Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #101

[Boxer]

I have carried a gun for years and am very knowledgeable about them. I cannot see a gun under his jacket. At one point early on, I thought I did. But the trigger and what would be the handle looks all wrong. My LE people do not see it either. They say it looks too big and could possibly be multiple items. Maybe in a bag. Binoculars? I think his gun was on or inside his waist area. Again, these are only opinions.

MOO I think he had both.

 

[margarita25]

I have carried a gun for years and am very knowledgeable about them. I cannot see a gun under his jacket. At one point early on, I thought I did. But the trigger and what would be the handle looks all wrong. My LE people do not see it either. They say it looks too big and could possibly be multiple items. Maybe in a bag. Binoculars? I think his gun was on or inside his waist area. Again, these are only opinions.

The reason the trigger and the handle is all wrong is because IMO hes’s got it strapped on in the body holster, moo. I’m in the process of “legally sourcing” the image.

ETA:
DBM

ETA2: It is certainly a BIG gun. I’ve shot an oozy before which is really heavy. My guess is it’s similar to a Colt or Glock .45 or something like that.

 

[cluciano63]

LE may have been told a car had been parked at that abandoned/unused building but the tipster could not remember what it looked like.

Jmo but I feel like the emotion at the PC was a kind of frustration, or desperation...realizing they used the wrong image for two years. Now they need people’s minds to go back to that day...any little thing to start from.

 

[IceIce9]

With respect, I disagree. I absolutely view a grown man lusting after a 14 yr old as a pedophile in every sense.

Yes!

 

[Jethro4WS]

Okay. @margarita25 I had posted the image - which was then removed. It is a stock image - that I had reversed to flip the side where the gun is. There are 3 EBAY auctions (already complete) that use the same image. I will link one below and maybe this will stay.

Here is the stock image used in this auction on EBAY.
Handgun Pistol Classic Shoulder Leather Gun Holster Double Mag Pouch Old West | eBay

And I will attach the reverse of that image.

 

[MistyWaters]

Considering the old railway bridge would presumably be connected to an abandoned rail line, if rabbit hunting is a popular activity near Delphi hearing gunshots in the distance might not be unusual.

Carroll County man shot while rabbit hunting
“Investigators determined three men had been hunting along an abandoned railroad bed north of Cutler.”

Small Game Regulations | eRegulations
Rabbit
Cottontail rabbit season is from Nov. 1, xxxx through Feb. 28, xxxx.

 

[HockeyMom330]

LE's words and actions since the recent PC make more sense IMO if they don't know the identity of the killer and they're not closing in on a suspect. I mean, they think he might live in Delphi, or once lived there, or works there, or sometimes visits there -- but none of it is definite. To me, this sounds like they still have no idea who it is.

Although I agree is sounds wishy-washy, I beleive that my #1POI might be living in Delphi (currently or very soon), has likely lived (at least temporarily) in Delphi since the murders, has worked/will be working there, and likely visits as he would have peers/social connections. Its possible to fit all those categories.

 

[newredtabby]

LE's words and actions since the recent PC make more sense IMO if they don't know the identity of the killer and they're not closing in on a suspect. I mean, they think he might live in Delphi, or once lived there, or works there, or sometimes visits there -- but none of it is definite. To me, this sounds like they still have no idea who it is.

I agree. In my mind it is playing out like this: LE has exhausted all the original tips and leads from the first released sketch (which BTW I believe was created not by any witness, but a combination of mug shots of people who early rumors suspected it might be) , hence the change of strategy. The new (old) sketch (which I also don't believe is substantiated by any witnesses, but again looks like currently rumored possible perps) was released to get a new line of tips generated, and everything Carter said about (to) the new possible "perp" was just info generated in an FBI profile of the killer. I don't think they have a clue who did this, and I don't believe LE is any closer today then they were 2 years ago to finding the killer. I also don't believe they have the perp's DNA, or any substantive evidence recovered from the crime scene. Pretty bleak .......

 

[margarita25]

Although I agree is sounds wishy-washy, I beleive that my #1POI might be living in Delphi (currently or very soon), has likely lived (at least temporarily) in Delphi since the murders, has worked/will be working there, and likely visits as he would have peers/social connections. Its possible to fit all those categories.

My guess is that he is perhaps “semi-local” and lives out in the country or something.

 

[Deleted member 278]

With respect, I disagree. I absolutely view a grown man lusting after a 14 yr old as a pedophile in every sense.

You might view it as such but the proper term is hebephilia.

 

[sunshineray]

No, LE has not released interviews nor any documents related to the investigation. I can also understand why other people are not speaking to the media about this case, other than the family members who have done so. RL is a good example. Rumours and speculation seem to erupt like wildfire and I’m certain it has touched almost every member of the community in one way or another by now.

But early on I vaguely recall LE stating that everyone on the trail had came forward except the man Libby videoed on the bridge, which was why he became the prime suspect.

That reason and the video/audio evidence too, IMO.

 

[Boxer]

Considering the old railway bridge would presumably be connected to an abandoned rail line, if rabbit hunting is a popular activity near Delphi hearing gunshots in the distance might not be unusual.

Carroll County man shot while rabbit hunting
“Investigators determined three men had been hunting along an abandoned railroad bed north of Cutler.”

Small Game Regulations | eRegulations
Rabbit
Cottontail rabbit season is from Nov. 1, xxxx through Feb. 28, xxxx.

