Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #116

[Charlot123]

I’m with you except for “group.” Id lean more toward one or two. Mostly because the more people involved, the more likely it would be that one would crack under the pressure and tell someone.

Right...and more DNA.

Either two best buddies, a dyad, with very complicated relationship. Or, two adults.

 

[Charlot123]

Well..just wondering out loud.. but, what if they have DNA, but they don't have anyone to cross-reference it to?
What if he lives just outside the area, and did not provide a DNA sample ?
If there is nothing in the database fro him, I assume they would not be able to match it?

MOO

If he is a human, there should be some matches, even in CODIS, maybe not close ones, maybe with common ancestor from 1700es, but something should be there. If there is nothing, it means that most likely, he is a recent immigrant from another country. Or that he belongs to a group that does not submit their DNAs (and I can’t imagine who it could be - even if he is Amish, he would cross- match with descendants of Germans and Dutch. Maybe even more than IRL because of endogamy.)

 

[tresir2012]

So let's assume for example someone sends in a tip from Colorado that says they saw someone who fits the description of either the new sketch or the video eating at a McDonalds in Denver. The man left in a pickup truck heading west on some road, but they do not know his name or his license plate number.

Do you think LE investigates those types of tips if they have to go through an entire process just to figure out who the person is? I do not. I think they put those tips in a pile to get to later. This is what I meant. I know they had billboards put up after the murders but those were of the still image taken from Liberty German's phone. They wanted a quick solve and knew that using something factual like the video versus some sketch that may or may not be correct was the best strategy. They probably had the sketch but decided against it. The quick solve did not happen.

As for any new information and intelligence, I hope that information was developed by LE and not from an eyewitness who thinks they saw the bridge guy killer. I think what happened was within the first 5 months of the case they realized they were not going to be able to catch the man with the billboards so they switched to a local strategy hoping that narrowing their focus to the Delphi, Indiana area would cause the local community to become focused on anyone who was even remotely a resemblance. Eventually in such a small community the right tip would come in. As of today, that strategy has not worked out either.

And that has left people like myself wondering if today is the day so tomorrow does not have to be.

Well something similar did happen in Colorado with a former POI who was just driving past a search party acting suspiciously so, yes, I think it can happen. In that case they had a photograph of the car though.

 

[tresir2012]

@tresir2012 , to be honest, me being an immigrant, I am even scared to google US bases - although to see if any female/kids murders/disappearances overlap with the neighborhood of US military bases would be interesting. (And if so, trace the pattern). It is really a question of overlapping 2 maps. But I can try to find out if there is anything military around Delphi. To even know if there was an army brat attending Delphi school, day, 10 years ago, who later moved. (And Evansdale since while I am not sure the two murders are connected, it is still a possibility).

I don't think you need to be scared to Google. I am in UK and do it all the time. On the case of Harry Dunn, I was googling all about the US listening base here in the UK. I'll do a search and see if I can post the results. Grissom has been suggested so that's one to start with.

ETA here are some former bases -

Indiana

and here is the Wiki list of active installations -

Category:Military installations in Indiana - Wikipedia

 

[tresir2012]

so they were mislead by someone not directly involved? or did fsg not want to implicate his friend?

This is what we don't know. I believe they interviewed and discounted someone close to the initial POI. Now they may have come back around to him and are gathering evidence and trying to break an alibi. MOO.

 

[tresir2012]

Does anyone remember talk of a homeless man on park bench asking for money near the bridge? If so who stated that? Trying to go back to the beginning to see where LE could have been lead astray.

Yes but not a quotable source. It was about 3 weeks before the murders IIRC.

 

[busymcmoody]

I have a feeling that we'll all be surprised when we learn who it was.

 

[PaulaDC]

Yes but not a quotable source. It was about 3 weeks before the murders IIRC.

We'll all I can say is like LE my direction has done a 360 too. Moo

 

[sunsetbeach]

Does anyone remember talk of a homeless man on park bench asking for money near the bridge? If so who stated that? Trying to go back to the beginning to see where LE could have been lead astray.

yes, I remember. It was a young male (allegedly related to Libby). The “confrontation” occurred three weeks prior to the murders near the same trail entrance the girls were dropped off at. The bench at the intersection.

(ok I just self deleted most of this post because I’m not sure it’s allowed).

 

[Justice101]

following

 

[Charlot123]

I have a feeling that we'll all be surprised when we learn who it was.

Nothing will surprise me after Watts’ case. However, imagine people’s expectations after JC was abducted? And the reality?
And if someone said to you, a person stole a cargo Bombardier at SeaTac, flew over the city, started performing some high acrobatics in the air, but missed and hit the ground - would you say it was a financially struggling, married Christian who never piloted a plane except for in a computer game?

