Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - #154 *Richard Allen Arrested*

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The family wishing this to be kept sealed can mean a lot of things:
- wanting respect & privacy for Abby and Libby
- wanting to stop the online speculation (it must be painfull for them to hear/read a lot of stuff out there)
- wanting a successfull trial, their lawyer might have told them a media circus has, in the past, hurt trials before.
- maybe they know what info or people the police is still working on & working together to stay quiet about it
- maybe the police is looking into a relative, friend or someone they love & they want to be 100% sure they’re ruled in or out before this comes out

MOO, just trying to keep all options open & not letting emotions or personal opinion get in the way.

Edited typos
What you just said and not wanting to taint a possible jury's minds with info before the trial has started. It's a high profile case so finding a jury without prior knowledge will be hard enough, especially with the release of more details.
 
I'm sorry, I haven't heard of Rochard Jewel before. What happened with him ?
He was a security guard at the 1996 Olympics accused by the MSM and FBI of orchestrating a fatal bombing. People believed it, psychoanalysied him and demonized him years before it was discovered that it was the anti-abortion bomber Eric Rudolph. It ruined his life. Point is -- just because law enforcement says someone is guilty, we should not assume it to be true until they demonstrate the evidence, which has not been done one bit in this case. Not one single, solitary piece of evidence. None

 
Somethings I have been wondering about.
  1. If L and A's deaths are the result of some kind of [insert word] 'ring', is there a chance that other local people are also involved in this 'ring' and;
  2. Does the fact that the probable cause document is sealed prevent RA from sharing his copy of that document with various potential defence counsel?
I think number 2 is my main concern. RA is entitled to legal counsel and if it can be shown in any way that access has been prevented, that opens avenues to all sorts of mischief down the road. How secure is the paperwork handed to RA?
 
He was a security guard at the 1996 Olympics accused by the MSM and FBI of orchestrating a fatal bombing. People believed it, psychoanalysied him and demonized him years before it was discovered that it was the anti-abortion bomber Eric Rudolph. It ruined his life. Point is -- just because law enforcement says someone is guilty, we should not assume it to be true until they demonstrate the evidence, which has not been done one bit in this case. Not one single, solitary piece of evidence. None

Thats really bad and it does happen. If RA is innocent though, i would hope the jury would recognise that from the evidence. Thats why trials happen, to prove or disprove guilt. I still think the PC AA should remain sealed. IMO.
 
Somethings I have been wondering about.
  1. If L and A's deaths are the result of some kind of [insert word] 'ring', is there a chance that other local people are also involved in this 'ring' and;
  2. Does the fact that the probable cause document is sealed prevent RA from sharing his copy of that document with various potential defence counsel?
I think number 2 is my main concern. RA is entitled to legal counsel and if it can be shown in any way that access has been prevented, that opens avenues to all sorts of mischief down the road. How secure is the paperwork handed to RA?
I think someone on here previously mentioned that it's only sealed to the public and the dependent and his council have a right to that information.
 
Has anyone listened to comparisons of “down the hill” with the minuscule snip of known-RMA audio?

Now THAT is dead-on … unlike with the sketches, which now seem like a bad joke, and the BG pics, which def look like RMA but are still hard to make out, I’m really surprised he wasn’t recognized by the audio IMO.

i don’t want to link to any comparisons cuz I can’t seem to get the rules for that right, but they’re easy to search up-
Yes, I'm surprised nobody recognized his voice, too, especially when LE added the "Guys," in front of 'Down the hill."
It's a word people use often when speaking to more than one person, especially kids his daughter's age.
 
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I think someone on here previously mentioned that it's only sealed to the public and the dependent and his council have a right to that information.
Yes, but he does not have counsel at the moment (reading between the lines of the Judges order). so my question is, can POTENTIAL counsel read the PC document/
 
Some really, really good posts/arguments for whether or not things should remain sealed. I keep flipping back and forth; I read one comment in support of documents remaining sealed and agree with that, then read a comment supporting the documents being unsealed, change my mind and agree with that, and then back and forth I keep going.

I think when it comes down to it though, my opinion is that it should be the same across the board (more or less) because that would be most fair for all. If documents should remain sealed due to the presumption of innocence until proven guilty for the arrested party & the possibility of innocent men and women having their lives destroyed due to an erroneous arrest, that should be the case for everyone who has been arrested.

