr Spielfogel’s expertise in that area isn’t required so he is likely just putting in his public defender time on the case at the moment.

MOO

 

[SouthAussie]

Yes, the US taxpayers will be paying for HM’s defense. Even if Claypool manages to get on the case, he’ll still collect the going rate for a public defender since HM has no income or assets. Since this isn’t a death penalty case, Mr Spielfogel’s expertise in that area isn’t required so he is likely just putting in his public defender time on the case at the moment.

MOO

Yes. I guess I should have said that Keith Spielfogel is an experienced capital case attorney (as opposed to death penalty lawyer). He is putting in his public defender time, but he is also qualified to defend a capital case. So there shouldn't be any future hiccups about 'inadequate defense'.


" .... at least one of whom shall be “learned in the law applicable to capital cases.” 18 U.S.C. § 3005. Attorney Keith Spielfogel has been represented to this Court by the Federal Defender Office of Detroit to possess such learning and experience."

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg...r-20038/pdf/USCOURTS-mied-1_04-cr-20038-1.pdf

 

[Chelly]

Per one of the articles posted:

Court records show a Cook County probate judge issued an emergency order Tuesday appointing one of Mack’s attorneys, Vanessa Favia, as the girl’s guardian.

Does this mean Stella is living with Vanessa Favia now?

 

[Niner]

Does this mean Stella is living with Vanessa Favia now?

No idea - it didn't say anything like that in the article.

 

[everybodhi]

She's an American citizen whose father is in prison there and mother is in prison here. I don't see the logic in sending her back to a foreign country to grow up, especially when the foster mother OS probably won't be granted custody.

She's also an Indonesian citizen, by Indonesian law Stella will have dual citizenship until she is 18, (or 21 by filing an extension request at 18), because she was born in Bali, jus soli.
Only children born jus soli to one or both foriegn parents have dual citizenship in Indonesia. No one else.
Once you are an adult, you must give up your foriegn passport, swear allegiance to Indonesia, and renounce any other country to obtain Indonesian citizenship rights, universal healthcare and the right to own land are the big ones. Only Indonesian citizens can own the land in Bali, it's a big deal. I can build a house, or a resort, but only lease the land, so eventually my property goes to the Balinese land owner.
The US doesn't recognize the renouncing of US citizenship so if Stella choses when she reaches adulthood to be a citizen in Bali, she won't ever really lose her US citizenship rights. She can always get a US passport because she will always be a US citizen. But she can lose her Indonesian citizenship at adulthood.
I was surprised Stella wasn't allowed to stay because she's a legal citizen by birth, but like in the US and many if not most countries, immigration trumps everything, they do whatever they want.
I've seen retiree expats deported just for being a jerk, speeding through their village on their motorbike and stealing someone's dog for a few days then acting dumb and giving it back. Or not wearing a mask. If the locals complain to immigration about you, you're out of here.
You don't even have to kill your mom, stuff her in a suitcase and leave her in the trunk of a cab parked in front of the St. Regis.

 

[Kamille]

She's also an Indonesian citizen, by Indonesian law Stella will have dual citizenship until she is 18, (or 21 by filing an extension request at 18), because she was born in Bali, jus soli.
Only children born jus soli to one or both foriegn parents have dual citizenship in Indonesia. No one else.
Once you are an adult, you must give up your foriegn passport, swear allegiance to Indonesia, and renounce any other country to obtain Indonesian citizenship rights, universal healthcare and the right to own land are the big ones. Only Indonesian citizens can own the land in Bali, it's a big deal. I can build a house, or a resort, but only lease the land, so eventually my property goes to the Balinese land owner.
The US doesn't recognize the renouncing of US citizenship so if Stella choses when she reaches adulthood to be a citizen in Bali, she won't ever really lose her US citizenship rights. She can always get a US passport because she will always be a US citizen. But she can lose her Indonesian citizenship at adulthood.
I was surprised Stella wasn't allowed to stay because she's a legal citizen by birth, but like in the US and many if not most countries, immigration trumps everything, they do whatever they want.
I've seen retiree expats deported just for being a jerk, speeding through their village on their motorbike and stealing someone's dog for a few days then acting dumb and giving it back. Or not wearing a mask. If the locals complain to immigration about you, you're out of here.
You don't even have to kill your mom, stuff her in a suitcase and leave her in the trunk of a cab parked in front of the St. Regis.

I believe there may be restrictions on that nationality by birth law in Indonesia (jus soli) and I believe that at least one parent must be an Indonesian citizen for a child born in the country to be considered a citizen. I think we went through this early on and I believe Stella has a US passport. I don’t think Indonesia would have deported Stella if she was a citizen in the foster system, especially since her birth mother wanted her to stay there.

https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4538aae64.pdf

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Does this mean Stella is living with Vanessa Favia now?

VF appears to have some strong Christian values so it wouldn’t surprise me if she has Stella and OS staying in her home or has found somewhere else for them to stay temporarily. I wonder how long OS is going to stay in the US and what will happen after she leaves.

MOO

 

[everybodhi]

I believe there may be restrictions on that nationality by birth law in Indonesia (jus soli) and I believe that at least one parent must be an Indonesian citizen for a child born in the country to be considered a citizen. I think we went through this early on and I believe Stella has a US passport. I don’t think Indonesia would have deported Stella if she was a citizen in the foster system, especially since her birth mother wanted her to stay there.

https://www.refworld.org/pdfid/4538aae64.pdf

MOO

Sorry I haven't read all the thread.
Thanks for sharing this document, I was under the impression jus soli was the law of the land but now I see jus sanguinis trumps jus soli. Blood is more important than being born here.
I don't know how they can live here, even if they were in good standing and HM was not a murderer.
They can only get visitor visas which require leaving every 1-6 months and it's rumored they will be cracking down on visa hopping, (flying to Malaysia for a day to get a visa stamp), and only allowing one 6 month social visa a year.
They cannot get a long term visa, she can't afford an investor visa which requires being director with ownership of a company valued at $700,000 USD minimum and an investment of minimum $70,000 in Bali. And you still cannot work, you have to hire Indonesians.
And she's too young for a retirement visa.
Her only option would be to marry an Indonesian, or give Stella up to adoption.