 

[PezCandy]

Does anyone remember talk of a homeless man on park bench asking for money near the bridge? If so who stated that? Trying to go back to the beginning to see where LE could have been lead astray.

if I remember correctly, a woman was at park with her kids and seen a man who looked like OBG asking for money. I THINK that this was an unconfirmed rumor.- It was posted on a site we’re not able to talk about, so I’ll just leave it at that-
I may be wrong, but I do remember what you are talking about. Nothing came of it.

 

[Charlot123]

I don't think you need to be scared to Google. I am in UK and do it all the time. On the case of Harry Dunn, I was googling all about the US listening base here in the UK. I'll do a search and see if I can post the results. Grissom has been suggested so that's one to start with.

ETA here are some former bases -

Indiana

and here is the Wiki list of active installations -

Category:Military installations in Indiana - Wikipedia

You know what I don’t see? Something closer to Carroll County. I think for an army brat, to go to school in the county, he has to live in the county. Even Grissom base is too far. MOO

 

[jhny]

Yes but not a quotable source. It was about 3 weeks before the murders IIRC.

I was sold on that group of meth users. however that Apr 2019 press conference was not addressed to the meth group. that presser implied it was someone respected by the community. I believe the killer or the killer's dad was at the press conference.

 

[busymcmoody]

Nothing will surprise me after Watts’ case. However, imagine people’s expectations after JC was abducted? And the reality?
And if someone said to you, a person stole a cargo Bombardier at SeaTac, flew over the city, started performing some high acrobatics in the air, but missed and hit the ground - would you say it was a financially struggling, married Christian who never piloted a plane except for in a computer game?

I mean more along the lines of someone we never had on the radar.

 

[Charlot123]

This is what we don't know. I believe they interviewed and discounted someone close to the initial POI. Now they may have come back around to him and are gathering evidence and trying to break an alibi. MOO.

Or, they may have collected all their POIs, short-listed them and made a collective portrait, so to say, with a chin from one, a mole from another one, a car from the third one, hoping that the pressure might make someone crack. They, too, probably have enough POIs on their list.

In the meantime, the labs are working at DNAs. I hope they forbade their POIs to leave IN, or if the kids as out of state, they are to stay at college premises.

 

[Charlot123]

I mean more along the lines of someone we never had on the radar.

I can not have too many people on the radar but my POIs have never been mentioned as such. And plus, not all family members have been cleared either, so...the ones uncleared are sort of on that list, still.

 

[JnRyan]

You know what I don’t see? Something closer to Carroll County. I think for an army brat, to go to school in the county, he has to live in the county. Even Grissom base is too far. MOO

No, I believe you had something. If one parent - say the mother - got a job teaching or in city/county government in Delphi, they could have lived in or near Delphi while the father commuted to Grissom. At most it was 36 miles, less if they lived to the east or northeast of Delphi. My commute, in probably MUCH heavier traffic to a Navy base was almost 30 miles. And sometimes the rules are strange. For example, the children of military families on Naval Weapons Station Earle do not go to the nearby schools, but attend schools in the next township or county over, based on an agreement between the Navy and the local government.

 

[stattlich1]

I believe the killer or the killer's dad was at the press conference.

Just think, if this above comment is true, and it may or may not be.....there are possibly a select few in local law enforcement who could be reasonably confident or certain of who the BG is, and have to pass him in the grocery store, or on the street, from time to time.....think about that for a bit!

My best hunch today is that BG, and possibly another individual, committed this atrocious act of murder because they had to cover up something they had done prior that the girls were either a part of or became aware of. I am convinced that this was a pre-meditated and targeted murder, and the one, or two killers involved knew the girls would be at the bridge that day.

My
Speculative
Thoughts

 

[TL4S]

Just think, if this above comment is true, and it may or may not be.....there are possibly a select few in local law enforcement who could be reasonably confident or certain of who the BG is, and have to pass him in the grocery store, or on the street, from time to time.....think about that for a bit!

My best hunch today is that BG, and possibly another individual, committed this atrocious act of murder because they had to cover up something they had done prior that the girls were either a part of or became aware of. I am convinced that this was a pre-meditated and targeted murder, and the one, or two killers involved knew the girls would be at the bridge that day.

My
Speculative
Thoughts

Even though I lean more towards an unplanned, random attack, I'm not totally closed off to the premeditated, targeted idea, especially since we don't know what happened. But here's my question:

If this was premeditated and targeted, is the thought that it was planned before that afternoon? And if so, even if BG somehow knew the girls were going to the trail, how was he to know he'd have that small open window of opportunity to commit the crime? Was he following them and waiting for the opening, which just happened perfectly when they crossed the bridge? Was he willing to not go through with it if it didn't work perfectly? Even then, at any point along the way someone else could have entered the scene. This is what keeps me leaning toward it being a random act.