Similarly with maintaining privacy & dignity for victims. If the thought is that keeping records sealed, out of respect for the victims then that should also be the case across the board for all victims.

Although Abby & Libby and this case as a whole have left a lasting impression on me and I have this special place in my heart for them due to following this case for so long, I don't feel it would be fair to award them more privacy or more dignity or more respect than any other homicide victims past, present or future.

I think when we start picking and choosing based mostly on THOSE reasons alone, we enter some dangerous territory.
 
Yes, but he does not have counsel at the moment (reading between the lines of the Judges order). so my question is, can POTENTIAL counsel read the PC document/
He was planning on hiring independent counsel, right? Maybe he has met with an attorney by now. I don't know how he can afford one though.
 
Yes, but he does not have counsel at the moment (reading between the lines of the Judges order). so my question is, can POTENTIAL counsel read the PC document/
I don't really know how it works in IN, but here you would only know what your client tells you until you formally file your notice of appearance and you get credited as somebody's attorney if a case is "under reserve" as we would call it.
If it's not sealed, anyone who knows the case number could see anything.

ETA: there is a turnaround though, it's common practice to ask a potential client for their Court website login information so you would access as them, and then you'd see what's available for them as the person accused.

I think he'd be borrowing against the futures of his wife and daughter if he went this route.
Barry Morphew had no issue with that :rolleyes:
 
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I support the family and what they would want. On the flip side - I'm not sure how that will play out legally? Would the court take a petition into consideration with something like this?
Absolutely not. They operate on the law. Not emotions.
imo The best place for a petition is to the legislature/Governor, who write those laws. But that won't help in this case most likely.
 
I think he will plead guilty and get life without parole to avoid being put on death row. That may not happen for some time though maybe late on next year. I read a comment from someone with a legal background that allegedly in the state of Indiana even if he accepts a plea deal the prosecution still need to have hearings outlining the charges that have been made against him and provide details of the plea agreement that he may have been offered and wished to accept. Then after hearing all the information they legally require to make an informed and lawful decision the Judge decides whether or not to approve or deny the plea agreement.

“The Indiana Supreme Court is in the process of appointing Allen County Superior Court Judge Fran Gull as special judge in the case after Carroll Circuit Court Judge Benjamin Diener’s recusal, spokeswoman Kathryn Dolan said.”


“A Fort Wayne man who once faced 13 charges related to child molesting has avoided time in prison after pleading guilty to two counts of sexual misconduct with a minor.

Allen Superior Court Judge Fran Gull sentenced 49-year-old Steven Wells to a three-year suspended prison sentence and ordered him to spend four years on probation, as called for in a plea agreement he reached with prosecutors.

Court records state Wells admitted to having sex with a 14-year-old girl and abusing a 13-year-old girl who has the mental capacity of a 7-year-old. The abuse happened between 2012 and 2016.”


Do you think it likely special Judge Frances C. Gull will remain the Judge for the duration of the legal process in the Delphi murder case? I’m concerned about the very lenient plea agreement approved in the case above and that Prosecutors did not seek a much more severe sentence. Understandably there has been a lot of criticism for this plea deal and a petition is still online for people to sign to try and get it overturned.
That's on the prosecution. A judge has to work within the framework they are given or else they risk crossing over into the executive branch powers. She could refuse the plea but she also could have seen the prosecutors had a weak case, legally and that would risk an acquittal.

Make sense?
 
The one inch core sample in RAs back yard had to have been for a specific reason in the SW.
If the location was indicated by a metal detector for a small object I think the would have carefully used a shovel to find what the detector alerted to.
A core sample is more like trying to find an old burn pit location or a buried tarp or sheer of plywood.
Imo We can't dismiss the possibilty of a clothing snap or button of some sort. I'm not sure how easily that would burn, but if he did it years ago maybe it's possible one kind of got buried under some debris and dirt and therefore protected to a degree? Maybe someone can help answer that? I just know that has happened in house fires and we saw it all the time as kids burning trash on our property that was just a larger version of photo of the fire pit at RAs home.

But how much of an idiot do you have to be to burn evidence in your own fire pit? Imo
 
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