I agree that it would be fairly typical to hear some shots, but I think hearing shots on the trail would likely be remembered, especially in light of missing girls day 1 and finding them dead day 2.

 

[TheVisual]

Or, Libby quickly concealed her phone so he wouldn’t be aware of it?

Yes, of course, BUT, regardless they would have fluid steps of the film to show. I would only understand what LE did if there was something there that they didn't want us to see. JMO

 

[MassGuy]

I agree that it would be fairly typical hear some shots, but I think heating shots on then trail would likely be remembered, especially in light of missing girls day 1 and finding them dead day 2.

I do too. I don’t believe he fired a gun, although he may have been armed with one.

This was a brazen crime, but he probably wasn’t as reckless as that.

Someone would have certainly heard something, even if they initially ignored the sound, or attributed it to hunters or something.

 

[sunshineray]

With respect, I disagree. I absolutely view a grown man lusting after a 14 yr old as a pedophile in every sense.

I agree, my friend was assaulted routinely by a good family friend who was a pedophile from the age of 8-14.

 

[margarita25]

“Standard Issue Police Pistol; The Glock is the Most Popular Law Enforcement Handgun. Firearms for law enforcement officers must be powerful enough to stop criminals and accurate enough to hit their mark. ... The Glock 19 was introduced into the market in 1988 and the Glock 22 was introduced in 1990....”

Standard Issue Police Pistols & Most Popular Law Enforcement Handguns; Glock 19 & 22, Smith & Wesson M&P9, Berretta Model 92, Sig Sauer P226, Heckler, Koch HK45, & Colt M1911 - Shooting Range Industries

I’m thinking maybe something like this:
Smith & Wesson M&P .45 Caliber Police Pistol w/Night Sights

From the above link:

“Gun Sales Are Permitted To Public Safety Only:

Sworn Law Enforcement officers, including Federal, State, County, & City (Includes retired L.E. officers with "retired" credentials)
EMT's, Fire Fighters, Volunteer Fire Fighters, and Paramedics
Military personnel including Reservists and National Guard with I.D. (Includes retired Military with "retired" credentials)
Military veterans medically and honorably discharged with retired ID or DD-214
Corrections Officers, including Parole and Probation Officers
State Licensed Security Companies (Loomis, RAM, etc.) also includes State Licensed Armed Security Officers
Court Judges, District Attorneys and Deputy District Attorneys
LE Academy Cadets with enrollment documentation from the Academy”

—-

We purchased our gun at a gun show and are none of the above. This was back in the early 90s though. There’s also the possibility of getting one from a Pawn shop or any sporting goods store. What are the current purchase laws/restrictions at Indiana gun shows I wonder.

I think I’m going to go look at Indiana gun shows, where, when and what their rules for sale are.

 

[TL4S]

LE may have been told a car had been parked at that abandoned/unused building but the tipster could not remember what it looked like.

Jmo but I feel like the emotion at the PC was a kind of frustration, or desperation...realizing they used the wrong image for two years. Now they need people’s minds to go back to that day...any little thing to start from.

I still wonder if there's a camera on the water tower, interstate bridge, or a building nearby that may have captured the car parked there. Perhaps it's either too far away, or not from an angle where the license plate or driver could be seen? Or maybe a police dashcam (or something similar on another vehicle) captured part of the car there while driving by on the interstate? Random curiosities...

 

[TL4S]

Okay. @margarita25 I had posted the image - which was then removed. It is a stock image - that I had reversed to flip the side where the gun is. There are 3 EBAY auctions (already complete) that use the same image. I will link one below and maybe this will stay.

Here is the stock image used in this auction on EBAY.
Handgun Pistol Classic Shoulder Leather Gun Holster Double Mag Pouch Old West | eBay

And I will attach the reverse of that image.

That's close, but I still don't think the angle looks right. IF that's a gun we're seeing, the barrel seems to be pointing more upward than any holster I've seen.

 

[hawkeyefan51]

Following my own thought..and I promise Ill get busy here in the house and stop posting about my thoughts but if he did come to town for a special occasion maybe he flew in and once here borrowed a car to get around to visit, visit old haunts, etc. Seriously, I've got to get busy

 

[Krwiley60]

The reason the trigger and the handle is all wrong is because IMO hes’s got it strapped on in the body holster, moo. I’m in the process of “legally sourcing” the image.

ETA:
No offense to your LE people, but I hope they’re not working this case if they don’t see the gun! Sorry that sounds harsh. No disrespect intended.

ETA2: It is certainly a BIG gun. I’ve shot an oozy before which is really heavy. My guess is it’s similar to a Colt or Glock .45 or something like that.

No disrespect taken. It’s just opinions. I carry a Glock and in my shoulder holster, the gun is under my left arm, not in front. I am right handed. Only the handle of the gun sticks out. I also have one that fits on my right side and the gun sits lower on my hip, but not in front. Only the handle sticks out. There are several different styles though. If it possibly was a gun, and a gun was involved, along with other items, I just cannot see him taking the time to mess around to get it out from under his jacket.

 

[MassGuy]

I still wonder if there's a camera on the water tower, interstate bridge, or a building nearby that may have captured the car parked there. Perhaps it's either too far away, or not from an angle where the license plate or driver could be seen? Or maybe a police dashcam (or something similar on another vehicle) captured part of the car there while driving by on the interstate? Random curiosities...

We just have to hope that they collected every piece of footage they could, in the days after this happened.

By now, it would almost certainly be too late to go back and gather additional footage.